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What Does Meditation Mean In Sikhism?

Discussion in 'Questions and Answers' started by kggr001, Jul 6, 2014.

  1. kggr001

    kggr001 Netherlands
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    What I think that meditating means is becoming super conscious, being one with the divine. I believe that everyone has his/her own way of doing that. One might do it in the vedic ways, the other might meditate by doing sewa, The other by reading and understanding the GGS ji. And some other person might be meditate by just realizing the greatness of the lord. These 4 methods works for me someone else might have his/her own ways to feel connected to the one.

    meditation.jpg

    How does Sikhi define Meditation, and how should one meditate in Sikhi?
     
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  3. Luckysingh

    Luckysingh Canada
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    May be we should try and address what ""meditation'' means outside of sikhi, if anything different.

    The problem is that many of us have our own versions of meditation, including what and how it is done.
     
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  4. itsmaneet

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    I agree with your above views. Meditating on the Gurmantar 'Waheguru' is most appropriate for a Sikh.

    Gurfateh !
     
  5. Harkiran Kaur

    Harkiran Kaur Canada
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    Meditate to me = Focus / Concentration.

    So when it says meditate upon ______ to me its saying focus upon ______ or concentrate upon _______.

    How one decides to do this may differ from someone else. Sitting Cross legged, eyes closed, naam jaap / simran - for others it might be while doing seva thinking of Waheguru in their mind... but I think the general idea is to consciously focusing inward, and concentration.
     
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  6. Seeker9

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    Probably means much the same as with a lot of other paths. The mind naturally is full of thoughts that are attached to our human lives. Some means is required to still the mind as completely as you can. Once in that clean clear state, you are more conducive to reflecting on spiritual matters
     
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  7. Seeker9

    Seeker9 United Kingdom
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    All I guess I should clarify my last post by saying that I am not saying there are secret words, physical positions, special times, rituals lighting candles etc. To me the goal is to discipline an undisciplined mind.
     
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  8. Abneet

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    Naam Simran is seen as contemplative meditation whether using the Mool Mantar or Vaheguru.The thing that you can say it 125,000 times or so but you have to have full focus to gain benefits of Naam Simran. The thing is what to focus on? If you need something to focus in your mind, focus on the picture of guru nanak dev ji that Sant Nand Singh managed because he did luckily get a real glimpse at him. :sippingcoffeemunda: But to the point, it can take a lot of practice to have your mann set straight and away from bad thoughts. Now I'm not telling you to quit your job and just meditate rest of your life lol, but doing seva and naam simran can really be beneficial to one practicing Naam. Both go together very well.

    Now others might say kundalini yoga practice and meditation are part of Sikhi. As of today, it looks like it is quite popular west of America. Though in the future it should not be allowed due to people practicing and doing nonsense rituals behind it.
     
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  9. Gyani Jarnail Singh

    Gyani Jarnail Singh Malaysia
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    Meditation..renunciation..bathing at sacred places, recitations of mantars, jaaps, pilgrimages, etc etc etc had been going on since ages before Guru nanak ji..the question to consider is whether we believe that Guru Nanak ji.s Divine Message is simply OLD wine in a ew bottle or recycled Message already revealed in the Vedas Puranas Kitabs...??

    OR do we believe that Guru nanak ji and His Divine Message is a Complete NEW Gyaan of the Creator..a Brand New way of doing things..new ways, new language, new meanings to old words..new paathways...new thoughts...new METHODS of KNOWING the CREATOR. Why did the GURU go to Kailash Parbatt, Mecca Medina, Benares, hardwaar, Kanshi, Mathura..and what did the Guru discuss with the assembled Yogis, mahapurahs, maha Gyanis Pirs and Sanyaisees etc etc ? These people were WELL versed..in fact the MASTERS of the OLD WAYS..established and founded with deep roots...Did the GURU hold the dialogue - IMPORTANT ENOUGH for Guru Ji to write it down as Siddh Ghosht. Is Siddh Ghosht ENDORSING what the Yogis saadhs holy men were doing ? Guru Ji saw them sitting cross legged, eyes closed, chanting, etc etc etc...is there even ONE TUK in the entire SGGS ENDORSING those ways and methods of "meditation" renunciation jaaps mantars etc etc ?? IF NOT then we ahve to consider why didnt Guru Ji endorse them....but TUKS condemning these unnecessary methods etc are many...

