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** Waheguru Gurmantar **

Discussion in 'Sikh Sikhi Sikhism' started by kaur-1, Mar 2, 2007.

  1. kaur-1

    kaur-1
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    Source:Singhs at Crossroads » Blog Archive » Waheguru Gurmantar


    Thanks to "ToTheMax" Team (sevaToTheMax.com and SikhiToTheMax.com)




    Waheguru Gurmantar

    WaheguruJeeKeeFateh WaheguruJeeKaaKhalsa
    Due to the recent trend by anti sikh cults to confuse the Sikh population on what the the Gurmantar is. The ‘Tothemax’ teams have been busy translating articles and chapters from knowledgble Gursikhs past and present to confront these vile distortions.

    The translation below is in three parts and is from the reknowed author on Gursikh Rehat and theology, Bhai Sahib Subehdar Behgal Singh Jee. The chapter is taken from his well reasearched book on ‘Waheguru Gurmantar’. We know the chapter is a long one, so we split it in 3 parts, please try and read all the parts, the knowledge in this chapter is priceless.
    As this is seva, please forgive us for any shortcomings on the translation, these are all our faults and nothing to do with Subedhar Jee. Please pray to Akal Purakh that he lets his moorakh children continue in this seva.
    WaheguruJeeKaaKhalsa WaheguruJeeKeeFateh!!


    Waheguru Gurmantar
    O Beloved, the word ‘Waheguru’ is the ‘Gurmantar’. Contemplate upon it and get rid of egotism.
    Quote from Bhai Gurdas Jee’s Varan 13/2
    vwihgurU gurU mMqR hY jp haumYN KoeI]
    vaahiguroo guroo ma(n)thr hai jap houmai(n) khoee||
    His Guru-manta is Vahiguru, whose recitation erases egotism.
    Get rid of the selfhood and then see your real Self. Its only with these godly virtues will you get beaded together with the virtuous Waheguru.
    Awp gvwey Awp hY gux guxI proeI ]
    aap gavaaeae aap hai gun gunee paroee ||a||
    Losing egotism and merging into the qualities of the supreme Lord, he himself becomes full of qualities.
    See Bhai Nand Lall’s gazal 19:
    Bhr qr& ik nzr krd hUey Xwr Awmd ]
    Bahar taraf ki nazar karad, hoo-ay zaar aamad.
    Which ever side I look, I only see the face of the Beloved.
    and gazal 22:
    hr jw ik ibMgrMd jmwly qy ibMgrMd ]
    Har jaa ki bingrandh zmaalay tay bingrandh.
    Holy evolved souls, wherever they look they only see Your form.

    jo bolq hY imRg mIn pMKyrU su ibnu hir jwpq hY nhI hor ]3]
    jo bolath hai mrig meen pa(n)khaeroo s bin har jaapath hai nehee hor ||3||
    Whatever the deer, the fish and the birds sing, they chant to the Lord, and no other. ||3|
    Gurmantar is that religious mantar or chant given to a Gursikh when he is initiated into the religious fold. This is a seed-form mantar or chant specially chosen from all the other words in the religious text.
    Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji has blessed Gursikhs with the Gurmantar, Waheguru. Setting aside the chant ‘Waheguru’ in the house of Sri Guru Nanak Sahib Ji and accepting some other word to be the gurmantar, is akin to turning your back towards Sikh way of life. If any person, regarding himself as the Sikh of Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji Maharaj, does not accept and does not contemplate upon the word ‘Waheguru’ as the Gurmantar, then he is an apostate, he is certainly not a Sikh. Bhai Prahlaad Singh, in a rahetnaamaa (Sikh code of conduct) quotes the tenth master Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji:-

    vwihgrU ky mMqR ibn jpY AOr koeI jwp]
    so swkq, isK mUl nih, bjn hY sRI muKvwk ]7]
    Waheguru kay mantar bin japai aur koee jaap.
    So saakat, Sikh mool nahi, bachan hai sree mukhvaak.
    If one contemplates upon a mantar other that the mantar ‘Waheguru’, He is an apostate, he is definitely not a Sikh.
    These are the words of Sri (Guru Gobind Singh Ji’s). (Code of conduct of Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji by Bhai Praladh Singh)
    In this very rehatnamaa in the 31st couplet Bhai Prahladh Singh Ji writes about the quote of the tenth Guru, in which Guru Ji says that without the ‘Waheguru’ mantar, the story of man’s life is false:
    Akwl purK ky bcn isau pRgt culwXo pMQ ]
    sB isKn ko bcn hY, guru mwnIAhu gRMQ ]30]
    Qwp clXo jo ggq hYN, iqnih invwvhu mwQ ]
    vwihgurU ky mMqR ibn, imiQAw swrI gwQ ]31]
    Akaal Purkh kay bachan siu, pargat chulaayo panth.
    Sab Sikhan ko bachan hai, Guru maanee-aho granth.30
    Thaap chalyo jo jagat mai, tinhi nivaavhu maath.
    Waheguru kay mantar bin,mithi-aa saaree gaath.31
    Upon the command of the Timeless Creator, the (Sikh) Brotherhood came into being.
    All Sikhs are directed to regard the Granth to be their Guru.
    That which has been installed in this world, bow your head in respect.
    Without the ‘Waheguru’ mantar, life’s whole saga is false.31
    Bhai Nand Lall Ji writes in his rahetnaamaa:-
    gurisK rihq sunhu ry mIq ]
    pRBwqy auT kr ihq cIq ]
    vwihgurU gurmMqR su jwp ]
    kr iesnwn pVoH jp jwp ]
    Gursikh rahet sunhu ray mee-t.
    Parbhatay uth kar hi-t cheet.
    Waheguru mantaar so jaap.
    Kar ishnaan parh-hay jap jaap.
    O Gursikh friends, listen to the rahet, the code of conduct.
    Arise in wee hours of the morning and in your heart lovingly contemplate
    Meditate upon the mantar ‘Waheguru’.
    Take a bath and recite (the Bani) Jap Ji and Jaap (Sahib).

    Dohiraa:
    vwihgurU gur jwpeI, vwihgurU kir iDAwn ]
    mukiq lwB so hoeI hY, gurisK irid mih mwn ]
    Waheguru gur jaa-pa-ee, Waheguru kar dhi-aan.
    Mukat laabh so ho-ee hai, gursikh ridh meh maan.
    Contemplate upon the gur(mantar) Waheguru and focus upon (the sound) Waheguru.
    The (resulting) principal benefit the Gursikh will savour in his heart.

