Kachi Bani

We have all heard this term being used quite often usually associated with criticising of certain granthi's and raagi's and even some sant babas.

As I have been getting much deeper into the gurbani, I notice how it gets manipulated and misinterpreted very easily in many areas.
I have also noticed how certain kathas will sometimes portray an alternative and more or less wrong message, than that originally intended.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/general-discussion/38143-kachi-bani.html
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38143

Maybe I am analyzing it more than I used to or I am some what more aware.

Before, I felt that kachi bani was when someone in the process of reading/reciting, proceeds in a non-respectful manner.

Now, I am wondering if false interpretations also constitute to such an offence (we could regard it as an offence) as kachi bani ??

Some thoughts and clarification would be much appreciated.


Waheguru
Lucky Singh

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Gyan dhyan kich karam na jaana, saar na jaana teri, Sab te vada sat Guru Nanak, jin kal rakhi meri.

You are part of a small community as most others close their eyes and let it sink in both good or bad.

Great thread.

Let us site some video examples with commentary where the message gets messed up.

Regards,

Sat Sri Akal.

How about 'Swaasan Di Maala Naal Simraa Main Pree Da Naam' ??

Ang 920

aavahu sikh sathiguroo kae piaariho gaavahu sachee baanee ||
Come, O beloved Sikhs of the True Guru, and sing the True Word of His Bani.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38143

baanee th gaavahu guroo kaeree baaneeaa sir baanee ||
Sing the Guru's Bani, the supreme Word of Words.

jin ko nadhar karam hovai hiradhai thinaa samaanee ||
Those who are blessed by the Lord's Glance of Grace - their hearts are imbued with this Bani.

peevahu a(n)mrith sadhaa rehahu har ra(n)g japihu saarigapaanee ||
Drink in this Ambrosial Nectar, and remain in the Lord's Love forever; meditate on the Lord, the Sustainer of the world.

kehai naanak sadhaa gaavahu eaeh sachee baanee ||23||
Says Nanak, sing this True Bani forever. ||23||

sathiguroo binaa hor kachee hai baanee ||
Without the True Guru, other songs are false.

baanee th kachee sathiguroo baajhahu hor kachee baanee ||
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38143
The songs are false without the True Guru; all other songs are false.

kehadhae kachae sunadhae kachae kacha(n)aee aakh vakhaanee ||
The speakers are false, and the listeners are false; those who speak and recite are false.

also;

saachai sunanai no pat(h)aaeae sareer laaeae sunahu sath baanee ||
To hear the Truth, you were created and attached to the body; listen to the True Bani.

As above,
Those who speak it are false,those that hear it are false,Those that speak and recite are false.
kehadhae kachae sunadhae kachae kacha(n)aee aakh vakhaanee

This implies that those listening are false also.

Waheguru
Lucky Singh

In the historical context...by the time of Guru Amardass Ji..it had become widely "known" that the Gurgadee of the House of nanak was being "recognised" as LEGITIMATE ONLY due to the presence of GURBANI being passed on to the successor. Genetics, lineage, ancestry , caste etc were NOT being considered as valid. The Tilak the outward signs of the next GURU was the fact that He was given the GURBANI of the PREVIOUS GURU.
And as a result those not given this Authentic Gurbani hit upon the idea that why not we too write such "Bani" since thats the one thing we lack as we are already Guru descendnats/lineage etc and known to the sangats as Guru shaibzadehs..and this FALSE BANI is the KACHI BANI that Guru Amardass Ji mentions. The undeniable transparently clear fact is that ONLY a TRUE SATGUR is capable of writing GURBANI.....nay "bani" (POETRY) that lacks this basic ingredient is FAKE/FALSE/KACHI as opposed to Authentic Pakkee Gurbani.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38143

Later on the Coming descendnats of the Guru sahibs people like MEHRBAN...elder brother of Guru Arjun ji who had acquired the very best KATHA SKILLS of Gurbani Exposition of the Gurbani of His father Guru Ramdass Ji....also acquired the skills necessray to write almost authentic Bani but it was neverthless KACHI as He was NOT the True SATGURU. After that his descendats the Hundalis had even better composers who also added the additional Mohr/Chhaap or stamp like MAHALLA CHHEVAN, MAHALLA SATVAAN to their Fake Kachi banis. ( THis may eb one reason why the authentic GURUS sitting on the Gurgadee as Sixth and Seventh Gurus - Hargobind ji and Har Rai Ji never wrote ant Gurbani thus dispensing with the Mahalla chhevan/stvaan controversy which would have made it very difficult for the sangats to differentiate the wheat form the chaff..
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38143

