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Jap(u) Ji Sahib - Question about Pauri 7

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jap ji sahib granth guru, japu, pauri, question, sahib
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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 25-Jul-2008, 00:57 AM
BhagatSingh's Avatar BhagatSingh BhagatSingh is offline
 
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Jap(u) Ji Sahib - Question about Pauri 7

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Ok I've haven't been on this site like forever now. So this is my way of getting back on.
I have a friend who was reading Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji and she pointed out the 9 continents in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji.
I'll paste the whole pauri, below. I want to know what you guys think. To my knowledge there are only 7 continents. I know some say that some continents should be considered one, but that means there are less than 7 continents. So, where do these 9 continents come from.

ਜੇ ਜੁਗ ਚਾਰੇ ਆਰਜਾ ਹੋਰ ਦਸੂਣੀ ਹੋਇ
जे जुग चारे आरजा होर दसूणी होइ ॥
Jė jug cẖārė ārjā hor ḏasūṇī ho*ė.
Even if you could live throughout the four ages, or even ten times more,

ਨਵਾ ਖੰਡਾ ਵਿਚਿ ਜਾਣੀਐ ਨਾਲਿ ਚਲੈ ਸਭੁ ਕੋਇ
नवा खंडा विचि जाणीऐ नालि चलै सभु कोइ ॥
Navā kẖanda vicẖ jāṇī*ai nāl cẖalai sabẖ ko*ė.
and even if you were known throughout the nine continents and followed by all,


ਚੰਗਾ ਨਾਉ ਰਖਾਇ ਕੈ ਜਸੁ ਕੀਰਤਿ ਜਗਿ ਲੇਇ
चंगा नाउ रखाइ कै जसु कीरति जगि लेइ ॥
Cẖanga nā*o rakẖā*ė kai jas kīraṯ jag lė*ė.
with a good name and reputation, with praise and fame throughout the world-

ਜੇ ਤਿਸੁ ਨਦਰਿ ਆਵਈ ਵਾਤ ਪੁਛੈ ਕੇ
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/jap-ji-sahib/22390-jap-u-ji-sahib-question-about.html
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=22390
जे तिसु नदरि न आवई त वात न पुछै के ॥
Jė ṯis naḏar na āvī ṯa vāṯ na pucẖẖai kė.
still, if the Lord does not bless you with His Glance of Grace, then who cares? What is the use?

ਕੀਟਾ ਅੰਦਰਿ ਕੀਟੁ ਕਰਿ ਦੋਸੀ ਦੋਸੁ ਧਰੇ
कीटा अंदरि कीटु करि दोसी दोसु धरे ॥
Kītā anḏar kīt kar ḏosī ḏos ḏẖarė.
Among worms, you would be considered a lowly worm, and even contemptible sinners would hold you in contempt.

ਨਾਨਕ ਨਿਰਗੁਣਿ ਗੁਣੁ ਕਰੇ ਗੁਣਵੰਤਿਆ ਗੁਣੁ ਦੇ
नानक निरगुणि गुणु करे गुणवंतिआ गुणु दे ॥
Nānak nirguṇ guṇ karė guṇvanṯi*ā guṇ ḏė.
O Nanak, God blesses the unworthy with virtue, and bestows virtue on the virtuous.

ਤੇਹਾ ਕੋਇ ਸੁਝਈ ਜਿ ਤਿਸੁ ਗੁਣੁ ਕੋਇ ਕਰੇ ॥੭॥
तेहा कोइ न सुझई जि तिसु गुणु कोइ करे ॥७॥
Ŧėhā ko*ė na sujẖ*ī je ṯis guṇ ko*ė karė. ||7||
No one can even imagine anyone who can bestow virtue upon Him. ||7||




 
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 25-Jul-2008, 01:27 AM
Astroboy's Avatar Astroboy Astroboy is offline
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Re: Jap(u) Ji Sahib - Question about Pauri 7

