Guru Arjan as Incarnation of Waheguru?

Ishna · #1 (**permalink**) 09-Jul-2011, 14:06 PM

Gurfateh

Some tuks from this shabad were sung at the Gurdwara I attend recently. I was suprised by the translation on the projector screen. I might be asking about something which is far beyond my comprehension at this point in my growth but thought I'd ask since there is some talk of avatars on another thread at the moment.

The shabad starts on Ang 1048. The parts I'm curious about are in green. Is it really saying Guru Arjan Dev Ji is an incarnation of Waheguru?

ਜੋਤਿ ਰੂਪਿ ਹਰਿ ਆਪਿ ਗੁਰੂ ਨਾਨਕੁ ਕਹਾਯਉ ॥
Joṯ rūp har āp gurū Nānak kahā▫ya▫o.
The Embodiment of Light, the Lord Himself is called Guru Nanak.

ਤਾ ਤੇ ਅੰਗਦੁ ਭਯਉ ਤਤ ਸਿਉ ਤਤੁ ਮਿਲਾਯਉ ॥
Ŧā ṯe angaḏ bẖa▫ya▫o ṯaṯ si▫o ṯaṯ milā▫ya▫o.
From Him, came Guru Angad; His essence was absorbed into the essence.

ਅੰਗਦਿ ਕਿਰਪਾ ਧਾਰਿ ਅਮਰੁ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੁ ਥਿਰੁ ਕੀਅਉ ॥
Angaḏ kirpā ḏẖār amar saṯgur thir kī▫a▫o.
Guru Angad showed His Mercy, and established Amar Daas as the True Guru.

ਅਮਰਦਾਸਿ ਅਮਰਤੁ ਛਤ੍ਰੁ ਗੁਰ ਰਾਮਹਿ ਦੀਅਉ ॥
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/questions-and-answers/36179-guru-arjan-as-incarnation-of-waheguru.html
Amarḏās amraṯ cẖẖaṯar gur rāmėh ḏī▫a▫o.
Guru Amar Daas blessed Guru Raam Daas with the umbrella of immortality.

ਗੁਰ ਰਾਮਦਾਸ ਦਰਸਨੁ ਪਰਸਿ ਕਹਿ ਮਥੁਰਾ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਬਯਣ ॥
Gur Rāmḏās ḏarsan paras kahi mathurā amriṯ ba▫yaṇ.
So speaks Mat'huraa: gazing upon the Blessed Vision, the Darshan of Guru Raam Daas, His speech became as sweet as nectar.

ਮੂਰਤਿ ਪੰਚ ਪ੍ਰਮਾਣ ਪੁਰਖੁ ਗੁਰੁ ਅਰਜੁਨੁ ਪਿਖਹੁ ਨਯਣ ॥੧॥
Mūraṯ pancẖ parmāṇ purakẖ gur arjun pikẖahu na▫yaṇ. ||1||
With your eyes, see the certified Primal Person, Guru Arjun, the Fifth Manifestation of the Guru. ||1||

ਸਤਿ ਰੂਪੁ ਸਤਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਸਤੁ ਸੰਤੋਖੁ ਧਰਿਓ ਉਰਿ ॥
Saṯ rūp saṯ nām saṯ sanṯokẖ ḏẖari▫o ur.
He is the Embodiment of Truth; He has enshrined the True Name, Sat Naam, Truth and contentment within His heart.

ਆਦਿ ਪੁਰਖਿ ਪਰਤਖਿ ਲਿਖ੍ਯ੍ਯਉ ਅਛਰੁ ਮਸਤਕਿ ਧੁਰਿ ॥
Āḏ purakẖ parṯakẖ likẖ▫ya▫o acẖẖar masṯak ḏẖur.
From the very beginning, the Primal Being has written this destiny upon His forehead.

ਪ੍ਰਗਟ ਜੋਤਿ ਜਗਮਗੈ ਤੇਜੁ ਭੂਅ ਮੰਡਲਿ ਛਾਯਉ ॥
Pargat joṯ jagmagai ṯej bẖū▫a mandal cẖẖā▫ya▫o.
His Divine Light shines forth, dazzling and radiant; His Glorious Grandeur pervades the realms of the world.

