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Was Rajneesh The Right Person to Translate Japji Sahib?

Discussion in 'Interfaith Dialogues' started by Veeru, Nov 10, 2006.

  1. Veeru

    Veeru
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    I saw a very nasty video by Rajneesh that it would be shameful for a Sikh to even post it here. I have heard from many people that Rajneesh has described japji Sahib very well. I am wondering if people agree that Rajneesh was not the appropriate person to do vyakhya on Japji Sahib. I don't believe he was a spiritual.
     
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  3. Arvind

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    If you are really interested, then you need to spend more time to read and understood Osho Rajneesh well... and not just comment based on one or a few videos or books.
     
  4. Hai_Bhi_Sach

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    :up:
    Well said Arvind ji. I second it.
     
  5. vaapaaraa

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    he had told that only Guru Nanak Ji was enlightened, and the other Gurus were ordinary ppl, he was widely attacked by Sikhs and but got saved from death.

    Dont follow fools like Osho. He used to read all day in library, thats where he got his "knowledge".
     
  6. Arvind

    Arvind
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    Question: How many of members have heard or read Osho's translation first hand... without getting influenced by his other trains of thoughts.
     
  7. Veeru

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    Let's put it this way. Spirituality is like pure water. Even a single drop of dirty water in it destroys it all...
     
  8. Tejwant Singh

    Tejwant Singh United States
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    Rajneesh was a charlaton and a criminal. His sect OSHO had plans to poison the city water system is Oregon. Fortunatley they were caught before the crime took place. They commited other crimes. His right hand adviser was jailed for bribery. Free sex/ group sex were mode de jour at his Ashrams. In order to avoid prison, Rajneesh agreed to be deported.

    With the character like this, it becomes an insult if one claims to interpret Guru Nanak's Gurbani.

    Lotus can grow in muck however not all kinds of muck can make a lotus grow. Rajneesh belonged to the latter.I have listened to Rajneesh's interpretation of japji. Nothing to write home about. Too much Hindutva in it.

    Tejwant
     
  9. A_Learner

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    Folks, it is very easy to criticize somebody. And especially those who are spiritually connected. Whatever character Rajneesh had should not be the question, your intension should be to find out whether he did a good job in explaining the meaning of Japji Sahib or not.... (A true soul can be of a sex worker, while a filthy one can be of pundit )

    And I think he has done an excellent job. I have listened to his translation and, from my experience, I can say that his viyakha was completely lucid and comprehensive. One of the best I have heard.
    Guru Nanak's banis have extra-ordinary depth, comparatively. And he has done well in exploring that.

    At the end of the translation you become a bigger fan of Guru Nanak's explanations than Rajneesh.
    I think his translation should be recorded done in English too.


    :up:
     
  10. Archived_member2

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    Pray Truth for all and say Satsriakaal!
    Dear all!

    Rajneesh Jee was a professor of philosophy. He was a great orator. God blessed him with higher consciousness than usual. God also arranged great Satsangs through him.

    Explaining Japujee is not restricted to ignorant Baabaas only. All spiritually progressing persons get fascinated with its Wisdom.

    For the true Gurus JAPU or Simran of Naam or Sabad is first and must to realize Truth. Osho Jee skipped but the word JAPU explaining Japujee. I wonder. Why?


    Balbir Singh
     
  11. simpy

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    no wonder Veer Balbir Ji is in his favor:


    me neech cannot thank Dhan Dhan Siri Guru Sahibaan enough for blessing us with Gurbani-DHAN DHAN SIRI GURU GRANTH SAHIB

    me neech is humbly asking for everybody's forgiveness
     
  12. Archived_Member1

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    they also succeeded in poisoning the food in 10 restaurants with salmonella bacteria... making 800 people sick and hospitalizing at least 50. it was the first bioterrorism attack on american soil.

    great guy, that rajneesh. :}:)

    so what if he translated/interpreted japji sahib. so have many SIKH scholars with less dirty backgrounds.
     
