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Sikligars, Vanjara Sikhs - The Heroes Forgotten?

Discussion in 'Hard Talk' started by Gyani Jarnail Singh, Sep 11, 2009.

  1. Gyani Jarnail Singh

    Gyani Jarnail Singh Malaysia
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    A documentary on the plight of Sikligar Sikhs and Vanjara Sikhs

    <embed src="http://blip.tv/play/g653gZ78ZwI" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="350">


    Why are the SIKH Vanjaras grossly neglected by all and sundry ?? This question has always bugged me..but first..to those who dont know what i am talking about....

    Who are the SIKH Vanjaras..also called the SIKLIGARS ?? These are a kaum of transient wanderers..often likened to GYPSIES..who trade in bhandeh, iron smithies work like making locks, baltees, pails, iron utensils, weapons..etc etc. Their population is about 100 MILLION while the total population of Sikhs in India is only about 20 Million. These Vanjaras became SIKHS of Baba nanak during his Udasees throughout India…since then they have called themselves SIKHS, their lives and rituals centre around a GUTKA of japji Sahib…but they are also some of the poorest of the poor..and in INDIA..a poor man is worthless..hence to the WEALTHY SIKHS of Punjab that constitute the Khalsa Panth..these 100 million Sikhs of Baba Nanak are a worthless commodity and hence completely sidelined never to be mentioned in sikh circles. After Guur nanak Ji sahib the next Guru that is mentioned briefly in Sikligar history is Guru hargobind Ji sahib. Guru Ji called some sikligar Sikhs to help in the manufacture of weapons.

    Thus apart from knowing just these two Guru Sahibs names…the Sikligars are not familiar with naythign else Sikhi is famous for…and neither has the Punjab Sikhs shown any keenness on their part togo out and cultivate ties with this huge population of Sikhs outside of Punjab. For the past 500 years these Sikligar Sikhs have not forgotten the two Guurs..Guru nanak and Guru hargobind Ji and called themselves SIKHS although they have no idea about even the SGGS. Their lives centre around Japji Sahib in Gutka Form only.
    Sikhs are never tired of claiming that ALL SIKHS are well off..Sikhs have no Beggars etc etc…but this is a fact that the 100 million Sikligars are SIKHS..and they are not well off…and they scratch the earth daily for food like chickens…at night most sleep without knowing when the next roti will come from. They have no houses but tents, no properties except a few utensils and their tools of trade. It is also a fact that many among them are HIGHLY SKILLED in their TRADE – locksmiths, iron smiths, weapons manufacturing etc etc…BUT sadly lack of education, capital etc means they a re unable to rise above the poverty line..generation after generation.. BUT they are SIKHS..YES..POOR SIKHS..YES..BUT NO “beggars”. They live strictly by the Gurmatt way that baba Nanak Ji taught them..Kirt Karo…and although circumstances force them to be “no wand chhako” types….and lack of resources and spiritual sustenance may also cancel the naam japoo characteristic..BUT the mere fact that they have NOT abandoned SIKHI for the past 500 years living in a hostile environment, have not abandoned their KESH..while living amongst non-kesha hindus and muslim majorities…shows their mettle.

    These Sikligar Sikhs are the true inheritors of the GURU KI GOLAK GREEB ka MOOHN..but sadly the Sikhs have handed over their Golaks either to the POLITICIANS..or to the Good for nothing wehlarr SAADHS/SANTS who run DERAS for their own PRIVATE BENEFITS. Who AMASS WEALTH privately in the GURUS NAME..open Private Colleges named after themselves, offer posts in them to their own relatives..and chelas..while continuously blowing the GURU HORN to befool the Sikh Sangats into giving them GOLAKs and charawwas decade after decade..with absolutely no accountability….they wash their hands off this by saying..Guru Janneh… aapeh GURU saza devegah..guru deean guru janneh..blah blah blah…and thus these wehlarr saadhs get bolder and make more trips abroad to collect even more dollars and pounds. POLITICIANS ans PUJAREES/SAADHS/DERAWALLAHS etc have no dhram..no sense of conscience..all they are interested in are SELF PRESERVATION..vote banks, power and amassing wealth. Tomorrow IF the rest of the SIKHS also become impoverished like the Sikligars..there will be no effect on the politicians or the derawallahs…they will just move on to greener pastures…this is also one reason WHY these DERAWALLAHS always stay away from SOLELY SIKH SANGATS…they PREFER a MILGHOBHA…...a mixture of Hindus, keshadharee hindus look alike Sikhs, sikh-hindus, hindu-sikhs, christian-sikhs !!Sikhs who pray at Muslim Pir Graves/samaadhs..etc etc BECAUSE then their NET stays WIDE…TRAWLER NETS that sweep the Ocean Floor…..”everything is welcome” !!because to them MONEY is PRIME..not DHARAM…so what if their Shardhaloo “sikh” prays to a muslim Grave…he is still a shardhaloo who will also matha tek to his golak..so why chase him away/chastise him ?? THIS is the Main REASON the DERAS are so popular..everybody is welcome..to do whatever his heart desires..as long as the Guru ji gets his cut !!