ਪਾਰਸੁ ਪਰਸਿ ਪਰਸੁ ਪਰਸਿ ਗੁਰਿ ਗੁਰੂ ਕਹਾਯਉ ॥
Pāras paras paras paras gur gurū kahā▫ya▫o.
Meeting the Guru, touching the Philosopher's Stone, He was acclaimed as Guru.

ਭਨਿ ਮਥੁਰਾ ਮੂਰਤਿ ਸਦਾ ਥਿਰੁ ਲਾਇ ਚਿਤੁ ਸਨਮੁਖ ਰਹਹੁ ॥
Bẖan mathurā mūraṯ saḏā thir lā▫e cẖiṯ sanmukẖ rahhu.
So speaks Mat'huraa: I constantly focus my consciousness on Him; as sunmukh, I look to Him.

ਕਲਜੁਗਿ ਜਹਾਜੁ ਅਰਜੁਨੁ ਗੁਰੂ ਸਗਲ ਸ੍ਰਿਸ੍ਟਿ ਲਗਿ ਬਿਤਰਹੁ ॥੨॥
Kaljug jahāj arjun gurū sagal sarisat lag biṯrahu. ||2||
In this Dark Age of Kali Yuga, Guru Arjun is the Boat; attached to him, the entire universe is safely carried across. ||2||

ਤਿਹ ਜਨ ਜਾਚਹੁ ਜਗਤ੍ਰ ਪਰ ਜਾਨੀਅਤੁ ਬਾਸੁਰ ਰਯਨਿ ਬਾਸੁ ਜਾ ਕੋ ਹਿਤੁ ਨਾਮ ਸਿਉ ॥
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=36179
Ŧih jan jācẖahu jagṯar par jānī▫aṯ bāsur ra▫yan bās jā ko hiṯ nām si▫o.
I beg from that humble being who is known all over the world, who lives in, and loves the Name, night and day.

ਪਰਮ ਅਤੀਤੁ ਪਰਮੇਸੁਰ ਕੈ ਰੰਗਿ ਰੰਗ੍ਯ੍ਯੌ ਬਾਸਨਾ ਤੇ ਬਾਹਰਿ ਪੈ ਦੇਖੀਅਤੁ ਧਾਮ ਸਿਉ ॥
Param aṯīṯ parmesur kai rang rang▫y▫ou bāsnā ṯe bāhar pai ḏekẖī▫aṯ ḏẖām si▫o.
He is supremely unattached, and imbued with the Love of the Transcendent Lord; he is free of desire, but he lives as a family man.

ਅਪਰ ਪਰੰਪਰ ਪੁਰਖ ਸਿਉ ਪ੍ਰੇਮੁ ਲਾਗ੍ਯ੍ਯੌ ਬਿਨੁ ਭਗਵੰਤ ਰਸੁ ਨਾਹੀ ਅਉਰੈ ਕਾਮ ਸਿਉ ॥
Apar parampar purakẖ si▫o parem lāg▫y▫ou bin bẖagvanṯ ras nāhī a▫urai kām si▫o.
He is dedicated to the Love of the Infinite, Limitless Primal Lord God; he has no concerns for any other pleasure, except for the Lord God.

ਮਥੁਰਾ ਕੋ ਪ੍ਰਭੁ ਸ੍ਰਬ ਮਯ ਅਰਜੁਨ ਗੁਰੁ ਭਗਤਿ ਕੈ ਹੇਤਿ ਪਾਇ ਰਹਿਓ ਮਿਲਿ ਰਾਮ ਸਿਉ ॥੩॥
Mathurā ko parabẖ sarab ma▫y arjun gur bẖagaṯ kai heṯ pā▫e rahi▫o mil rām si▫o. ||3||
Guru Arjun is the All-pervading Lord God of Mat'huraa. Devoted to His Worship, he remains attached to the Lord's Feet. ||3|| ਅੰਤੁ ਨ ਪਾਵਤ ਦੇਵ ਸਬੈ ਮੁਨਿ ਇੰਦ੍ਰ ਮਹਾ ਸਿਵ ਜੋਗ ਕਰੀ ॥
Anṯ na pāvaṯ ḏev sabai mun inḏar mahā siv jog karī.
All the gods, silent sages, Indra, Shiva and Yogis have not found the Lord's limits -