  13. simpy

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    'Translating Japji' IS THE TRICK TO ATTRACT FOLLOWERS. THAT'S ALL.

    A show off of borrowed knowledge AS HIS OWN.......
     
  14. Sikh80

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    Even Mr. Khushwant singh has also made his own translation and has stated many things about jap ji sahib. Translation ,in a democracy, is free for all with no strings attached. Where is the risk?

    Osho/Rajnish has a good following in India. There are many centres in almost al big cities.
     
  15. bhupipadam

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    Dear Gursikhs,
    Had any one created any thing or write any thing that should explain Gurbani and osho rajneesh did that in Japji Sahib,s translation in front of giani zail singh. we are all bound imperfectionist bcoz no body is complete and who will make normal humans to understand guru,s bani like japji sahib. dont say who did it just read it and how well he explained it that should be the point of consideration. by talking on this kind of issue we are again into personalisation process as it was 500 years back. Gurus themselves did enter bani of different saints into Guru Granth Sahib symbolises that only the word in the praise of God will be considered nothing else,then why this kind of personalised question like he was eligible for describing Jap ji sahib. Do u people agree that we ourself are eligible for talking like this for any one like osho or some one else or even me or urself ,,,, why we are talking non sense for nothing just forget the word criticise and learn the word meditation , start doing it u ll find hidden quotes by God that ll make ur mouth shut and u ll stop criticising any thing for ever . criticising will bring ur moral down in spirituality bcoz God never ever did any thing wrong till date ....... rest is all upto ur knowledgability if u could understand silence of God. Gurfateh......
     
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  16. Shamsheer Singh

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    Can u shre the proof where Acharya Rajnish says that only Guru Nanak Sahib was enlightened and others wern't...When you claim something you claims it with proofs. Otherwise ur claims is nothing but a VOID!
     
  17. pk70

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    Osho was very learned person and he grasped pretty much well what he studied, he could recall from his memory any reference he wanted to. After having said that, I must say, he had no originality to pass on, just like a Math teacher, who can teach but cannot introduce new principles to solve problems. If you read his interpretation of Jap ji, you would never go into the depth Guru Nanak takes you if he is understood. Osho talked on hear say, never stuck to the idea Guru tries to pass on. Just one example, about Guru Nanak, whose mind was embracing Lord as infinite, who leads the soul to move on higher through realm of knowledge, Osho wrote” when Nanak died, he thought about his birth place( as he witnessed that) and imagined flowers were blooming…’ Osho could have done so , not Guru Nanak, there is no place in Jap ji about such whims of mind. I listened to his tapes, read his books and also especially went through his interpretation of Japji, couldn’t find it impressive in any way, I mean not even the vast knowledge he displayed in his other discourses or books, it lacked it here. He was a real master of words, many did fall for that art; however, mind fixed on logic and its application as he did, would not get influenced by him in any way. So Sikhs should not feel better that he did any better job in interpreting Jap ji, it can be systematically torn apart by taking support from Guru Nanak’s ideology alone.
     
  18. A_Learner

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    I take that you did not like the translation/presentation Rajnesh made. Well, that is your take.
    But I loved it. There were so much unknown that he was able to explore. I haven't read or heard anybody explaining japji Sahib with such lucidity.
    I mean who was able to explain Infinity-Infinities!!

    I don't think it was done for 'showoff'. And even if it was done to impress you with his knowledge, it should not effect you. I think the intention should be to able understand & assist in meditation.

    A story goes a Dhagi-Baba told a woman that her ailing husband will be pain free, if she serves food to Baba for one year and utter waheguru's name during cooking & serving. And she started bringing food to him. She had to cover a lot of distance from her place and cross a river to reach Baba's place. But she meticously & religiously would serve him food while uttering the true name. In the monsoon season, the husband gets well and woman asks Baba to accompany her to their home to bless their place. The river was flooded & woman asks Baba to follow her lead to reach the other side. Now Baba is scared of the river and tells the woman she has gone crazy in asking him to clear the river. But woman persists that she has been doing it for months by uttering waheguru's name, as per Baba's instructions.

