Which Is More Important Simran Or Sewa?

[Taranjeet singh]

I am no one to interrupt the flow of the thread. I have read most of the posts with interest and application of mind. It is clear from the reading of the posts that meaning of 'sewa' and 'simran' are the function of our own understanding of the things stated in Bani. There are many shades of the meanings of the two terms and no rigid prescription is available with rocket like precision to arrive at the meaning.
There is a stress of 'sewa' i.e. at many places in Bani and generally understood to be remembering him.[ Farid ji, Namdev ji etc.,]
Sewa is also stated to be selfless service.[Bhagat Puran singh ji].
Looked from purely macroscopic view remembering the Lord is Simran as well as sewa. Isolatedly, there cannot be 'sewa' without remembering him and his creation.[Simran] Without any further hair splitting, I would invite attentions of my reverend Brothers to Slok Maha IX..introductory parts that speaks for itself.....
ONE UNIVERSAL CREATOR GOD. BY THE GRACE OF THE TRUE GURU:
SHALOK, NINTH MEHL:
If you do not sing the Praises of the Lord, your life is rendered useless. Says Guru Nanak, meditate, vibrate upon the Lord; immerse your mind in Him, like the fish in the water. || 1 || Why are you engrossed in sin and corruption? You are not detached, even for a moment! Says Guru Nanak, meditate, vibrate upon the Lord, and you shall not be caught in the noose of death. || 2 || Your youth has passed away like this, and old age has overtaken your body. Says Guru Nanak, meditate, vibrate upon the Lord; your life is fleeting away! || 3 || You have become old, and you do not understand that death is overtaking you. Says Guru Nanak, you are insane! Why do you not remember and meditate on God? || 4 || Your wealth, spouse, and all the possessions which you claim as your own — none of these shall go along with you in the end. O Guru Nanak, know this as true. || 5 || He is the Saving Grace of sinners, the Destroyer of fear, the Master of the masterless. Says Guru Nanak, realize and know Him, who is always with you. || 6 || He has given you your body and wealth, but you are not in love with Him. Says Guru Nanak, you are insane! Why do you now shake and tremble so helplessly? || 7 || He has given you your body, wealth, property, peace and beautiful mansions. Says Guru Nanak, listen, mind: why don’t you remember the Lord in meditation? || 8 || The Lord is the Giver of all peace and comfort. There is no other at all.
Says Guru Nanak, listen, mind: meditating in remembrance on Him, salvation is attained. || 9 || Remembering Him in meditation, salvation is attained; vibrate and meditate on Him, O my friend. Says Guru Nanak, listen, mind: your life is passing away! || 10 || .......on and on.....so says the Bani and all of us walk like solitary reapers with sickle in left hand....with an effort to meet Him...........

It is only an opinion of a learner and no accuracy is guaranteed.

 

[Ambarsaria]

Fundamental in all such discussion is to remember that we are always a single entity in thought and action. At the same time many thoughts and actions can occur. Your mind could be singing internally or you verbalize (e.g. Satnam Waheguru) as you are doing sewa in the langar.
You could be driving to work (doing sewa to self versus walking) and listening to a shabad and humming along.

So I find some of the divisions are there to understand but the Sikh practical life requires us to act as one being always in touch with many facets espoused in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji.

Just some thoughts.

Sat Sri Akal.

 

[Scarlet Pimpernel]

remembering the Lord is Simran as well as sewa

Veera I have sworn an oath to contradict everyone on Spn atleast once,but I like this interpretation so I will have to wait, thank you for the help against the Mad Musketeer .

 

[Gyani Jarnail Singh]

The "Simran" and "sewa" that is practiced widely in the Sikh World today is NOT as per Gurmatt or Gurbani at all.......This type are actually CONDEMNED in Gurbani as Dikhawa .....ritual...useless behaviour...and FRUITLESS !!

 

[Tejwant Singh]

The "Simran" and "sewa" that is practiced widely in the Sikh World today is NOT as per Gurmatt or Gurbani at all.......This type are actually CONDEMNED in Gurbani as Dikhawa .....ritual...useless behaviour...and FRUITLESS !!

Gyani ji,

Guru Fateh.

Well said, as usual. No one could have put it better.

Thanks & regards

Tejwant Singh

 

[Ambarsaria]

Depiction of Bhai Kanahiyah ji doing sewa to all.

Depiction of Guru Arjun Dev ji doing simran while being tortured.

Each is important and in its own place and each has its applications to suit and be effective.

Sat Sri Akal.

 

[Chinu]

One question for all of here...