ਫੁਨਿ ਬੇਦ ਬਿਰੰਚਿ ਬਿਚਾਰਿ ਰਹਿਓ ਹਰਿ ਜਾਪੁ ਨ ਛਾਡ੍ਯ੍ਯਿਉ ਏਕ ਘਰੀ ॥
Fun beḏ birancẖ bicẖār rahi▫o har jāp na cẖẖādi▫ya▫o ek gẖarī.
not even Brahma who contemplates the Vedas. I shall not give up meditating on the Lord, even for an instant.

ਮਥੁਰਾ ਜਨ ਕੋ ਪ੍ਰਭੁ ਦੀਨ ਦਯਾਲੁ ਹੈ ਸੰਗਤਿ ਸ੍ਰਿਸ੍ਟਿ ਨਿਹਾਲੁ ਕਰੀ ॥
Mathurā jan ko parabẖ ḏīn ḏa▫yāl hai sangaṯ sarisat nihāl karī.
The God of Mat'huraa is Merciful to the meek; He blesses and uplifts the Sangats throughout the Universe.

ਰਾਮਦਾਸਿ ਗੁਰੂ ਜਗ ਤਾਰਨ ਕਉ ਗੁਰ ਜੋਤਿ ਅਰਜੁਨ ਮਾਹਿ ਧਰੀ ॥੪॥
Rāmḏās gurū jag ṯāran ka▫o gur joṯ arjun māhi ḏẖarī. ||4||
Guru Raam Daas, to save the world, enshrined the Guru's Light into Guru Arjun. ||4||

ਜਗ ਅਉਰੁ ਨ ਯਾਹਿ ਮਹਾ ਤਮ ਮੈ ਅਵਤਾਰੁ ਉਜਾਗਰੁ ਆਨਿ ਕੀਅਉ ॥
Jag a▫or na yāhi mahā ṯam mai avṯār ujāgar ān kī▫a▫o.
In the great darkness of this world, the Lord revealed Himself, incarnated as Guru Arjun.

ਤਿਨ ਕੇ ਦੁਖ ਕੋਟਿਕ ਦੂਰਿ ਗਏ ਮਥੁਰਾ ਜਿਨ੍ਹ੍ਹ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਨਾਮੁ ਪੀਅਉ ॥
Ŧin ke ḏukẖ kotik ḏūr ga▫e mathurā jinĥ amriṯ nām pī▫a▫o.
Millions of pains are taken away, from those who drink in the Ambrosial Nectar of the Naam, says Mat'huraa.

ਇਹ ਪਧਤਿ ਤੇ ਮਤ ਚੂਕਹਿ ਰੇ ਮਨ ਭੇਦੁ ਬਿਭੇਦੁ ਨ ਜਾਨ ਬੀਅਉ ॥
Ih paḏẖaṯ ṯe maṯ cẖūkėh re man bẖeḏ bibẖed na jān bī▫a▫o.
O mortal being, do not leave this path; do not think that there is any difference between God and Guru.

ਪਰਤਛਿ ਰਿਦੈ ਗੁਰ ਅਰਜੁਨ ਕੈ ਹਰਿ ਪੂਰਨ ਬ੍ਰਹਮਿ ਨਿਵਾਸੁ ਲੀਅਉ ॥੫॥
Parṯacẖẖ riḏai gur arjun kai har pūran barahm nivās lī▫a▫o. ||5||
The Perfect Lord God has manifested Himself; He dwells in the heart of Guru Arjun. ||5||

ਜਬ ਲਉ ਨਹੀ ਭਾਗ ਲਿਲਾਰ ਉਦੈ ਤਬ ਲਉ ਭ੍ਰਮਤੇ ਫਿਰਤੇ ਬਹੁ ਧਾਯਉ ॥
Jab la▫o nahī bẖāg lilār uḏai ṯab la▫o bẖaramṯe firṯe baho ḏẖā▫ya▫o.
As long as the destiny written upon my forehead was not activated, I wandered around lost, running in all directions.