    In ‘Tankhaa-naamaa’(a composition of Bhai Nand Lall) Bhai Nand Lall tells us that it was Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji Maharaj who initiated the contemplation of the mantar ‘Waheguru’.
    Chaupai
    sunhu nMd lwl ieh swj ]
    prgt krwauN Apno rwj ]
    cwr brn iek brn krwauN ]
    vwihgurU kw jwp jpwaUN ]
    Souno Nand Lal eh saaj
    Parguth krao aapnoo raaj
    Chaar baran ek baran krao
    Waheguru Ka jaap jpao
    Listen Nand Lall with rapt attention.
    I will bring into manifestation our reign.
    (In which) the four castes I’ll make into one.
    (and) initiate the contemplation of the (mantar) Waheguru.
    In Bhai Desaa Singh Ji’s rehatnaamaa the instruction from the tenth Emperor is indicated as follows:-
    vwihgurU inq bcn aucwry ]
    vwihgurU ko ihrdy Dwry ]
    Awgy Awvq isMG ju pwvY ]
    vwihgurU kI &qy bulwvy ]
    Waheguru nit bhachan Ochare
    Waheguru Ko Hirde thare
    Aage avaat singh jo pave
    Waheguru kee Fateh Bolaave
    Utter the (mantar) Waheguru daily.
    Absorb the (mantar) ‘Waheguru into your heart.
    Upon meeting a Singh face to face, utter the salutation of Waheguru (meaning utter Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh).

    While the discussion so far has been based on examples from rahetnaamaas, the code of conduct, the Gurbani uttered by the Tenth Emperor, Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji too, re-emphasis that Gurmantar is indeed Gurmantar. In the compilation Sarab Loh Granth Guru Ji states:-
    swih goibMd isMg Pqh sqgur kI
    vwihgurU suic mMqR AKY ]
    Saahe Gobind Singh Satgur Kee
    Waheguru Sach Mantar Aake
    The Emperor (Sri) Gobind Singh (Ji) extends the fateh (salutation) of the Satguru,
    Utter, the true mantar ‘Waheguru’.
    Sahib Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji states in the ‘Sarab Loh Granth’ that this mantar ‘Waheguru’ is given to the Khalsa by Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji, so that the Sikhs of the Guru can contemplate upon this true mantar and merge into the Timeless Being. The text of this instruction is as follows:-
    swr mMqR cwroN kw cwr ]
    vwihgurU mMqR inrDwr ]
    klp klp pRB AKCr khI ]
    sRI gur nwnk jwpXo shI ]
    inj Awqm pRmwqm drsXo ]
    cwr klp mih mMqR srsXo ]
    sw mMqR pRB Kwlsh dInw ]
    vwihgurU pd pwvn kInw ]
    Saar Mantar Chaaro ka Chaar
    Waheguru Mantar nirdhaar
    Kalp kalp prabh akchar kehee
    Sri gur nanak japeoo sehee
    Nijh atam prmatam dhrseeo
    Char kalp meh mantar sarsheoo
    Saa mantar prabh khalse dheena
    Waheguru padh pavan keena
    The four fold divisions (within the Hindu Dharma) have four separate mantaras.
    (Of them all the) mantar Waheguru is supreme.
    With great thought and imagination the Primal Being uttered word.
    Sri Guru Nanak (got people to) contemplated upon this true (mantar).
    (With it) one can experience the presence of the Primal Being within the soul.
    It is the summation of the four separate mantar.
    This mantar, the Primal Being bestowed upon the Khalsa.
    The word ‘Waheguru’ was thus sanctified.
    Many faithless Sikhs expressed doubt saying that the mantar ‘Waheguru’, was bestowed to the Gursikh by the tenth Master Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji and this Gurmantar was not in vogue during the time of Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji. To caste away this doubt raised by the so called Sikhs, it is essential to give references from the Vaars of Bhai Gurdaas, from the Bani of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji and from historical records. Bhai Gurdaas Ji writes:
    vwihgurU gurU mMqR hY jp haumYN KoeI]
    vaahiguroo guroo ma(n)thr hai jap houmai(n) khoee||
    His Guru-manta is Vahiguru, whose recitation erases egotism.
    siqgur purK dieAwl hoie vwihgurU scu mMqR suxwXw]
    sathigur purakh dhaeiaal hoe vaahiguroo sach ma(n)thr sunaayaa||
    Becoming kind, the Guru recites true mantra Vaheguru for him.
    Now the point to note here is this that if Guru Nanak Dev Ji had not given Gursikhs the gurmantar ‘Waheguru’ then Braham Gyani Baba Buddha Ji, a much respected and admired Sikh of Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji, also present at the time of Sri Guru Arjan Dev Ji, could have told Bhai Gurdas Ji that we have been given a different gurmantar by Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji and could have gone on to ask him why had he written that ‘Waheguru’ is the gurmantar. The reason why Baba Buddha Ji did not raise this issue is that Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji gave his Sikhs the gurmantar ‘Waheguru’ and Baba Buddha Ji himself received the same mantar.
    An even bigger proof that ‘Waheguru’ is the gurmantar is that Sri Guru Arjan Dev Ji, the fifth incarnation of Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji, was himself present and he himself gave the Vaars (compilations) of Bhai Gurdas Ji the status of a key to Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. If there was some form of shortcoming in the quotation ‘Waheguru is the gurmantar, its contemplation erases egotism’, then he would have stopped Bhai Gurdas Ji from writing it.
    As Bhai Gurdas Ji has referred to the word ‘Waheguru’ is gurmantar, it is necessary to give some quotation by way of references from Gurbani as proof that the word ‘gurmantar’ has not only been used in Gurbani but also to show that the instruction to chant the ‘gurmantar’, to contemplate and instill it into the heart came from Guru Maharaj.
    pwpiVAw pCwiV bwxu scwvw sMin@ kY ]
    gur mMqRVw icqwir nwnk duKu n QIveI ]2]
    paaparriaa pashhaarr baan sachaavaa sa(n)nih kai ||
    gur ma(n)thrarraa chithaar naanak dhukh n thheevee ||2||
    Take aim with the arrow of Truth, and shoot down sin.
    Cherish the Words of the Guru’s Mantra, O Nanak, and you shall not suffer in pain. ||2||

    duKu klysu n Bau ibAwpY gur mMqRü ihrdY hoie ]
    dhukh kalaes n bho biaapai gur ma(n)thra hiradhai hoe ||
    Suffering, agony and fear do not cling to one whose heart is filled with the GurMantra.

    rsik rsik gun gwvh gurmiq ilv aunmin nwim lgwn ]
    AMimRqu rsu pIAw gur sbdI hm nwm ivthu kurbwn ]1]
    rasak rasak gun gaaveh guramath liv ounaman naam lagaan ||
    a(n)mrith ras peeaa gur sabadhee ham naam vittahu kurabaan ||1||
    Through the Guru’s Teachings, I sing the Glorious Praises of the Lord with joyous love and delight; I am enraptured, lovingly attuned to the Naam, the Name of the Lord.
    Through the Word of the Guru’s Shabad, I drink in the Ambrosial Essence; I am a sacrifice to the Naam. ||1||

    hmry jgjIvn hir pRwn ]
    hir aUqmu ird AMqir BwieE guir mMqu dIE hir kwn ]1]
    hamarae jagajeevan har praan ||
    har ootham ridh a(n)thar bhaaeiou gur ma(n)th dheeou har kaan ||1||
    The Lord, the Life of the World, is my Breath of Life.
    The Lofty and Exalted Lord became pleasing to my heart and my inner being, when the Guru breathed the Mantra of the Lord into my ears. ||1||Pause||