    The Sikligars have such a great pool of Talent that can be literally ignited if given the chance…investment in their EDUCATION..their SKILLS DEVELOPMENT..and MARKETING of their Products..such a huge pool of SIKHI…that can overnight BOOST the SIKH population form 20 million to over 100 million and all over INDIA. IF these people have guarded their SIKHI so jealously for 500 years in such ADVERSE CONDITIONS..what wonders can they achieve if given the RIGHT ENVIRONMENT. SIKH Gurdwaras raise BILLIONS in GOLUCK Collections yearly..WASTE colossal sums on GURU KA LANGGARS to feed the already OBESE SIKHS !!
    No one has even looked at the sikligars seriously…not the SGPC with its multi kror budgets…not the Delhi Gurdwara Committee – also with multi million charawwas yearly…no one is willing to help them.

    The entire Sikh Khalsa Panth should hang its head in SHAME. We have neglected such a big portion of us..the poorer section of our Panth..is forced to live hand to mouth. Just a small capital outlay towards establishing workshops to employ these master craftsmen..and a little advertising or Marketing their produce can send them on the path to prosperity….and we can make good use of our GOLUCKS….to help our fellow SIKH. Right now they are approaching the Indian govt in New Delhi for help..but I am not hopeful…the Govt is also not a party that helps genuine cases…it is also politically motivated….so they are going to be disappointed there as well…the ORDINARY SIKH is their BEST BET…IF the Ordinary SIKH is made aware of their plight..and each SIKH takes it upon his head that he is going to ensure his local GURDWARA helps the Sikligars..then a concerted effort can be set moving… CHARITY BEGINS AT HOME..and the SIKH HOME is so Crammed FULL of the NEEDY…yet we close our EYES and pretend all is A-OK..what a FARCE. Its time to RIGHT that WRONG being done for the past 500 years…
     
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  3. kds1980

    kds1980 India
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    Re: Why are sikligars/vanjara sikhs neglected/ignored ?

    Gyani ji

    do you have any source to prove that sikligar sikhs are 100 millions.100 million is simply too much and I think these numbers are exgerated
     
  4. Gyani Jarnail Singh

    Gyani Jarnail Singh Malaysia
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    Re: Why are Sikligars, Vanjara Sikhs Neglected, Ignored?

    Kanwardeep singh ji,
    gurfateh.

    I am just going by the 10 Kror figure mostly quoted in the various Indian Press reports - latest on 9/9/09 in the Rozana spokesman Editorial .
    Heres a Tribune report:

    Bring nomadic Sikhs into mainstream: Bibi
    Our Correspondent​
    Phagwara, August 30
    Former SGPC President and Akali MLA Bibi Jagir Kaur today demanded that 11 crore “Sikligar and Wanjara” Sikhs belonging to nomadic society in 22 states of country should be brought into Sikh mainstream and a Sikh mission set up for them. These Sikhs lived outside Punjab, particularly in Rajasthan, Maharashtra, Karnataka, Andhra Pradesh, Gujarat and other southern states and followed Sikh tenets, claimed Bibi who recently was given the title of “Wanjara Mother” by these Sikhs at a national-level function held near Nagpur. Punjab has many apostate (patit) Sikhs but there is no“ patitupuna” among the Sikligars and Wanjara Sikh tribes, she asserted.