ਕਲਿ ਘੋਰ ਸਮੁਦ੍ਰ ਮੈ ਬੂਡਤ ਥੇ ਕਬਹੂ ਮਿਟਿ ਹੈ ਨਹੀ ਰੇ ਪਛੁਤਾਯਉ ॥
Kal gẖor samuḏar mai būdaṯ the kabhū mit hai nahī re pacẖẖoṯā▫ya▫o.
I was drowning in the horrible world-ocean of this Dark Age of Kali Yuga, and my remorse would never have ended.

ਤਤੁ ਬਿਚਾਰੁ ਯਹੈ ਮਥੁਰਾ ਜਗ ਤਾਰਨ ਕਉ ਅਵਤਾਰੁ ਬਨਾਯਉ ॥
Ŧaṯ bicẖār yahai mathurā jag ṯāran ka▫o avṯār banā▫ya▫o.
O Mat'huraa, consider this essential truth: to save the world, the Lord incarnated Himself.

ਜਪ੍ਯ੍ਯਉ ਜਿਨ੍ਹ੍ਹ ਅਰਜੁਨ ਦੇਵ ਗੁਰੂ ਫਿਰਿ ਸੰਕਟ ਜੋਨਿ ਗਰਭ ਨ ਆਯਉ ॥੬॥
Jap▫ya▫o jinĥ arjun ḏev gurū fir sankat jon garabẖ na ā▫ya▫o. ||6||
Whoever meditates on Guru Arjun Dayv, shall not have to pass through the painful womb of reincarnation ever again. ||6||

ਕਲਿ ਸਮੁਦ੍ਰ ਭਏ ਰੂਪ ਪ੍ਰਗਟਿ ਹਰਿ ਨਾਮ ਉਧਾਰਨੁ ॥
Kal samuḏar bẖa▫e rūp pargat har nām uḏẖāran.
In the ocean of this Dark Age of Kali Yuga, the Lord's Name has been revealed in the Form of Guru Arjun, to save the world.

ਬਸਹਿ ਸੰਤ ਜਿਸੁ ਰਿਦੈ ਦੁਖ ਦਾਰਿਦ੍ਰ ਨਿਵਾਰਨੁ ॥
Basėh sanṯ jis riḏai ḏukẖ ḏariḏar nivāran.
Pain and poverty are taken away from that person, within whose heart the Saint abides.

ਨਿਰਮਲ ਭੇਖ ਅਪਾਰ ਤਾਸੁ ਬਿਨੁ ਅਵਰੁ ਨ ਕੋਈ ॥
Nirmal bẖekẖ apār ṯās bin avar na ko▫ī.
He is the Pure, Immaculate Form of the Infinite Lord; except for Him, there is no other at all.

ਮਨ ਬਚ ਜਿਨਿ ਜਾਣਿਅਉ ਭਯਉ ਤਿਹ ਸਮਸਰਿ ਸੋਈ ॥
Man bacẖ jin jāṇi▫a▫o bẖa▫ya▫o ṯih samsar so▫ī.
Whoever knows Him in thought, word and deed, becomes just like Him.

ਧਰਨਿ ਗਗਨ ਨਵ ਖੰਡ ਮਹਿ ਜੋਤਿ ਸ੍ਵਰੂਪੀ ਰਹਿਓ ਭਰਿ ॥
Ḏẖaran gagan nav kẖand mėh joṯ savrūpī rahi▫o bẖar.
He is totally pervading the earth, the sky and the nine regions of the planet. He is the Embodiment of the Light of God.

