Sikh News Great Shabad Albumn Or Not?

[Randip Singh]

I think this album....click link below.....is great:

Songs Of The Soul Bride, MP3 Album Music Download at eMusic

However some I know hate it.........what do you think?

 

[ekmusafir_ajnabi]

Very poor attempt, out of tune not sung with any emotion. It is like reading bani with and English Accent. ....................a glimpse of the future of kirtan.

 

[Randip Singh]

Very poor attempt, out of tune not sung with any emotion. It is like reading bani with and English Accent. ....................a glimpse of the future of kirtan.

What is wrong with reading Bani in an English accent?

What do you mean songs were out of tune or were the compositions different from the usually shouting Ragi's?

 

[ekmusafir_ajnabi]

[admin cut]

 

[Randip Singh]

From your answers on other debates I can see you are a very rude and presumptious individual.

My influeces ranges from Nusserat Fateh Ali Khan to Oasis.............I would say my musical appreciation is pretty well rounded, and I don't need to be lectured by prejudiced people as to whether I appreciate music or not.

 

[Admin]

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Best Regards.

 

[Randip Singh]

[Admin Cut: Dear Musafir Ji, kindly adhere to Terms of Service (TOS) at SPN strictly!! You can read them by visiting the link towards bottom right side of every page. Some rules are reproduced below for your ready reference. Thanks for your cooperation.]

1. Respect: Treat all members with the kind of respect that you expect from them in return for yourself.

2. Unity in Diversity: Many members on SPN, come from various religious and cultural backgrounds and may have variable conflicting opinions. Religion and Philosophy are general but unique for each person's understanding and progress. If you disagree, simply accept the difference and ask for information you may not know. Un-necessary bragging, trash talk, childish arguements only take us away from the topic in hand. Please avoid them at any cost.

3. Blaming: Avoid blaming others. Seeing someone's fault is easier than your own fault.

4. Introspection: Try to find your own fault and purify your mind.

5. Karma: Always check your karma and its fruit from participating in this network... [More Here]

Thanks again for your co-operation.

Best Regards.

sorry Aman....but this fellows accusation that I was doing Manmat made me see red. I will be more civil in future.

 

[ekmusafir_ajnabi]

Aman ji,

My sincere apologies for the tone of my language in my previous reply.

Randip Singh ji,

From your answers on other debates I can see you are a very rude and presumptuous individual.

My influences ranges from Nusserat Fateh Ali Khan to Oasis.............I would say my musical appreciation is pretty well rounded, and I don't need to be lectured by prejudiced people as to whether I appreciate music or not.

Perhaps I was abrupt in replying to you thread. I do apologize.

There is a big difference between the music of Nusserat Fateh Ali Khan-Oasis and Mohammed Rafi and Lata Mangeshkar. It is like comparing a spiritual journey from UK - west with one from UK - east. I have an article some time ago where they compared eastern music to western form of music and its effect on plant life. It was concluded that the plant moved away from the source of music whereas it came closer to the Music of the East (Here I am referring to classical music).

Tej Kaur in you link I feel is not doing justice to the emotion expressed in the shabads. Nowadays it is becoming a trend to produce records for fame and money without giving any regard to feelings expressed in the shabads. Vast majority of the singers do not have any musical learning background. I feel if we accept this type of music we will be encouraging to make a mockery of Gurbani and hence our religion.

 

[Randip Singh]

Aman ji,

My sincere apologies for the tone of my language in my previous reply.

Randip Singh ji,



Perhaps I was abrupt in replying to you thread. I do apologize.

There is a big difference between the music of Nusserat Fateh Ali Khan-Oasis and Mohammed Rafi and Lata Mangeshkar. It is like comparing a spiritual journey from UK - west with one from UK - east. I have an article some time ago where they compared eastern music to western form of music and its effect on plant life. It was concluded that the plant moved away from the source of music whereas it came closer to the Music of the East (Here I am referring to classical music).