    2. The Sikh population of the world, as broken down by Dr. Dalvinder Singh Ji is as follows:

    (Dr. Dalvinder Singh Ji has put these figures down in 'crores, 'lacs' etc. I have attempted to standardise them in western terms for ease.)

    Mainstream Sikhs in India 20,000,000 (many many youth are monas)
    Sikligar 40,000,000
    Vanjaras 50,000,000
    Satnamias 10,000,000
    Johari (Maharashthra) 20,000
    Assami (20 villages in Assam) 20,000
    Bihari - Kishanganj and Patna in Bihar 20,000
    Tharu - Bijnaur, UP 20,000
    Lamas - Larmapa and Naingmapa tribes of Tibet origin 125,000
    Sindhis 200,000
    Canada, America, UK, Australia, Thailand, Malaysia, Kenya etc. 1,000,000
    Other Sikhs * 1,000,000
    TOTAL 122,380,000


    3. http://www.guruangaddev.org/ignired-i.htm gives vanjara population as:
    Most of the Sikhs will be surprised to know that there are above 12 crores of the ignored Sikh tribe people in the country. Major of them are :​

    VANJARAS

    [​IMG]

    Numerically the Vanjara tribe is the most important, spread all over South India. Vanjaras are among those Sikhs who irrigated with the blood of whole of their families, the plant of Sikhism. They were so brave that men like Bachitar Singh turned away elephant by hitting his steel covered head with spear; so knowledgeable that after Bhai Gurdas, whatever interpretation of Gurubani has been done, it was by a Vanjara Sikh, Bhai Mani Singh, who got his pores cut for Sikhism.

    Numerically the Vanjara tribe is the most important, spread all over South India. Vanjaras are among those Sikhs who irrigated with the blood of whole of their families, the plant of Sikhism. They were so brave that men like Bachitar Singh turned away elephant by hitting his steel covered head with spear; so knowledgeable that after Bhai Gurdas, whatever interpretation of Gurubani has been done, it was by a Vanjara Sikh, Bhai Mani Singh, who got his pores cut for Sikhism. Vanjaras like Makhan Shah sacrificed his wealth to search out the Guru and Lakhi Shah burnt his own house to cremate the body of Ninth Guru.

    Guru Nanak came in contact with numerous Vanjaras during the udasis. He composed rhymes addressing Vanjaras. Janamsakhis record Bhai Mansukh as the first Vanjara Sikh who got associated with the Gurughar and inspired the emperor Shivanbh of Sri Lanka to embrace sikhism and thus helped spread Sikhism outside the boundaries of India. There was another Sikh of the Sixth Guru Haridas Vanjara, the daroga of Gwalior fort. During Guru Hargobind’s imprisonment Sikhs like Babe Buddha, Bhai Gurdas, Bhai Ballu, Bhai Parana and Bhai Kirtia would often come to him from Punjab. He would not only inform the Sixth Guru of all the news of the royal court but also provided all facilities. When Guruji was asked of his release from Gwalior, he explained his important role as follows; One day Haridas Daroga come to me and side,” When Emperor Jahangir sleeps in his palace he sees dreadly faces and threatening shrieks resound in his mind asking him to release the ‘Peer of Hind’ whom he has incarcerated in Gwalior fort” (Guru Kiran Sakhian, P. 34) “Wazir Khan gave the Daroga his message to release the prisoners. After watching the massage all those prisoners undergoing were left. I asked the Daroga, “What is written in the letter about remaining prisoners”. He replied with folded hands. Those who could not be released now could escape by holding the robe of the Guru” The Daroga was a Sikh of the Guru. I asked him to get a large sized robe stitched. By morning all the kings got freed holding onto Guru’s robe. (Guru Kian Sakhian, P. 35-36)
    Makhan Shah was associated with Sikhism since the Sixth Guru. Bhatt Vahis testify this “ The cavalcade of Bhai Makhan Shah who was the Sikh of Guru, was going to Kashmir. The satguru joined him there. After pilgrimage of Mutton Martand along with Bhai Dasa and Bhai Aru Ram, he reached the place of Bhai Makhan Shah at Mota Tanda. Bhai Dasa, father of Bhai Makhan Shah breathed his last there.”

