Is Hindu/Sikh a Valid Adherent?

harry haller · #1 (**permalink**) 28-Jan-2012, 15:05 PM

Gurfatehji

A subject that needs some validation, I am aware that it is not uncommon for Hindus to also pray to Guru Nanakji, which I take as a huge compliment, but given the myriad of deities that Hindus have available to them, it does not seem unreasonable for a Hindu to do this.

However, some Hindus feel this should be reciprocated by our acceptance and worship of these deities, which is simply impossible under the SRM which clearly states:-

Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/sikh-sikhi-sikhism/37952-is-hindu-sikh-a-valid-adherent.html
Article I – Definition of Sikh

Any human being who faithfully believes in:
• One Immortal Being
• Ten Gurus, from Guru Nanak Dev to Guru Gobind Singh
• The Guru Granth Sahib
• The utterances and teachings of the ten Gurus
• The baptism bequeathed by the tenth Guru, and who does not owe allegiance to any other religion, is a Sikh.

I am aware that some people use the adherent Hindu/Sikh, but how can the teachings be anything other than a melting pot of contradictory opinions and concepts?

Hinduism has the caste system, Sikhism has strict rules regarding equality, the fact that these are not followed is another matter....
Hinduism has reincarnation, Sikhism does not
Hinduism has Karma, Sikhism does not
Hinduism is full of rituals and exciting ceremonies, Sikhism has gone out of its way to distance itself from such

I know that there are Sikhs who embrace a lot of Hinduism without even realising it, but there are too many differences, the end result is a confusion.

I have nothing against the Hindu religion, I have a lot of respect for the many Gods and Goddesses, I have respect for the right of anyone to worship anything they so wish, but do I believe they existed? No, of course not, I am a Sikh, I believe only in Creator that has no birth or death and without form, and that invalidates the Hindu Gods, so I cannot believe in them, although any concept that agrees with Sikhi, I am happy to embrace, but with the direction coming from Creator, not Idols.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=37952

As a Sikh, Creator Created, and that is it, its boring, its not exciting, no bells and whistles, no fire or sun worship, just simple tuning into Creators voice to achieve salvation with the minimum of fuss and ceremony.

So I would be interested in comments as to what a Hindu/Sikh actually is

Navdeep88 · #2 (**permalink**) 28-Jan-2012, 18:32 PM

Harry Ji,

This is just a personal perspective... but I think someone identifying themselves as Hindu/Sikh is someone who has little idea of who they are... haha! even less than me!

harry haller · #3 (**permalink**) 28-Jan-2012, 18:33 PM

I would rather be on a path, any path, than going round in circles Bhain ji

Kamala · #4 (**permalink**) 28-Jan-2012, 22:47 PM

MOST OF YOUR FACTS ARE WRONG WRONG WRONG.

Sikhism does believe in the 840sky/water reincarnations and believes in KARMA. Although, I musat agree that Sikhism does restrict the caste system, many traditional indian Sikhs still use it, I can gurantee to you over 90% of Sikhs do take the caste system seriously, but in different ways, as in like some people only let their jatt sons marry jatt ladys instead of chamar girls. We also do have cerimonies like Holamahala which is almost identical to Hindu Holi. Why do you think the guru ji made the same so similar? It isn't a coincedence. You are making our religion seem abrahamic, but really we are dharmic.

prakash.s.bagga · #5 (**permalink**) 28-Jan-2012, 23:04 PM

It should be interesting to know who has given definition to Sikhs.??
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=37952
One should always respect the other faiths and philosophies. Adhering to a particuar philosophy is individuals right.But this does not allow disrepect for others.This has been the way of thinking of Sikh GuRus.
Prakash.S.Bagga

harry haller · #6 (**permalink**) 28-Jan-2012, 23:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamala

MOST OF YOUR FACTS ARE WRONG WRONG WRONG.

Sikhism does believe in the 840sky/water reincarnations and believes in KARMA. Although, I musat agree that Sikhism does restrict the caste system, many traditional indian Sikhs still use it, I can gurantee to you over 90% of Sikhs do take the caste system seriously, but in different ways, as in like some people only let their jatt sons marry jatt ladys instead of chamar girls. We also do have cerimonies like Holamahala which is almost identical to Hindu Holi. Why do you think the guru ji made the same so similar? It isn't a coincedence. You are making our religion seem abrahamic, but really we are dharmic.

