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Guru Granth Sahib
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ਜਪੁ | Jup
ਸੋ ਦਰੁ | So Dar
ਸੋਹਿਲਾ | Sohilaa
ਰਾਗੁ ਸਿਰੀਰਾਗੁ | Raag Siree-Raag
Gurbani (14-53)
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Gurbani (71-74)
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Vanjara (81-82)
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ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਝ | Raag Maajh
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ਰਾਗੁ ਗਉੜੀ | Raag Gauree
Gurbani (151-185)
Quartets/Couplets (185-220)
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Thintteen (343-344)
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ਰਾਗੁ ਆਸਾ | Raag Aasaa
Gurbani (347-348)
Chaupaday (348-364)
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Chhant (435-462)
Vaar Aasaa (462-475)
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ਰਾਗੁ ਗੂਜਰੀ | Raag Goojaree
Gurbani (489-503)
Ashtpadiyan (503-508)
Vaar Gujari (508-517)
Vaar Gujari (517-526)
ਰਾਗੁ ਦੇਵਗੰਧਾਰੀ | Raag Dayv-Gandhaaree
Gurbani (527-536)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਿਹਾਗੜਾ | Raag Bihaagraa
Gurbani (537-556)
Chhant (538-548)
Vaar Bihaagraa (548-556)
ਰਾਗੁ ਵਡਹੰਸ | Raag Wadhans
Gurbani (557-564)
Ashtpadiyan (564-565)
Chhant (565-575)
Ghoriaan (575-578)
Alaahaniiaa (578-582)
Vaar Wadhans (582-594)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸੋਰਠਿ | Raag Sorath
Gurbani (595-634)
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Vaar Sorath (642-659)
ਰਾਗੁ ਧਨਾਸਰੀ | Raag Dhanasaree
Gurbani (660-685)
Astpadhiya (685-687)
Chhant (687-691)
Bhagat Bani (691-695)
ਰਾਗੁ ਜੈਤਸਰੀ | Raag Jaitsree
Gurbani (696-703)
Chhant (703-705)
Vaar Jaitsaree (705-710)
Bhagat Bani (710)
ਰਾਗੁ ਟੋਡੀ | Raag Todee
ਰਾਗੁ ਬੈਰਾੜੀ | Raag Bairaaree
ਰਾਗੁ ਤਿਲੰਗ | Raag Tilang
Gurbani (721-727)
Bhagat Bani (727)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸੂਹੀ | Raag Suhi
Gurbani (728-750)
Ashtpadiyan (750-761)
Kaafee (761-762)
Suchajee (762)
Gunvantee (763)
Chhant (763-785)
Vaar Soohee (785-792)
Bhagat Bani (792-794)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਿਲਾਵਲੁ | Raag Bilaaval
Gurbani (795-831)
Ashtpadiyan (831-838)
Thitteen (838-840)
Vaar Sat (841-843)
Chhant (843-848)
Vaar Bilaaval (849-855)
Bhagat Bani (855-858)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗੋਂਡ | Raag Gond
Gurbani (859-869)
Ashtpadiyan (869)
Bhagat Bani (870-875)
ਰਾਗੁ ਰਾਮਕਲੀ | Raag Ramkalee
Ashtpadiyan (902-916)
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Anand (917-922)
Sadd (923-924)
Chhant (924-929)
Dakhnee (929-938)
Sidh Gosat (938-946)
Vaar Ramkalee (947-968)
ਰਾਗੁ ਨਟ ਨਾਰਾਇਨ | Raag Nat Narayan
Gurbani (975-980)
Ashtpadiyan (980-983)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਲੀ ਗਉੜਾ | Raag Maalee Gauraa
Gurbani (984-988)
Bhagat Bani (988)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਰੂ | Raag Maaroo
Gurbani (889-1008)
Ashtpadiyan (1008-1014)
Kaafee (1014-1016)
Ashtpadiyan (1016-1019)
Anjulian (1019-1020)
Solhe (1020-1033)
Dakhni (1033-1043)
ਰਾਗੁ ਤੁਖਾਰੀ | Raag Tukhaari
Bara Maha (1107-1110)
Chhant (1110-1117)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕੇਦਾਰਾ | Raag Kedara
Gurbani (1118-1123)
Bhagat Bani (1123-1124)
ਰਾਗੁ ਭੈਰਉ | Raag Bhairo
Gurbani (1125-1152)
Partaal (1153)
Ashtpadiyan (1153-1167)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਸੰਤੁ | Raag Basant
Gurbani (1168-1187)
Ashtpadiyan (1187-1193)
Vaar Basant (1193-1196)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸਾਰਗ | Raag Saarag
Gurbani (1197-1200)
Partaal (1200-1231)
Ashtpadiyan (1232-1236)
Chhant (1236-1237)
Vaar Saarang (1237-1253)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਲਾਰ | Raag Malaar
Gurbani (1254-1293)
Partaal (1265-1273)
Ashtpadiyan (1273-1278)
Chhant (1278)
Vaar Malaar (1278-91)
Bhagat Bani (1292-93)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕਾਨੜਾ | Raag Kaanraa
Gurbani (1294-96)
Partaal (1296-1318)
Ashtpadiyan (1308-1312)
Chhant (1312)
Vaar Kaanraa
Bhagat Bani (1318)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕਲਿਆਨ | Raag Kalyaan
Gurbani (1319-23)
Ashtpadiyan (1323-26)
ਰਾਗੁ ਪ੍ਰਭਾਤੀ | Raag Prabhaatee
Gurbani (1327-1341)
Ashtpadiyan (1342-51)
ਰਾਗੁ ਜੈਜਾਵੰਤੀ | Raag Jaijaiwanti
Gurbani (1352-53)
Salok | Gatha | Phunahe | Chaubole | Swayiye
Sehskritee Mahala 1
Sehskritee Mahala 5
Gaathaa Mahala 5
Phunhay Mahala 5
Chaubolae Mahala 5
Shaloks Bhagat Kabir
Shaloks Sheikh Farid
Swaiyyae Mahala 5