    The Seventh Guru stayed with him in Kashmir, This is mentioned in ‘Guru Kian Sakhian’ and ‘Bhatt Vahi “ Guru Har Rai Jee, the Seventh Guru, Son of Baba Gurditta Jee arrived in Srinagae in the year seventeen hundred seventeen, Krishan pakh, Panchami of Jeth month. Makjhan Shah, son of Bhai Dasa, grandson of Binai, maternal grandson of Beheru, Sub caste Vanjara came to him.’ (Guru Kian Sakhina, P.40) The Guru stayed at the Tanda of Makhan Shah in Kashmir for four months. (Bhatt Vahi Talaunda Pargana Jeend)................read more at site.

    4. http://www.sikhiwiki.org/index.php/Sikligar_Sikhs............ONLY Sikligars..Vanjaras etc not included..

    The SikhWiki site is acut and paste job from the site given in 3. It gives population fo sikligars and vanjaras as 12 Krors....120 Million.


    Since you are in India can you get other figures to dispute these...Hopefully ???
     
  5. kds1980

    kds1980 India
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    Re: Why are Sikligars, Vanjara Sikhs Neglected, Ignored?

    But then why these people don't call themselves as sikhs in census of India?

    why there are are no Sikligar or vanjara sikh political leaders?

    why there are no sikligar or vanjara sikh Gurdwara's?

    40 and 50 million is not a a small number. It is equal to tribal population of india
     
  6. AusDesi

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    Re: Why are Sikligars, Vanjara Sikhs Neglected, Ignored?

    I've seen Banjaras etc. I doubt they are Sikhs. If they are, they are hiding it pretty well.
     
  7. Gyani Jarnail Singh

    Gyani Jarnail Singh Malaysia
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    Re: Why are Sikligars, Vanjara Sikhs Neglected, Ignored?

    These are quite valid questions...maybe someone out there knows the answers...

    After all just how many DALITS are SIKHS in PUNJAB..How many off them are "Leaders"/political or otherwise ??
    Just how many DALIT GURDWARAS are there in Punjab ? How many DALITS have become CM of Punjab ?? or at least Ministers ?? there are RAKHVEEAN SEATS reserved for Dalits to ENSURE a dalit wins...is it the same for the sikligars..vanjaras..?

    Its a chicken and egg situation..IF not a Single Vanjara/sikligar cna make it through High SChool..how many Leaders can we expect from them ?
    How amny TRIBAL Leaders are there..has nay TRIBAL become a PM/CM of any state ??

    Its a REALITY that in INDIA...a MINORITY RULES..a MINORITY Grabs all RESOURCES..of education, of quotas..of political leadership..jobs..etc etc..and the VAST Majortiy just works day and night to support this minority blood suckers.

    IMHO..the situation MUST CHANGE..the sikligars and vanjaras must be FOUND..and brought IN..
     
  8. kds1980

    kds1980 India
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    Re: Why are Sikligars, Vanjara Sikhs Neglected, Ignored?


    Dalits in Punjab have their own identity.They have reservations in jobs,Dalit ministers.They have their own Gurdwara's in the form of ravidasia's which some of them now are preferring to part away from sikhism.May be their is no
    Dalit CM Because majority Jat population will never accept it. but still they have their own political identity.Can any political party now even think of messing with dalits? We have recently seen the example of Dera sant killing
    so The case of Dalits and sikligar,vanjara sikhs are totally different
     
  9. Gyani Jarnail Singh

    Gyani Jarnail Singh Malaysia
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    Re: Why are Sikligars, Vanjara Sikhs Neglected, Ignored?

    Thats what I meant..just how many DALIT SIKHS outside PUNJAB have Gurdwaras/leaders ?
    These Vanjaras/sikligars are OUTSIDE PUNJAB...spread all over and out of touch with Mainstream Sikhi.

    2. The Sant Niranjan Dass ( Vieanna incident ) is just another DERA like that of Gurmeet Ram Rahim, Bhaniara, and Asutosh. A lot of people are making the mistake of treating a DERA as IF it is the MAIN RAVIDASSEE NATION !! which cna make decisiosn on behalf of all ravidassis all over the world !! Its a Media circus !! spun around and many are falling into it..and such a strong aversion to the TRUTH coming out...

    3. NONE of the Ravidass GURDWARAS in the UK...have removed any SGGS or allowed this SANT to have his programmes there earlier when they found out he was self promoting his own GURUDOM.
     