    Satguru Ji gives so much importance to gurmantar, that according to his decree, those persons who do not obtain gurmantar from the Guru, their life is accursed, depraved and equated to some low animals like dogs, swine, donkeys, crows and snakes:-
    gur mMqR hIxs´ jo pRwxI iDRgMq jnm BRstxh ]
    gur ma(n)thr heenasy jo praanee dhhriga(n)th janam bhrasattaneh ||
    That mortal who lacks the Guru’s Mantra - cursed and contaminated is his life.

    kUkrh sUkrh grDBh kwkh srpnh quil Klh ]33]
    kookareh sookareh garadhhabheh kaakeh sarapaneh thul khaleh ||33||
    That blockhead is just a dog, a pig, a jackass, a crow, a snake. ||33||

    In Gurbani decrees such as these, ‘contemplate the gurmantar’, ‘give ear to the gurmantar’, ‘chant only the one Naam’, lay stress on this point that, to meditate upon the Timeless Being, to instill His remembrance in the innate self, there is a need for a specific shabad or word and this shabad can only be obtained from the Guru through initiation. That shabad which the Guru gives during initiation is called Gurmantar. In Gursikhi (the Sikh way of life), this shabad is given by the panj piaa-rays (the five beloveds) by way of initiation to a Gursikh during the Amrit ceremony in the presence of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. From the time of Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji Ji till this day, through generations, Guru Sahib has been giving this shabad to the Sikhs in the form of gurmantar. This point is mentioned by Bhai Gurdaas Ji (when he writes): ‘Waheguru is the gurmantar, its contemplation erases egotism’, and the tenth Master says the same thing in the Saraab Loh Granth:
    siqgurU isKn pRin aupdysXo ]
    vwihgurU suic mMqR ivSysXo ]
    Satguru sikhan prin updhesheo
    Waheguru sooch mantar vasheseo
    The Satguru in instructing the Sikhs said,
    Waheguru is the distinctive true mantar.

    Gurbani also mentions that without the initiation from the Guru, (divine) knowledge cannot be acquired. Satguru Ji says that, as talking is not possible without the tongue, hearing is not possible without ears, and seeing is not possible without eyes, similarly without getting the initiation from the Guru (divine) knowledge cannot be attained:
    quotation from SGGSJ M5/1140
    ibnu ijhvw khw ko bkqw ]
    ibnu sRvnw khw ko sunqw ]
    ibnu nyqRw khw ko pyKY ]
    nwm ibnw nru khI n lyKY ]2]

    bin jihavaa kehaa ko bakathaa ||
    bin sravanaa kehaa ko sunathaa ||
    bin naethraa kehaa ko paekhai ||
    naam binaa nar kehee n laekhai ||2||

    Without a tongue, how can anyone speak?
    Without ears, how can anyone hear?
    Without eyes, how can anyone see?
    Without the Naam, the mortal is of no account at all. ||2||

    Bhai Gurdas Ji too mentions in his writings that a Sikh upon getting initiation from the Guru, acquires divine knowledge and thus merges in the Guru.

    gur isK isK gur soie AlK lKwieAw]
    gur dIiKAw lY isK isK sdwieAw]
    gur sikh sikh gur soe alakh lakhaaeiaa||
    gur dheekhiaa lai sikh sikh sadhaaeiaa||
    Being one with each other the Guru and the Sikh have made the Lord perceptible (in the form of Guru).
    Getting initiated by the Guru the disciple has become a Sikh.
    Those so called Sikhs who say that there is no need to get the gurmantar from the Guru because they can read the Bani of the Guru and get linked with the Timeless Being, then they are advised to carefully read and imbibe in their mind the discussion on gurmantar and initiation by the Guru given above. It is true that Bani is Guru and all the ambrosial nectars are within it, but the acquiring of the ambrosial divine knowledge can only take place when man accepts the message received via Bani and acts upon it.
    The above Gurbani deliberations have clarified one thing, that without getting initiation from the Guru, without getting guidance from the Guru, without getting gurmantar from the Guru and without contemplating upon it, man can never be liberated. Man’s wickedness and sins committed over numerous births can only be erased if he accepts the gurmantar as per guru’s instructions and with every breath he contemplates upon it.
    gur siqgur kw jo isKu AKwey su Blky auiT hir nwmu iDAwvY ]
    audmu kry Blky prBwqI iesnwnu kry AMimRq sir nwvY ]
    aupdyis gurU hir hir jpu jwpY siB iklivK pwp doK lih jwvY ]
    iPir cVY idvsu gurbwxI gwvY bhidAw auTidAw hir nwmu iDAwvY ]
    jo swis igrwis iDAwey myrw hir hir so gurisKu gurU min BwvY ]

    gur sathigur kaa jo sikh akhaaeae s bhalakae out(h) har naam dhhiaavai ||
    oudham karae bhalakae parabhaathee eisanaan karae a(n)mrith sar naavai ||
    oupadhaes guroo har har jap jaapai sabh kilavikh paap dhokh lehi jaavai ||
    fir charrai dhivas gurabaanee gaavai behadhiaa out(h)adhiaa har naam dhhiaavai ||
    jo saas giraas dhhiaaeae maeraa har har so gurasikh guroo man bhaavai ||
    One who calls himself a Sikh of the Guru, the True Guru, shall rise in the early morning hours and meditate on the Lord’s Name.
    Upon arising early in the morning, he is to bathe, and cleanse himself in the pool of nectar.
    Following the Instructions of the Guru, he is to chant the Name of the Lord, Har, Har. All sins, misdeeds and negativity shall be erased.
    Then, at the rising of the sun, he is to sing Gurbani; whether sitting down or standing up, he is to meditate on the Lord’s Name.
    One who meditates on my Lord, Har, Har, with every breath and every morsel of food - that GurSikh becomes pleasing to the Guru’s Mind.
    In the line that appears in the above verse- ‘Following the Instructions of the Guru, he is to chant the Name of the Lord, Har, Har’- the instruction is a pointer (to the hukam or command) that the chant that is to be contemplated upon, is the word form of gurmantar of the Timeless Being received as a directive from the Satguru during initiation. The chanting and contemplating of this will erase all the wickedness and sins.
    Take the next statement after this - ‘Then, at the rising of the sun, he is to sing Gurbani; whether sitting or standing, he is to meditate on the Lord’s Name’- this is a pointer which says that Gurbani and Naam (gurmantar) received during initiation, individually both are truths. First Gurbani builds up our righteous character and then it motivates us to contemplate upon the Naam. Gurmantar is that shabad through which the Timeless Being Waheguru can be worshipped. This shabad or word in Gursikhi is ‘Waheguru’ which the Guru utters as the Sikh listens. Bhai Gurdaas says in the following quotation:-
    inrMkwr Awkwr kr joiq srUp AnUp idKwieAw]
    vyd kqyb Agocrw vwihgurU guru Sbd suxwXw]
    nira(n)kaar aakaar kar joth saroop anoop dhikhaaeiaa||
    vaedh kathaeb agocharaa vaahiguroo gur shabadh sunaayaa||
    The formless Lord has been beholden in the form of the light (in Guru Nanak and other Gurus).
    The Gurus recited Word-Guru as Vahiguru who is beyond the Vedas and Katebas (the semtic scriptures).

