Why do we pray

japjisahib04 · #1 (**permalink**) 22-Oct-2007, 19:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by seeker07

You have not made me a perfect person but YOU alone are Perfect; He is the All-powerful Cause of causes and this drama belongs to the Lord; He performs it, and He watches over it. The Lord is kind and compassionate to all beings and creatures; His Protecting Hand is over all. He is the Treasure of Excellence, the Lord of the Universe; through the Guru, He acts.
“Where is that Guru thru. Whom you act?Whatever You do, O True Lord - that is what happens, so why should we grieve? ..……..Amen.

It is a part of play staged by Him, we all are merely players and as such wisdom and blessing are accorded to each individual as per the part.

A very good write up, quite impressed. But there is no escape but to pray for His grace. Guru Nanak in Japji sahib has clearly indicated, 'moh kai bolan boliye jit sun dharai piyar - amrit vella sach nao vadhyaei veechar - Along with good thoughts and deeds, Guru Nanak advises his devotees that in the beginning as a training to awake in the ambrosial hours of the morning, mediate on Ek-Ong-kar- God who is TRUTH, sing His praises instead of hollow rituals and be good human being. As Gurbani tells us nirban keertan GAVOH KARTAI KA NIMAKH SIMRAN JIT CHUTAI. Gurbani has given its judgement, 'tat gian amrit har naam, uthat baithat har har dhiyah andin sukrit kariyeh, simro SImar simar sukh pavoh.

And then you cannot put a price tag in exchange for good deeds or bhaghati. Gurbani tells us ghaal na mileo save na mileo. mileo aaye achinta. You never know in which stage you have reached.
Regards Sahni Mohinder

Sikh80 · #2 (**permalink**) 25-Oct-2007, 14:16 PM

Respected Sir,
Thank you very much for your kind reply and guidance.As stated by you everything depends on HIS grace and the destiny that has been ordered/written for us. I may sound very negative when I state that Guru Sahibaans have used the word Naam /sabad as if it is always present with us or have been realised by the seeker. However, this is not the case with us or atleast with me. We have to seek 'Naam' or word of 'sabad'. This would happen with HIs grace/nadar or 'mehr'.How to invoke this would again be a mystry.?How to please the one whom we yet do not appreciate.

At many places in Gurbani we get an idea that it is not to be assumed that we would get it or not even after doing everything that is prescribed. Yes we do get peace of mind by practice of Simran of 'waheguru'.There is no guarantee or an assurance of getting at the naam' or 'sabad'. Mind has its own doubts in this regard.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/gurmat-vichaar/17651-why-do-we-pray.html

I shall take your advice and will try to focus on the simran in early hours as early as possible. In any case HE is beyond comprehension.

It is for the intellect to have a flight and try to establish the identity of self with the super soul.It ,again, is dependent upon HIS grace. The understanding and appreciation is quite important to have a 'devotion' for HIM and 'fear' of the Almighty culminating in love for HIM.There are few missing links in between. irrespective of these I would continue that have been stated above by your goodself.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=17651
One has to fight one's Mahabharat onself.Thanks again for your kindness.

Kind regards.

japjisahib04 · #3 (**permalink**) 25-Oct-2007, 16:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by seeker07

Respected Sir,
Thank you very much for your kind reply and guidance.As stated by you everything depends on HIS grace and the destiny that has been ordered/written for us. I may sound very negative when I state that Guru Sahibaans have used the word Naam /sabad as if it is always present with us or have been realised by the seeker. However, this is not the case with us or atleast with me. We have to seek 'Naam' or word of 'sabad'. This would happen with HIs grace/nadar or 'mehr'.How to invoke this would again be a mystry.?How to please the one whom we yet do not appreciate.

At many places in Gurbani we get an idea that it is not to be assumed that we would get it or not even after doing everything that is prescribed. Yes we do get peace of mind by practice of Simran of 'waheguru'.There is no guarantee or an assurance of getting at the naam' or 'sabad'. Mind has its own doubts in this regard. Kind regards.