Tej Kaur in you link I feel is not doing justice to the emotion expressed in the shabads. Nowadays it is becoming a trend to produce records for fame and money without giving any regard to feelings expressed in the shabads. Vast majority of the singers do not have any musical learning background. I feel if we accept this type of music we will be encouraging to make a mockery of Gurbani and hence our religion.

I totally disagree.

Music is music.....a dear friend of mine who is trained classically....you may have heard of him (Talvin Singh)..........plays eastern and western music. There is no difference.

It is very presumptious to assume this person has done this for money too, considering you know nothing about her?

Regards

 

[ekmusafir_ajnabi]

Randip singh ji,

I totally disagree.

Music is music.....a dear friend of mine who is trained classically....you may have heard of him (Talvin Singh)..........plays eastern and western music. There is no difference.

It is very presumptious to assume this person has done this for money too, considering you know nothing about her?

We shall differ at this point. Music is not just music. There is much more to it paerpahps your have not gone deep enough in this area.

Talvin Singh - I am fully aware of this gentleman. I would not personally categorised him among musicians. He is an arranger of sounds and not a composer.

Tej Kaur - I do not need to know her personal history to comment on her music. If I did then my view would be biased.

I have just heard another track of hers on another site. It is deplorable. It is an insult not only to our religion but also to the memory of our beloved gurus.
I would consider this as part of "Kachhi Bani". If our Gurus have written their poetry in Ragas then there must be a good reason behind it.

Please address this issue with an open mind I am not here to score points with you. Our aim is one and the same "To promote Sikhism".

Regards

 

[Admin]

Being a neutral listener... i personally loved her voice and intensity and i must say i could feel the devoption as well... music should be a soup for the soul and i think in my case it was like that...

Thanks.

 

[Randip Singh]

Randip singh ji,

We shall differ at this point. Music is not just music. There is much more to it paerpahps your have not gone deep enough in this area.

What an incredibly insulting and patronising person you are……….

Your statement below about Talvin Singh shows me you have no knowledge about music. Stick to your Hindi Film industry Lata and Rafi………….I would rather listen to Ustad Lachman Singh, Nusert Fateh Ali Khan, Ustad Sultan Khan, Ran Shankar, and Bhairavi.:whisling:

Talvin Singh - I am fully aware of this gentleman. I would not personally categorised him among musicians. He is an arranger of sounds and not a composer.

Utter Nonsense.

Talvin Singh studied from 14 years old under Ustad Lachman Singh ji. He is a Table player extraordinaire. He is not a mere music arranger. If you knew anything about music or heard any classical Indian music in concert you would know this. Talvin learned to play and mastered tabla at this tender age and then went on to master all sorts of other percussion instruments and such.

Tej Kaur - I do not need to know her personal history to comment on her music. If I did then my view would be biased.

I have just heard another track of hers on another site. It is deplorable. It is an insult not only to our religion but also to the memory of our beloved gurus.
I would consider this as part of "Kachhi Bani". If our Gurus have written their poetry in Ragas then there must be a good reason behind it.

You, the person who thinks Talvin Singh is a music producer, and does not know that he is consider an Ustad interms of Tabla playing not only here but in India, it is hilarious you can call Tej Kaur's interpretation "Kachi Bani". You do not know the basics of classical Indian music, then how can you make these claims?

I think your comments are an insult to Tej Kaur and should be withdrawn at once. You should apologise.

If you don't like her music just say so, but don't try and back it up with spurious claim that you are some sort of expert on classical Indian Raga………….because clearly you are not.:advocate:

Please address this issue with an open mind I am not here to score points with you. Our aim is one and the same "To promote Sikhism".

Regards

Alas, I don't think your goal is to promote Sikhism…………..I think your goal is to promote your version of Sikhism and deride and be patronizing to everyone else.

 

[ekmusafir_ajnabi]

I am appauled by your lack of knowlege on this subject. You have a very stong EGO too. My understanding of a sikh is "A Sikh is a student who is always learning throughout his life." To me, you do not appear to be a student anymore.

I do not wish to waste any more time arguing with you.

"You can take the horse to water but you cannot make him drink it".

Guru Fateh.

