Translation by Swarn Singh Bains

Ishna · #1 (**permalink**) 26-Jun-2012, 18:59 PM

Gurfatehji

I came across this translation of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji:

http://swarnbains.tripod.com/

Has anyone else perused this translation?

Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/guru-granth-darpan/38719-translation-by-swarn-singh-bains.html
I haven't had a very close look at it yet but at first glance the translation seems quite unique.

For example, here is paurhi 38 and the concluding shalok of Japji Sahib:

Be stable like a mountain, patience like a goldsmith. Be humble like an anvil; repeat the name of God like the repetition of a hammer. Intent like bellows and repeat the name of God from within, as fire gives heat. Make sincerity a pot; mint your mind with the name of God. That is how divinity is achieved. Blessed by God is the only one who can do this. Nanak says, only with God’s grace you can miss God and enjoy the fruit. ||38||
Hymn: Using air as a culture, life has been created by the
reaction of water and earth. The way, day and night begin and end. Same way the whole creation takes birth and dies. Good or bad whatever they do are accounted for in God’s court. Everyone gets the fruit of their deeds, some soon others late. Whoever worked hard to recite the name of God? Nanak says, they have attained salvation and many more have accompanied them.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38719

Is this closer to a word-for-word translation from the original to English than some of the more popular translations?

It is no small task to translate Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji!

Luckysingh · #2 (**permalink**) 27-Jun-2012, 10:41 AM

Ishna ji, a very intersting little discovery here!!!

It's nice to see a slightly different worded version.
I think this author has done very well and has given a simplified translation with more of an essence to it.
It is NOT more closer in terms of word for word as you ask, but from what I have read so far, it does seem of high value.

The problem that you can get with word for word is that it can move away from it's true intended meaning, especially with the many metaphors used.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38719

You may not quite get what I mean, let me explain-

I understand it much better and realise how one can mislead because I've tried and still do attempt translating by myself. You may have seen a few of my attempts at the sukhmani sahib after Ambarsariaji's conclusions and in some other places.
Here, I did as close as a word for word that I possibly could by breaking down sentences to single words. However, the results can end up off track if you are not careful or you don't catch the true meaning or essence early enough. It also took me a long time, for an ashtpadi of 8 lines it could take a few hours very easily. BUT, I must applaud Ambarsaria ji for his very thorough method and careful approach. His results have been outstanding and difficult to fault, in fact, marvelous at times.-

I am not 1st language punjabi, so my vocab and reading skills are very limited and slow- just reading punjabi has been self taught, much after I was 25 years old!!! -so you can imagine!! After having attempts at doing word for word without reference to any teeka, I have learnt and realised just how easy it is to make a shabad apply in the incorrect manner, infact it makes sense to question 'is this what the guru's words meant ?' everytime that one actually proceeds with this task.

With the above mentioned, from what I have read so far, I find it very good to read along with any existing translations on srigranth.org .

FOR EXAMPLE in early japji where mention of the word of guru and some describing is given and mention of mythological figures like shiva, brahma, parvati, vishnu...etc..is 1stly touched upon and mentioned numerous times again throughout but with different contexts.....--Having a look, we can see-----

ਗਾਵੀਐ ਸੁਣੀਐ ਮਨਿ ਰਖੀਐ ਭਾਉ ॥

Gāvī▫ai suṇī▫ai man rakẖī▫ai bẖā▫o.

Sing, and listen, and let your mind be filled with love.

ਦੁਖੁ ਪਰਹਰਿ ਸੁਖੁ ਘਰਿ ਲੈ ਜਾਇ ॥
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38719

Ḏukẖ parhar sukẖ gẖar lai jā▫e.

Your pain shall be sent far away, and peace shall come to your home.
ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਨਾਦੰ ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਵੇਦੰ ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਰਹਿਆ ਸਮਾਈ ॥

Gurmukẖ nāḏaŉ gurmukẖ veḏaŉ gurmukẖ rahi▫ā samā▫ī.

The Guru's Word is the Sound-current of the Naad; the Guru's Word is the Wisdom of the Vedas; the Guru's Word is all-pervading.

ਗੁਰੁ ਈਸਰੁ ਗੁਰੁ ਗੋਰਖੁ ਬਰਮਾ ਗੁਰੁ ਪਾਰਬਤੀ ਮਾਈ ॥
Gur īsar gur gorakẖ barmā gu

r pārbaṯī mā▫ī.
The Guru is Shiva, the Guru is Vishnu and Brahma; the Guru is Paarvati and Lakhshmi.

