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Christianity What is the Living Word? Comparisons of Sikh Scripture, the Quran, and the Christian Testament

Discussion in 'Interfaith Dialogues' started by mattqatsi, May 17, 2010.

  1. mattqatsi

    mattqatsi
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    Knowledge is power and the lack of it is death. It's great to speak with fellow truth seekers when to be honest no one cares anymore today.

    I'm not sure what the Sikh view is except that the Introductory video mentions that your scriptures are regarded as the "eternal living guru." As for the Bible, that's kind of hard to explain or comprehend, but then again, it's not like "God" or anything that directly relates to Him is exactly an attainable, fully understandable Concept. That's what makes us human and Him God.
    This may sound like proselytizing, but I'm trying to explain a more abstract concept.
    But to try and explain it, the start of John 1 tells us that "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." The Living Word is Jesus or Yeshua. The word "angel" means "messenger" and Yeshua is the in-between of the physical realm and the unseen, omnipresent Yahweh. Yeshua is the message to humanity that Yahweh loves us, that we aren't lost cases. The Bible is the physical, written Message while Yeshua is the living Message, the Son of God Who came to earth and Who is alive in heaven. His death and resurrection are the Message, one that still exists complete today.
    This may sound a little weird but...
    This is the Living Word because it isn't just a bunch of Words, It isn't just some nice poetry and bedtime stories, these Words have Power, supernatural Power. That's not an ideal I'm just spouting off because it's what I've been told, I've experienced it. I know that these words can bind up and throw away demonic forces, I don't know the Sikh stance on supernatural beings, but I know that I've sat next to supernatural beings (without seeing them) before and I've read different things out loud around them. There's only One bit of reading that has an effect in the supernatural, for "some reason" spiritual beings have auditory reactions, sometimes it's just clicking or something similar, but these Words in particular force them to react.
    It also has some... odd influences. I'm not a firm believer in "coincidence" and whenever I take the Book out to read a little bit like somewhere at school, it seems to become a magnet for itself. No matter where I read, more often than not It attracts other Bibles, I know it may sound weird ascribing consciousness to a book, but it always tends to find a way out of hiding in the backpack and out into the open.
    It also has this wonderful tendency to have you open randomly (or not randomly, but "coincidentally") to passages that pertain to your situation oftentimes when you need it. If one starts reading, they begin to understand. It is Yeshua and Ruach HaKadosh Who help guide people to what they need and how to understand it. Sometimes Passages stick out completely and others seem... dim while reading. It is often those illuminated Passages that speak directly to the reader.
    It's really hard to explain without sounding insane, but It is an anomaly, It is a whole different experience than what I've had with every single other religious text.
    One last reason It is the Living Word is because of how It is read and interpreted and whatnot. It's a Story, an "Epic that spans generations" where actual historical events have meaning. It's parable through documented history. It is also prophecy through history. Take for instance Revelation, the most oft-quoted book by religious fanatics. That was a prophecy that was made unto Jerusalem. Everything was fulfilled in AD 70, every metaphor accounted for and every empire called by name (the "Preterist" interpretation.) We even have historical documents of the heavens opening in the sky and thousands of eyewitness reports of everything (recorded by Josephus.) Some people interpret this prophecy as an abstract one that spanned through the ages, that every event happened in order but on a 2000-year scale (the Historicist view.) This is actually correct as well, everything happened in order and according to detail (i.e. some armies which performed certain actions, like the Turk invasion, had the same army colors as the ones described and used in AD 70.) There's also the "spiritual" interpretation which talks about the events described being a metaphor for the spiritual life, and they have a cohesive interpretation too. The "Futurist" view is happening right now, in fact events are beginning to transcribe that did not make sense a month ago (like the oil spill is prophesied, as well as other events that have happened one after another.) All of these interpretations, Preterist, Historicist, Spiritual, Futurist, are correct (or at least cohesive.) The fact that there are multiple levels of interpretation that are all correct that correspond to an event 2000 years ago, a 2000 year history and a climax about to happen, help prove to me that this is the Living Word, It spans generations and is just as relevant today. Did you know that the name Barack Obama is in the Bible? Or "chamas" as it refers to Islamic violence against Israel? Or the word "alah" as something that Israel will have to deal with? (sorry, I'm not trying to get into politics.) Or what about the fact that if you count the number of years, according to the Bible, from Adam to Abraham that it is exactly 1948 years? The covenant of Israel was made with Abraham, and Israel was established as a state in 1948.
    All of this means, to me, that it is the Living Word.
    Wow that was long, sorry.
    I guess you can say we see the Bible in the same way, that It is our Teacher and Guider, or at least a form of It.