ਭਨਿ ਮਥੁਰਾ ਕਛੁ ਭੇਦੁ ਨਹੀ ਗੁਰੁ ਅਰਜੁਨੁ ਪਰਤਖ੍ਯ੍ਯ ਹਰਿ ॥੭॥੧੯॥
Bẖan mathurā kacẖẖ bẖeḏ nahī gur arjun parṯakẖ▫y har. ||7||19||
So speaks Mat'huraa: there is no difference between God and Guru; Guru Arjun is the Personification of the Lord Himself. ||7||19||

BhagatSingh · #2 (**permalink**) 09-Jul-2011, 14:46 PM

Ishna ji
Yes the Gurmukhi suggests that it is saying that Guru Arjan Dev ji is the incarnation of God/God himself. Mathura uses the word Avtar for Guru Arjan. Avtars are incarnations.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=36179
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=36179

Now one person might reject this literal translation and advise to take it metaphorically like some sort of poetic praise. The other will take it word for word. (we will hear from more people soon) All perspectives point to towards the truth.

My suggestion would be to go beyond the words and try to feel what the word "incarnation" and the whole shabad is referring to. Meditate on the shabad.

Now, what other words can you use for that? (avoid thinking about that, post the words that immediately come through from meditation, and if no words arise that is fine too)

spnadmin · #3 (**permalink**) 09-Jul-2011, 20:06 PM

This subject comes up often enough. The shabad in question is by the poet KALL (Kahl), and is part of the granth that includes shabads by the Bhatts. These were Hindu poets who lived in the times and locale of the gurusahiban. They were monotheists. Their praise of the Gurus includes references to Hindu ideas and devtas...because they were Hindus. The common confusion is to conclude that Guru Arjan Dev is somehow acceding to Hindu ideas like avatars because he included their compositions in the Adi Granth. Because of this mental confusion, some of us veer in the direction of one of two mistaken ideas: 1) that Sikhism is blended with sanatan or Hinduism; or conversely, 2) that these shabads should be removed because they are impure. The former argument widely promoted in Sikhi, and reinforced in the writing of McLeod. The latter argument put forward by the early Panj Khalsa Diwan.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=36179
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=36179

It is interesting to me that the only time the word avatar is used in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji is in the compositions of the Bhatts. Or, in other words, in the Bhatt Bani.

This is my humble offering to the discussion. I await the moments when either problem 1 or problem 2 or both are pressed upon us in the thread.

Without a doubt it will occur.

spnadmin · #4 (**permalink**) 09-Jul-2011, 20:17 PM

Background:

Quote:

Bhai Gurdas also gives in his Vãrãñ, XI. 21, a brief account of these Bhatts. What was the number of Bhatts whose compositions are included is a question not yet firmly answered. According to a tradition, Kalh, a leading Bhatt poet, took it upon himself to note down some of the verse of the Bhatts from the vahis and passed it on to Guru Arjan at the time of the compilation of the Holy Book. As for the number of Bhatt contributors to the Guru Granth Sahib, Sahib Singh, Teja Singh, Tãran Singh and other modern scholars count 11 of them, whereas Santokh Siñgh (Sri GurPratãp Suraj Granth), Bhai Vir Singh (Guru Granth Kosh)and some others among the traditional scholars count 17, and Panclit Kartãr Singh Dãkha puts the figure at 19. This variation in owed to the fact that the Bhatts used to sing in chorus and sometimes the chorus sung in a group went in the name of the leader at other times individually in the members of the group.

From among the 17 Bhatts positions figure in the Guru Granth Sahib, Bhikhã, son of Rayyã, was a resident of Sultãnpur Lodhi and had been a follower of Guru Amar Das. Of the total 123 savaiye in the Guru Granth Sahib two are of his composition, both in praise of Guru Amar Das Of the remaining sixteen Bhatt contributors four are his sons; Kalh, also called or Kal Thãkur, who is reckoned to be the most learned of all the Bhatts, has 10 in praise of Guru Nanak, 9 each of Guru Angad and Guru Amar Das, 13 in praise of Guru Ram Das and 12 in praise of Guru Arjan; Jalap who had migrated to Goindval with his father has four his name all of which are in praise of Guru Amar Das; Kirat (d. 1634) has eight savaiye, four each in praise of Guru Amar Das and Guru Ram Dãs; and Mathurã 12, all in praise of Guru Ram Dãs. Salh who has three savaiye extolling the pre-eminence of Guru Amar Dãs (1) and Guru Ram Dãs (2), Bhalh who has one savaiyya in praise of Guru Amar Dãs were the sons of Sekhã, a brother of Rayya.