ਜੇ ਹਉ ਜਾਣਾ ਆਖਾ ਨਾਹੀ ਕਹਣਾ ਕਥਨੁ ਨ ਜਾਈ ॥

Je ha▫o jāṇā ākẖā nāhī kahṇā kathan na jā▫ī.

Even knowing God, I cannot describe Him; He cannot be described in words.

ਗੁਰਾ ਇਕ ਦੇਹਿ ਬੁਝਾਈ ॥

Gurā ik ḏehi bujẖā▫ī.

The Guru has given me this one understanding:

ਸਭਨਾ ਜੀਆ ਕਾ ਇਕੁ ਦਾਤਾ ਸੋ ਮੈ ਵਿਸਰਿ ਨ ਜਾਈ ॥੫॥

Sabẖnā jī▫ā kā ik ḏāṯā so mai visar na jā▫ī. ||5||

there is only the One, the Giver of all souls. May I never forget Him! ||5||

Now, S.S.Bains sums up the above as-

Miss and listen His name with intent.
It will fill you with joy by eliminating sorrows. You can become divine
by listening, praying by missing. God is in you. Divinity is achieved by
the grace of a guru. People have achieved it. Such as Shiva, Brahma,
Parvati etc. Even if I know about God, still I cannot explain, because
God is beyond comprehension. Guru has explained one thing clearly.

There is only one who gives to everyone. I do not forget Him.

So, you can see how looking at both makes the picture a lot more clearer and how easy it is to go off track if we just concentrate on one.
Then after the task of translating, concluding and gaining the essence is done, comes the REAL MAGIC of APPLYING this very Gurmatt personally to Oneself!!!!
This is what makes the Guru Granth Sahib Ji exactly what it is.

Waheguru
Lucky Singh

navneetk · #3 (**permalink**) 28-Jun-2012, 11:40 AM

Ishna ji,
I do not know as to why you are fascinated by the site.The very First Paudi of Japji sahib is incorrectly translated.The slok to38 paudi is not properly translated.It was enough for me to discard this site when we have srigranth.org where almost all possible resources are available.The site is shoddy job done.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38719
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38719
Beware!

Ishna · #4 (**permalink**) 28-Jun-2012, 12:22 PM

Navneet ji

Thank you for your concern and warning. I think it is good practice to approach all translations with caution and to always remember that translations will always be influenced by the translators culture, bias and individual understanding. It is imperitive we all learn Gurmukhi ourselves and learn the meaning of the words and historical context so we can interpret the original for ourselves.

People who are on the road to understanding can sometimes benefit by contrasting translations. Hence my interest in the site (I wouldn't go as far as calling it a fascination).
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38719

I am interested in your interpretation of the first paurhi of Japji Sahib and where you feel it has been translated incorrectly, please.

Also when it comes to calling the translation shoddy, I'm sure Mr Bains Ji put a lot of effort into translating the entire Guru Granth Sahib Ji to the best of his ability.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38719

peacesignkaur

Randip Singh · #5 (**permalink**) 28-Jun-2012, 21:51 PM

Interesting...I'll take a look.

Luckysingh · #6 (**permalink**) 29-Jun-2012, 02:50 AM

We shouldn't write off other peoples very hard put efforts, especially when they are intended for the benefit of others.

I explained what my first impression was from the few pages I skimmed through.
It is NOT a replacement for the existing translated versions and I never said it was.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38719

When I compared and contrasted what I had read, I concluded that you can read it in conjunction and not as a replacement. If you do this you may avoid the simple errors that others make when reading the word for word translations.
Classic example, is people that insist the hindu mythological figures are for real and should be accepted and worshipped just because they are repeatedly mentioned in the bani.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38719

I don't like to write off people's work, especially when they may have made a good effort to divert you away from misintepretations. Also, if I can do something better than the other, only then am I in a position to criticise. Why should I criticise some body's work if I couldn't do it better ??

It's same as watching people on x factor or other contests. If they can sing better than me, I don't **** them off. I may compare them to each other, but I never say he or she is totally crap or ****. There is NOT even a single ounce of gurmat action in that.-It shouldn't be done.
Same goes for anything else, we are all better in some things more than others and others will be better in other things more than you. If you cannot accept this and would rather play with this fact by slating others, then you are not being gurmat and this is not the true sikh way.

I still haven't had time to check any more of Mr Bains's effort, but if someone can find a huge fault when comparing and contrasting, then by all means post the work for all to see.- as with the little I have seen yet, I didn't come across any.

Again, I think Ishna ji came up with a good discovery to share with all of us. That is what we are here to do.

Waheguru