Compare your given translation with this :-

If one could extend one's life to four ages,(1)
nay make it ten times longer;
If one were known throughout the nine planes of creation;
And everyone therein followed him in respect;
If every creature praised him to the sky:
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=22390
All this and more has no value if God's eye looked not
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=22390
kindly upon him:
Without His goodwill, he will be reckoned as
the meanest worm amongst worms;
And sinners shall charge him with sins.
O Nanak, He bestows virtues on those who have none,
and adds to the store of the virtuous.
But there is naught that can bestow aught upon Him.
(1) Nanak here is referring to the ancient Indian doctrine of the four Yugas or cycles of time, which somewhat parallels the Western belief in the Golden Age, the Silver Age, the Bronze Age and the Iron Age. Nanak makes frequent use of such concepts and doctrines from ancient Hindu lore; but He refers to them not in a spirit of scientific truth, but often as a Divine poet, who employs allusion and mythology to drive home His point.
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  #3 (permalink)  
Old 25-Jul-2008, 02:08 AM
BhagatSingh's Avatar BhagatSingh BhagatSingh is offline
 
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Re: Jap(u) Ji Sahib - Question about Pauri 7

hmm that makes sense.
I was looking up nine continents on google and found that in the Chinese philosophy, there are nine continents.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=22390
But again when Guru SAhib says that God has created infinite worlds and such, then why stick to jsut 9 continents/ planes of creation.
I see how Guru Nanak is talking to a certain audience here, and is refering to what they know.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=22390
But this also relates to the 84 lakh joons. Akal's creation is infinite so why say 84 lakh joon?
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  #4 (permalink)  
Old 25-Jul-2008, 02:22 AM
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Re: Jap(u) Ji Sahib - Question about Pauri 7

In Sukhmani Sahib, there is another reference about Nau Khand.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=22390
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=22390

Nau Khand Prithmi Firrey Chirr Jeevai

and many other references too like this one :-

Page 208, Line 2
ਨਉ ਖੰਡ ਪ੍ਰਿਥਮੀ ਇਸੁ ਤਨ ਮਹਿ ਰਵਿਆ ਨਿਮਖ ਨਿਮਖ ਨਮਸਕਾਰਾ ॥
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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 25-Jul-2008, 02:40 AM
Canuck Singh's Avatar Canuck Singh Canuck Singh is offline
 
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Re: Jap(u) Ji Sahib - Question about Pauri 7

Hmmm interesting...
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 25-Jul-2008, 12:15 PM
BhagatSingh's Avatar BhagatSingh BhagatSingh is offline
 
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Re: Jap(u) Ji Sahib - Question about Pauri 7

yes why again mention that He is in the nine continents of the world when He is everywhere?
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  #7 (permalink)  
Old 26-Jul-2008, 17:20 PM
Gyani Jarnail Singh's Avatar Gyani Jarnail Singh Gyani Jarnail Singh is offline
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Re: Jap(u) Ji Sahib - Question about Pauri 7

its a figure of speech...in relation to common usage of such phrases at that time...Hindus beleived in a certian number of worlds..mulims beleived in a different number of worlds..etc etc.
It doesnt mean Guru Ji is "limiting" to just 9..or 18...or "everywhere"...
Just for arguments sake..
Everywhere" is also a LIMITATION as far as Akal Purakh is concerned..He is BEYOND ALL LINGUISTIC "WORDS".......
we must go for the ESSENCE..the SPIRIT of Gurbani...not split hairs/dissect individual "words"...

In Modern Usage we had the MISS WORLD..( even though she is not really "world") then we had to have MISS UNIVERSE...next will be MISS MILKY WAY..MISS ANDROMEDA......just "words"....merely words...to express an idea...???? similar to Nau Khands..18 nether worlds...???
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=22390
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=22390

The ESSENCE is that AKAL PURAKH IS WAY WAY BEYOND.......whatever word we use will be way way not enough...

Gyani jarnail Singh
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Old 04-Aug-2008, 23:37 PM
onkar singh's Avatar onkar singh onkar singh is offline
 
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Re: Jap(u) Ji Sahib - Question about Pauri 7

Delighted..JAP SATNAM SADHA SATNAM..To improve the quality of life & awarness..
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  #9 (permalink)  
Old 05-Aug-2008, 07:12 AM
Gyani Jarnail Singh's Avatar Gyani Jarnail Singh Gyani Jarnail Singh is offline
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Re: Jap(u) Ji Sahib - Question about Pauri 7

there used to be "nine" planets...for along long time..BUT.....no more !!! as our instruments and scientists get smarter...we can now safely "see" more than 9 in our own family...way way beyond into the universe.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=22390
ONLY GURBANI stays true forever....
Gyani jarnail Singh
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Old 05-Aug-2008, 20:09 PM
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Re: Jap(u) Ji Sahib - Question about Pauri 7

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I also wonder about the Chaursi lakh joona too. Is that also a figure of speech?
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