Is Atheism the Ultimate Sikhi?

Well another morning, another day, strange things keep happening, no visions or spectral ghosts, but life does not seem to be like walking through glue so much. I run a small modest IT shop, its not really a shop, it looks more like a junk shop, full of half built pc's and laptops everywhere. Several times, my wife has rang to say don't forget to pay this bill or put some money aside for that, and someone has come in with that exact amount of money to buy something. Yesterday, I should have bought a part for the butcher next door, but it was a busy day, and I ended up onsite till late, just about to leave I noticed a similar part on his table, 'your welcome to it' I was told. Some might call it good luck, but in reality who knows.
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As a former atheist, the closest I managed to get to some sort of idea of the world was that there must be universal truths, truths that could not be bent or distorted, ie, one should not kill, however killing is acceptable if say, you would save a hundred others through the process, but who is to decide how many?.

Once you have found the universal truth and submitted to it, life would be better I used to muse.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=35294

Randipji helped enormously with his comments about Ek Onkar, yes truly beautiful, could his truth be mine, I wondered, and now here I am.

I will share one other thing with you, as people, we love the people round us, sometimes we may love too much, I have felt, at times an imbalance inside me, I have always felt that I always gave more than I got back, although it is not a competition, and one should not love to receive, but some days I have felt empty and 'loved out'. However, I will admit that once you grasp the concept that You are doing the best you can, and having faith, that feeling of emptiness seems to subside ever so slightly.

I will carry on posting here, my daily experiences, they say that in human nature the search is better than the finding, if the whole truth is only revealed at death, then there is no anticlimax. I have also found, when the big black dog comes and sits on my shoulder, that thinking of all the noble sikhs that gave sacrifice to maintain sikhism, of the suffering and the calm faces, helps hugely in putting into balance what I am facing on a daily basis, and what others have in the past.

 
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Harry ji,

So the book wasn't inspired by Buddhist philosophy? Thanks for informing me about this, I had the wrong idea for a long time.

Harry Haller ji,

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh!

That is a beautiful thought.

Belief is a matter of personal faith in God. In Sikhism, it's your faith in your Guru who leads you to meet God or have God like experiences.
Let me pen down a personal experience way back in 1986.

I was in the Indian Air Force then posted at a remote fighter base. We had about thirty odd Sikh personal from the lowest rank up to three Sikh officers. Unlike in the Indian Army, religious places are personal matters in the IAF. Individuals may make a place if they so desire with their own resources or get together on Sunday or special days in someone's house.

On that Air Force Station, the authorities had permitted to make a Mandir, a Gurdwara and a Church and everyone was happy.
In 1986, it was time to celebrate the birth anniversary Guru Nanak Dev ji. I being the senior most Sikh officers was the Chairman of the Gurdwara Management Committee and we had limited funds through individual contributions. We took stock and realized that we could make Langar for about 1000 people. We sat down in front of Guru Granth Sahib in the small Gurdwara and made the menu and I allocated duties and responsibilities to various Airmen, Sergeants and Warrant Officers.

On the final day we sent out a word to everyone on the Station that we would be celebrating and everyone was welcome. We invited the Station Commandeer who was one rank senior to me and I called the Commanding Officer of a Sikh Battalion in the local Army cantonment and requested him to send about 50 odd men to participate and to come himself. We had asked one Saint from a nearby Dera to do Kirtan.
On the final day, while the Kirtan was going on and the small Gurdwara was full of people, I was sitting next to my Boss out of courtesy. One of the Warrant Officers who was in charge of making Dal came and whispered in my ear, "Sahibji, too many people have come. The outside grounds are brimming full. We are going to run short of Langar. Shall I put extra water in the Dal. We have enough Atta and we can manage".

I said, "No". He persisted but I maintained that we had made our menu sitting in front of Guru Maharaj and it is up to him to see us through this situation. So he looked at me with disappointment and went away.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=35294

When the Ardas was done and Kara Prashad was being distributed, I looked out and found the place full of people. The local Sikh Battalion had turned up in large numbers. I announced that people may sit where ever they are and organize in lines so Langar can start. Once they started eating, I did an approximate count of the lines and found more than 2000 heads sitting there enjoying the Guru's Langar.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=35294
When the day was done, we the Committee sat down to take stock. Everyone reported that all the food is finished and no one has gone away without eating. Someone said that there were about a hundred odd laborers who were at a nearby construction site. They came late and we gave them whatever was left.