Balh who has five savaiye stressing the spiritual oneness of the Gurus was son of Tokhã, another brother of Rayya. Haribañs, the eldest son of Gokha, a brother of Rayya, has two savaiyyes , both in praise of Guru Arjan. Nalh has five savaiyyes all in praise of Guru Ram Das. Das also spelt dasu or dasi, has composed ten savaiyyes including one conjointly written with Sevak, who in addition to this has four savaiyye of his own. Parmanand has five savaiyyes are in praise of Guru Ram das, Tal's single one in praise of Guru Añgad .Jalan has two savaiye in praise of Guru Ram Das, Jalh one in praise of Guru Amar Dãs and Gayand five which glorify Guru Ram Dãs. Of the total 123 , ten each pay homage to Guru Nãnak and Guru Angad, 22 to Guru Amar Dãs, Ram Dãs and 21 to Guru Arjan.

The main purpose of these savaiye is to acclaim the Gurus, not as individuals but as the revelation they embodied.The Bhatts see the Gurus as one light, as one spirit passing from one body to the other. Bhatt Kirat for instance: Just as (Guru) Angad was ever the part of Guru Nãnak's being so is Guru Ram Dãs of (Guru) Amar Dãs's Again, Bhatt Kalh: From Guru Nanak was Angad: from Angad, Amar Dãs received sublime rank. From Guru Ram Das descended Guru Arjan, the great devotee of God (GG, 1407). This concept of all the Gurus being one light, one voice has informed all along the Sikh belief and development and constitutes today a fundamental principle of the faith

Source: http://www.sikhiwiki.org/index.php/Bhatts

Note: The Bhatt, BAL, it is thought by some may be the one and same KAL, who is speaking in the shabad.

Ishna · #5 (**permalink**) 09-Jul-2011, 20:50 PM

Perhaps it would help me if I was to research what exactly a Hindu avtar is.

Taking the entire shabad into consideration makes a couple of tuks stand out to me which I think help return the reader to the Sikh mindset. I would say they are:
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=36179

line 1 stanza 2 (sorry I don't know the right term for the different sections)
He is the Embodiment of Truth; He has enshrined the True Name, Sat Naam, Truth and contentment within His heart.

Line 3 stanza 5
O mortal being, do not leave this path; do not think that there is any difference between God and Guru.

And all of stanza 7.

When I read this as a Sikh, with no real understanding of Hinduism, and knowing that Waheguru is Ajooni (not born), I gather from the shabad that Guru Arjun is a shining example of a human at the height of God Realisation, who possesses all the qualities of God which you realize by attuning to the Naam. This is not God coming down into one little person, but one little person opening up into God.

Stanza 7 especially reminds me of Sachkhand as in Japji Sahib. The height of human consciousness and spiritual evolution is when you realize you are God looking upon the creation. That's where Guru Arjan was at, which is why Mathura says he is God incarnated.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=36179

That's my interpretation.

Ishna · #6 (**permalink**) 09-Jul-2011, 20:56 PM

Thanks Spnadmin ji for the background on the Bhatts!

spnadmin · #7 (**permalink**) 09-Jul-2011, 21:14 PM

Ishna ji

I believe that you also put the scanner on exactly why Guru Arjan Dev decided to include these bani in the Adi Granth: the message as he read it is consistent with the message of Guru Nanak.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=36179

For me the important reminder is always that Akaal does not incarnate and has no avatars.

prakash.s.bagga · #8 (**permalink**) 09-Jul-2011, 21:20 PM

ISNA Ji,
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=36179
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=36179
I feel that the meaning of the word AVTAARu in the quoted Sabad can be taken as a reference to Guru Arjanu ji showing a trait or typical character to a marked degree
of Prabhu Creator and this is more clarified with the mentioning of Pratakh Hari.
This is my personal thinking .
Prakash.S.Bagga

BhagatSingh · #9 (**permalink**) 10-Jul-2011, 01:27 AM

Ishna ji,
When one goes from non-dual to dual, these sorts of "differences" arise.

