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Did God create an imperfect world?

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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 20-Mar-2010, 16:47 PM
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The world is full of pain,misery and sickness.God,being omni-potent could easily have created a perfect world.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/atheism/29599-did-god-create-an-imperfect-world.html
Could someone enlighten me,without playing with words,so a lay-man like me can understand"God"s Great Game-plan".
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 20-Mar-2010, 22:02 PM
Narayanjot Kaur's Avatar Narayanjot Kaur Narayanjot Kaur is offline
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Re: Did God create an imperfect world?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jasbirkaleka View Post
The world is full of pain,misery and sickness.God,being omni-potent could easily have created a perfect world.
Could someone enlighten me,without playing with words,so a lay-man like me can understand"God"s Great Game-plan".

jasbirkaleka ji

Hope you don't think I am playing with words.

I cannot explain God's Great Game-plan because I am not God. However, this is my imperfect understanding.

Each of us as individuals will have perspectives and knowledge that is incomplete and imperfect. If the knowledge of every individual who lived, has lived, will live could be combined --- that would still only be the total of many incomplete and imperfect understandings.

We understand the universe incompletely and imperfectly because we cannot take the perspective of Akaal who is timeless and is the Doer of Everything.
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  #3 (permalink)  
Old 21-Mar-2010, 02:26 AM
Mai Harinder Kaur's Avatar Mai Harinder Kaur Mai Harinder Kaur is offline
 
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Re: Did God create an imperfect world?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jasbirkaleka View Post
The world is full of pain,misery and sickness.God,being omni-potent could easily have created a perfect world.
Could someone enlighten me,without playing with words,so a lay-man like me can understand"God"s Great Game-plan".
The short answer is, "No." No one can enlighten you, only Akaal Purakh can do that. Understanding of such things is a direct experience and any attempt to explain can only be a pack of not-quite-truths. Even thinking about explaining is frustrating.

The world is perfect, exactly as it is. What we see as pain, misery and sickness is a part of the plan that we, with our finite brains and tiny bit of understanding, cannot get our minds around. I myself have had my share of pain, misery and sickness, so I have some small idea what I'm talking about. It is all Hukam of Vaheguru and the sooner we all learn to accept that, the sooner we can all live in chardi kala.

This is not cold. I have long been a social activist, working to help alleviate these hurtful things where they exist. That, too, is the Hukam of Vaheguru. Once that one little concept is assimilated as a working part of a person, life becomes simple and without worry. Not easy, simple. My experience is that that is the answer to everything. It's all attitude. Accept all as the Hukam of Vaheguru. (I'm no saint. I forget this from time to time and need reminding, too.)

Sorry if this seems like word-play. Words are all I have. Watch this video a few times. It might help. Or it might not. In either case, it is time well spent.


YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.
YouTube- Mool Mantar - Sikh Prayer
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  #4 (permalink)  
Old 21-Mar-2010, 03:24 AM
Embers's Avatar Embers Embers is offline
 
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Re: Did God create an imperfect world?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jasbirkaleka View Post
The world is full of pain,misery and sickness.God,being omni-potent could easily have created a perfect world.
Could someone enlighten me,without playing with words,so a lay-man like me can understand"God"s Great Game-plan".
Our minds are limited. We look to our minds for an answer. Often the answer isn't satisfactory. Often we ask others or turn to books or science to help satisfy the urge to explain.

Our minds are limited in the same way that we can not see all points of view in every debate. Similarly we are limited physically, we don't have eyes in the back of our head* and we cannot see everything and explain everything that happens around us. We hear a scream and turn around to see a person on the floor, we can never explain exactly why. We are limited to our own perspective in time and space. The limitation is natural.

We can grow frustrated and disillusioned with a world which we cannot fully explain.

Our blessings begin the moment we become aware that we know we have this limitation. We can accept it as part of our being human. A part of the human condition. We know that we cannot understand everything and explain everything. We are only ever presented with a part of the whole story. At some point we have to shrug our shoulders and accept we don't know it all. This realisation has to lead to some acceptance of the situation, be it bad or good.

If we are lucky then with acceptance comes a moment we look to God for exaplantion. The moment we turn our hearts and minds inwards to God the grace and blessings of Akal Purakh that Gurus so often remind us, opens to us. Akal Purakh is ever ready to help, knowing our condition as the creator knows his creation.


----------
*Eyes in the back of the head. A side topic is Brahma, which we hear of in the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Brahma is depecited with four heads. Some say the four heads represent the ability to see everything at once: north, east, south and west. i.e. so Omnisicient, all knowing. As we don't have the blessing (or curse) of four heads we must come to accept ourselves and with it all that happens in Waheguru's universe.
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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 21-Mar-2010, 19:32 PM
Astroboy's Avatar Astroboy Astroboy is offline
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Re: Did God create an imperfect world?

Quoted by Narayanjot Kaur
Quote:
We understand the universe incompletely and imperfectly because we cannot take the perspective of Akaal who is timeless and is the Doer of Everything.

None of us truly live in reality. We live in what we think is reality, but it’s
actually just our own individual perception of what reality is.