Swaiyyae in Praise of Gurus
Shaloks in Addition To Vaars
Shalok Ninth Mehl
Mundavanee Mehl 5
ਰਾਗ ਮਾਲਾ, Raag Maalaa
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<blockquote data-quote="Harjas Kaur Khalsa" data-source="post: 53533" data-attributes="member: 2125"><p></p><p><span style="color: black">I am challenging the corruptions of Sikh definitions and criticisms of Sikh practice in what you are saying publically. Veerji, I don't mean you harm, but please examine some of the errors in what you are saying. I wish you greatest blessings. But this teaching Sikhism to Sikhs full of errors and misunderstandings and radical new self-definitions is off the wall. Especially since you have publically renounced Sikhism and embraced Bahai religion. You don't see anything distorted in that?</span></p><p> </p><p>You said on another forum</p><p></p><p style="text-align: left">So from this which was written a few months ago, it says it will be quite some time before you even read Siri Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaaj. And you have never taken amrit. Veerji, you never became a disciple of Guruji. You never embraced this religious path or learned what it was about. Instead, you jumped into it with all your own ideas about what it should be. I can quote directly from what you've written. You cannot claim to have <strong>followed </strong>Sikhism for over a year, because you never followed Sikhism.</p><p><span style="color: navy"><span style="color: navy"><span style="color: navy"><span style="color: navy"></span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: navy"><span style="color: navy"><span style="color: navy"><span style="color: navy"></span></span></span></span></p><p></p><p> </p><p></p><p style="text-align: left"></p><p></p><p style="text-align: left"><span style="color: black">Sikh comes from the word shishya, which is one-half of a Sanskrit concept, Guru-Shishya. There is no such thing as a Shishya without a Guru. </span>Shishya does not translate into English as "student." It translates into "disciple," one committed to following a Guru. In Sikhism, Sikhs are disciples of Guru Nanak Dev Ji, and all the Jyote manifestations until the Dhan Dhan Siri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. It is very specific what a Sikh is. The generalist terminology in which you are using it as "I'm Sikhi of another manifestation," As to put your abandonment of Sikh religion and Guru to pursue the path of Bahai is some kind of equivalent to Sikhi is complete bhull. </p><p></p><p><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><p style="text-align: left"><p style="text-align: left"></p> </p><p></span><p style="text-align: left"><p style="text-align: left"></p> </p><p></span><p style="text-align: left"><p style="text-align: left"></p> </p><p></span><p style="text-align: left"><p style="text-align: left"></p> </p><p></span><p style="text-align: left"><p style="text-align: left"></p> </p><p></span><p style="text-align: left"><p style="text-align: left"></p> </p><p></span><p style="text-align: left"><p style="text-align: left"></p> </p><p></span><p style="text-align: left"><p style="text-align: left"></p> </p><p></span><p style="text-align: left"><p style="text-align: left"></p> </p><p></span><p style="text-align: left"><p style="text-align: left"></p> </p><p></span><p style="text-align: left"><p style="text-align: left"></p> </p><p></span><p style="text-align: left"><p style="text-align: left"></p> </p><p></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span><p style="text-align: left"><p style="text-align: left"></p></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></p><p style="text-align: left"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></p></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></p><p style="text-align: left"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></p></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></p><p style="text-align: left"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></p></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></p><p style="text-align: left"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></p> </p><p></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"><span style="font-family: 'WebAkharThick'"><span style="color: #800000"></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span><p style="text-align: left"></p><p style="text-align: left"></p> <p style="text-align: left"></p> <p style="text-align: left">Please be clear out of respect to Sikh religion. You are passing yourself off as something you are not. On a physical level, you have no bond with the Sikh Guru. You are not a Sikh, follower of Sikh Guru. You publically renounced the Sikh religion, which is the path given to us to follow by Guruji, thus you have turned your back on Guru.