You have raised doubt that there is no assurance or guarantee of getting at the naam as mind has it own doubts. Hee I would like you to read the next line of that pankti wherein Guru Nanak declares that once we surrender to His Will, he not only stands witness but guarantees that once we start taking care of our amrit velya, mediate on His Holy Name and sing His prace in addition to being a good human beings, filth is washed and mind becomes pure. He clearly states. nanak aavai janiey sabh aapai sachiar. Jap is churning Naam. Churning in going into the repetition and listen to the wisdom of waheguru.

Further to take the flight, it is the love and love only which will invite His grace.
Regards sahni mohinder

Sikh80 · #4 (**permalink**) 25-Oct-2007, 18:09 PM

[quote=japjisahib04;61250]You have raised doubt that there is no assurance or guarantee of getting at the naam as mind has it own doubts. Hee I would like you to read the next line of that pankti wherein Guru Nanak declares that once we surrender to His Will, he not only stands witness but guarantees that once we start taking care of our amrit velya, mediate on His Holy Name and sing His prace in addition to being a good human beings, filth is washed and mind becomes pure. He clearly states. nanak aavai janiey sabh aapai sachiar. Jap is churning Naam. Churning in going into the repetition and listen to the wisdom of waheguru.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=17651

Respected Sir,
Again very kind of you to have replied me so quickly.I shall be garteful if you can kindly quote the line of Gurbani wherein it has been By Guru Nanak ji as to the guarantee.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=17651
It is true that I am not clear and I am only trying to be clear about that I am doing.In the above post you have also used 'naam' instead of Name of Lord.Kindly illumine. When I see'naam' I presume it is the holy 'Sabad' or something of the nature and when I see 'name' I read it as the name of the God.Kindly explain in which context have you used the 'naam'
Sorry for mistakes
Warm Regards

japjisahib04 · #5 (**permalink**) 25-Oct-2007, 19:57 PM

[quote=seeker07;61251]

Quote:

Originally Posted by japjisahib04

.I shall be garteful if you can kindly quote the line of Gurbani wherein it has been By Guru Nanak ji as to the guarantee. It is true that I am not clear and I am only trying to be clear about that I am doing.In the above post you have also used 'naam' instead of Name of Lord.Kindly illumine. When I see'naam' I presume it is the holy 'Sabad' or something of the nature and when I see 'name' I read it as the name of the God.Kindly explain in which context have you used the 'naam' Sorry for mistakes.Warm Regards

It is written at many places in Gurbani. First, we take from Japjisahib, where in lst pauri, Guru NANAK raises a million dollar question 'keev sachiara hoeye keev kudhe teuteh pal -Guru nanak answers this question in fourth pauri 'amrit velya sach nao vadhaaiye veeechar, Good thoughts, remembering His name in the early morning and singing His song in order to churn Naam i.e. Gur sabd. Then Guru Nanak clarifies, 'nanak aavai janeiye sabh aapai sachiar - that if we remember and mediate upon Him alongwith being good human by reflecting good thoughts of gurbani, I stand guarantee that you will be truthful and or able to illuminate the jyot inside. Since Nanak is mentioned in this pankti it stands Guru Nanak himself is witnessing and guaranteeing.

At second place on page 94, again similar question is asked, 'keo piyara pritam milai meri mai, and Guru Nanak answers. mil sanghat khoj dasai vich sanghat har prabh vasai jeo.
Regards sahni mohinder

Sikh80 · #6 (**permalink**) 26-Oct-2007, 07:28 AM

Respected Sir,

Once more I thank you for your valuable citations. Yes sir, we can think of by constant practice of simran /jaap and by becoming a good human being, it is the prerogative of sikhs only.Sangat is also one of the place wherein Guru sahibaans have indicated that one can meet HIM and come face to face with HIM.

sqsMgiq mih ibswsu hoie hir jIvq mrq sMgwrI ]3] (401-16, Awsw, mÚ 5)
In the Sat Sangat, the True Congregation, this faith is established, that the Lord is with us, in life and in death. ||3||

I have reproduced one entry to this regard.There would be other as well in Gurbani.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=17651

Yes, I visited Gurdwara sahib yesterday on reading your post and had my evening prayers with sangat.It was an elating experience. Today,I got up at 4 a.m. and did as per told by your good self. I shall make it a practice. I missed some part of my life. But it is never too late.I thank you for advising me at most oppurtune time.It is about 6.20a.m here.Wishing You a Good day,Sir.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=17651

Regards

Sikh80 · #7 (**permalink**) 31-Oct-2007, 23:07 PM

This is simple question that I have put to respected sangat.I shall be very grateful as to why do we really pray. What are we asking for?Is it something that HE will give us by sheer asking.?
Will it not be as per pre-ordained destiny of ours that let us have that we have?Will the making prayers change the situation/scenario.?
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=17651
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=17651
Lord knows our Hearts and gives us that is best for us.But still we pray.
Kindly guide.