    And the dead word? Basically most other books, but that's kind of why I started this thread, to try and find out how the Sikh Scriptures compared. Mathematical trends like that help prove Divine inspiration to me so I want to see if there are other texts that are similar in effect.

    I'm only a learner, I didn't discover this on my own, I'm just following along and mimicing those with greater mental calculation skills. But I am trying to learn, which is why I'm here. How can I differentiate between the two? Well right now I only know of one Living Text, and that is because it is filled with the Spirit of the Living God. But looking for mathematical trends is how I'd figure anything out.

    Mid-first century, it is narrowed down to 50-70 AD

    Well He said a lot and we have four non-conflicting accounts (some eyewitnesses) of what He said and did. That's kind of the difference between the Bible and other religious texts. The Koran is basically all Muhammad telling what is what, so is the Tao Te Ching, so are some of the Hindu texts. Most other religious texts are done by a small group of "enlightened" people. The Bible takes four different angles of seeing the "Jewish Messiah", it takes the stories of Fishermen or Tax Collectors, normal everyday people and relates their individual accounts of when God came down to earth in human form and made a splash in the water of life (when He wasn't walking on it or turning it into wine.)
    To have him say what's what like a pompous man seeking after fame would completely defeat the message, this was a God Who was humble enough to come incarnate in the flesh because He loves us.
    Besides, like I said before, Yeshua is the Bible. Everything in that book points towards Him, seriously. What importance are the genealogies? Every name has a meaning and when placed in order actually form cohesive sentences with hidden messages. Every story relates to Him somehow. People foreshadow His arrival and prophesy about it, then He shows up and the rest of the New Testament is the recording of the effects of the ripple wave He made when He splashed down. The Bible is what Jesus wrote down, It is tons of authors, kings, wise men, women, homeless missionaries, wild prophets, and princes all writing down poetry or history or prophecy or personal letters that would make a Holy Text with seals like this Mark one. There are many more.

    It confirms it, even more so. I'll explain that later though. I've already typed too much for now.

    I can't really say much more than that this helped me define what Texts I saw as Divine and worthy of being followed and believed. Stuff like this and the aforementioned Living Word explanation helped spur me on to love more, it caused me to want to be Christ to others. It helped ground me for helping the homeless and with other forms of spreading love.

    Yes, thank you for inquiring, having to discuss with someone instead of blab at them is of little use to me or anyone except to stroke my ego. If you have any insights, Sikh or otherwise, please add them in no matter what they are. I came here to learn.
     
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  3. Tejwant Singh

    Tejwant Singh United States
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    Re: Mathematics in Scripture?

    Mattqatsi ji,

    Guru Fateh.

    It seems you have dodged all my questions and I can not see anything logical in your posts despite you talking about the mathemetical logics in your posts.

    I wonder why this non response response.

    You are doing nothing but repeating certain things like a parrot who is trying to hide his ugly plumage. Pardon my bluntness.

    What I have asked you in a straight forward manner, you are reluctant to respond in the same fashion for the reasons only known to you.

    Let's start afresh, shall we?

    First and foremost Sri Guru Granth Sahib was written directly by our Gurus.So, they are first hand accounts which means nothing is distorted. It is not a second hand information and hearsay like Jesus' by other people like the Gospels of Mark, John, Luke and Matthew.