</p> <p style="text-align: left"><span style="color: black">You aren't even aware of how much error and distortion is in your thinking. You cannot follow a Guru, and leave the Guru's path (Sikhism) and say you are still following the same Guru. We are not all Sikhs of one God.</span></p> <p style="text-align: left"></p></p> <p style="text-align: left"></p> <p style="text-align: left"></p><p style="text-align: left">First the term Jehovah is an Anglicized corruption of the Hebrew Tetragrammaton YHWH, which the Jewish scholars left out all vowels so the word would remain unpronounceable. Later, Christian thologians in flagrant violation of Jewish teaching, rendered the word Yahweh, and used it in casual speech. Another violation of Jewish teaching, because YHWH represented an unknowable aspect of creator God, like nirguna. To speak this uncreated, infinite potential with finite lips was to render it another, finite meaning which invalidated the concept. To further corrupt matters, the term Jehovah has no Hebrew linguistic equivalent. The word is simply derived as God's name, like a human being has a given name which is a parallel to idolatry, or worship of a recognizable form.</p></p> <p style="text-align: left"></p><p style="text-align: left">And in addition to that, according to Christian theologians, Jehovah God is the same equivalent as Jesus the human being, who possesses dual natures, both divine and human. Thus, to refer to Waheguru as equivalent to Jehovah, is to call Waheguru as Jesus the man-God, clearly an idolatrous concept. I'm afraid if you analyze religious terms, one has to acknowledge things are not equivalents, but very defined contradictory teachings.</p></p> <p style="text-align: left"></p><p style="text-align: left">Waheguru according to the vaars of Bhai Gurdas is V for Vishnu, H for Har, G for Gobind and R for Ram. I do not believe for one moment any Christian will accept this definition of God as being equivalent to Jehovah. Now, on another level, yes there is one God, and we call him different things. But what I'm highlighting is be careful with definitions. YHWH does have a parallel to Waheguru but not Jehovah, because in Sikhism God is not an incarnated being like Jesus.</p></p> <p style="text-align: left"></p><p style="text-align: left">We cannot all be Sikhs of God, Veerji, because one cannot be a disciple of the nirgun aspect of Unfathomable God. This is why a Guru is needed. A Guru is the physical presence of a reality greater than human minds can comprehend. You cannot be a disciple of Unknowable consciousness. You can only be a disciple of Guru, who imparts to his chelas this opportunity to become jeevan mukt through opening the tenth door and giving darshan of Waheguru.</p></p> <p style="text-align: left"><span style="color: black">How in the world did you follow Waheguru? By intuition? You didn't bother with the man-made rehits....</span></p><p style="text-align: left"></p> <p style="text-align: left"></p><p style="text-align: left">Veerji, first of all the ShabadGuruji is laaridar saroop, very difficult to read. And there are points of contention in Gursikhi, because people all have different minds and understandings. This isn't bad, it makes things lively. Bhai Gurdas was the scribe of Guru Arjun Dev and penned much of the Siri Guru Granth Sahib Ji in his own hand directly from the Guru's instruction. Reading vaars of Bhai Gurdas can help clear up contentious points of interpretation in Gurbani.</p> <p style="text-align: left"><span style="color: black">Sikh religion actually provides a lot of checks and balances and secondary sources of clarification to avoid internal contradiction or independant interpretation. It's impossible to approach this religion as you would Christianity where the definitions are so broad and so ancient that hundreds of individual interpretations compete for validity. Sikhism is very clear. And what you are teaching and promoting is <strong>anti-Gurmat.