Suppose... Your husband is a fan of any bollywood actress or Your wife is fan of bollywood actor. Days and Nights keeps on praising his/her beauty, smartness, and other appealing things etc.., and keep on singing hyms for him/her -- anytime you notice.

But your spouse is perfect in his/her family duties, Do all kind of sewa for you, Gives you medicine -- whenever you need, Gives you food -- whenever you need, or do anything -- anytime you need, but doesn't stop singing hyms, or stop praising his/her favourite actor/actress.

Well my question is: Do you like this kind of behaviour by your spouse ?

My answer is: NO

 

[Harry Haller]

I have concluded that if Sewa are the wheels of the car, Simran is the steering wheel, thanks to all, especially brother spji who inspired me to go to sleep last night with Amrit Bani on the radio

 

[Harry Haller]

One question for all of here...

Suppose... Your husband is a fan of any bollywood actress or Your wife is fan of bollywood actor. Days and Nights keeps on praising his/her beauty, smartness, and other appealing things etc.., and keep on singing hyms for him/her -- anytime you notice.

But your spouse is perfect in his/her family duties, Do all kind of sewa for you, Gives you medicine -- whenever you need, Gives you food -- whenever you need, or do anything -- anytime you need, but doesn't stop singing hyms, or stop praising his/her favourite actor/actress.

Well my question is: Do you like this kind of behaviour by your spouse ?

My answer is: NO

Sorry Chinuji, the analogy here is quite incorrect

the argument is Sewa versus Simran, what you are talking about is Sewa whilst carrying out mental infidelity, I cannot see how this relates to the argument, would you care to explain, thank you

 

[Chinu]

Sorry Chinuji, the analogy here is quite incorrect

the argument is Sewa versus Simran, what you are talking about is Sewa whilst carrying out mental infidelity, I cannot see how this relates to the argument, would you care to explain, thank you

Harry ji, I know my question seems to be off topic,
Even than.. I request you to answer this, so that i could carry on the discussion, or Really if you are intrested to know what's going in my mind.

"Satshriakal"

 

[Harry Haller]

One question for all of here...

Suppose... Your husband is a fan of any bollywood actress or Your wife is fan of bollywood actor. Days and Nights keeps on praising his/her beauty, smartness, and other appealing things etc.., and keep on singing hyms for him/her -- anytime you notice.

But your spouse is perfect in his/her family duties, Do all kind of sewa for you, Gives you medicine -- whenever you need, Gives you food -- whenever you need, or do anything -- anytime you need, but doesn't stop singing hyms, or stop praising his/her favourite actor/actress.

Well my question is: Do you like this kind of behaviour by your spouse ?

My answer is: NO

This is a tricky question, if answered honestly, neither of us are 'fans' of anyone really, I hardly watch TV, my wife does, but I have never ever heard her mention finding another man attractive in anyway shape or form.

Also we do very little for each other, We do lots for other people, but not that much for each other as we are quite independent, the concept of having someone do anything and be at my beck and call is quite scary, either they would want me to do the same for them, which can create a strange relationship filled with resentment and tab keeping, in my view anyway.

I am mentioning the background because in a marriage/union, it is not as simple as saying 'do you like this behaviour', it is not for me to like her behaviour, any more is it for her to like my behaviour, we love each other, and accept each other as honest people, so provided we are honest, what is there not to like.

The nearest I can get to this from my point of view, is if my wife has had a hard day, I will walk the dogs, feed the ferrets, give them water, check on stepson, and maybe cook a meal so that when she gets in, she can eat and then go to sleep, sometimes, if an opinion on this forum has made an impression, I will talk about the poster, and the opinion, and how enlightened I found them, I might talk for an hour, praising and lauding the poster, and wife's reaction, regardless of the sex of the poster, is always to show a keen interest and be happy that I am sharing something with her,

If she discussed someone at work, say a male, I would show the same interest, as I respect and trust her, if it were say a movie star, we are on new ground, because in 7 years I have never heard my wife say anything remotely sexual about another man, she has praised many, at work, or for charitable works, or for contributions to society, but never looks, but then by the same token, my wife has shown complete indifference to my own look which changes constantly, sometimes hairy, always messy, sometimes smart, even when I wore a bear suit for 3 months, she never spoke to me or treated me any different.

If it were my wife behaving like this, no it would not bother me, our bond travels deeper than someone she admires and talks about

I have been honest with my reply, I hope it helps

 

[Chinu]

This is a tricky question, if answered honestly, neither of us are 'fans' of anyone really, I hardly watch TV, my wife does, but I have never ever heard her mention finding another man attractive in anyway shape or form.