  10. kds1980

    kds1980 India
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    Re: Why are Sikligars, Vanjara Sikhs Neglected, Ignored?

    Gyani ji

    Please forgive me but are there any sizeable number of Dalit sikhs outside punjab?
    and where they have numbers Like Uk they have created their own Gurdwara's.

    In democracy with numbers things like leaders,places of worship automatically come's

    Anyway if the report is true then sikhs should try to integrate them in mainstream sikhism and make sure that in next census of India they will call themselves as sikhs
     
  11. Gyani Jarnail Singh

    Gyani Jarnail Singh Malaysia
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    Re: Why are Sikligars, Vanjara Sikhs Neglected, Ignored?

    Heresa view on the vieanna incident which sheds more light...hopefully the truth will emerge..
    Quote:
    Dr W Owen Cole wrote that when visiting India in 1983, he was taken to meet "the Satguru of the Ravidasis" at Varanasi. To quote, "He lived some way outside the sacred part of the city, where Ravidas had chosen to end his days....Religions should be organisms rather than organisations and so I found these people to be. They had turned from Sikhism from which they hoped to gain improved social status or at least acceptance, and were in the process of moving further towards total independence.....The Satguru told me that many other hymns existed [in addition to those in SGGS] and that a Hindi collection was being compiled . ULTIMATELY, THE SIKH SCRIPTURE WOULD BE REPLACED BY THEIR OWN AND THE LANGUAGE OF THE SIKHS WOULD GIVE WAY TO HINDI, THUS ENABLING THE RAVIDASIS TO BECOME MORE THAN A PUNJABI-BASED MOVEMENT" (The capitals are mine.)
    As an afterthought Dr Cole adds, "Whether they would ever become more than a dalit movements of chamars or cobblers, like their founder, is more uncertain. "
    (Autobiography "Cole Sahib - the story of multifaith journey", Sussex Academic Press, p. 143 (The book was sent to me for review).

    That was in 1983 when Dr Owen Cole visited India. So, the dalits are simply carrying on with their pre-planned agenda - the Vienna incident is an excuse.
    (My item at The Sikh Times is relevant.)

    Gurmukh Singh (UK)
     
  12. Gyani Jarnail Singh

    Gyani Jarnail Singh Malaysia
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    Re: Why are Sikligars, Vanjara Sikhs Neglected, Ignored?

    Kanwardeep singh ji,

    IN Malaysia/Singapore/Thailand/Indonesia/Australia/NZ region there are a substantial number of Dalits Kamboj Mazhbi etc..BUT they share the same Gurdwaras with US. IN Singapore they used to have a Ravidass Sabha but not anywhere else. Our Gurdwara cater to all SIKHS and we have no problems with anyone...Dalits have become Pardhaans !!
    About the UK..i dont have any figures...

    2. The way things are going..the Majority Community is pulling more strongly...only the STRONGLY GROUNDED SIKHS will resist the ultimate Black Hole of Hinduism...
     
  13. harbansj24

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    Re: Why are Sikligars, Vanjara Sikhs Neglected, Ignored?

    Originally quoted by Ausi Desi Ji.

    I've seen Banjaras etc. I doubt they are Sikhs. If they are, they are hiding it pretty well. Yes Ausi Desi Ji,

    I too have seen these Vanjaras. I too was not aware that they are Sikhs.
    But their behaviour is like that of true Guru Nanak Sikhs. They go about their work quietly. Unlike other tribes of India they do not make nuisance of themselves and do not indulge in any criminal activity. Yes I too have marveled at their skills.
     
  14. harbansj24

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    Re: Why are Sikligars, Vanjara Sikhs Neglected, Ignored?

    Originally quoted by Ausi Desi Ji.

    l.

    Yes Ausi Desi Ji,

    I too have seen these Vanjaras. I too was not aware that they are Sikhs.
    But their behaviour is like that of true Guru Nanak Sikhs. They go about their work quietly. Unlike other tribes of India they do not make nuisance of themselves and do not indulge in any criminal activity. Yes I too have marveled at their skills.
     
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  15. ruby1

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    I agree with you that Siklgiar and Vanjara Sikhs are neglected Sikhs.
     

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