Coming to the time of GURU GOBIND SINGH JI. Guru Gobind ingh Ji alos made the DISTINCTION between what is GURBANI and whats NOT by clearly Passing on GURGADEE ONLY to Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Since the TRUE SATGUR is Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji...it logiclalay follows that the ONLY GURBANI is whats inside the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. PERIOD. AS sitting Tenth nanak on the Gurgadee of Nnak..ant compositions by Guru Gobind Singh ji could ahve been made GURBANI by being ADDED to Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji by GURU GOBIND SINGH JI HIMSELF as He was the one and ONLY perosn authorized to do so. Earlier GURU ARJUN JI had ADDED huge amounts of HIS OWN GURBANI written under Mahalla panjavaan to the AAD GRANTH (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji). Guru Arjun Ji placed the MOHR/STAMP/SEAL of Mahalla Panjavaan at the END of AD GRANTH..and this SEAL was MAINTAINED by GURU GOBIND SINGH JI in the same place - END of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji..after He ahd added the GURBANI of Guru teg bahadur Ji at the appropriate places and Raags in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Thus there is no reason for any HUMAN to second GUESS GURU GOBIND SINGH Ji for the reasons for not adding any of his own compositions into Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji and why etc ?? The ONLY GURBANI is thus now in the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. All compositions OUTSIDE the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji are NOT GURBANI as that in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji...no matter who the AUTHOR is...may it be Kabir Ji, Ravidass Ji, or Guru Gobind Singh ji..
Now to the MODERN ERA....Now a days what is referrd to as KACHI BANI are the TWO LINER JINGLE STYLES of Totkeh that MOST BABA TYPES love to sing and make the snagat sing along to the tune of CHAMTAS. A few decades ago this style was used to read JOTTIAN WALLEH SHABAD..and the entire Sangat used to participate....the Lead Granthi leading..then the Men snag a line or two and then the Ladies would pick up the REFRAIN....The SHABADS snag were GURBANI taken form Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji and NOT man made Kavitas or poems.
What the Babas derawallahs etc do is RECITE TWO LINERS....Kandhah ret deean..bandiah..naam jap laey.....kandhan ret deean...Satnaam waheguru..Bandhiah naam jap leay..etc etc REPEATED agian and agin and the snagat is asked to repeat while the Baba takes a breather...This is KACHI BANI becasue its NOT GURBANI form Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji..its NOT Bhai Gurdass Ji Vaars kabits or Bhai nanad Laal Goyahs kabits. THOSE are the ONLY compositions recognised by SRM to be sung as KIRTAN. However any Kavita, dhadee Vaar etc can be READ/SUNG as LONG as it doesnt give the impression of KIRTAN...which is soleley RESERVED for GURBANI ONLY. DHADEES STAND UP nad sing their Vaars...perfectly all right and no one calls this KIRTAN. POETS also stand up on stage in the presenc eof Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji evena dn READ out POETRY/Kavitas/GEETS etc...again perfectly all right as its NOT KIRTAN. What people OBJECT to si the DUPLICITY practised by the baba derawallah types..who sit on STAGE, and read kavitas and geets KIRTAN STYLE.

There is nothing wrong per se with the Sarsan kee mala sung by late jagadharee wallah Baba sewak Ragi....as long as its not taken for KIRTAN. I Love the sarssan kee mala geet...but i dont recite it as GURBANI. MY Late dad wrote thousands of such Kavitas and our family Jatha used to sing them at weddings shaheedee jordmelas, gurpurabs etc etc with the sangat participating with gusto...in fact my dad was much sought after for wedding sehras and kavitas becasue he had the knack of putting as much as hundred names in one kavita perfectly in tune and balance..making every member of the family happy....and celebrated in a wedding ~!! and its all KACHI...

Since the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji is NOT in PROSE..any KATHA is always INDIVIDUALS way of understanding...so this cannot be called Kachi as in kachi bani (masquaradinga s Gurbani)

Watch This..This is KACHI BANI of the WORST KIND....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...v=RRwEYy2ed3s#!

ANOTHER fine example of giving prominence to KACHI BANI instead of GURBANI KIRTAN...in the same style reserved for GURBANI. This is all man made poetry of worst sort...cant be called POETRY also as its not academic standard but just JINGLES of advertisers.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38143

a different viewpoint..comedy

Although it may seem that this famous geet conveys a good intended message, it can be misleading because the Pree or Pi might not be the Almighty God, instead a viakti like a Baba or Pir who has died or will die.

Our Guru is Bani, Atul and Permanent - Na Aavai na Jaavai.
Most Geets sung today are mere shadows of the truth. Sachi Bani leads you to the truth not away from it.