    Moral of the Story - EVEN if a not so liked/ dishonest person puts you in the right path, it is still good for you and works in your favor.

    We are not debating the personality & character of Rajesh. Whereas we are discussing his oration & transalation of Japji Sahib. And I think he has done it extremly well. So my appreciations to him for exposing certain things my novice mind was not able to conceptualize.

    Waheguru ji ka khalsa. Waheguru ji ke fateh.
     
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  19. pk70

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    I wrote in favor of his being intelligence, his art of words. Point out a single sentence where I went personal by attacking his personal life ?( who did, it is their take to weigh a person who comments on Spiritual Master like Guru Nanak, so let them have this liberty, please read the name of the thread)

    I want you to post any thing that is lucid and that impressed you on Jap ji by Osho, you are talking as if you had read all other Japji interpretations; I doubt that; however, if you say so, I take your word but it also proves, under his impression, you have forgot that due to compact form of Japji, Osho explanation falls short. So please, to prove your impression, post his any interpretation, I shall see how much lucidity is there, keeping in mind Guru Nanak ideology in totality There are many Osho lovers out there who advocate his lower mentality comments about Lord Christ too, so I am aware of that too. I do not need to take his personality to discuss here. If they claim his interpretation is lucid, I have to resist it on the basis of Guru Nanak ideology. Thanks.
     
  20. A_Learner

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    I wrote in favor of his being intelligence, his art of words. Point out a single sentence where I went personal by attacking his personal life ?( who did, it is their take to weigh a person who comments on Spiritual Master like Guru Nanak, so let them have this liberty, please read the name of the thread)

    'Name' of thread is - Was Rajneesh The Right Person to Translate japji Sahib?
    Was Rajneesh The Right Person - That indicates you are judging the person's knowledge or personal characterter.
    There is no animosity here. It seems that you have taken opinion bit personally. My opinion is my view point. And I am certainly free to put forward my opinion.


    I want you to post any thing that is lucid and that impressed you on Jap ji by Osho,

    I provided that in my earlier post about - Infinite Infinities.


    you are talking as if you had read all other Japji interpretations; I doubt that;

    Again Singh Sahib - This is a discussion forum....you do not even know or have met me. And yet you are able to pass judgment about my knowledge. I have heard/read transalations atleast in double figures- Just FYI. And I wouldn't like to politicize this topic.

    I clearly stated that it 'seems' that you did not like the translation. But I did.
    You and I have two different minds and the differences are bound to happen. But don't underestimate anybody's knowledge or view point.


    however, if you say so, I take your word but it also proves, under his impression, you have forgot that due to compact form of Japji, Osho explanation falls short.

    I am not sure what you meant by 'compact form of Japji'. And how his explanation falls short. Guru Nanak's bani as said - 'Baani dhooroh chal keh aayi'. So whether form it is in 'compact or expanded' is again an opinion.

    So please, to prove your impression, post his any interpretation, I shall see how much lucidity is there, keeping in mind Guru Nanak ideology in totality

    Again I have put forth my view point. And it seems you have done that too.
    I am not sure what good will it do by posting a couplet of his translation and you passing out a judgment.

    According to you it is not lucid whereas I think it is. Lets end it there!!

    There are many Osho lovers out there who advocate his lower mentality comments about Lord Christ too, so I am aware of that too. I do not need to take his personality to discuss here. If they claim his interpretation is lucid, I have to resist it on the basis of Guru Nanak ideology.

    What is Guru Nanak's ideology? You refer it quite often and seem to understand it well. Please share your thoughts.


    Thanks
     
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  21. pk70

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    You bring Osho’s interpretation; I shall explain you one by one. Thanks:)
     

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