 

[Randip Singh]

I am appauled by your lack of knowlege on this subject. You have a very stong EGO too. My understanding of a sikh is "A Sikh is a student who is always learning throughout his life." To me, you do not appear to be a student anymore.

I do not wish to waste any more time arguing with you.

"You can take the horse to water but you cannot make him drink it".

Guru Fateh.

you stated Talvin Singh was a mere Music Arranger....I pointed out correctly that he was an Ustad of Table.............I cannot help it you cannot take it when you are wrong!

Hankaar seems to be clouding your judgemnt....a friend of Hari Singh perchance?

 

[ekmusafir_ajnabi]

Aman Singh ji,

Re: Great Shabad Albumn or Not?

Being a neutral listener... i personally loved her voice and intensity and i must say i could feel the devoption as well... music should be a soup for the soul and i think in my case it was like that...

Thanks.

This is your view and I respect that.

One's opinion is based on ones' understanding of music and the exposure one has had. In my opinion we are currently being exposed to a poor quality music by poor I mean "Out of tune, lacking expression and the mood in which the writer has expressed emotion. When all these element are well ballanced then the food of the soul becomes ready you can go into a spiritual trance. Otherwise it is a case of one likes more sallt or pepper.

"Somehow a frog from The Ocean once meets a frog that has lived in a well for all its life. The frog from the Ocean introduces himself and the frog from the well makes a big leap and asks the frog from the Ocean, Is your Ocean this big? The frog from the Ocean replies no. The frog from the well make more leaps and ask for confirmation but gets disappointed."

The moral of the storey is "One should not put a fence around oneself and assume what they know is the ultimate. "

I have a much closer experience with music in general and have been in the company of Saints who are able to make Rain and Fire with their singing. These people are able to fine tune themselves with nature and become one with nature. Music is an ocean and one should not bury ones head in sand like an osterich.

People start to call themselves musicions as soon they learn SA RE GA MA. and start producing records as soon as they have learned a shabad or two.

Music is a Sadna and a gift from the gods. Music, Spirituality and Diet go hand in hand. When you combines these three elements you can enter into another dimension.

We as Sikhs are so fortunate that our beloved Gurus have given us so much that our preechers are no themselves unaware of it and thus unable to promote it. We lack understanding, we make incorrect pronounciations of words. Our Gurmukhi is so fertile that you can go into trance by correctly pronouncing a single letter.

There is an ocean of music out there dive into it and find out. On should not underestimate it. It saddens me when I see people making a mockery of very critical issues due to their lack of understanding.

 

[Randip Singh]

Aman Singh ji,



This is your view and I respect that.

One's opinion is based on ones' understanding of music and the exposure one has had. In my opinion we are currently being exposed to a poor quality music by poor I mean "Out of tune, lacking expression and the mood in which the writer has expressed emotion. When all these element are well ballanced then the food of the soul becomes ready you can go into a spiritual trance. Otherwise it is a case of one likes more sallt or pepper.

"Somehow a frog from The Ocean once meets a frog that has lived in a well for all its life. The frog from the Ocean introduces himself and the frog from the well makes a big leap and asks the frog from the Ocean, Is your Ocean this big? The frog from the Ocean replies no. The frog from the well make more leaps and ask for confirmation but gets disappointed."

The moral of the storey is "One should not put a fence around oneself and assume what they know is the ultimate. "

I have a much closer experience with music in general and have been in the company of Saints who are able to make Rain and Fire with their singing. These people are able to fine tune themselves with nature and become one with nature. Music is an ocean and one should not bury ones head in sand like an osterich.

People start to call themselves musicions as soon they learn SA RE GA MA. and start producing records as soon as they have learned a shabad or two.

Music is a Sadna and a gift from the gods. Music, Spirituality and Diet go hand in hand. When you combines these three elements you can enter into another dimension.

We as Sikhs are so fortunate that our beloved Gurus have given us so much that our preechers are no themselves unaware of it and thus unable to promote it. We lack understanding, we make incorrect pronounciations of words. Our Gurmukhi is so fertile that you can go into trance by correctly pronouncing a single letter.