    Same goes for Buddha, Confucius, Mohammad, Socrates and many more.

    If things are not recorded or said directly by the person, they can be easily distorted changed depending on the authours. The proof is that the four gospels have contradictions about certain things which do not need any discussion at the moment.

    You are still not able to respond what is the " Dead Word". You can only talk about the " Living Word" if you are able to explain the former, otherwise it is a futile attempt.

    you write:

    Who is Him God? A mortal being?

    What does the above mean in your mathematical sense? Word means language and what is the Word? This also relates to my other questions to you in the introduction thread about the commandments and I hope you respond to them here in this thread.

    When did John write this and how did he know what he claimed? It is clearly a hearsay which can not even be admitted in the courts of justice.

    What kind of messenger and please explain what an angel looks like and how do angels procreate?

    Yes, it was long and made no sense. I expected a lot more from someone who claims to be a genius in mathematics and have discovered the numbers game in the Bible.

    What do you learn from the following verse in the Bible and this is just one of many?

    Isaiah 13:15-18 If God can find you, he will thrust you through, smash your children to pieces before your eyes, and rape your wife.

    Do you mean that the Mathematical trends make the Bible " The Living Word"? How so?

    My question:

    Your response:

    Some say the Gospel of Mark was written 100 to 125 years later. But let me give you the benefit of the doubt and I like your phrase "narrowed down" which indicates people are unsure about it so it is all guess work which contradicts your claim about the " Living Word" because " Living Word" can not be based on guesstimates.

    Let's try to simplify it in a more logical, mathematical term which is your speciallity.

    Can you please share with us what you did, ate, wore, whom you talked to and about what 5 years ago today?

    Do not forget to give us all the details.

    The fact remains that all Jesus' words are second-hand quotes by Matthew, Mark, Luke, or John. This Son of an omnipotent, omniscient God who could confound the wise men of the temple never wrote his own gospel.

    It only confirms that all is a hearsay. Nothing first hand by Jesus.

    We will talk about breeding goodness in the next interaction.

    Please do not forget to respond about your God's commandment as asked in the Introduction Thread.


    Thanks

    Tejwant Singh
     
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    #2 Tejwant Singh, May 17, 2010
    Last edited: May 17, 2010
  4. mattqatsi

    mattqatsi
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    Re: Mathematics in Scripture?

    I did not think I was dodging the responses, there was one I purposefully avoided but I said I would get back to it later because, at the time, I had spent an hour laying on my side typing that with one hand. I apologize, I should have chosen a day when I was in better health to respond. Thankfully I'm a bit more awake, alert and... energized now.
    Repeating certain things? That was actually all creative, those aren't prepackaged responses, a lot of what I was talking about most people of my own faith would argue with, I was merely... Well, I'm sorry if it came across that way.

    Alright, round 2. What a way to make a good first impression.

    I actually personally strongly disagree with this. Things can be easily distorted, but the Bible was preserved in a way these others weren't. The Quran was written on leaves and bark for two generations until it could be copied down. The Gospels do not provide contradictory points at all. I've looked through every alleged one and they are all easily resolved, sometimes in a beautiful fashion. But I guess where we differ is that I believe these accounts to be Divinely Inspired and therefore preserved by God through the ages, and sometimes that preservation is confirmed by discoveries like this mathematical structure, or older identical manuscripts are found. Like the Dead Sea Scrolls, they helped show that some of our Jewish manuscripts had not been altered for hundreds of years. Things can be distorted by authors, but it becomes apparent that text was not manipulated or lost. This section of Mark for instance, if one word or letter would have been different, all those sevens would not be possible, the whole thing would change, the order would fall apart into disarray.

    I thought I had explained that. The "Dead Word" is something that does not carry real Power behind it, it doesn't shake the mountains or form civilizations or penetrate hearts beyond what is normal. This text is the dead word. I guess you can say, for a better definition, that "Dead Text" doesn't have a consciousness behind it, there isn't a Spirit moving in and through it that shapes and directs the life of the holder.