How can Waheguru be unborn when he is present everywhere, He is everything we perceive and our ability to perceive, and present even in a newly born child, when he is the newly born?
Similarly,
How can Waheguru be born when he is present everywhere, He is everything we perceive and our ability to perceive, and present even in a newly born child, when he is the newly born?

So is he unborn or born at this point?
Same could be asked of all his other traits.
Is he a protector or a destroyer? Is he loving or unloving?
Does he incarnate or not? etc etc the list is endless...

Meditating on Waheguru floods the empty glasses of questions. The questions and their answers become unimportant. In fact, if you look closely (ie meditate) the question is realized to be the answer.
Question: So is he unborn or born?
Answer: He is unborn and born.

Both point towards the Truth. One must step beyond the duality to see it. Here again I stress how meditation is important.

Quote:

ਸਲੋਕੁ ॥
सलोकु ॥
Salok.
Shalok:

ਆਪਹਿ ਕੀਆ ਕਰਾਇਆ ਆਪਹਿ ਕਰਨੈ ਜੋਗੁ ॥
आपहि कीआ कराइआ आपहि करनै जोगु ॥
Āpėh kī▫ā karā▫i▫ā āpėh karnai jog.
He Himself acts, and causes others to act; He Himself can do everything.

ਨਾਨਕ ਏਕੋ ਰਵਿ ਰਹਿਆ ਦੂਸਰ ਹੋਆ ਨ ਹੋਗੁ ॥੧॥
नानक एको रवि रहिआ दूसर होआ न होगु ॥१॥
Nānak eko rav rahi▫ā ḏūsar ho▫ā na hog. ||1||
O Nanak, the One Lord is pervading everywhere; there has never been any other, and there never shall be. ||1||

ਪਉੜੀ ॥
पउड़ी ॥
Pa▫oṛī.
Pauree:

ਓਅੰ ਸਾਧ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਨਮਸਕਾਰੰ ॥
ओअं साध सतिगुर नमसकारं ॥
O▫aŉ sāḏẖ saṯgur namaskāraŉ.
ONG: I humbly bow in reverence to the One Universal Creator, to the Holy True Guru.

ਆਦਿ ਮਧਿ ਅੰਤਿ ਨਿਰੰਕਾਰੰ ॥
आदि मधि अंति निरंकारं ॥
Āḏ maḏẖ anṯ niraŉkāraŉ.
In the beginning, in the middle, and in the end, He is the Formless Lord.

ਆਪਹਿ ਸੁੰਨ ਆਪਹਿ ਸੁਖ ਆਸਨ ॥
आपहि सुंन आपहि सुख आसन ॥
Āpėh sunn āpėh sukẖ āsan.
He Himself is in the absolute state of primal meditation; He Himself is in the seat of peace.

ਆਪਹਿ ਸੁਨਤ ਆਪ ਹੀ ਜਾਸਨ ॥
आपहि सुनत आप ही जासन ॥
Āpėh sunaṯ āp hī jāsan.
He Himself listens to His Own Praises.

ਆਪਨ ਆਪੁ ਆਪਹਿ ਉਪਾਇਓ ॥
आपन आपु आपहि उपाइओ ॥
Āpan āp āpėh upā▫i▫o.
He Himself created Himself.

ਆਪਹਿ ਬਾਪ ਆਪ ਹੀ ਮਾਇਓ ॥
आपहि बाप आप ही माइओ ॥
Āpėh bāp āp hī mā▫i▫o.
He is His Own Father, He is His Own Mother.

ਆਪਹਿ ਸੂਖਮ ਆਪਹਿ ਅਸਥੂਲਾ ॥
आपहि सूखम आपहि असथूला ॥
Āpėh sūkẖam āpėh asthūlā.
He Himself is subtle and etheric; He Himself is manifest and obvious.