There is an ocean of music out there dive into it and find out. On should not underestimate it. It saddens me when I see people making a mockery of very critical issues due to their lack of understanding.

But Talvin Singh has studied with an Ustad since 14 and since you claim yto know so much about music, how come you did not know he was a table virtuoso?

Could it be that you are completely wrong? Could it be that you have a MASSIVE EGO which make YOU think you are always right? Could it be that you have no idea who Talvin Singh is?

 

[ekmusafir_ajnabi]

But Talvin Singh has studied with an Ustad since 14 and since you claim yto know so much about music, how come you did not know he was a table virtuoso?

Could it be that you are completely wrong? Could it be that you have a MASSIVE EGO which make YOU think you are always right? Could it be that you have no idea who Talvin Singh is?

Talvin Singh is a baby among the calibre of people I am talking about. And this has nothing to do with ego. There are far better talented individuals than Talvin Singh that you may not be aware of.

My knowledge of Talvin Singh is : He made his name in the pubs and clubs of London where people do not gather to listern to the quality of music but gather to pass time. They do not care for that matter who is playing the music. Every so often they will put their glasses and cigarettes down to clap. He is also romoured to have been taking narcotics. This is your The "Tavin Singh" you are referring to is it not?

Studying from an Ustaad does not necessarily make one a virtuoso. Yes he may have knowledge I do not deny that but that is common knowledge like many others in this field.

If as you put it, "He is a virtuoso of Tabla", perhaps you can put forward some of his solo tabla recordings that I can listern to. Any jugalbandis with eminent artists? perhaps. Afterall he is an Ustaad in your words, you should have no problems is putting some album names forward.

I look forward to it. Maybe I have overlooked the artistic flair of this marvellous genious friend of yours. (This gentleman I believe is the same man who has worked for/with Nitin Sawhneyin the past)

 

[Randip Singh]

Talvin Singh is a baby among the calibre of people I am talking about. And this has nothing to do with ego. There are far better talented individuals than Talvin Singh that you may not be aware of.

I am sure there are better talents….I could name a few…..but Talvin is a great talent nonetheless……………and not a mere music producer as you claimed……...admit it you were wrong!:crazy:

My knowledge of Talvin Singh is : He made his name in the pubs and clubs of London where people do not gather to listern to the quality of music but gather to pass time. They do not care for that matter who is playing the music. Every so often they will put their glasses and cigarettes down to clap. He is also romoured to have been taking narcotics. This is your The "Tavin Singh" you are referring to is it not?

Whether he took narcotics or not is neither here nor their….this has nothing to do with his music talent…..you have a real talent for slandering…..a real piece of work!! - You really excell at Nindiya First accuse me of Manmat.....the Tej Kaur of Kachi Bani and now Talvin Singh.OMG

So people in London don't gather to listen to music but to pass time, according to the GREAT Musafir Ajanabi…………..have you any comprehension of how arrogant, patronizing and condescending this statement is.

Yes he gained mainstream fame through clubs….however, he was already a name in the Indian classical music scene........considering you know everything about Indian music you should know that?

Studying from an Ustaad does not necessarily make one a virtuoso. Yes he may have knowledge I do not deny that but that is common knowledge like many others in this field.

According to you anyone who does not meet your standard is a non-entity….face it…..Talvin could have spent another ten years on top that he did studying music but he would not meet your standard……I doubt anyone could………….because you claim to know best.

If as you put it, "He is a virtuoso of Tabla", perhaps you can put forward some of his solo tabla recordings that I can listern to. Any jugalbandis with eminent artists? perhaps. Afterall he is an Ustaad in your words, you should have no problems is putting some album names forward.

Dear Ekhmusafir……….Since you are all knowing about the music industry surely you would know about Talvin's albumns and also his live performances. What can a mere mortal like me teach one such as yourself who knows everything there is about music?