    vwihgurU gur Sbd lY iprm ipAwlw cup clolw]
    vaahiguroo gur shabadh lai piram piaalaa chup chalolaa||
    The Guru’s word he receives is Vahiguru, the wondrous Lord, and remains silently immersed in delight. Var 6/5,

    paux gurU gur sbd hY vwihgurU gur sbd suxwXw]
    poun guroo gur sabadh hai vaahiguroo gur sabadh sunaayaa||
    The Guru’s word is the air, the Guru and wondrous lord has recited Word the Guru. Var 9/13,

    vyd n jwxY Byd ikhu SyKnwg nw pwey]
    vwihgurU swlwhxw gur Sbd Alwey ]]
    vaedh n jaanai bhaedh kihu shaekhanaag naa paaeae||
    vaahiguroo saalaahanaa gur shabadh alaaeae ||
    The Vedas also do not understand this mystery and even the Sesanag (mythological snake having thousand hoods) cannot know its limits.
    Vahiguru, God, is eulogised through recitation of the Word of the Guru, Gurbani. (9,13)

    Drmswl krqwrpur swDu sMgiq scKMf vswieAw]
    vwihgurU gur Sbd suxwieAw]
    Dharmsal kirtharpur sadh sangat sachkhand vasaiaa
    waheguru gur shabad sunaiaa
    Founding dharmasala, the place for dharma, at kartarpur, it was inhabited by the holy congrration as the abode of truth.
    Word ‘Waheguru’ was imparted to the people (24/1)

    to be continued……..


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  3. kaur-1

    kaur-1
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    Waheguru Gurmantar - Part 2

    We have already discussed above that through the writings of Bhai Gurdaas, the Bani uttered by Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji and the many rahitnaamaas (codes of conduct), it has been established that the shabad or word gurmantar has been accepted as the gurmantar of the Khalsa. Now the discussion on gurmantar will be based on the quotations found in Sri Guru Granth Sahib. Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji in his fifth form, while praising the Timeless Being, says that the Timeless Being exists in the creation in numerous forms and colours, is ever present within each and every life-form, is not a slave to anyone and is entirely carefree. Guru Ji refers to such a Timeless Being as ‘Gur-Wah’ :-
    Quotation from Gurbani M5 376
    inkit jIA kY sd hI sMgw ]
    kudriq vrqY rUp Aru rMgw ]1]
    vymuhqwjw vyprvwhu ]
    nwnk dws khhu gur vwhu ]4]21]
    nikatt jeea kai sadh hee sa(n)gaa ||
    kudharath varathai roop ar ra(n)gaa ||1||
    vaemuhathaajaa vaeparavaahu ||
    naanak dhaas kehahu gur vaahu ||4||21||
    He is near at hand; He is the eternal Companion of the soul.
    His Creative Power is all-pervading, in form and color. ||1||
    The Lord is absolutely independent, and totally care-free;
    O servant Nanak, chant His Glorious Praises. ||4||21||

    The word Wah Wah is used in Gurbani to praise the Timeless Being Waheguru. Satguru Ji says that he who praises the Timeless Being Waheguru by using the word ‘Wah Wah’, will be freed from the cycles of births and deaths and jam, the couriers of death, will not approach him. Guru Ji says:-
    Quotations from Gurbani M3 3/514, M3 515,
    vwhu vwhu bwxI scu hY gurmuiK lDI Bwil ]
    vwhu vwhu sbdy aucrY vwhu vwhu ihrdY nwil ]
    vaahu vaahu baanee sach hai guramukh ladhhee bhaal ||
    vaahu vaahu sabadhae oucharai vaahu vaahu hiradhai naal ||
    Waaho! Waaho! is the Bani of the True Word. Searching, the Gurmukhs have found it.
    Waaho! Waaho! They chant the Word of the Shabad. Waaho! Waaho! They enshrine it in their hearts.

    vwhu vwhu gurisK inq sB krhu gur pUry vwhu vwhu BwvY ]
    nwnk vwhu vwhu jo min iciq kry iqsu jmkMkru nyiV n AwvY ]2]
    Vaahu vaahu gurasikh nith sabh karahu gur poorae vaahu vaahu bhaavai ||
    Naanak vaahu vaahu jo man chith karae this jamaka(n)kar naerr n aavai ||2||
    Waaho! Waaho! Let all the Gursikhs continually praise Him. Waaho! Waaho! The Perfect Guru is pleased with His Praises.
    O Nanak, one who chants Waaho! Waaho! with his heart and mind - the Messenger of Death does not approach him. ||2||
    Guru Ji says that they who utters ‘Wah Wah’ their faces will glow, meaning they will triumphant in this world and the world hereafter.
    Quotation From Gurbani M4 313
    saudy vwhu vwhu aucrih auTdy BI vwhu kryin ]
    nwnk qy muK aujly ij inq auiT sMmwlyin ]1]
    Soudhae vaahu vaahu oucharehi out(h)adhae bhee vaahu karaen ||
    Nanak thae mukh oujalae j nith out(h) sa(n)maalaen ||1||
    While asleep, they chant, ""Waaho! Waaho!"", and while awake, they chant, ""Waaho!"" as well.
    O Nanak, radiant are the faces of those, who rise up early each day, and dwell upon the Lord. ||1||
    We have already discussed earlier that according to the writings of Bhai Gurdaas Ji (the word) ‘Waheguru’ is gurmantar and by contemplating upon it egotism is erased. These writings of Bhai Gurdaas Ji are an elucidation of this quotation of SatguruJi:-
    Quotation from Gurbani M3/515
    vwhu vwhu sy jn sdw krih ijn@ kau Awpy dyie buJwie ]
    vwhu vwhu kriqAw mnu inrmlu hovY haumY ivchu jwie ]
    vaahu vaahu sae jan sadhaa karehi jinh ko aapae dhaee bujhaae ||
    vaahu vaahu karathiaa man niramal hovai houmai vichahu jaae ||
    Waaho! Waaho! Those humble beings ever praise the Lord, unto whom the Lord Himself grants understanding.
    Chanting Waaho! Waaho!, the mind is purified, and egotism departs from within.
    The amount of importance Guru Ji attaches to the word ‘Wah’ is the same as the importance he gives to the word ‘Guru’. Guru Ji says, whosoever while uttering ‘Guru-Guru’ takes the refuge of the Timeless Being Waheguru, he gets to meet the Timeless Being Waheguru.
    Quotation from Gurbani M5/837
    guru guru krq srix jy AwvY pRBu Awie imlY iKnu FIl n peIAw ]5]
    gur gur karath saran jae aavai prabh aae milai khin dteel n peeaa ||5||
    Uttering, ""Guru, Guru"", she seeks His Sanctuary; so God comes to meet her, without a moment’s delay. ||5||
    M5/213
    myry mn guru guru guru sd krIAY ]
    rqn jnmu sPlu guir kIAw drsn kau bilhrIAY ]1] rhwau ]
    jyqy sws gRws mnu lyqw qyqy hI gun gweIAY ]
    jau hoie dYAwlu siqguru Apunw qw ieh miq buiD pweIAY ]1]
    myry mn nwim ley jm bMD qy CUtih srb suKw suK pweIAY ]
    maerae man gur gur gur sadh kareeai ||
    rathan janam safal gur keeaa dharasan ko balihareeai ||1|| rehaao ||
    jaethae saas graas man laethaa thaethae hee gun gaaeeai ||
    jo hoe dhaiaal sathigur apunaa thaa eih math budhh paaeeai ||1||
    maerae man naam leae jam ba(n)dhh thae shhoottehi sarab sukhaa sukh paaeeai ||
    O my mind, dwell always upon the Guru, Guru, Guru.
    The Guru has made the jewel of this human life prosperous and fruitful. I am a sacrifice to the Blessed Vision of His Darshan. ||1||Pause||
    As many breaths and morsels as you take, O my mind - so many times, sing His Glorious Praises.
    When the True Guru becomes merciful, then this wisdom and understanding is obtained. ||1||
    O my mind, taking the Naam, you shall be released from the bondage of death, and the peace of all peace will be found.