</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align: left"></p><p style="text-align: left"> <span style="color: black">If you are a submitted disciple of Satguruji, it will take you into the sadhsangat, not off on a beaten track, not off into Bahai religion. Independant truth-seeking is the antithesis of being a Sikh, a disciple, a follower of Guru. One reason you don't like to debate religion, yet you are on forums is you are preaching errors and avoiding correction. Analyze what you are saying with accepted Gursikhi. You have to admit you contradict mainstream Sikh teaching. You should have enough humility to realize that maybe you shouldn't be teaching in the name of Sikhism or criticizing Sikhism.</span></p></p> <p style="text-align: left"></p> <p style="text-align: left"><span style="color: black">Veerji, what you are doing, is liable to punishment. All</span><span style="color: black"> I read in your blog, in your posts is arguing against the answers. You aren't annoying, you're disrespectful of Sikhism, and you're teaching false things in it's name. If I'm a</span><span style="color: black">nnoying" to Gursikh elders, I ask them for forgiveness. I don't justify my own errors by criticizing their "hard talk." They don't owe you any respect. But if you are a disciple of this path, you owe them a great deal of respect. Especially Panj Piare who are G</span><span style="color: black">uruji's own saroop.</span></p> <p style="text-align: left"></p> <p style="text-align: left"> <span style="color: black">According to Gurbani you must be part of a sangat. You cannot do Sikhi on your own. You cannot just read Gur</span><span style="color: black">bani. You have to learn Gurmukhi</span><span style="color: black">. You have to be submitted to Guru before you can have any kind of understanding. And as a Sikh, you have to conform your opinions</span><span style="color: black"> to the Panth. </span></p> </p></p> <p style="text-align: left"></p><p style="text-align: left"><p style="text-align: left"><span style="color: black">I'm not assuming what you're doing. I can quote you word for word if you like. Guru Nanak Dev Ji was not a prophet or a great teacher. He is living Guru. See, this is the kind of falsehood and distortion you promote. Guru Nanak Dev Ji is not a manifestation like the Baha'ullah or Jesus. That's your interpretation. But when someone tells you thats incorrect Sikh teaching, you just go on like a lawnmower and say all these Sikhs are wrong, you alone are right on the basis of individual self-authority and contine to speak for what Sikhism is or isn't, criticizing and correcting based on your own, erroneous opinions. </span></p></p> <p style="text-align: left"></p> <p style="text-align: left"></p><p style="text-align: left"><span style="color: black">You are blaming your personal experiences on others, and do not have eyes to see that your own actions have ostracized you. Not only do you have wrong opinions about Sikhism, you are publically promoting your own opinions over "man-made rehits." So</span><span style="color: black">me of the scholars who wrote Rehitnamay heard from the Guru's own lips. DIRECTLY! The Khalsa Panth is a corporate entity, the sargun saroop of Gu</span><span style="color: black">ruji and has put together the Rehit Maryada.</span></p> <p style="text-align: left"> <span style="color: black">You are deliberately skirting the answer. It's not anything to do with what Bahais do. But pointing out that you cannot be your own authority in the name of Sikh religion, because the secondary sources for Sikhism prevent internal contradiction and independent interpretation, which is what you are doing. Not to follow teachings of Bahai's is NOT the same as denouncing prophets. Again, Guruji is not a prophet. And we are NOT told to study other religious faiths. Why would we do this when we have Shabadguru? When we have our own religious path?</span></p> </p></p> <p style="text-align: left"></p><p style="text-align: left">Why are you promoting that Sikhs can interchangeably follow any teaching, or any path or any guru/prophet/incarnation as it suits them, while still calling themselves the name of Sikh? If someone is a Sikh, shishya, he is committed to, he is disciple of a True Guru. That path and command he follows, not another.</p> <p style="text-align: left"><p style="text-align: left"></p></p> <p style="text-align: left"></p> <p style="text-align: left"></p><p style="text-align: left"> <span style="color: black">You abandoned Sikh religion, what do you think?</span></p> <p style="text-align: left"><span style="color: black">But you are not submitted to Guruji, so what's the point?</span></p> <p style="text-align: left"></p> </p> </p></blockquote> <p style="text-align: left"><p style="text-align: left"><p style="text-align: left"> <span style="color: black">Your posts and blog are filled with your interpretation, criticisms, and correction of what you feel is wrong with Sikh religion. Do you deny this? Naturally such positions provoke a response. Or do you deny this too? </span></p> <p style="text-align: left"><span style="color: black">Do you think such negative criticism of Sikhs and Sikhi is NOT argumentative? We should all sit back and unquestioningly be taught by the likes of you without responding? The Sikh community is putting on a display pretending to be Sikhi, while you who publically renounce Sikhism make yourself some kind of authority of proper Sikh teaching. You can't see how crazy and imbalanced this is?</span></p> </p> </p><p>[/QUOTE]</p>
[QUOTE="Harjas Kaur Khalsa, post: 53533, member: 2125"] [COLOR=navy][/COLOR] [COLOR=black]I am challenging the corruptions of Sikh definitions and criticisms of Sikh practice in what you are saying publically. Veerji, I don't mean you harm, but please examine some of the errors in what you are saying. I wish you greatest blessings. But this teaching Sikhism to Sikhs full of errors and misunderstandings and radical new self-definitions is off the wall. Especially since you have publically renounced Sikhism and embraced Bahai religion. You don't see anything distorted in that?[/COLOR] You said on another forum [LEFT]So from this which was written a few months ago, it says it will be quite some time before you even read Siri Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaaj. And you have never taken amrit. Veerji, you never became a disciple of Guruji. You never embraced this religious path or learned what it was about. Instead, you jumped into it with all your own ideas about what it should be. I can quote directly from what you've written. You cannot claim to have [B]followed [/B]Sikhism for over a year, because you never followed Sikhism.[/LEFT] [COLOR=navy][COLOR=navy][COLOR=navy][COLOR=navy][COLOR=navy][COLOR=navy][COLOR=navy][COLOR=navy][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR] [/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR] [LEFT][COLOR=navy][/COLOR][/LEFT] [LEFT][COLOR=black]Sikh comes from the word shishya, which is one-half of a Sanskrit concept, Guru-Shishya. There is no such thing as a Shishya without a Guru. [/COLOR]Shishya does not translate into English as "student." It translates into "disciple," one committed to following a Guru. In Sikhism, Sikhs are disciples of Guru Nanak Dev Ji, and all the Jyote manifestations until the Dhan Dhan Siri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. It is very specific what a Sikh is. The generalist terminology in which you are using it as "I'm Sikhi of another manifestation," As to put your abandonment of Sikh religion and Guru to pursue the path of Bahai is some kind of equivalent to Sikhi is complete bhull. [/LEFT] [FONT=WebAkharThick] [FONT=WebAkharThick][FONT=WebAkharThick][COLOR=#800000][FONT=WebAkharThick][COLOR=#800000][FONT=WebAkharThick][COLOR=#800000][FONT=WebAkharThick][COLOR=#800000][FONT=WebAkharThick][COLOR=#800000][FONT=WebAkharThick][COLOR=#800000][FONT=WebAkharThick][COLOR=#800000][FONT=Verdana][FONT=WebAkharThick][COLOR=#800000][FONT=WebAkharThick][COLOR=#800000][FONT=WebAkharThick][COLOR=#800000][FONT=Verdana][FONT=WebAkharThick][COLOR=#800000][FONT=WebAkharThick][COLOR=#800000][FONT=WebAkharThick][COLOR=#800000][FONT=WebAkharThick][COLOR=#800000][FONT=Verdana][FONT=WebAkharThick][COLOR=#800000][FONT=WebAkharThick][COLOR=#800000][FONT=WebAkharThick][COLOR=#800000][FONT=Verdana][FONT=WebAkharThick][COLOR=#800000][FONT=WebAkharThick][COLOR=#800000][LEFT][LEFT][/left][/left][/COLOR][LEFT][LEFT][/left][/left][/FONT][LEFT][LEFT][/left][/left][/COLOR][LEFT][LEFT][/left][/left][/FONT][LEFT][LEFT][/left][/left][/FONT][LEFT][LEFT][/left][/left][/COLOR][LEFT][LEFT][/left][/left][/FONT][LEFT][LEFT][/left][/left][/COLOR][LEFT][LEFT][/left][/left][/FONT][LEFT][LEFT][/left][/left][/COLOR][LEFT][LEFT][/left][/left][/FONT][LEFT][LEFT][/LEFT] [/LEFT] [/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT][/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT][LEFT][LEFT] [/LEFT] [/LEFT] [/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT] [/COLOR][/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][LEFT] [LEFT] Please