Also we do very little for each other, We do lots for other people, but not that much for each other as we are quite independent, the concept of having someone do anything and be at my beck and call is quite scary, either they would want me to do the same for them, which can create a strange relationship filled with resentment and tab keeping, in my view anyway.

I am mentioning the background because in a marriage/union, it is not as simple as saying 'do you like this behaviour', it is not for me to like her behaviour, any more is it for her to like my behaviour, we love each other, and accept each other as honest people, so provided we are honest, what is there not to like.

The nearest I can get to this from my point of view, is if my wife has had a hard day, I will walk the dogs, feed the ferrets, give them water, check on stepson, and maybe cook a meal so that when she gets in, she can eat and then go to sleep, sometimes, if an opinion on this forum has made an impression, I will talk about the poster, and the opinion, and how enlightened I found them, I might talk for an hour, praising and lauding the poster, and wife's reaction, regardless of the sex of the poster, is always to show a keen interest and be happy that I am sharing something with her,

If she discussed someone at work, say a male, I would show the same interest, as I respect and trust her, if it were say a movie star, we are on new ground, because in 7 years I have never heard my wife say anything remotely sexual about another man, she has praised many, at work, or for charitable works, or for contributions to society, but never looks, but then by the same token, my wife has shown complete indifference to my own look which changes constantly, sometimes hairy, always messy, sometimes smart, even when I wore a bear suit for 3 months, she never spoke to me or treated me any different.

OK... 0

If it were my wife behaving like this, no it would not bother me, our bond travels deeper than someone she admires and talks about

So.. if your wife is behaving like this and the reason you don't bother so much, that because your bond travels deeper, and your bond travels deeper, that because you both love each other, and accept each other as honest people, Even doing very little for each other, still you understand each other very well and love each other.

Well.. the over all reason for this deep bond, trust, honesty is true love, or truely you remember each other everytime -- weather you are doing any work, or going anywhere, Right ? am i Right ?

Please give me the answer so that i could carry the discussion.

"Satshriakal"

 

[Harry Haller]

She is in my heart always, a lot of my devotion to Creator is done through my love for her, so yes, you are correct

 

[Chinu]

She is in my heart always, a lot of my devotion to Creator is done through my love for her, so yes, you are correct

So.. you love your wife because she loves you and remember you everytime... anywhere... everywhere, weather she may work for you or not, do any kind of sewa for you or not.

Thus.. the real thing, which you feel is syptom of true love is that she may remember you everytime...anywhere... everyhere.

Harry... What do you think that the creator who has created so big and never ending universe, want our "Sewa" ?, The real thing "He" want is that one should remember "Him" everytime... anywhere... everywhere... and in short i call this as "Simran", and this similar to what you aspect from your wife to do for you.

But...Yes! that thing is something else... that one is doing "Sewa" in love for creator. That type of "Sewa" is something else..., that type of "Sewa" is another form of love.

Anyhow... Guru Nanak the starter of "Sikh-Panth", We we also call as "Sewa-Panth" has started three types of Sewa's

1. Tan -- Physically
2. Man -- With Mind (Simran)
3. Dhan -- Money etc..

Three of these sewa's should walk parllelly -- for one to become a compleate Gur-Sikh, if we are missing anyone from these three, we are in big doubt.

We are bounded with these three things Body, Mind, and Money etc.. in this world, these three things becomes the reason of our soul to come again and again (Death & Births), in this world. Our soul can never get compleate libration from this World or Bhavsagar until we surrender ourself to creator with these three (Body, Mind and Money)

If the person is just doing sewa with Money and Mind, That person is saving his Body... means that person is lazy in doing physical sewa, such person can never get libration, because such person will ever remain bounded with body and will come again in this world

Similarly if one is doing sewa with Mind and Body, that person is saving Money... Such person can also never get libration from this world because he/she will come back again in this world to enjoy the collected money.

And if one who is just doing sewa with Body and Money, that person is saving his relations -- truely which are false, That person is saving his/her Relations in this world, So if he/she is not doing "Sewa of Mind" means "Simran", such person will also come back in this world due to false attachments.

So... the compleate surrender to creator is necessary for compleate libration, and to do parllely all these three sewa's is only possible when we fall in true love creator by doing "Simran".