    Did Guru Ji just Change from Har har mahadev to vaheguru ?? Har har Mahadev and many other chants were being used for Meditation etc....did GURU ji say Waheguru is better ?? IN fact the earlier Names of the Creator are many and used in the GURUbani..much more than Waheguru which is used only by the Bhatts and the word is NOT a "name" per se but an EXCLAMATION !!! ( WONDROUS GURU Wah-Guru).
    So are we so buys Counting the TREES that we forget to Taste the Fruit..when the GURU clearly directs us..EAT and DIGEST...Khaveh Bhuncheh tis ka hoyeh udharoh..ONLY those who eat, chew.. and digest food get its benefits.. same for Mann Food !!

    Guru Nanak ji STRESSED ACTION...KARAM....Karmee aveh Kapprrah....YOUR ACTIONS RESULT in HONOUR /dishonour !! The GURU WORKED..He married..He travelled..he preached..He sweated..he earned and He SHARED. The Very Same things that the CREATOR DOES...HE ACTS via His laws and Nature etc..He is a DOER..and He distributes..DENDA DEH laindeh thaak paiyeh...

    The SIKH is an ACTION fellow..he works..he earns honest labour..he shares..he has discipline..he takes RESPONSIBILITES ( the sadhus and Yoguis shirked responsibility)..he is a Benefit to society, the samaaj..he is social (not recluse sitting in underground caves or in jungles)..

    2. SIKHS have "Darshan" of the Jagdee JYOT of Das Patshahs SGGS DAILY on doing parkash and Paath. This is merely looking..REAL DARSHAN is FOLLOWING and adopting the Gurus HUKMNAMAH after it has been taken or lsitened to...
    With the Jagdee Jyot of 10 Gurus present before us..SOME stubbornly continue to claim their Waddeh baba Ji had a "glimpse" of Guru nanak Ji..others claim they saw Guru gobind Singh Ji on a Horse in Hemkunt..blah blah blah. Whatever for ?? There is NOT a single claim in our History that Sikhs contineud to pine for a "glimpse" of Guru nanak ji when the Guru was Guru Angad Sahib Ji...No one had any glimpses of Guru Angad Sahib Ji when Guru Amardass Ji was GURU..and so on...ARE we SIKHS of the post 1708 era...been bitten by RABID DOGS that we HALLUCINATE ?? we have "glimpses" of GURUS that are no longer around BUT CANNOT SEE the GURU PRESENT as SGGS..a GURU that was commanded to be accepted as SOLE GURU by the Predecessor Guru gobind Singh Ji ?? Are we admitting that we DONT actually have Full FAITH in the SGGS as GURU..we still "need to hallucinate" that we saw this Guru and that Guru ??And we then put those "hallucinations" on to a Canvas Via a THIRD Party (portrait painter) and claim that the hallucination is the REAL GURU NANAK ?? I think thats really a case for Anti-Rabies injections. Didnt the GURUS have the Very BEST painters, portrait artists who would have painted the most authentic portraits like the ones we have of the Mughal Emperors ?? WHY didnt the GURS ALLOW such paintings and have their PERSONAL histories RECORDED ?? They wrote their Gurbani themselves..BUT didnt do all that stuff ???? Are we better than Guru nanak ji to imagine "the real" Guru nanak ?? and install that photo in Sikh homes as authentic ??

    Part two to follow...
     
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  10. Abneet

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    The Gursikhs are here to bring Sikhs closer to GGS. If they do their own manmat thats not according to GGS then we should know its wrong. Speaking of seeing glimpse of Gurus. Jarnail Ji, it is a blessing to get darshan of our guru 's in our lifetime, but even better to merge with the One. Baba Nand Singh did so much kirat and seva in his life why are you scolding such people. He got that picture for people to focus on something when doing simran. You wanna start bashing on the concept of Naam Simran? He saw GGS as Satguru Nanak Devi Ji. He brought people closer to GGS and taught people. We can judge others, but ask first how much have we done ourselves? Including me I am nothing compared to them the real Sants have done their seva in this world and left. We should be inspired by them and take their sayings of having faith in GGS and study it.
     
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  11. Gyani Jarnail Singh

    Gyani Jarnail Singh Malaysia
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    SGGS declares.."darshan parseeyeah Guru keh Janam maran DUKH jayeh..."...
    Are we sikhs being asked merely to go to Gurdwara daily (or even once in a blue moon)..pick up the rumallah..and have 'darshan"...do aprkirma and all our dukhs janam maran goes away..or just mathatek..and "darshan" routine is complete...or sit a while..and listen...to the granthi/pathi singh muttering away..and think thats it..duty done..mission accomplished...??

    IMHO.."darshan" implies ACTION...we have to LIVE our life..CHANGE our habits..follow the Gurmatt way..only then can we hope for GURPARSAAD to get the phall we desire...sadly 99% of us are satisfied with the the actions in first para as "Darshan"....

    Some clever ones claim they have seen the "CHEF"...but cant see the RECIPE...or even take the effort to COOK/Bake as per the recipe...Can looking at an imaginary painting of the CHEF..do any good ??..we have to get off our butt and ACT..buy the ingredients, do what the recipe requires..bake the cake..EAT it..chew IT..and get the benefits....ONLY then is it Mission accomplished. No Amount of closed eyes, mutters, sitting cross legged, in darkness or dimmed lights... whatever are going to get the cake baked.....Haan Ji..accepted that AFTER the cake has been baked, chewed eaten and digested..we can sit back and relax..closed eyes, crossed legs..lights dimmed..and REFLECT on the feeling...BLISS...taste of the cake on our tongues and on our minds...NAAM...BUT bake the cake first...
     
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  12. Gyani Jarnail Singh

    Gyani Jarnail Singh Malaysia
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    The REAL BLESSING is SGGS....what the GURU Himself gifted us..left it for us..ordained us to obey...1429 pages of the SGGS..Needs SEVERAL LIFETIMES....just as the Gurus needed 10 to give it to us..we need many many more than 10 to really appreciate it...so I fail to see any "blessing" elsewhere. I am already 65..have spent the past 60 years at the Lotus Charan of SGGS..still find myself at EK Oangkaar...as an Woodworth wrote..I have many miles to go..many promsies to keep before i sleep..Din gavaeh khhan vich..raat gavai sunn vich..life is short....FOCUS on EK Oangkaar takes so much effort..why waste time on imaginary paintings no one can authenticate.

    Apologies if you saw my writing as "scolding"...not my intention..I ma just very PASSIONATE about what I beleive in..so get a little carried away but never compromise on satikaar of SGGS.

    You are a student..do you study your text books or you need a picture of the professor to "focus" on the questions in the exam ???..I would tell my studnets to FOCUS on the TEXT....not a picture of mine as their teacher..and thats WHY GURU SAHIBS didnt have their portraits painted...They did not want their SIKHS to keep on focussing on their faces/bodies...and neglect the Gurbani/Gurmatt.
     
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  13. Abneet

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    I see what your saying. Doing bhagti does help us mentally to fight the panj chor in our mind. Naam Simran is there to help us. I only referred to that picture while doing Naam Simran. While reciting Bani that picture is irrelevant you have to then focus and analyze the text. Is Naam Simran what Guru Nanak Devi Ji really went against? Also The Khalsa fight the panj chor daily. On top of that your right, we shouldn't just be worried about bhagti but focus on kirat too. Honest work has to be done too no doubt. But bhagti is done to help you spiritually in this world. Both can be done. One should balance with the other. But we choose what we want to focus on. These days, many Sikhs,especially in Punjab, aren't interested in working to make a change.

    On the point of Sants, I see no problem of them giving bachans and such to sangat to help with their jeevan and having sevadaars with them to do kirat and honest selfless service. But when they reach anti-gurmat views not according to guru ji's teachings then we have a problem. GGS is our guru but we can't see that. Many Sikhs don't see GGS as the Divine Truth taught by our Gurus. Gyani ji, most of the high jeevan hard-working Sikhs aren't the ones running the Panth at the moment. Sikhs in authority only have divine education. Sikhs should have worldly and divine education. Both make you strong as steel. We are in a bad state where Sikhs are running to the nearest dera for their problems or meditation camps or such gurus that say they have mystical powers where they cannot understand the GGS has the full package deal. Going to gurdwaras seeing Sikhs listening shabads, eat langar, and go back to their normal life. We are the ones who don't realize we are doing things wrong. As Sikhs, especially Amritdharis, we are silent helping out with the community and going on with our live without making a change around us. Unlike Khalsa Aid though who are doing a great job. Hopefully that changes soon.
     
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  14. Luckysingh

    Luckysingh Canada
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    The only real fact about what is and what isn't meditation, is the fact that it is ONLY done with the MIND.
    Only your Mind is in contemplative simran if it is with that single-pointed thought of 'waheguru'.
    True simran and meditation happens when 'waheguru' is at the forefront of all activity in the Mind.
    It doesn't matter if you are doing some active seva, jap or listening/singing shabad/kirtan....


    The problem is that people don't understand that it is the Mind that does simran and not anything else.
    However, one may use any tool that he or she feels comfortable with and in my opinion that is never manmatt.

    You can jap all you want until your tongue fatigues, or use a rosary, or stare into a candle flame or other object......(whatever tickles your fancy!)...But,if you are doing any of these and your Mind is busy running in all directions of thoughts, then I'm afraid there is no meditation/simran going on.

    Nevertheless, if someone finds that using a rosary or sitting in front of Guru Nanak's (nanaksar)portrait, can help them maintain that 'single-pointed focus''......Then in my opinion that is totally acceptable..... Because the MIND is meditating and it doesn't matter what tool you use or seva activity you are doing.
    What is seva of your hands ?
    What is seva of your tongue ?

    Other members enjoy their humble lifestyles of poking fun at my parroting... BUT my questions is... ''How do you know if I'm parroting or doing all my simran in my mind'' ??

    You can't really see inside me can you.. ?
    Who knows more about my being 'antarghat' ??......me or someone else ?

    Gyanji, is comparing Guru Nanak's teachings as whether it is the same old vedic rus(wine) in a new bottle ,or a newer rus in a newer or old bottle..!!
    Problem is, that you are not tasting any rus at all, but just comparing the bottles.

    How can you ever compare the contents without experiencing them ?
    The MIND is inside the bottle, and whatever the parrot dancing on top of the bottle may be doing, it is not going to tell anyone what the MIND inside is doing...
     
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  15. Harry Haller

    Harry Haller United Kingdom
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    A bit like Brahmins in Hinduism!!
     
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  16. chazSingh

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    meditation, meditation, meditation...that age old topic...

    i missed my amrit vela simran last night...mind was too overpowering..."go back to sleep, do it tomorow...you have a busy day at work, you need the extra sleep"..

    and i failed...i went back to sleep...

    now i'm sat at work with this heart tearing feeling of being so seperate to Waheguru, that i'm reading gurbani, partaking in this forum, and trying to do my work duties with a smile on my face and as truthfully and lovingly as i can..

    but nothing....nothing beats that moment, during those magical ours of the night where that distance doesn't seem so much, and the thirst is quenched a little...these powerful moments where my doubts are removed and confirmation is made that no matter what happens in the day ahead...waheguru is right here with me...

    teeth get dirty when we miss brushing them in the morning...
    mind soon starts to waver again when contemplation on Waheguru Ji stops..
     
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  17. Tejwant Singh

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    This is a request to ALL who are participating in this thread.

    Meditation or whatever name one calls it by is a personal endeavour. Therefore all participants should say that it is their personal experience which can never be duplicated by anyone else and it is NOT a blanket statement for all Sikhs because many do disagree with this stance.
    They have no right to speak for any other Sikh..

    Thanks & regards

    Tejwant Singh
     
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  18. Abneet

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    It is part of Sikhi and in every meryada as I know of.
     
  19. Tejwant Singh

    Tejwant Singh United States
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    No it is not because everyone has a different meaning for it. The proof is in my other post where it clearly shows that many words in Gurbani are used as meditation. So, common sense would dictate it does not have ONE UNIVERSAL meaning in Sikhi as per SGGS, our only Guru.

    And secondly, please read my post again."it is their personal experience which can never be duplicated by anyone else".

    Tejwant Singh
     
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  20. kggr001

    kggr001 Netherlands
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    The Guru's and the Bhagats pretty much felt the same experience. The were literally and figuratively speaking one with the lord.
     
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  21. Tejwant Singh

    Tejwant Singh United States
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    Please post the proof of your claim from the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, our only Guru and also prove that their meanings of "meditation" are the same as your personal ones because as I showed you from the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji in my earlier post, the word Meditation is used for different words.

    Sikhi is all about pragmatism and reasoning, not what we may feel to be true.



    Tejwant Singh
     
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