be clear out of respect to Sikh religion. You are passing yourself off as something you are not. On a physical level, you have no bond with the Sikh Guru. You are not a Sikh, follower of Sikh Guru. You publically renounced the Sikh religion, which is the path given to us to follow by Guruji, thus you have turned your back on Guru. [COLOR=navy] [/COLOR][COLOR=black]You aren't even aware of how much error and distortion is in your thinking. You cannot follow a Guru, and leave the Guru's path (Sikhism) and say you are still following the same Guru. We are not all Sikhs of one God.[/COLOR] [/LEFT] [LEFT]First the term Jehovah is an Anglicized corruption of the Hebrew Tetragrammaton YHWH, which the Jewish scholars left out all vowels so the word would remain unpronounceable. Later, Christian thologians in flagrant violation of Jewish teaching, rendered the word Yahweh, and used it in casual speech. Another violation of Jewish teaching, because YHWH represented an unknowable aspect of creator God, like nirguna. To speak this uncreated, infinite potential with finite lips was to render it another, finite meaning which invalidated the concept. To further corrupt matters, the term Jehovah has no Hebrew linguistic equivalent. The word is simply derived as God's name, like a human being has a given name which is a parallel to idolatry, or worship of a recognizable form.[/LEFT] [LEFT]And in addition to that, according to Christian theologians, Jehovah God is the same equivalent as Jesus the human being, who possesses dual natures, both divine and human. Thus, to refer to Waheguru as equivalent to Jehovah, is to call Waheguru as Jesus the man-God, clearly an idolatrous concept. I'm afraid if you analyze religious terms, one has to acknowledge things are not equivalents, but very defined contradictory teachings.[/LEFT] [LEFT]Waheguru according to the vaars of Bhai Gurdas is V for Vishnu, H for Har, G for Gobind and R for Ram. I do not believe for one moment any Christian will accept this definition of God as being equivalent to Jehovah. Now, on another level, yes there is one God, and we call him different things. But what I'm highlighting is be careful with definitions. YHWH does have a parallel to Waheguru but not Jehovah, because in Sikhism God is not an incarnated being like Jesus.[/LEFT] [LEFT]We cannot all be Sikhs of God, Veerji, because one cannot be a disciple of the nirgun aspect of Unfathomable God. This is why a Guru is needed. A Guru is the physical presence of a reality greater than human minds can comprehend. You cannot be a disciple of Unknowable consciousness. You can only be a disciple of Guru, who imparts to his chelas this opportunity to become jeevan mukt through opening the tenth door and giving darshan of Waheguru.[/LEFT] [COLOR=navy][COLOR=navy] [/COLOR][/COLOR][COLOR=black]How in the world did you follow Waheguru? By intuition? You didn't bother with the man-made rehits....[/COLOR] [LEFT] [LEFT]Veerji, first of all the ShabadGuruji is laaridar saroop, very difficult to read. And there are points of contention in Gursikhi, because people all have different minds and understandings. This isn't bad, it makes things lively. Bhai Gurdas was the scribe of Guru Arjun Dev and penned much of the Siri Guru Granth Sahib Ji in his own hand directly from the Guru's instruction. Reading vaars of Bhai Gurdas can help clear up contentious points of interpretation in Gurbani. [COLOR=black]Sikh religion actually provides a lot of checks and balances and secondary sources of clarification to avoid internal contradiction or independant interpretation. It's impossible to approach this religion as you would Christianity where the definitions are so broad and so ancient that hundreds of individual interpretations compete for validity. Sikhism is very clear. And what you are teaching and promoting is [B]anti-Gurmat.[/B][/COLOR] [LEFT][COLOR=navy][COLOR=navy] [/COLOR][/COLOR][COLOR=black]If you are a submitted disciple of Satguruji, it will take you into the sadhsangat, not off on a beaten track, not off into Bahai religion. Independant truth-seeking is the antithesis of being a Sikh, a disciple, a follower of Guru. One reason you don't like to debate religion, yet you are on forums is you are preaching errors and avoiding correction. Analyze what you are saying with accepted Gursikhi. You have to admit you contradict mainstream Sikh teaching. You should have enough humility to realize that maybe you shouldn't be teaching in the name of Sikhism or criticizing Sikhism.