ਲਖੀ ਨ ਜਾਈ ਨਾਨਕ ਲੀਲਾ ॥੧॥
लखी न जाई नानक लीला ॥१॥
Lakẖī na jā▫ī Nānak līlā. ||1||
O Nanak, His wondrous play cannot be understood. ||1||

ਕਰਿ ਕਿਰਪਾ ਪ੍ਰਭ ਦੀਨ ਦਇਆਲਾ ॥
करि किरपा प्रभ दीन दइआला ॥
Kar kirpā parabẖ ḏīn ḏa▫i▫ālā.
O God, Merciful to the meek, please be kind to me,

ਤੇਰੇ ਸੰਤਨ ਕੀ ਮਨੁ ਹੋਇ ਰਵਾਲਾ ॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
तेरे संतन की मनु होइ रवाला ॥ रहाउ ॥
Ŧere sanṯan kī man ho▫e ravālā. Rahā▫o.
that my mind might become the dust of the feet of Your Saints. ||Pause||

ਸਲੋਕੁ ॥
सलोकु ॥
Salok.
Shalok:

ਨਿਰੰਕਾਰ ਆਕਾਰ ਆਪਿ ਨਿਰਗੁਨ ਸਰਗੁਨ ਏਕ ॥
निरंकार आकार आपि निरगुन सरगुन एक ॥
Nirankār ākār āp nirgun sargun ek.
He Himself is formless, and also formed; the One Lord is without attributes, and also with attributes.

ਏਕਹਿ ਏਕ ਬਖਾਨਨੋ ਨਾਨਕ ਏਕ ਅਨੇਕ ॥੧॥
एकहि एक बखाननो नानक एक अनेक ॥१॥
Ėkėh ek bakẖānano Nānak ek anek. ||1||
Describe the One Lord as One, and Only One; O Nanak, He is the One, and the many. ||1||

ਪਉੜੀ ॥
पउड़ी ॥
Pa▫oṛī.
Pauree:

ਓਅੰ ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਕੀਓ ਅਕਾਰਾ ॥
ओअं गुरमुखि कीओ अकारा ॥
O▫aŉ gurmukẖ kī▫o akārā.
ONG: The One Universal Creator created the Creation through the Word of the Primal Guru.

ਏਕਹਿ ਸੂਤਿ ਪਰੋਵਨਹਾਰਾ ॥
एकहि सूति परोवनहारा ॥
Ėkėh sūṯ parovanhārā.
He strung it upon His one thread.

ਭਿੰਨ ਭਿੰਨ ਤ੍ਰੈ ਗੁਣ ਬਿਸਥਾਰੰ ॥
भिंन भिंन त्रै गुण बिसथारं ॥
Bẖinn bẖinn ṯarai guṇ bisthāraŉ.
He created the diverse expanse of the three qualities.

ਨਿਰਗੁਨ ਤੇ ਸਰਗੁਨ ਦ੍ਰਿਸਟਾਰੰ ॥
निरगुन ते सरगुन द्रिसटारं ॥
Nirgun ṯe sargun ḏaristāraŉ.
From formless, He appeared as form.

ਸਗਲ ਭਾਤਿ ਕਰਿ ਕਰਹਿ ਉਪਾਇਓ ॥
सगल भाति करि करहि उपाइओ ॥
Sagal bẖāṯ kar karahi upā▫i▫o.
The Creator has created the creation of all sorts.

ਜਨਮ ਮਰਨ ਮਨ ਮੋਹੁ ਬਢਾਇਓ ॥
जनम मरन मन मोहु बढाइओ ॥
Janam maran man moh badẖā▫i▫o.
The attachment of the mind has led to birth and death.

ਦੁਹੂ ਭਾਤਿ ਤੇ ਆਪਿ ਨਿਰਾਰਾ ॥
दुहू भाति ते आपि निरारा ॥
Ḏuhū bẖāṯ ṯe āp nirārā.
He Himself is above both, untouched and unaffected.

ਨਾਨਕ ਅੰਤੁ ਨ ਪਾਰਾਵਾਰਾ ॥੨॥
नानक अंतु न पारावारा ॥२॥
Nānak anṯ na pārāvārā. ||2||
O Nanak, He has no end or limitation. ||2||
.....

pp250

PS "Avtar" and similar words are used by other authors in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji as well. Ishna ji maybe you should have a look at those as you look at this shabad.

Do a search of " incarnate" (<space> then incarnate) on srigranth.org