"Satshriakal"

 

[Harry Haller]

Chinuji, many thanks for taking the time to reply and make your point which is extremely valid, but I have made some points of my own

So.. you love your wife because she loves you and remember you everytime... anywhere... everywhere, weather she may work for you or not, do any kind of sewa for you or not. I never said this, I love my wife because of who she is, not because she loves me, these are two different points

Thus.. the real thing, which you feel is syptom of true love is that she may remember you everytime...anywhere... everyhere. Again, I never said this, true love is a mutual respect and kinship for each other, in fact, I have said the opposite, she may remember whoever is on her mind at the time, normally her patients, (she is a nurse), her son, or our animals, I rarely take up much of her thinking time as I make no or little demands on her, she gives to others and leans on me, in the same way that I give to others and lean on her, we give very little to each other, we are not needy in that way with each other, we exist to assist each other in our individual pursuits, like best friends

Harry... What do you think that the creator who has created so big and never ending universe, want our "Sewa" ?, The real thing "He" want is that one should remember "Him" everytime... anywhere... everywhere... and in short i call this as "Simran", and this similar to what you aspect from your wife to do for you.Although I now accept that simran is important in giving direction, I do not believe Creator wants anything from me, if I can leave this earth with my actions making a good difference, if there was a point to being born, then that is good. For Creator to want me to remember him sounds Abrahamic to me, Creator does not want anything, it is up to us as individuals to maintain and encourage consonance in a practical and pragmatic way imho

But...Yes! that thing is something else... that one is doing "Sewa" in love for creator. That type of "Sewa" is something else..., that type of "Sewa" is another form of love.

Anyhow... Guru Nanak the starter of "Sikh-Panth", We we also call as "Sewa-Panth" has started three types of Sewa's

1. Tan -- Physically
2. Man -- With Mind (Simran)
3. Dhan -- Money etc..

Three of these sewa's should walk parllelly -- for one to become a compleate Gur-Sikh, if we are missing anyone from these three, we are in big doubt. I agree my brother, but again, with mind, for direction, not to keep Creator happy

We are bounded with these three things Body, Mind, and Money etc.. in this world, these three things becomes the reason of our soul to come again and again (Death & Births), in this world. Our soul can never get compleate libration from this World or Bhavsagar until we surrender ourself to creator with these three (Body, Mind and Money) This sounds a bit like reincarnation which I am not a believer in

If the person is just doing sewa with Money and Mind, That person is saving his Body... means that person is lazy in doing physical sewa, such person can never get libration, because such person will ever remain bounded with body and will come again in this world

Similarly if one is doing sewa with Mind and Body, that person is saving Money... Such person can also never get libration from this world because he/she will come back again in this world to enjoy the collected money. This sounds a bit verdic to me brother

And if one who is just doing sewa with Body and Money, that person is saving his relations -- truely which are false, That person is saving his/her Relations in this world, So if he/she is not doing "Sewa of Mind" means "Simran", such person will also come back in this world due to false attachments. and this

So... the compleate surrender to creator is necessary for compleate libration, and to do parllely all these three sewa's is only possible when we fall in true love creator by doing "Simran". I am not interested in liberation, I have no carrot in front of me other than doing the right thing, liberation is not important to me, enlightenment is, when I die, I will be dust, my essence will live on through my actions, and those I have touched, Giani Zail Singh once said 'If I were to be told to sweep the floor, then that would be good too' the statement in itself can only apply to Creator, although he applied it, wrongly in my opinion, to the premier at the time, but that is how I feel about Creator, sweeping floors, living in big houses, its all the same to me now, as long as I am learning, and I am showing my love to Creator through actions and seeking direction from essence of Creator within

"Satshriakal"

kaurhug

 

[Chinu]

Harry... really you don't believe in Afterlife and Compleate libration ? 0

 

[Harry Haller]

Harry... really you don't believe in Afterlife and Compleate libration ? 0

I am afraid not my friend, this is it

 

[Chinu]

I am afraid not my friend, this is it

Once a grosser went to a women in the village to purchace a goat,
Said the women: I love this goat very much, so i cannot sell this goat even in 100 bucks winkingmunda

Well harry... i didn't asked, are you afraid or not.:grinningsingh:

Anyways... Nice to have chat with you.

_/\_ "Satshriakal"
Your Brother Chinu

 

[Gurdaas]

I have read the various comments on the topic of " What is more important, Seva or Simran " and my own contribution is as follows:-

Why do we need to distinguish the importance of one over the other. Surely the important thing is that they be done, either individually or together.

 

[Navdeep88]

I think simran's more personal, and in a sense almost selfish... its for our own piece of mind.

Seva is more selfless in that its focus is on others. So out of the two, I think Seva is the heavyweight just b/c I think thats kinda the outcome of Simran anyways. Internal to external. you feeling healthy and good is only worth something if you extend it to others. idk, just my thoughts.

Wow, harry ji, this topic really made me think.