☀️ JOIN SPN MOBILE
Forums
New posts
Guru Granth Sahib
Composition, Arrangement & Layout
ਜਪੁ | Jup
ਸੋ ਦਰੁ | So Dar
ਸੋਹਿਲਾ | Sohilaa
ਰਾਗੁ ਸਿਰੀਰਾਗੁ | Raag Siree-Raag
Gurbani (14-53)
Ashtpadiyan (53-71)
Gurbani (71-74)
Pahre (74-78)
Chhant (78-81)
Vanjara (81-82)
Vaar Siri Raag (83-91)
Bhagat Bani (91-93)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਝ | Raag Maajh
Gurbani (94-109)
Ashtpadi (109)
Ashtpadiyan (110-129)
Ashtpadi (129-130)
Ashtpadiyan (130-133)
Bara Maha (133-136)
Din Raen (136-137)
Vaar Maajh Ki (137-150)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗਉੜੀ | Raag Gauree
Gurbani (151-185)
Quartets/Couplets (185-220)
Ashtpadiyan (220-234)
Karhalei (234-235)
Ashtpadiyan (235-242)
Chhant (242-249)
Baavan Akhari (250-262)
Sukhmani (262-296)
Thittee (296-300)
Gauree kii Vaar (300-323)
Gurbani (323-330)
Ashtpadiyan (330-340)
Baavan Akhari (340-343)
Thintteen (343-344)
Vaar Kabir (344-345)
Bhagat Bani (345-346)
ਰਾਗੁ ਆਸਾ | Raag Aasaa
Gurbani (347-348)
Chaupaday (348-364)
Panchpadde (364-365)
Kaafee (365-409)
Aasaavaree (409-411)
Ashtpadiyan (411-432)
Patee (432-435)
Chhant (435-462)
Vaar Aasaa (462-475)
Bhagat Bani (475-488)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗੂਜਰੀ | Raag Goojaree
Gurbani (489-503)
Ashtpadiyan (503-508)
Vaar Gujari (508-517)
Vaar Gujari (517-526)
ਰਾਗੁ ਦੇਵਗੰਧਾਰੀ | Raag Dayv-Gandhaaree
Gurbani (527-536)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਿਹਾਗੜਾ | Raag Bihaagraa
Gurbani (537-556)
Chhant (538-548)
Vaar Bihaagraa (548-556)
ਰਾਗੁ ਵਡਹੰਸ | Raag Wadhans
Gurbani (557-564)
Ashtpadiyan (564-565)
Chhant (565-575)
Ghoriaan (575-578)
Alaahaniiaa (578-582)
Vaar Wadhans (582-594)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸੋਰਠਿ | Raag Sorath
Gurbani (595-634)
Asatpadhiya (634-642)
Vaar Sorath (642-659)
ਰਾਗੁ ਧਨਾਸਰੀ | Raag Dhanasaree
Gurbani (660-685)
Astpadhiya (685-687)
Chhant (687-691)
Bhagat Bani (691-695)
ਰਾਗੁ ਜੈਤਸਰੀ | Raag Jaitsree
Gurbani (696-703)
Chhant (703-705)
Vaar Jaitsaree (705-710)
Bhagat Bani (710)
ਰਾਗੁ ਟੋਡੀ | Raag Todee
ਰਾਗੁ ਬੈਰਾੜੀ | Raag Bairaaree
ਰਾਗੁ ਤਿਲੰਗ | Raag Tilang
Gurbani (721-727)
Bhagat Bani (727)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸੂਹੀ | Raag Suhi
Gurbani (728-750)
Ashtpadiyan (750-761)
Kaafee (761-762)
Suchajee (762)
Gunvantee (763)
Chhant (763-785)
Vaar Soohee (785-792)
Bhagat Bani (792-794)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਿਲਾਵਲੁ | Raag Bilaaval
Gurbani (795-831)
Ashtpadiyan (831-838)
Thitteen (838-840)
Vaar Sat (841-843)
Chhant (843-848)
Vaar Bilaaval (849-855)
Bhagat Bani (855-858)
ਰਾਗੁ ਗੋਂਡ | Raag Gond
Gurbani (859-869)
Ashtpadiyan (869)
Bhagat Bani (870-875)
ਰਾਗੁ ਰਾਮਕਲੀ | Raag Ramkalee
Ashtpadiyan (902-916)
Gurbani (876-902)
Anand (917-922)
Sadd (923-924)
Chhant (924-929)
Dakhnee (929-938)
Sidh Gosat (938-946)
Vaar Ramkalee (947-968)
ਰਾਗੁ ਨਟ ਨਾਰਾਇਨ | Raag Nat Narayan
Gurbani (975-980)
Ashtpadiyan (980-983)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਲੀ ਗਉੜਾ | Raag Maalee Gauraa
Gurbani (984-988)
Bhagat Bani (988)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਾਰੂ | Raag Maaroo
Gurbani (889-1008)
Ashtpadiyan (1008-1014)
Kaafee (1014-1016)
Ashtpadiyan (1016-1019)
Anjulian (1019-1020)
Solhe (1020-1033)
Dakhni (1033-1043)
ਰਾਗੁ ਤੁਖਾਰੀ | Raag Tukhaari
Bara Maha (1107-1110)
Chhant (1110-1117)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕੇਦਾਰਾ | Raag Kedara
Gurbani (1118-1123)
Bhagat Bani (1123-1124)
ਰਾਗੁ ਭੈਰਉ | Raag Bhairo
Gurbani (1125-1152)
Partaal (1153)
Ashtpadiyan (1153-1167)
ਰਾਗੁ ਬਸੰਤੁ | Raag Basant
Gurbani (1168-1187)
Ashtpadiyan (1187-1193)
Vaar Basant (1193-1196)
ਰਾਗੁ ਸਾਰਗ | Raag Saarag
Gurbani (1197-1200)
Partaal (1200-1231)
Ashtpadiyan (1232-1236)
Chhant (1236-1237)
Vaar Saarang (1237-1253)
ਰਾਗੁ ਮਲਾਰ | Raag Malaar
Gurbani (1254-1293)
Partaal (1265-1273)
Ashtpadiyan (1273-1278)
Chhant (1278)
Vaar Malaar (1278-91)
Bhagat Bani (1292-93)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕਾਨੜਾ | Raag Kaanraa
Gurbani (1294-96)
Partaal (1296-1318)
Ashtpadiyan (1308-1312)
Chhant (1312)
Vaar Kaanraa
Bhagat Bani (1318)
ਰਾਗੁ ਕਲਿਆਨ | Raag Kalyaan
Gurbani (1319-23)
Ashtpadiyan (1323-26)
ਰਾਗੁ ਪ੍ਰਭਾਤੀ | Raag Prabhaatee
Gurbani (1327-1341)
Ashtpadiyan (1342-51)
ਰਾਗੁ ਜੈਜਾਵੰਤੀ | Raag Jaijaiwanti
Gurbani (1352-53)
Salok | Gatha | Phunahe | Chaubole | Swayiye
Sehskritee Mahala 1
Sehskritee Mahala 5
Gaathaa Mahala 5
Phunhay Mahala 5
Chaubolae Mahala 5
Shaloks Bhagat Kabir
Shaloks Sheikh Farid
Swaiyyae Mahala 5
Swaiyyae in Praise of Gurus
Shaloks in Addition To Vaars
Shalok Ninth Mehl
Mundavanee Mehl 5
ਰਾਗ ਮਾਲਾ, Raag Maalaa
What's new
New posts
New media
New media comments
New resources
Latest activity
Videos
New media
New comments
Library
Latest reviews
Donate
Log in
Register
What's new
New posts
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Welcome to all New Sikh Philosophy Network Forums!
Explore Sikh Sikhi Sikhism...
Sign up
Log in
Discussions
Hard Talk
Akhand Paath In Languages Other Than The Original
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Chaan Pardesi" data-source="post: 168494" data-attributes="member: 7047"><p>[[[The alternative for someone who doesn't understand Punjabi etc fluently is to listen to an interrupted barrage of nonsense (to their ears). The reader could be speaking TellyTubby language and the listener would be none the wiser. (this is an extreme example to illustrate the point and disrespect to Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj is NOT intended)</p><p> </p><p> </p><p><u>If the listener doesn't understand then the act is bordering on ritual unless the are listening with some other intention</u>.]]]</p><p> </p><p> </p><p> </p><p>The answer is simple & straightforward..and has been seen in practice and proven.The American Sikh converts all speak excellent english!BUT all their patth pooja is conducted in Punjabi; despite the fact their first introduction to Sikhi was in English, or for the sake of pulling hairs here and there, say it is in AMERICAN English!</p><p> </p><p>If a driver does not understand the laws of traffic and has no road sense, then just because he has the key and knows how to start the car , does not qualify him to drive!</p><p> </p><p>Neither can he decide that as he understands roads run this way and that way, he simply drives this way or that way!Rules are present in any society!</p><p> </p><p> </p><p>Thus, if one wishes genuine understanding in any subject or religion, one has to make efforts to learn the knowledge and rules of that and understand how certain practices are conducted.</p><p> </p><p> </p><p>Just as one cannot be building ten mile long bridges across seas simply from reading books; or reading from a translated version of Punjabi, from English! </p><p> </p><p> </p><p> </p><p>If I dont understand farsi in the company of Afghans , then it is my misfortune that I dont have the skill;nothing comes platted on a platter like many expect these days.The afghans are not going to change their language that has history for the sake of one me,for one day or ten minutes.. that has no knowledge and understanding of their language.Someone may interpret and explain but that does not qualify me an expert in farsi!</p><p> </p><p> </p><p> </p><p> </p><p>If one wishes to be a teletubby-than that is their own bringing! I see many today even among the Punjabis who are more than teletubbies..instead are busy rattling on their own teletubby language and have no clue what the paathi is rendering through his ucharan of the Guru Granth Sahib..so the issue of the language being in Punjabi or not has no bearing upon such teletubbies!It does not make them non teletubbies simply because they can speak Punjabi- but as they dont understand, it is easier to remain a teletubby for them.</p><p> </p><p> </p><p>There is so much of an expectation of everything on the platter these days...I grew up in a small town with no Punjabi school; no gurmukhi or learning facilities in the gurduara, but because of the need to know and my own interests in the language and religion.. I pained to learn the Punjabi language, and struggled through to learn abt Guru Granth sahib...without any supervison but making sure I did it correctly listening to and reading of others..now I have been commented to be a clear and and correct Ucharian - paatthi of Guru Granth sahib, thanks to the Guru sahib!</p><p> </p><p> </p><p> </p><p>If I had sat around like the teletubbies and expect the humans change and accept my teletubby language simply because I dont understand theirs, human progress would have not come abt!</p><p> </p><p>Life is more than often not fair, nor offers an equal opportunity for all...like some understand to differentiate between what has been explained , others will go on about the bush...there is absolutely nothing stopping one to learn about Guru Granth sahib and sikhi in any language, but there is certain protocols in sangat that have to be conducted by certain people in certain manner.</p><p> </p><p>I have seen many people who have become mona, have ability to conduct their patth in the Gurus language, BUT, the BIG BUT they cannot conduct the same in the sangat nor sit in the tabiya of the Guru Granth sahib in the darbar sahib!Yet there is absolutely nothing short comming in their ability to conduct the patth in Punjabi.These people have also become another brand of teletubbies, sadly!</p><p> </p><p>Finally, the parampara of the Sikh code of conduct does not allow a patth in the tranliterated versions and I dont see any possibility of that.</p><p> </p><p>Islam is a good example.There are hudereds translated versions of the Koran in almost all languages of the world; but all prayers are still conducted in their mosque through the traditional language of Arabic- despite that one muslim from Africa into the mosque will not understand another muslim that has come from Indonesia - but the Koran joins them in ONE language.That has not turned them into teletubbies; yet Sikhs come with hundereds of excuses that they may as well be teletubies; well I say than it is their own fault, but no boy's else!Gurfateh.