Quoted by Ambers
Quote:
We can grow frustrated and disillusioned with a world which we cannot fully explain.
Changing the world from the outside isn't going to change anything. It is like trying to remove the thorns from the garden. Rather we need to wear a strong pair of shoes to avoid being pricked by the thorns.

We can't paint all the white roses red but we can wear red-tinted glasses to get the job. The change must come from our viewpoint and not the object.
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 21-Mar-2010, 19:39 PM
japjisahib04's Avatar japjisahib04 japjisahib04 is offline
 
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Re: Did God create an imperfect world?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jasbirkaleka View Post
The world is full of pain,misery and sickness.God,being omni-potent could easily have created a perfect world.
Could someone enlighten me,without playing with words,so a lay-man like me can understand"God"s Great Game-plan".
Jasbirkaleka Ji,
If everything is so smooth,then where is the fun, and who will work, who will give justice and then who will remember God.
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Old 21-Mar-2010, 20:42 PM
Taranjeet singh's Avatar Taranjeet singh Taranjeet singh is offline
 
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Re: Did God create an imperfect world?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jasbirkaleka View Post
The world is full of pain,misery and sickness.God,being omni-potent could easily have created a perfect world.
Could someone enlighten me,without playing with words,so a lay-man like me can understand"God"s Great Game-plan".
First Part: Pain and Misery

I am also a layman.

That the world is full of Misery has been also observed by Guru Sahibs and the following line is also indicative of the same:
1.Nanak Dukhia sab sansara


Guru Sahibs have advised that one should make efforts to cross-over this Bhaojal:
2. Sarnjaam Lag Bhaojal Taran ke


How to do this is again summed up in a very popular Line:
3. Naam Khumari Nanaka Chadi Rahe din Raat


Second Part: Game Plan

AS per Bani. This is His drama/play.He has created this.He has also created Maya and the three-Gunas. He has also ingrained 'ego' in every one. We are also His part but we do not realize this. So far as we are concerned we cannot fathom the Game plan of the Lord as He is incomprehensible and unfathomable. Guru Sahibs have stated clearly that even if one has seen/met/realized him , He cannot be described.Hence the purpose of His actions would also remain beyond human comprehension.This drama will end when He decides to wind up this show and all of this creation will get absorbed into the Creator.

Hope it clarifies this.

Coming Back to pain and Misery I am reminded of a dialogue that took place between Brahma and Lord Shiva. Brahma was asked by Shiva to clarify as to what kind of miserable world has he created. To this Brahma replied that He has made this world for every one to enjoy and for this purpose he has given every body a beautiful thing and that is 'mind'. It is for the people to use this correctly.

Shiva thought over this , smiled and went to Trance after pondering for one or two minutes. After this he never asked anything from Brahma.
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Old 21-Mar-2010, 21:28 PM
jasbirkaleka's Avatar jasbirkaleka jasbirkaleka is offline
 
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Re: Did God create an imperfect world?

Japjisahib04 ji Sat Sri Akal.
Where is the fun when millions die in earth-quacks or epidemics?
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=29599
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=29599
When an infant, who is not even aware of the world around him, dies of cancer or some other disease, where is the justice?
Do we ever torment or torture our children just to make them remember that we are their parents?
Sorry,I fail to find any logic in your answer.
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Old 21-Mar-2010, 21:45 PM
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Re: Did God create an imperfect world?

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Quote:
Originally Posted by jasbirkaleka View Post
The world is full of pain,misery and sickness.God,being omni-potent could easily have created a perfect world.
Could someone enlighten me,without playing with words,so a lay-man like me can understand"God"s Great Game-plan".
Jasbir ji,


Guru Fateh.

I am actually confused by your question, so I seek your help. I have no idea what thought process you had to go through to post this question.

Pardon my bluntness, but the question sounds quite myopic especially from a person like you whose posts I enjoy a lot because they are almost always thought provoking which nudge us to the deeper level of our thought process.

What is imperfect about the Sun? If there were not this planet called The Sun, then we would not be here.

Or are we still mourning about the extinction of many species like Dinosaurs when a big asteroid hit this speck of sand called the Earth?


Mystery solved! Giant asteroid killed the dinosaurs, say scientists

Mystery solved! Giant asteroid killed the dinosaurs, say scientists

Or are we talking about the destruction created by the ice age?

But we discovered something interesting on the other day. Here it is:
NASA Finds Shrimp-Like Creature, Jellyfish Beneath Antarctic Ice Sheet: 'We Were Just Gaga Over It'

NASA Finds Shrimp-Like Creature, Jellyfish Beneath Antarctic Ice Sheet: 'We Were Just Gaga Over It'

Or are we talking about this omnipotent God creating flood (Genesis6-9), hence killing millions because he claimed that men had become wicked. One wonders why He did not use His omnipotence to instill goodness in them so they could be steered away from wickedness!

Or are you just concerned about this tiny little speck called the Earth and have concluded Ik Ong Kaar's blue print for all the WOW! and the AWE! factors that surround us?

So, Jasbir ji, please help me understand your question so I can learn from it.

Thanks & regards

Tejwant Singh
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