I got these reports from each individual who was supposed to be looking after each part of the Langar. That Warrant Officer (Arora) who was in charge of Dal, looked sheepish. When questioned he said, "Sahibji, you told me not to put water in the Dal but I did not listen to you. I am very sorry because I put two buckets of water and two buckets worth Dal is left over and gone bad within no time".
I told him, "The moral of the story is that you must have faith in the Guru. He will take care of you".

We had actually fed more than 2000 people with Langar which was for 1000.

There are several cases like this where the Langar has never run short because it is Gods' Own.

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh!

A few days ago, I sat here and thought 'atheism the ultimate sikhi', boy was I wrong, well, Im not so sure now. Although the one good thing is that any sense of searching for the truth and following a reasonable moral code is enough to call myself a sikh, so at least I have labelled myself correctly this time.

Everything pleasant that took place as described above was taken away the next day, with interest!. Now normally, I would shrug it off and move on, but this time, I started asking questions to the inner voice, why? Its been 15 years since I have had expectations or faith, is it just me? or do we all do it, in any case, I now feel that once you start directing your deeds and quantifying them, you just cannot help but be deeply hurt when bad things start to happen to you. Does the belief in a god (inner or not) taint whatever it is you do on an almost daily basis?. If this just applies to me, then possibly the title should be, is atheism the ultimate sikhi for harry haller.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=35294

After some thought on the subject, it is possible I am dealing with this from an abrahamic point of view, which is where I am getting bogged down. Although thanks to Randipji, I have realised that instead of big bearded man, concentrate on the one thing , the constant truth, I wonder if the word translated to constant, could also point to the word eternal as well, but then my punjabi is not that brilliant.

It is clear that the love for this constant truth, the respect of it, the listening to it, is hugely important, but am I the only person that keeps humanising it, with a personality and feelings and rationale, when surely it is better just to focus on the universal, constant and eternal truth, and accept it. To me such behaviour borders on atheism, as defined in wikki

Atheism is, in a broad sense, the rejection of belief in the existence of deities.[1] In a narrower sense, atheism is specifically the position that there are no deities.[2] Most inclusively, atheism is simply the absence of belief that any deities exist.[3] Atheism is contrasted with theism,[4][5] which in its most general form is the belief that at least one deity exists

If you marry the meaning of atheism with the ek onkar being the constant truth, then to be a good and productive sikh, should we not conduct our lives as atheists, as indeed deity worship is forbidden in sikhism.

Now, when I use the word atheist, I mean deity worshippers who humanise god. You cannot humanise god, it is the simple choice between your own will, and the true will.

I look forward to corrections and comments

Confusedji,

Herman Hesse, without a doubt, had a huge interest in Buddhism, in Siddhartha, he relates how Buddhism cannot answer the questions for young Siddhartha, and as he does in many of his books, relates how worldly pleasures corrupt, enslave and bring on a living death which can only be left behind once you have found 'your way', like a lot of hesse's books, a quick search of google shows it has been hugely misunderstood, but then maybe that is because no two people could read one of hesse's books and come to the same conclusion, the writing is beautiful beyond belief, but extremely individual to the point that you begin to share your own experiences with what is being set for you on the pages, and you mould the book to yourself.

one of the finer quotes

When someone is seeking ... it happens quite easily that he only sees the thing that he is seeking; that he is unable to find anything, unable to absorb anything ... because he is obsessed with his goal. Seeking means: to have a goal; but finding means: to be free, to be receptive, to have no goal.

Well Harry,

Another of the most startling revelations for me was in the first like of Mul Mantaar, Onkaar is described as Akal Moorat, which literally means beyond space and time....now for someone of a scientific persuation like me that concept blew my mind away. These guys 500 years ago were describe this concept of the Constand/Eternal, beyond space and time!!

Sikhism, something I dismissed in my youth had some radical concepts right under my nose and I did not even realise.