    Earlier, I was trying to explain what the dead word is as compared to the Living Word through explaining the Living Word through its differences. Dead words can't protect anyone from spiritual forces or guide its reader.

    An immortal Being Who descended and became mortal for our, and His, sake. One who was once mortal but now holds the keys to death and Hades in His hand, One Who has conquered death.

    I'll copy those other questions over a bit later. There was no mathematical backing or meaning to this Verse but I was trying to show that, from the Bible's standpoint, Yeshua is the Word ("The Word" refers to the Bible in whole,) and the Bible is the Message.

    He believed it, Yahweh revealed it to him, John was a prophet. Hearsay? Then it was, from my viewpoint, hearsay from God. What does Yahweh care about human courts? He gives His Word and it's up to us whether to believe it or not.

    I just meant that the word "angel" means "messenger," that would be the dictionary definition. While I certainly believe that angelic beings exist (but don't procreate), I can temporarily be an angel of the Lord, or you can be. But only in the sense of being a messenger, not some sort of spiritual transformation.

    I'd like to pull the sick card, I've been up for nearly 50 hours now. But I apologize, it was disjointed and kind of throwing everything together. But you have to admit trying to describe "The Living Word" is no easy task.

    While taking single verses here and there out of context, especially grand context, is not normally a valid way of studying a Holy Text, this one is a bit "gruesome" in one sense. But also, from the brief context I read, which you should really find a more accurate translation by the way, this serves two purposes. One is, if you've ****** off God, if you're a nation that stands in stark defiance, He will destroy you if He feels like it. This is basically the equivalent of saying "okay guys I've had enough" and he'll unleash the mongols or whatever savage nation there is that hates you against you. He's no longer holding back the floodgates of another culture's hate.
    Also, it is a prophecy against Babylon, which, I hate saying this, but you need to understand a bit more about eschatology to see what this means. It's part of a much larger scale thing and God is saying that because of their horrendous horrendous trespasses, and that they rejected Him even when He showed up again, He's going to stop protecting them, their time is up. A lot of people see this verse today as connected with the FEMA camps being built in America.
    It's a tough topic and terrible to single out a verse that can misunderstood and misconstrued.

    Anything that God Divinely Inspired, He sent His Spirit to help guide the writing, and He would do that for a reason. This Writing has purpose if it's Divinely Inspired. If it has this seal on it, which is BEYOND impossible for man to create, then It is Divinely Inspired. If something is Divinely Inspired, that makes It the Living Word.

    The Living Word can not be based on guesstimates, correct, but look at your argument. The date doesn't change the message, it doesn't change the story, and it doesn't change the Divine seal on it. Why would God go to the effort of preserving part of the Gospel, why would He seal up different sections of It if He didn't intend on preserving It. You keep forgetting the central belief that Scripture came from Inspiration, and that different things help show that. These manuscripts copies numbered in the thousands by a few hundred years after the incident. We have manuscripts from different places, different areas of the world that mostly agree with each other. Some take out sections, like this section of Mark. Ironically enough, the NIV Bible takes out this chunk as well as a few other different ones. I hope I've shown from the Christian perspective why this 12-verse chunk is considered to be Inspired (by the few who know about this.) When the NIV takes all these extra verses out because they didn't appear in some early manuscripts, all of the verses in Mark add up to 666. Ironic because John warned us that the MARK of the Beast would be with a 666. Coincidental? I doubt it especially since God reinforced the belief that this section is Inspired.

    That's where a bit of faith comes in. To me, it makes more sense that His life would be portrayed by four distinct Gospels, especially since there are four distinct beasts surrounding His Throne. It makes sense that Jesus wouldn't compile a list of "do's and don'ts" because if you look at the story of the whole Bible, beginning to end, the reason He came is because He already gave us a list of "Do's and Don'ts" and we kept screwing up to an incredible degree so He took that Law away. He came to lead by example, and what better way to show His example to the world than to have four different accounts of how He acted. He didn't come to say "Stop doing this" and "do that" but to show us how to properly love one another (which I totally failed at today, sorry, I came to learn about Sikhism, not quite to argue my own faith, or at least not to this extreme.)
     