Soul_jyot · #8 (**permalink**) 31-Oct-2007, 23:26 PM

source: http://www.gurmat.info/sms/smssikhism/prayers/

Prayer in one or the other form has been performed since the most primitive times. Human beings used to please God or gods by offering sacrifices accompanied by the singing of praises to obtain certain favors from them.

Ardas is a supplication or humble request. It is a supplicatory prayer of the Sikhs. It is not only a kind of worship, but is also an invisible emanation of most powerful form of energy that one can generate spiritually. Sikh prayer for Sarbat Da Bhala is recited at beginning or closing of a service or an important task.

Prayer is a personal talk with God from the inward depth of heart. It is earnest opening of heart before God for receiving His boons. It is a worshipful address to God, whether aloud or silent in one’s thoughts. True prayer is pure adoration and dedication. It has no ulterior motive.

Styles and times of prayer

It can be individual, family or congregational prayer. It can be vocal or silent in the heart. It can be performed everywhere and at all the times. There is no prescribed posture, time or the place but it must be performed from core of the heart with full devotion. Generally, devotees pray to God with closed eyes and with folded hands. They concentrate their attention, mind and soul on the Supreme Soul.

Although words in the prayer are almost the same but the feelings of individual participants cannot be weighed or measured. Depth of emotions can not be probed. In a congregation full of worshippers, the identical words which have deep meanings, will affect different people in different ways. Who is to say what and with what intention, each feels deep inside. The religious impulse which is carried out in the secret depths of the human heart, between one individual and Akal Purakh, in the end is a very private and personal matter.

The individual prayer is normally performed in homes and the congregational prayer is performed in Gurdwaras. Sikhism stresses upon both types of prayers. It is essential for the individual to attend holy company (Sangat) of the Gurmukhs and join the congregational prayer in the Gurdwara.

Forms

Generally, the individuals pray for physical health, material needs, welfare of the family, universal prosperity or for attainment of spirituality. Human beings pray to God for relief from the physical and worldly pains. Prayer for fulfillment of worldly desires defeats its own purpose. It can be in the form of thanks giving to the Almighty for His gifts and boons, adoration, praise or a petition.

What do the Sikhs pray for ?

The Sikhs pray for peace and prosperity of the universe as a whole and not just for a particular sect or group of people. It is for “Sarbat Da Bhala”. It is a prayer for asking the boon of spirituality and unity with the God Almighty. Sikh Ardas is also a summary of the suppression, oppression, tyranny and religious bigotry committed upon the Sikhs by the unjust rulers. It is a narration of the story of martyrs who preferred to sacrifice their lives than to flicker from their faith.

Prayer cleans the heart and is a direct connecting link between man and God. It gives a devotee the dynamic power to achieve harmonious assembly of body, mind and spirit to shun Haumai and link with the inexhaustible motive power that spins the universe.

Guru Arjan Dev says,

“By praying to the Guru, no obstacle befalls the devotee.”

ibGnu n koaU lwgqw gur pih Ardwis ]

(816-17)

It is believed in Sikhism that

“the prayer of a person before God never goes in vain.”

ibrQI kdy n hoveI jn kI Ardwis ]

(819)

Whatever we ask, we receive from God because we are doing the things that are pleasing in His eyes. The things we ask and yet we do not receive because we are asking for a wrong purpose and for sensual pleasures.

“What ever I ask of my God, He blesses me with the same exactly.”

jo mwgih Twkur Apuny qy soeI soeI dyvY ]

(681)

“Even without one's speaking, the True Lord knows everything.”

ibnu boly bUJIAY sicAwr ] rhwau ]

(662)

Guru Nanak Dev says,

“Without our saying, everything is known to the Lord”.

ivxu boly jwxY sBu soie ] rhwau ]

(661)

Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=17651

Is the prayer of every person, fruitful ?