As for humanism "God" in Sikhi we have the concept of the Gurmukh, i.e. that who is not self willed, and who's will is commanded by the Constant Truth. To many this person may appear God like beause he/she is able to percieve eventualities. The Munmook is the opposite to this, i.e.slef willed and who is swayed by Kaam, Kridh, Moh , Lobh and Hankaar.

Well, I seem to have to got myself in a bit of a mess here,...

Having accepted the concept of constant truth, and hugely impressed by the concept of Akal Moorat, reasonably the next step seemed to be to cherish and love these concepts. However this was not so straight forward or easy as it sounds.

Firstly, I have been interested in the concept of personality for many many years. I have always maintained that I do not have one, I act, talk and dress as I want, unless I am in the company of my parents or my brother (especially my brother!), but on the whole I tend not to hide behind a mask of my choosing, purely because I do not have to, I have no social circle or friends to impress or worry about.

Now if I were to embrace these concepts, I would have to harness a personality to do so, and the person that I am at present, would in effect die.

I have been reasonably happy since the bear outfit episode. My wife and I are very close to two very young girls that have had quite a hard time at young ages, for their last birthday I hired a bear suit (they know me as uncle brown bear), and then decided to wear it for the next 3 months, pretty much every day. Then, I had a large portfolio of businesses we did IT support for, most of whom I found insufferable, and I did all my on site visits dressed as a bear, went to bed in it, shopping etc. Why? well, my own wife did not even ask me that, not once in 3 months, she would come downstairs to find a bear eating breakfast and walking out to his car, and she would just kiss my nose, hug me and tell me to have a good day! Well the reason was to assist in the destruction of what little personality I had left, to be free of ego, pride, and what other people thought of me, it worked..
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Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=35294

What worries me is that this new truth loving personality will not, strictly be me, it will be someone else that is actually holding the true me in check.

Secondly, I would imagine that the truth does not wish to be loved as second best, which would mean I would have to place it above my wife, parents, stepson and brother. That is not so easy. Easy with my parents, as they are already Gursikhs, but my wife is not, and I could not imagine loving anything above my wife, even if it meant I would become the most learned man in the world. Surely the more enlightened I became, the less I would need my wife, whereas at the minute I am bound to her by every cell in my body.

Thirdly, having just been through a huge financial crisis, which is about to come to an end very shortly, now is the time to work hard and build a foundation for us both. For one reason or another we both lost everything and had to rely on my parents for help. Now is the time for action, not looking.

I informed my wife of this yesterday, while we were out with the dogs, they had gone on ahead and I shouted Dans name. Dan came running towards me with Alfie in tow, in the distance I could see the flame red hair of my wife in the sun, eventually I embraced all three of them. I apologised to my wife for being distant and preoccupied with god and explained why I felt the search would have to wait. She listened, smiled, and then said, 'I don't think you should give up, I think this is something that needs to be done together, so that there are three of us, not me on side and you and god on the other, and then We can all move to the light together'

thank you for reading this

Harry Haller ji just some comments and your notes in black while my comments in red,

Please note I submit the above as positive and not a critique. I apologize if it comes across as negative.

Sat Sri Akal.

Ambersariaji

There is no criticism, only reasoned arguments from someone who seems to have gone down this path a long time ago, and I would like to thank you hugely for your time and observations, it is in no way negative, it only confirms just how much about this subject I do not know, I think sometimes it is easy to jump on something I read here and think whooooa, thats not for me, but then I read what you have kindly written, and I think, no I like that, thats good.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=35294

Perhaps you could clear up a point that have been vexing me

One of the comments on the thread regarding the young girl who wanted to dance, was not to enjoy dancing too much, as you could end up enjoying the dance more than god, ok, that threw me a bit, the way you and Randipji talk, you talk of something constant that is true, you do not speak of beings or personalities, but you both seem in a minority, the majority seem to believe in a living, feeling being that you must put ahead of everything else in your life, whose name brings bliss to you and the worship of, brings eternal happyness, I would say I am as far down the road as accepting there is a truth, eternal and constant, and accepting that the respect of this truth, and to allow myself to be guided by this truth will make me a better person, and understand the ways of life better.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=35294

This is as far as I have got, I have no huge urge to pray or get on my knees, although, yes, I could imagine that listening to nice kirtan would not be unpleasant, nor listening to a passage and explanation from the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, but that is probably as far as I feel able to go, from a simran point of view.