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  5. Tejwant Singh

    Tejwant Singh United States
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    Mattqatsi ji,

    Guru Fateh.

    Thanks for some of the responses. As you are tired and hence not able to think clearly, we shall continue this tomorrow.

    Please do not forget to respond to my other questions.

    One last thing, you as a logical person and seeker of the truth should know that truth needs no FAITH as you claimed at the end because Truth IS.

    Sleep on it tonight and think about it.

    I hope you get enough rest so that contradictions can be erased.

    Take care.

    Tejwant Singh
     
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  6. roopsidhu

    roopsidhu
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    SSA,
    Well done Tejwant ji, I wanted to raise many of the question you have raised already. Thanks a lot. great way of responding to mattqatsi. keep it up.
    roopsidhu
     
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  7. Seeker9

    Seeker9 United Kingdom
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    Sat Sri Akal everyone

    PLease forgive me for being lazy and responding to 2 threads (this one and an earlier mathematical one) in one reply

    In reply to the tile of this particular thread, you may find the attached link useful:
    Shabad, Gurbani, Naam - What Is It?

    With regard to this and the earlier thread, I am intrigued by the mathematical precision you are seeing in the Gospels

    I would also, using an "Occam's razor" type approach, like to think this through logically and see if we can come to any conclusions as to the possible divine origins of such precision. In doing so, I mean no disrespect to the Bible and its teachings

    So here goes...

    - I guess you have been reading an English translation. I think it is fair to say that when you translate anything, you always lose something of the original. And there have been several major English translations of the Bible over the centuries since the Gutenberg Bible appeared in the 15th Century

    -Those English translations may themselves have been translated from other languages like Greek or Latin

    -Those Greek and Latin translations may themselves have been translated from even older scriptures which may have been in Hebrew, Aramaic, Coptic etc

    -The Church has made significant interventions over the centuries in terms of what their official endorsed Bible should include and what the overall fundamental Christian messages should be (see First and Second Council of Nicea)

    So, taking all of the above into consideration, how much of the mathematical patterns are down to deliberate divine intention and how much are down to nature. We see mathematical series in nature all the time......just look at Fibonacci and the Golden Spiral (World Mysteries - Science Mysteries, Fibonacci Numbers and Golden section in Nature)

    So personally, I would be inclined less to look at the numbers and focus more on the great wisdom contained within the Scriptures, which is how we would always approach Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji and which is why for us the question of numbers has never arisen before

    Ultimately, I would like to ask what do the existence of mathematical series in holy scriptures mean? Is it some kind of proof of divine origins?
    Is such proof even necessary?

    So please don't take any offence but my personal view is that such endeavour is a wasted effort and detracts from the main point and purpose which is everything the scriptures represent and their message for mankind

    Thanks for reading
     
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  8. japjisahib04

    japjisahib04 Kuwait
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    I just meant that the word "angel" means "messenger," that would be the dictionary definition. While I certainly believe that angelic beings exist (but don't procreate), I can temporarily be an angel of the Lord, or you can be. But only in the sense of being a messenger, not some sort of spiritual transformation.

    Does it mean God has part time temporary partner to pass His message? How did Jesus recognize them to take their word. Do the temporary partner change their posture or bore special mark?
    Sahni Mohinder
     
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  9. Tejwant Singh

    Tejwant Singh United States
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    Mattqats ji,

    Guru Fateh.

    I hope you have rested well and are preparing yourself to answer my questions that have not been responded yet.

    Allow me to start with your ending post.

    I beg to differ with you. First of all this is an interaction, not an argument.I have no idea what your true intentions are but your posts in the Introduction Thread tell us the other story, like the story BP is telling us how much oil is coming out of the broken pipeline.