    These words of Guru Ji ‘Vay-muhtaa-jaa vaypar-wah, Nanak daas kahuh gur wah’ have been going on for generations. This proof is obtained from Bhai Santokh Singh’s composition Gurpartaap Sooraj book 4 and chapter 46 where the words ‘Simrahu Waheguru Gurwah’ appear. From this it appears that that the words ‘Gurwah’ and ‘Waheguru’ have been used for the Timeless Being.
    The gurmantar ‘Waheguru’ which Guru Ji has imparted (to us) is the essence of all names. The numerous ways of uttering this name are included in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Within various separate shabads or words, the form of this mantar or chant appears as ‘Wah’, ‘Guru’ and ‘Gur’. In the combined state, the form of this gurmantar is ‘Waheguru’, ‘Waheguru’ and ‘Gur Wah’.
    Through some of the words found in Sri Guru Granth Sahib, we have already mentioned above that the form of gurmantar ‘Gurwah’, is because of ‘Wah’ and ‘Guru’. Now some shabads are given which make use of the complete form of gurmantar. These are found in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji on page 1402 and 1403.
    vwihgurU vwihgurU vwihgurU vwih jIau ]
    siq swcu sRI invwsu Awid purKu sdw quhI vwihgurU vwihgurU vwihgurU vwih jIau ]1]6]
    syvk kY BrpUr jugu jugu vwhgurU qyrw sBu sdkw ]
    vaahiguroo vaahiguroo vaahiguroo vaahi jeeo ||
    sath saach sree nivaas aadh purakh sadhaa thuhee vaahiguroo vaahiguroo vaahiguroo vaahi jeeo ||1||6||
    saevak kai bharapoor jug jug vaahaguroo thaeraa sabh sadhakaa ||
    Waahay Guru, Waahay Guru, Waahay Guru, Waahay Jee-o.
    You are forever True, the Home of Excellence, the Primal Supreme Being. Waahay Guru, Waahay Guru, Waahay Guru, Waahay Jee-o. ||1||6||
    Your servants are totally fulfilled, throughout the ages; O Waahay Guru, it is all You, forever.
    From the shabad found on page 1403 it is very clear that the shabad ‘Waheguru’ is used only for the Timeless Being:
    kIAw Kylu bf mylu qmwsw vwihgurU qyrI sB rcnw ]
    qU jil Qil ggin pXwil pUir rh´w AMimRq qy mITy jw ky bcnw ]
    mwnih bRhmwidk rudRwidk kwl kw kwlu inrMjn jcnw ]
    gur pRswid pweIAY prmwrQu sqsMgiq syqI mnu Kcnw ]
    kIAw Kylu bf mylu qmwsw vwhgurU qyrI sB rcnw ]3]13]42]
    keeaa khael badd mael thamaasaa vaahiguroo thaeree sabh rachanaa ||
    thoo jal thhal gagan payaal poor rehyaa a(n)mrith thae meet(h)ae jaa kae bachanaa ||
    maanehi brehamaadhik rudhraadhik kaal kaa kaal nira(n)jan jachanaa ||
    gur prasaadh paaeeai paramaarathh sathasa(n)gath saethee man khachanaa ||
    keeaa khael badd mael thamaasaa vaahaguroo thaeree sabh rachanaa ||3||13||42||
    You have formed and created this play, this great game. O Waahay Guru, this is all You, forever.
    You are pervading and permeating the water, land, skies and nether regions; Your Words are sweeter than Ambrosial Nectar.
    Brahmas and Shivas respect and obey You. O Death of death, Formless Lord, I beg of You.
    By Guru’s Grace, the greatest thing is obtained, and the mind is involved with the Sat Sangat, the True Congregation.
    You have formed and created this play, this great game. O Waahay Guru, this is all Your making. ||3||13||42||
    The presence of this word ‘Waheguru’ in (the Bani) Saveyeh in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji proves the point that the word ‘Waheguru’ is used for the Timeless Being (the Primal Being). This word has appeared thirteen times on pages 1402 and 1403. So according to the instruction of Satguru Ji, ‘Waheguru’ is the gurmantar that we should chant or contemplate upon.
    Of all the mantars or chants found in the four ages this is the supreme mantar. Although the word ‘Waheguru’ appears to be rather short when reading and centupling, it is the most potent. It has the power to fulfill all desires and put right all the affairs to the extent that it can transform man into becoming selfless and erase his evil inclinations. It can also connect man with the Primal Being in the innate self thus enabling him to experience the presence of Waheguru. The value of the fruits that man can attain, when he fixes his attention and meditates on the Timeless Being, can never be expressed. Those who contemplate upon the mantar ‘Waheguru’, only those Gursikhs will experience the divine hue and only they will know how priceless and precious the experience is.
    Quotation from Gurbani M5/81
    sweI nwmu Amolu kIm n koeI jwxdo ]
    ijnw Bwg mQwih sy nwnk hir rMgu mwxdo ]1]
    saaee naam amol keem n koee jaanadho ||
    jinaa bhaag mathhaahi sae naanak har ra(n)g maanadho ||1||
    The Master’s Name is Priceless; no one knows its value.
    Those who have good destiny recorded upon their foreheads, O Nanak, enjoy the Love of the Lord. ||1||
    In Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji there is a reference about this very word ‘Waheguru’ in which Guru Ji says:-
    Quotation from Gurbani M5 /747-757
    byd kqyb isimRiq siB swsq ien@ piVAw mukiq n hoeI ]
    eyku AKru jo gurmuiK jwpY iqs kI inrml soeI ]3]
    baedh kathaeb simrith sabh saasath einh parriaa mukath n hoee ||
    eaek akhar jo guramukh jaapai this kee niramal soee ||3||
    One may read all the books of the Vedas, the Bible, the Simritees and the Shaastras, but they will not bring liberation.
    One who, as Gurmukh, chants the One Word, acquires a spotlessly pure reputation. ||3||
    This word ‘Waheguru’ is so precious that, that knowledge which cannot be obtained by reading all the world’s scriptures and books of knowledge, all that knowledge can be obtained with this shabad of the Guru.
    Quotation from Gurbani M5/216,
    cqur byd muK bcnI aucrY AwgY mhlu n pweIAY ]
    bUJY nwhI eyku suDwKru Ehu sglI JwK JKweIAY ]3]
    chathur baedh mukh bachanee oucharai aagai mehal n paaeeai ||
    boojhai naahee eaek sudhhaakhar ouhu sagalee jhaakh jhakhaaeeai ||3||
    Reciting the four Vedas from memory, they do not obtain the Mansion of the Lord’s Presence hereafter.
    Those who do not understand the One Pure Word, utter total nonsense. ||3||
    M1/467
    nwnk lyKY iek gl horu haumY JKxw JwK ]1]
    Naanak laekhai eik gal hor houmai jhakhanaa jhaakh ||1||
    O Nanak, only one thing is of any account: everything else is useless babbling and idle talk in ego. ||1||
    Bhai Gurdaas Ji writes in his Kabet Saveyeh that just as a precious stone is small to look at, but its price can fill ones coffers; just as a cheque has little or no weight, but with a paper cheque a huge amount of cash can be collected; just as a seed is but small, but the tree that grows out of it bears numerous fruits; in the same way while the shabad of the Guru appears to be rather short, but its importance only becomes apparent when the essence of the soul is acquired and experienced:

    jYsy hIrw hwQ mY qnk so idKweI dyq
    jaisae heeraa haathh mai thanak so dhikhaaee dhaetha

    mol kIey dmkn Brq BMfwr jI ]
    mol keeeae dhamakan bharath bha(n)ddaar jee ||

    jYsy br bwDy huMfI lwgq n Bwr kCu
    jaisae bar baadhhae hu(n)ddee laagath n bhaar kashhu

    AwgY jwie pweIAq lCmI Apwr jI ]
    aagai jaae paaeeath lashhamee apaar jee ||

    jYsy bit bIj Aiq sUKm srUp hoq
    jaisae batt beej ath sookham saroop hotha

    boey sY ibibiD krY ibrKw ibsQwr jI ]
    boeae sai bibidhh karai birakhaa bisathhaar jee ||

    qYsy gur bcn scn gurisKn mY
    thaisae gur bachan sachan gurasikhan mai

    jwnIAY mhwqm gey hI hirduAwr jI ]
    jaaneeai mehaatham geae hee haridhuaar jee ||

    Quotation from Bhai Gurdaas Ji

    The second Bhai Gurdaas Ji writes in his Vaar:-

    hir vwihgurU mMqr AgMm jg qwrnhwrw]
    har vaahiguroo ma(n)thar aga(n)m jag thaaranehaaraa||
    jo ismrih nr pRym isau phuNcY drbwrw]
    jo simarehi nar praem sio pahu(n)achai dharabaaraa||

    In ‘Mehmaa Parkash’ every episode ends with the following line:-

    vwihgurU muK kro aucwr ]
    ho dieAwl kr lhy auDwr ]
    vaahiguroo mukh kuro ouchaar
    ho dhaeiaal kur lehae oudhaar
    Say the word Waheguru with your mouth.
    Being compassionate (the Timeless Being) will save you.

    Giving examples from the janamsakhi (biography) of Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji, Bhai Santokh Singh Ji writes in ‘Sri Guru Nanak Parkash’- when Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji went to the land of lust, the women there changed Bhai Mardana Ji into a sheep and (seeing this) Guru Ji advised them as follows:-
    iqq vwihgurU muK nwm jpo
    Ardws iqhvl kI krIXy ]
    mn kwmnw pUrn hovihgI
    hir kIriq pRIiq irdy DrIXy ]

    Contemplate upon the Name of Waheguru.
    Make your supplications by offering the karhaa-parshaad.
    Your desires will be fulfilled,
    When you keep the Lords praises in your heart.
    (Sri Guru Nanak Parkash Poorbaardh Chapater 7)

    In the Triya Raj (where ladies of lust rule) too Guru Ji gave the same advice:-
    sK sMq Awie qW pY mMq n clwie inj
    tihl bnwie kIjY Cor rIiq mwn kI ]
    ‘vwihgurU’ jpo mK jwih Bv jnX dK,
    Dyiq suK rIiq jXNo sMqoK isMG Bwn kI ]

    The holy saint has arrived and your spells will not work on him.
    Learn to serve and do away with egotism.
    Utter Waheguru and all your difficulties will vanish.
    Says Santokh Singh (the Guru blessed them with this) beneficial and comfort giving practice.

    Many other historical references also confirm that the shabad or word ‘Waheguru’ is the gurmantar of the Khalsa.
    In this century the sants or spiritually evolved beings like Baba Attar Singh Ji Mastuanaa, Sant Baba Nand Singh Ji Nanaksar, Sant Karam Singh Ji Hotee Mardhaan, Sant Sangat Singh Ji Kamaalee-ay Wale, Sant Baba Sunder Singh Ji, Sant Khalsa Gurbachan Singh Ji Bhindraan Wale, Bhai Sahib Bhai Randhir Singh Ji Narangwal Wale, Sant Ishar Singh Ji Rarh-ay Wale, and many other spiritually evolved saint meditated and contemplated upon the ‘Waheguru’ mantar and persuaded many other to take Amrit , the ambroisal nectar, and receive the gift of gurmantar ‘Waheguru’ by treading the path of Gur-maryadha (Sikh code of conduct), sent into motion by Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji.
    To be continued………
     
  4. SSMDCX

    SSMDCX
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    Stop Copying - Be Original, Five Something To The Sangat
     
  5. badmash

    badmash
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    Nice translations. But practical earth bound issues dominate.
     
  6. kaur-1

    kaur-1
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  7. Sikh80

    Sikh80
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    It is avery good write up Kaur-1.keep it up. also your copy and paste are good.saves time. What do you think kaur-1
    Awp gvwey Awp hY gux guxI proeI ]
    aap gavaaeae aap hai gun gunee paroee ||a||
    Losing egotism and merging into the qualities of the supreme Lord, he himself becomes full of qualities.
    See Bhai Nand Lall’s gazal 19:

    Kindly post Bhai nand lall's gazal19:,if you have kaur-1
     
  8. kaur-1

    kaur-1
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  9. Archived_member2

    Archived_member2
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    Pray Truth for all and say Satsriakaal!
    Dear all and Kaur-1 Jee!

    I have a request. Please be clear in referring an article that quotes true Guru's Vaaks and statements from other writers. Do not promote articles that are giving vague statements. The articles referred here are not clearly differentiating between writers and the true Gurus.
    For example, Gurdev never said that 'Waheguru' was Gurumantra but the writer of the article referred insists that Waheguru is Gurumantra.
    Already many people are following others than their true Gurus. Do you want true Sikhs to do the same?


    Balbir Singh
     
  10. Archived_Member1

    Archived_Member1
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    the article seems clear to me. perhaps you should read it more carefully or ask questions if you don't understand it.

    did you miss the part from Sarlobh Granth, written by Guru Gobind Singh ji? what about Bhai Gurdas ji, who Guru Arjun Dev referred to as the "key" to gurbani? do you doubt Guru Arjun Dev ji's judge of character? or Guru Gobind Singh ji's very words?

    i'm sure you have some explanation about secret mantras that you can't share with us mere mortals... :)
     
  11. muneet

    muneet
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    Naanak laekhai eik gal hor houmai jhakhanaa jhaakh ||1||
    O Nanak, only one thing is of any account: everything else is useless babbling and idle talk in ego. ||1||
    Bhai Gurdaas Ji writes in his Kabet Saveyeh that just as a precious stone is small to look at, but its price can fill ones coffers; just as a cheque has little or no weight, but with a paper cheque a huge amount of cash can be collected; just as a seed is but small, but the tree that grows out of it bears numerous fruits; in the same way while the shabad of the Guru appears to be rather short, but its importance only becomes apparent when the essence of the soul is acquired and experienced
    i think your answer was there all the time!
     
  12. SSMDCX

    SSMDCX
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    Ik Oankaar Sat Naam Satgur Parsaad
    Dhan Dhan Gur-Guru-Satgur-Gurbani-Sat Naam-Sat Sangat
    Kottan Kot Dandaut Parvaan Karna Ji; Gur Fateh Parvaan Karna Ji

    With the Anant Beyant Gur Kirpa Gur Parsaad we are trying to dedicate following Seva at the Shree Charans of Dhan Dhan Guru and Dhan Dhan Akal Purakh and Dhan Dhan Sat Sangat Ji:S

    HABAD “VAHIGURU” DEVINE MEANING

    siqjug siqgur vwsdyv vwvw ivSnw nwm jpwvY]duAwpr siqgur hrIikRSn hwhw hir hir nwm iDAwvY]qRyqy siqgur rwm jI rwrw rwm jpy suK pwvY]kiljug nwnk gur goibMd ggw goivMd nwm jpwvY]cwry jwgy chu jugI pMcwiex ivc jwie smwvY]cwroN ACr iek kr vwihgurU jp mMqR jpwvY]jhW qy aupijAw iPr qhW smwvY

    sathijug sathigur vaasadhaev vaavaa vishanaa naam japaavaidhuaapar sathigur hareekrishan haahaa har har naam dhhiaavaithraethae sathigur raam jee raaraa raam japae sukh paavaikalijug naanak gur gobi(n)dh gagaa govi(n)dh naam japaavaichaarae jaagae chahu jugee pa(n)chaaein vich jaae samaavaichaaro(n) ashhar eik kar vaahiguroo jap ma(n)thr japaavaijehaa(n) thae oupajiaa fir thehaa(n) samaavai

    This Shabad by Dhan Dhan Bhai Gurdass Ji explains how the Shabad “Vahiguru” came in to existance and what does it mean. It basically describes the Mahima - praise of Lord Vishnu as a Satgur in Sat Yug by taking the First letter of His Name “Va” in the Shabad “Vahiguru”, then this Shabad describes the Mahima – praise of Lord Krishna as a Satgur in the Dwaaper Yug, Who was and Who is being remembered as HareeKrishna by the masses and this divine name gives us the letter “Hi” of the Shabad “Vahiguru”, then the Shabad describes the Mahima of Lord Ram as a Satgur in the Treta Yug and this divine name gives the letter “Ru” in the Shabad “Vahiguru”, whereas this Shabad descibes the Mahima of Guru Nanak Patshah Ji as a Satgur in the Kal Yug as Gobind – God Nirankaar- gives us the letter “Gu” in the Shabad Vahiguru. This means that the Shabad Vahiguru represents all the Satgurus – Vishnu, Ram, Krishn, and Guru Nanak Patshah Ji from all ages – Sat Yug, Treta Yug, Dwaaper Yug and Kalyug and therefore it is called the Gurmanter – because it represents the Satgurus of all four ages. When we recite the Shabad “Vahiguru” then we infect recite the Mahima – praise of these Satgurus – Vishnu, Ram, Krishan and Guru Nanak Patshah Ji, so this Shabad “Vahiguru” is not the Naam, but it is the Mahima of these Satgurus, the praise of these Satgurus and by reciting the Shabad “Vahiguru” we don’t recite the Naam but we do remember these Satgurus of all four ages, we do recite the praise of these Satgurus. In the end Bhai Gurdass Ji has said that when we recite this Shabad “Vahiguru” then we go back to the Origin, which indirectly means that we reach the salvation. This Pauri also signifies that the Satgurus – Vishnu, Harikrishna, Ram and Nanak in these four ages as described above served and delivered the Naam to the Sangat. (This also clarifies that only a Satgur can deliver the Naam to the Sangat.) The most important thing to understand here is that Bhai Gurdass Ji have explained the Shabad “Vahiguru” as the Mahima if the Satguru and not the Naam and have called the Shabad “Vahiguru” as Mante (and not Gur Manterr, whereas most people understand the Shabad “Vahiguru” as Naam and call it a Gur Manter, which is contrary to what Bhai Gurdass Ji have explained in this Shabad. Whereas the Shabad “SAT” has very clearly been defined as a NAAM that leads us to the Jivan Mukti and beyond Maya as announced by Dhan Dhan Shri Guru Nanak Patshah Ji in the Mool Manter (explained in an earlier Gur Parsaadee writing). So when we recite the Shabad “Sat Naam Vahiguru” (please note that the Shabad Sat Naam leads the Shabad Vahiguru) it means that “SAT” is the “NAAM” and this Naam is “Dhan Dhan” – the Mahima of all the Satgurus from all four ages – Dhan Dhan Vishnu Ji, Dhan Dhan HareeKrishn Ji, Dhan Dhan Shri Ram Ji and Dhan Dhan Guru Nanak Patshah Ji, so when we recite the Shabad “Sat Naam Vahiguru” then we mean that “SAT” is the “NAAM” and The Satgurus Vishnu, Krishna, Ram and Nanak are the Mahima of this Naam, which means that when we do Sat Naam Vahiguru Simran then we remember the Nirgun Saroop of Akal Purakh and also His Mahima in terms of these Satgurus – Ram, Krishan, Vishnu and Nanak. This also means that the Mahima of Akal Purakh – which are the Satgurus – Vishnu, Ram, Krishan and Nanak is next to the Naam, the Naam came in to existance first and then the Mahima came in to existance, the Akal Purakh came in to existance first, then His Naam came into existance and then the Mahima came in to existance – which means that Naam is bigger than Mahima, the Mahima will lead you to the Naam and then the Naam will lead you to the Akal Purak ( this is exactly what happened to us – started with Vahiguru Simran, then got blessed with the Gur Parsaad of Naam, Puran Bandgi and Seva, so switched to Sat Naam Vahiguru Simran, then Sat Naam Simran, then only SAT Simran and then even SAT disappeared –Namastang Nirnamy as described by Dhan Dhan Dassam Patshah Ji in Jaap Sahib). Some people have misunderstood that we have changed the Gurmanter to Sat Naam, which is not true, Sat is the Naam and Vahiguru Manter is the Mahima of Akal Purakh or Mahima of Naam and that will remain so, nobody can change it, all we have tried to bring out this Puran SAT – divine truth to the masses and nothing else. This doesn’t mean that you can’t meditate on the Shabad Vahiguru, you can continue to do so until you get the Gur Parsaad of Naam, Puran Bandgi and Seva and then as we said you will automatically switch to Sat Naam Vahiguru and so on. So please remove that misunderstanding from your minds and be clear about the eternal divine truth that SAT is the Naam, SAT is the Guru, and Vahiguru is the Mahima of Akal Purakh Ji and His Bhagats, the Mahima of Satgur.