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Chaan Pardesi, post: 168494, member: 7047"] [[[The alternative for someone who doesn't understand Punjabi etc fluently is to listen to an interrupted barrage of nonsense (to their ears). The reader could be speaking TellyTubby language and the listener would be none the wiser. (this is an extreme example to illustrate the point and disrespect to Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj is NOT intended) [U]If the listener doesn't understand then the act is bordering on ritual unless the are listening with some other intention[/U].]]] The answer is simple & straightforward..and has been seen in practice and proven.The American Sikh converts all speak excellent english!BUT all their patth pooja is conducted in Punjabi; despite the fact their first introduction to Sikhi was in English, or for the sake of pulling hairs here and there, say it is in AMERICAN English! If a driver does not understand the laws of traffic and has no road sense, then just because he has the key and knows how to start the car , does not qualify him to drive! Neither can he decide that as he understands roads run this way and that way, he simply drives this way or that way!Rules are present in any society! Thus, if one wishes genuine understanding in any subject or religion, one has to make efforts to learn the knowledge and rules of that and understand how certain practices are conducted. Just as one cannot be building ten mile long bridges across seas simply from reading books; or reading from a translated version of Punjabi, from English! If I dont understand farsi in the company of Afghans , then it is my misfortune that I dont have the skill;nothing comes platted on a platter like many expect these days.The afghans are not going to change their language that has history for the sake of one me,for one day or ten minutes.. that has no knowledge and understanding of their language.Someone may interpret and explain but that does not qualify me an expert in farsi! If one wishes to be a teletubby-than that is their own bringing! I see many today even among the Punjabis who are more than teletubbies..instead are busy rattling on their own teletubby language and have no clue what the paathi is rendering through his ucharan of the Guru Granth Sahib..so the issue of the language being in Punjabi or not has no bearing upon such teletubbies!It does not make them non teletubbies simply because they can speak Punjabi- but as they dont understand, it is easier to remain a teletubby for them. There is so much of an expectation of everything on the platter these days...I grew up in a small town with no Punjabi school; no gurmukhi or learning facilities in the gurduara, but because of the need to know and my own interests in the language and religion.. I pained to learn the Punjabi language, and struggled through to learn abt Guru Granth sahib...without any supervison but making sure I did it correctly listening to and reading of others..now I have been commented to be a clear and and correct Ucharian - paatthi of Guru Granth sahib, thanks to the Guru sahib! If I had sat around like the teletubbies and expect the humans change and accept my teletubby language simply because I dont understand theirs, human progress would have not come abt! Life is more than often not fair, nor offers an equal opportunity for all...like some understand to differentiate between what has been explained , others will go on about the bush...there is absolutely nothing stopping one to learn about Guru Granth sahib and sikhi in any language, but there is certain protocols in sangat that have to be conducted by certain people in certain manner. I have seen many people who have become mona, have ability to conduct their patth in the Gurus language, BUT, the BIG BUT they cannot conduct the same in the sangat nor sit in the tabiya of the Guru Granth sahib in the darbar sahib!Yet there is absolutely nothing short comming in their ability to conduct the patth in Punjabi.These people have also become another brand of teletubbies, sadly! Finally, the parampara of the Sikh code of conduct does not allow a patth in the tranliterated versions and I dont see any possibility of that. Islam is a good example.There are hudereds translated versions of the Koran in almost all languages of the world; but all prayers are still conducted in their mosque through the traditional language of Arabic- despite that one muslim from Africa into the mosque will not understand another muslim that has come from Indonesia - but the Koran joins them in ONE language.That has not turned them into teletubbies; yet Sikhs come with hundereds of excuses that they may as well be teletubies; well I say than it is their own fault, but no boy's else!Gurfateh. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Discussions
Hard Talk
Akhand Paath In Languages Other Than The Original
This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
Accept
Learn more…
Top