    Only a student can be a teacher and through the interaction, we can learn from each other. So, please do not feel defensive about anything. When you have that urge go and re read your own posts about your talking about your own religion to others etc. etc.


    Quote:
    <table border="0" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr> <td class="alt2" style="border: 1px inset;"> Originally Posted by Tejwant Singh [​IMG]
    What do you learn from the following verse in the Bible and this is just one of many?

    Isaiah 13:15-18 If God can find you, he will thrust you through, smash your children to pieces before your eyes, and rape your wife.

    </td> </tr> </tbody></table>
    Your response:

    The first thing you should try to learn is to ask questions rather than jumping to the conclusions about others. In this case about the right translation. How do you know which is the right and wrong translation or is it the one that you have is the only right one?

    You never mentioned in any of your posts while trying to proselytise that some of the translations may not be correct and with that result, your own mathematical calculations may not be up to the par because of that.

    In order to become a learner, one has to learn first and foremost to give the benefit of the doubt rather than doubting others. Hence, it is must to ask question to receive information rather than deciding what they know with your own mindset and preconceived notions.

    I have no idea if you know this, that Portuguese is the closest language to Latin in which the Bible was translated to from Greek and Aramaic. So, in the Christian literati, the translation in Portuguese is considered the most correct one. You should try it in case you have not.

    I am fluent in Portuguese and that verse was taken from the Portuguese Bible and translated by me.So, your logic is quite illogical here I might add. Your preconceived notion about me and where I got the translation from does not do any justice to a learner like you.

    I have heard this trick from many Christians before that the "non- believers" take things out of context but then they fail in their argument when pressed further. FYI, I have lots of friends from all different religions and many of them are scholars in their respective religions and we enjoy our frequent email interactions and our monthly meetings where nothing but our individual perspective of religions is shared and discussed in a meaningful manner. After all we all come from ONE SOURCE.

    http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/qawwali/29392-aawal-allah-noor-ao-paya-ustaad.html#post126498

    And also, I would like to add that I am well versed in the Abrahamic and Eastern religions.

    I consider this my duty being a Sikh, a learner in my personal opinion.

    That is why I mentioned in my first post to make knowledge your best friend rather than your worst enemy and we can only do that by asking questions to others what we do not know rather than jumping to conclusions.

    Now let's get back to your post. First tell me how rape and murder can be taken out of context whether it is YOUR GOD who is doing it or anyone else?

    As now you know a bit about me, I can give you many many verses like that and you will give up justifying these horrendous acts by YOUR GOD because there is no justification and I am sure you are aware of it but accept them as a blind faith which is mathematically irrational and contradicts your own logic of mathematics because blind faith makes people blind and takes the truth out of it. The fact of the matter is Truth needs no faith, no belief. As mentioned before Truth IS. You as a truth seeker should know that.

    Your above statement makes one come to the conclusion that YOUR GOD is not omnipotent- ALL POWERFUL. Let me put it another way by asking you a question.

    If you had ALL THE MONEY IN THE WORLD, then who else would have it?The logical answer is NO ONE else.

    Now, you may say "but I can share that money with others" which would be very kind on your part but then you would cease to have ALL THE MONEY IN THE WORLD.

    So, just think about the above a bit deeper in a logical sense and let me know what conclusion you come to.

    Before we discuss what prophecy means, I would like you to read the following thread.

    http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/sikh-sikhi-sikhism/30035-karni-nama-raj-nama-sikh-book.html

    Secondly, One can easily conclude from your argument that your God is not omnipotent, a lousy teacher and father, is a punisher rather than loving whom you call just. Let me give you another example.
    A loving God would do like a loving parent and put plastic locks in the electrical outlets, locks on doors to cleaning fluids, etc. NOT say, look there is some battery acid,I am going away and it is right here in your room, but do not play with it.

    No, it is not misunderstood. Rape and killing people into pieces especially by someone who is ALL POWERFUL GOD is a horrible thing and we should reject it rather than embrace it because by embracing it, it shows what kind of moral grounds we stand on.


    Quote:
    <table border="0" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr> <td class="alt2" style="border: 1px inset;"> Originally Posted by Tejwant Singh [​IMG]
    Some say the Gospel of Mark was written 100 to 125 years later. But let me give you the benefit of the doubt and I like your phrase "narrowed down" which indicates people are unsure about it so it is all guess work which contradicts your claim about the " Living Word" because " Living Word" can not be based on guesstimates.
    </td> </tr> </tbody></table>
    Your response:

    Once again you have nothing to counter my argument with. If you do not know what Jesus said how can someone inspire you to find out and you write that after 50 years?

    The fact is that no one knows the real message. So It makes no sense when you claim that the message has not been changed when you have no idea what Jesus said in the first place.

    There is the basic thing missing here, which is called logic and you call yourself the expert in it.

    BTW, I am still waiting for the response to your actions 5 years ago.:)

    Why didn't Jesus write his own Gospel?

    I am learning a lot from our interaction.

    Thanks for giving me this opportunity.

    Regards

    Tejwant Singh
     
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    #8 Tejwant Singh, May 17, 2010
    Last edited: May 18, 2010
  10. roopsidhu

    roopsidhu
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    there is no other living word than words of Sri guru granth sahib ji
     
  11. Tejwant Singh

    Tejwant Singh United States
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    RoopSidhu ji,

    Guru Fateh.

    I agree with you. We are the true people of " The Book", because SGGS, our only Guru is all first hand and original. No hearsays written after 100's of years.

    Regards

    Tejwant Singh
     
  12. Astroboy

    Astroboy Malaysia
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    ਨਾਮ ਤੇਰੇ ਕੀ ਜੋਤਿ ਲਗਾਈ (Previously namjap)
    Writer SPNer Contributor

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    I would like to throw some light on THE LIVING WORD as appears in the Bible, Sufi Order and Sri Guru Granth Sahib.

    In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God,
    and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God.
    All things were made by Him: and without Him was not anything made
    that was made. In Him was life; and life was the light of men...
    John 1:1-5

    Abdul Razaq Kashi tells us,
    The Great Name (ism-i-azam) is the very essence and life of all names.
    Its manifested form (Shabd) is supporting the entire creation,
    It is the great sea in which we all appear as waves.
    He alone can understand this mystery who belongs to our order.​
    SHABD IS NOT THE SUBJECT OF READING, RITUAL OR RECITING The Inner Sound Principle is All-Conscious
    and too subtle for the ears, the tongue and the pen. It is an Unwritten Law and an Unspoken Language.
    It is self-existing, self-sustaining and self-supporting and yet is the very life of all that exists both in the
    animate and inanimate creation. But It can be realized in the deepest depths of the soul, for the two are
    of the same essence, the soul being but a drop of the Ocean of All-Consciousness. In the Sikh scriptures,
    It is also called "Sacha Shabd" or the True Word:

    Sriraag M.3 (Ang 35)
    Page 35, Line 16
    ਸਚੈ ਸਬਦਿ ਮਨੁ ਮੋਹਿਆ ਪ੍ਰਭਿ ਆਪੇ ਲਏ ਮਿਲਾਇ ॥
    सचै सबदि मनु मोहिआ प्रभि आपे लए मिलाइ ॥
    Sacẖai sabaḏ man mohi▫ā parabẖ āpe la▫e milā▫e.
    God joins to Himself those whose minds are fascinated with the True Word of His Shabad.
    Guru Amar Das - view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok


    Page 117, Line 8
    ਉਤਪਤਿ ਪਰਲਉ ਸਬਦੇ ਹੋਵੈ ॥
    उतपति परलउ सबदे होवै ॥
    Uṯpaṯ parla▫o sabḏe hovai.
    Creation and destruction happen through the Word of the Shabad.
    Guru Amar Das - view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
     
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