Nevertheless here is few:

1997 Soundz of the Asian Underground Polygram
1998 O.K. Polygram
1999 Talvin Remixsingh OK Island
2001 Ha Polygram
2001 Back to Mine DMC
2002 Vira Navras

I look forward to it. Maybe I have overlooked the artistic flair of this marvellous genious friend of yours. (This gentleman I believe is the same man who has worked for/with Nitin Sawhneyin the past)

I doubt with such a sarcastic tone tinged with such a bloated ego you will look forward to listening to them…………nevertheless here is hoping you crawl out of that pit of darkeness in which you dwell where nindiya, hankaar, and krodh seem to be by words for being a Sikh. …..what a shame.

Talvin Singh is a great talent…..like Ravi Shankar he has demostrated that great music is music whether East or West………..too bad your narrow little mind cannot comprehend that.

 

[ekmusafir_ajnabi]

If as you put it, "He is a virtuoso of Tabla", perhaps you can put forward some of his solo tabla recordings that I can listern to. Any jugalbandis with eminent artists? perhaps. Afterall he is an Ustaad in your words, you should have no problems is putting some album names forward."

"

1997 Soundz of the Asian Underground Polygram
1998 O.K. Polygram
1999 Talvin Remixsingh OK Island
2001 Ha Polygram
2001 Back to Mine DMC
2002 Vira Navras

You do not have an answer to what i asked, Do you? I do not see any solo recordings of this "Tabla Ustaad" in your list. These albums are all that contains music "ARRANGEMENT".

From the past week or so I have joined this forum, all i seem to hear from you is I am right and you are wrong. Anything other than what you say is wrong. Anything that is beyond your comprehension is wrong. You are a very self opinionated individual. You just cannot accept that someone else can be more knowledgeable than you.

You challenged me about Talvin Singh. I have given you a brief insite into him to assure you that yes I know him. I have no enimity with Talvin Singh or for that matter with you either. He is a great music arranger for those who like his music and there are plenty. It is a big world and there is place for everyone in it. If your understanding of music cannot go beyond his compilations then that is your personal drawback. And it clear that you rather see the world as you want to sitting in your little well.

I have nothing further to add to this topic. In order to have a sensible discussion one needs a worthy opponent and in this case you definitely are not.

 

[Randip Singh]

"
You do not have an answer to what i asked, Do you? I do not see any solo recordings of this "Tabla Ustaad" in your list. These albums are all that contains music "ARRANGEMENT".

Have you some sort of problem. He has arranged and played on these Albumsn too.

Your problem is that your ego is so massive you do not know when to admit you are wrong.

"
From the past week or so I have joined this forum, all i seem to hear from you is I am right and you are wrong. Anything other than what you say is wrong. Anything that is beyond your comprehension is wrong. You are a very self opinionated individual. You just cannot accept that someone else can be more knowledgeable than you.

You have zero knowledge. You cannot accept the Talvin Singh is a table player....that is because you have never seen him perform. I have seen him live on several occaision. He did a great solo performance at the Mercury Music awards.

You are a nasty horrible man, who has one of three answers when you don't agree with someone, these are:

1) You are doing Manmaat

2) You are doing Kachi Bani

3) You are taking drugs.

"
You challenged me about Talvin Singh. I have given you a brief insite into him to assure you that yes I know him. I have no enimity with Talvin Singh or for that matter with you either. He is a great music arranger for those who like his music and there are plenty. It is a big world and there is place for everyone in it. If your understanding of music cannot go beyond his compilations then that is your personal drawback. And it clear that you rather see the world as you want to sitting in your little well.

I have nothing further to add to this topic. In order to have a sensible discussion one needs a worthy opponent and in this case you definitely are not.

He has not only arranged the music but played it. If you knew anything about music you would know this. The fact he is great in a studio too only adds to his talent.

Admit it you are worng.

Anyway....evryone else.....here are some amateur footage of Talvin playin table....but it can't be him becaue Ekh Musafir says so:

YouTube - murcof talvin singh eric trufaz scopitone 2006


playing with Bjork:

YouTube - Bjork - Bigtime Sensuality Live

demostrating the universitality of music, and what utter nonsense ekh musafir is talking.

Oh but that can't be Talvin playing....he is just an arranger.....:ice: