Seeker07 You have asked some very interesting questions in the last few days. The question on this thread is deceptively simple. Who or what is the Naam that the Guru gives is the really hard question. It is not easy to answer -- and I am sure that there will be others more qualified than I who will participate. But here is what makes the question about Satgur difficult. Obviously Satgur means more than The True Guru -- otherwise there would not be so many uses of the term. Satgur in some settings actually refers to a human being who has received "Naam" (another deceptively simple concept) and has the ability to pass Naam onto other human beings. Within the Shabd Guru tradition Waheguru is the Satgur. Yet this opens up another line of questions - Are Waheguru and Guru one and the same. Was there a Divine Presence before there was Waheguru? Did Waheguru merge with this Divine Presence making two become One? The logical analysis, and fund of theological knowledge required to carry on a meaningful dialog, is beyond my abilities. And somehow my need to worship fervently is disturbed by too much discussion, too much logic, too much analysis. There is a place for discussion, logic and analysis -- as in Internet forum. That is how we learn. But at some point, speaking only for myself, I know I need to just concede -- All is Waheguru, Truth is the Identity of Waheguru, who is the Satgur -- and be done with it. It is all in the mool mantar. The Naam received from Guru (Waheguru) would then be the reason for prayer. Does this make sense?