[/COLOR][/LEFT] [COLOR=navy][COLOR=navy] [/COLOR][/COLOR][COLOR=black]Veerji, what you are doing, is liable to punishment. All[/COLOR][COLOR=black] I read in your blog, in your posts is arguing against the answers. You aren't annoying, you're disrespectful of Sikhism, and you're teaching false things in it's name. If I'm a[/COLOR][COLOR=black]nnoying" to Gursikh elders, I ask them for forgiveness. I don't justify my own errors by criticizing their "hard talk." They don't owe you any respect. But if you are a disciple of this path, you owe them a great deal of respect. Especially Panj Piare who are G[/COLOR][COLOR=black]uruji's own saroop.[/COLOR] [/LEFT] [LEFT] [COLOR=black]According to Gurbani you must be part of a sangat. You cannot do Sikhi on your own. You cannot just read Gur[/COLOR][COLOR=black]bani. You have to learn Gurmukhi[/COLOR][COLOR=black]. You have to be submitted to Guru before you can have any kind of understanding. And as a Sikh, you have to conform your opinions[/COLOR][COLOR=black] to the Panth. [/COLOR][/LEFT] [/LEFT] [LEFT][LEFT][COLOR=black]I'm not assuming what you're doing. I can quote you word for word if you like. Guru Nanak Dev Ji was not a prophet or a great teacher. He is living Guru. See, this is the kind of falsehood and distortion you promote. Guru Nanak Dev Ji is not a manifestation like the Baha'ullah or Jesus. That's your interpretation. But when someone tells you thats incorrect Sikh teaching, you just go on like a lawnmower and say all these Sikhs are wrong, you alone are right on the basis of individual self-authority and contine to speak for what Sikhism is or isn't, criticizing and correcting based on your own, erroneous opinions. [/COLOR][/LEFT] [LEFT][COLOR=black]You are blaming your personal experiences on others, and do not have eyes to see that your own actions have ostracized you. Not only do you have wrong opinions about Sikhism, you are publically promoting your own opinions over "man-made rehits." So[/COLOR][COLOR=black]me of the scholars who wrote Rehitnamay heard from the Guru's own lips. DIRECTLY! The Khalsa Panth is a corporate entity, the sargun saroop of Gu[/COLOR][COLOR=black]ruji and has put together the Rehit Maryada.[/COLOR][/LEFT] [LEFT] [COLOR=black]You are deliberately skirting the answer. It's not anything to do with what Bahais do. But pointing out that you cannot be your own authority in the name of Sikh religion, because the secondary sources for Sikhism prevent internal contradiction and independent interpretation, which is what you are doing. Not to follow teachings of Bahai's is NOT the same as denouncing prophets. Again, Guruji is not a prophet. And we are NOT told to study other religious faiths. Why would we do this when we have Shabadguru? When we have our own religious path?[/COLOR][/LEFT] [/LEFT] [LEFT]Why are you promoting that Sikhs can interchangeably follow any teaching, or any path or any guru/prophet/incarnation as it suits them, while still calling themselves the name of Sikh? If someone is a Sikh, shishya, he is committed to, he is disciple of a True Guru. That path and command he follows, not another.[/LEFT] [LEFT][LEFT][/LEFT] [LEFT][COLOR=navy][COLOR=navy][B] [/B][/COLOR][/COLOR][COLOR=black]You abandoned Sikh religion, what do you think?[/COLOR] [COLOR=navy] [/COLOR][COLOR=black]But you are not submitted to Guruji, so what's the point?[/COLOR] [COLOR=navy][COLOR=navy][/COLOR][/COLOR][/quote] [COLOR=black]Your posts and blog are filled with your interpretation, criticisms, and correction of what you feel is wrong with Sikh religion. Do you deny this? Naturally such positions provoke a response. Or do you deny this too? [/COLOR] [COLOR=black]Do you think such negative criticism of Sikhs and Sikhi is NOT argumentative? We should all sit back and unquestioningly be taught by the likes of you without responding? The Sikh community is putting on a display pretending to be Sikhi, while you who publically renounce Sikhism make yourself some kind of authority of proper Sikh teaching. You can't see how crazy and imbalanced this is?[/COLOR][/LEFT] [/LEFT] [/LEFT] [/QUOTE]
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