The prayer of a God loving, pure and true person is always heard and answered. The prayer from the core of the heart of a contented person is respected in the court of Almighty.

Sikhs conclude their daily prayer with the plea:

“Nanak, may the glorious Name be ever in ascendancy and may all people prosper by Your grace.”

nwnk nwm cHVdI klw, qyry Bwxy srbq kw Blw ]

(Ardas)

Guru Arjan Dev says,

“God cures all pains; He Gives us comforts. He does not suffer any ills who prays with faith.”

qIny qwp invwrxhwrw duK hMqw suK rwis ]

qw kau ibGnu n koaU lwgY jw kI pRB AwgY Ardwis ]

(714)

“To seek any thing except You is to invite the greatest sufferings;

Bless me with the boon of Thy Name and so that I may feel contended and my mind’s hunger be satisfied.”

ivxu quDu horu ij mMgxw isir duKw kY duK ]

dyih nwmu sMqoKIAw auqrY mn kI BuK ]

(958)

Guru Arjan Dev Ji says,

“Make supplication before Him who is the bestower of bliss and the destroyer of dread. He, to whom the Merciful Master shows His mercy, has his affairs adjusted forthwith.”

suKdwqw BY BMjno iqsu AwgY kir Ardwis ]

imhr kry ijsu imhrvwnu qW kwrju AwvY rwis ]

(44)

“Joining both the hands, I make a supplication before Thee, O’ my Lord. If You will, then alone I will be embellished.”

duie kr joiV krau Ardwis ]

quDu BwvY qw Awxih rwis ]

(736)

“Kirat the minstrel, makes a supplication, O’ Guru Ram Das, keep me ever under Your protection.”

iek Ardwis Bwt kIriq kI gur rwmdws rwKhu srxweI ]

(1406)

“Without being told, the Lord knows everything, so before whom else should we make a supplication.”

ivxu boilAw sBu ikCu jwxdw iksu AwgY kIcY Ardwis ]

(1420)

Astroboy · #9 (**permalink**) 31-Oct-2007, 23:57 PM

"As you think, so you become".
What is the good of worshipping God?
Maulana Rumi said that "My inner self is so much overflooded
with my Master that I have forgotten who I am. I am no more".
God is manifested in Him.

He is also within us, but is not manifest. With just a little thought of His, He gives us a boost to rise above body consciousness. We are given some capital, something to start with, of seeing and hearing God.

Render unto Him all that belongs to Him,
And make His Will thine own.
In return He showers His blessings manifold,
0 Nanak! He is ever so merciful.
He who has Him as his boon companion,
He stands in need of naught?
Gaudi Mehla 5

Once a certain king intended to go abroad. He inquired of his queens as to what gift each of them would like him to bring for them from the foreign lands. One of them asked for costly jewels, another for rich apparel and still another for cosmetics. Some asked for fineries and others for delicacies, etc. The youngest of them, who loved the king most, requested his early return so that she would not have to languish long in his absence. The king on his return sent the various gifts to his other queens and himself went to the palace of the youngest and was highly pleased that there was someone who loved him the most, much more than his riches and wealth. The queen too thanked God for her good fortune that her husband was with her and that she needed nothing else. The rest of the queens, though each one of them had got what she wanted, had not the good fortune to claim their husband's attention. All their riches and gifts availed them not without their beloved.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=17651

In exactly the same way we, through shortsightedness, ask from God or Guru for trinkets of no consequence and not Him and His Saving Grace, and like the different queens in the parable, suffer most the pangs of separation. All the riches of the world fail to give the least satisfaction. On the contrary, these things distract us from the Truth and make us more miserable. If we could but win His Grace we would then be in want no more. All His riches come to us automatically, without asking. Even if they are denied for one reason or another, it matters not, for without Him and His love they are dirty trash.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=17651

All riches and fineries befit him who has won Him,
And even without them, what care if he were to live in poverty?
Shalok M.5

What may I ask for and repeat unto Thee except
That I hunger and thirst for Thy sight;
It is through the Word of the Master that
one reaches Truth, Nanak, therefore, prays for this alone.
Suhi M.1

I have just one submission and listen ye to that,
Certainly Thou art great, compassionate, and immaculate?
Tilang M.1