    Dassan Dass
     
  13. Archived_member2

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    Pray Truth for all and say Satsriakaal!
    Dear all and Jasleen_Kaur Jee!

    Quote "did you miss the part from Sarlobh Granth, written by Guru Gobind Singh ji?"
    What is Sarlobh Granth? Is this different from Dasam Granth written by Sri Guru Gobind Singh Jee?

    Quote "what about Bhai Gurdas ji, who Guru Arjun Dev referred to as the "key" to gurbani?"
    I am not sure if it is true. Please provide a reference where and when Guru Arjan Dev Jee said so.

    Quote "do you doubt Guru Arjun Dev ji's judge of character? or Guru Gobind Singh ji's very words?"
    No. I am listening. The true Gurus right now too. Whose CDs are you listening?

    Quote "i'm sure you have some explanation about secret mantras that you can't share with us mere mortals..."
    One may experience Truth. One cannot talk it.

    **************

    Muneet Jee, thanks for the wonderful Vaak from Guru Naanak Dev Jee.
    nwnk lyKY iek gl horu haumY JKxw JwK ]1]
    nwnk lyKY ek gl ho{ hamY JKxw JwK ]1]
    naanak laykhai ik gal horu ha-mai jhakhnaa jhaakh. ||1|| SGGS 467-15
    Naanak, written is one talk. Rest is ego's useless babbling.

    No one needs to read anything else once he receives true Naam, also not from Bhai Gurdas Jee.
    Gurdev is singing gracefully in the above Sabad also that reading is wasting precious life.

    **************

    Dassan Dass Jee, I appreciate your efforts explaining borrowed thoughts from Bhai Gurdas Jee. He explains the four letters are the Waheguru and are its source.
    May I ask? Did God give birth to Vishnu, Hari, Gobind and Raam or the combination of the first letters of their names made Waheguru? Please explain.


    Balbir Singh
     
  14. Archived_Member1

    Archived_Member1
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    question to balbir singh:

    why do you repeatedly ask questions that other people have answered for you in other threads? can't remember? do a search. i'm in no mood to argue with you.
     
  15. Sikh80

    Sikh80
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    As stated above when we recite 'vaheguru' we are doing mahima of the satgurus. In fact we are doing nothing by saying the first alphabets in the form of a word.it is human imagination only that we are praising the four satgurus.

    2.It is not clear as to how you have arrived at that these four satgurus were responsible for giving Naam. So far sikhs are concerned the 'Naam' and its concept started only in 15/16th century.

    3. Yes, we all consider 'Vaheguru' as naam only ,it is the way the things are unless there is some revolutionary concept that you are telling us.[What is mante?]

    4. It is well known that 'waheguru' gurumantar hey has come from Bhai sahib only.

    5. You have used Lord with vishnu, Krishna, Ram but have not used the same with Nanak dev ji. Any specific reasons for this. In which context Lord is used.We generally use it as alter-nemo for God.

    6. The portion above that is not colored in blue has been cramped and some concepts are lost. Shall be grateful if yoiu could kindly rephrase it and type it in slightly bolder font.
    Thanks and regards.
     
  16. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
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    Jasleen ji

    Speaking as mod now. You describe an annoying pattern of repeating questions asked and answered in other threads (and also in other forums). What you have detected is a technique referred to as "trolling". The intent of trolling is to throw a forum into an uproar. The effects are usually temporary. Until the next trolling incident occurs.

    One of my favorite examples comes from a thread on SPN entitled "Does God Have Hands." Speaks for itself.

    In this thread, the comment by Balbir ji "For example, Gurdev never said that 'Waheguru' was Gurumantra but the writer of the article referred insists that Waheguru is Gurumantra" is explicitly contradicted by Bhai Gurdas in Vaar 13 Pauree 2. This has already been pointed out by Kaur-1 Bhenji in another thread. But Balbir will say that Gurdev didn't say it so what Bhai Gurdas says doesn't count. Trolling. Throws a bunch of people into an uproar.
     
  17. Sikh80

    Sikh80
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    aad.
    as a mod you have some rights.kindly delete that is not as per norms and is well within your rights.
     
  18. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
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    Jios

    Most of you are well versed enough in Gurmat to know that this is full of internal contradictions.

    Sikh80 ji,

    Your comments pretty much sum up the problems with the thesis (?) of SSMDCX ji).

    Also, Sikh80 ji

    I believe in free speech and the ability of most people in the forum to sort out what is going on here.
     
    #17 spnadmin, Jan 23, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 23, 2008
  19. Sikh80

    Sikh80
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    aad2000
    It is fine with me. Kindly proceed as that you like as mod. if i have done something that is not as per norms and rules of your site.
     
  20. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
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    Sikh80 ji

    You are OK in my book.
     
  21. Sikh80

    Sikh80
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    aad2000
    It is fine.
     

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