Kamalaji

Many thanks for your post, I note you are in fact Hindu/Sikh, so what a wonderful chance for me satisfy my question by interacting with a knowledgeable person of the very adherent that I find confusing.

Firstly let us ponder the wise words of the SRM on the subject:-

A Sikh’s living, earning livelihood, thinking and conduct should accord with the Guru’s tenets. The Guru’s tenets are:
a. Worship should be rendered only to the One Timeless Being and to no god or goddess.
b. Regarding the ten Gurus, the Guru Granth and the ten Gurus word alone as saviors and holy objects of veneration.
c. Regarding ten Gurus as the effulgence of one light and one single entity.
d. Not believing in cast or descent, untouchability, magic, spells, incantation, omens, auspicious times, days and occasions, influence of start, horoscopic dispositions, shradh (ritual serving of food to priests for the salvation of ancestors on appointed days as per the lunar calendar), ancestor worship, khiah (ritual serving of food to priests - Brahmins - on the lunar anniversaries of the death of an ancestor), pind , there is more,

http://www.gurunanakdarbar.net/sikhrehatmaryada.pdf

So Kamalaji, please educate me as to how you can possibly be a Sikh? if you believe in points (d), which seems to go dead against the SRM.

Also when you say 'We' I find it most confusing, do you mean 'We' Hindus? 'We' Sikhs or 'We' Hindu/Sikhs?

I look forward to your clarification on the matter, thank you

harry haller · #7 (**permalink**) 28-Jan-2012, 23:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prakash.s.bagga

It should be interesting to know who has given definition to Sikhs.??
One should always respect the other faiths and philosophies. Adhering to a particuar philosophy is individuals right.But this does not allow disrepect for others.This has been the way of thinking of Sikh GuRus.
Prakash.S.Bagga

Prakashji,

Out of respect I have tended to not really get involved in debate with you, however as you have so kindly contributed to this thread, I feel honour bound to reply,

It should be interesting to know who has given definition to Sikhs.??

Well, that would probably be the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji and for clarification on interpretation, the SRM, would you not say?

One should always respect the other faiths and philosophies

I have not shown any disrespect for any faith, I have merely said I do not believe in them any more than I believe in the tooth fairy, however, I respect all faiths and the right of anyone to follow whatever faith they choose. I am quite fond of the saying, if you are a Hindu, be a good Hindu, if you are a Muslim, be a good Muslim, and if you are a Sikh, be a good Sikh

I note that you use the phrase 'definition to Sikhs' as if you were speaking as someone who is not a Sikh, kindly explain

Kamala · #8 (**permalink**) 28-Jan-2012, 23:47 PM

Mr.Haller, there is a difference between beleiving in a goddess/god and beleiveing they existed. I do not go to mandirs and pray to the gods/goddesses, I go to the mandir to pay my respects to them. I beleive that those goddesses/gods do exists and are real. That is the part where I say I am half Hindu on this forum because most of you do not believe the gods didn't even exist, when in fact there are many storys from the past between ~700 years that they have came prakat. I am Sikh and I bleive the gods EXISTED.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=37952
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=37952

Namashkar.

harry haller · #9 (**permalink**) 29-Jan-2012, 00:10 AM

Kamalaji

you seem confused, as do some of your posts, but then that is not surprising given your above statements.

Simply put, you are not a Sikh, its very simple, here is another extract that you fail miserably on

Not believing in or according any authority to Muslim seers, Brahmins holiness, soothsayers, clairvoyants, oracles, promise of an offering on the fulfillment of a wish, offering of sweet loaves or rice pudding at graves on fulfillment of wishes, the Vedas, the Shastras, the Gayatri (Hindu scriptural prayer unto the sun), the Gita, the Quran, the Bible, etc.. However, the study of the books of other faiths for general self-education is
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=37952
admissible

So by your admission, you believe that these gods and goddesses existed, although you do not worship them , your beliefs are against the code of Sikhs, the SRM, you are not educating yourself, you believe they existed, sorry, but you are not a Sikh...
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=37952

I have no problem with your opinions, but they are the opinions of a non Sikh, please do not try and pollute Sikhism with the very Vedic practices that the Gurus fought so hard to move away from,

Sat Sri Akal/Namashkar