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Sikhism and Black Magic

Discussion in 'Sikh Sikhi Sikhism' started by gagan, Jul 10, 2005.

  1. gagan

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    Can anyone tell me or post any views on whether sikhs actually belive in Black magic, like they say in india 'jadoo tauna' do these things really exist? or are we led to believe that these are unrealistic?
     
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  3. gagan

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    Black magic

    Can anyone tell me or post any views on black magic..whether sikhs actually believe in this, like they say in india 'jadoo tauna' or are we led to believe that all this is unrealistic?
     
  4. CaramelChocolate

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    Re: Black magic

    All rituals, supersitions are FORBIDDEN in Sikhism. I guess black magic would come under this, right?
     
  5. Gyani Jarnail Singh

    Gyani Jarnail Singh Malaysia
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    Re: Black Magic

    SIKHS beleive in ONLY and ONLY AKAL PURAKH. In Gurmatt there is NO DEVIL...you know like the guy carrying atrishul and having horns on his head bobbing up and down in Hell volcano etc.


    GURBANI is Sarab Rog ka Aukhad NAAM....that is the NAAM of WAHEGURU is the CURE for EVERYTHING.

    Jadoo toona black magic are for WEAK FOOLS, who dont have self confidence and lack FAITH in WAHEGURU.

    The Authorities in malaysia have just arrested such a "Master" who claims he is powerful enough to make Oprah Winfrey blind/deaf just by watching her TV show...even though the SHOW he is watching is years old, a repeat ..and Oprah winfrey is in America thousands of miles away....and you know what..his "die hard followers hang on to his every word as GOD TRUTH !!! and they came from as far away as New Zealand to be in His SKY KINGDOM which he says is a copy of the Kingdom of GOD !!

    This si solid proof that all thsi Hocus Pocus doesnt WORK.....and its all tricks of the mind...the weaker you are the easier you fall.

    Have FULL FAITH in GURBANI and GURU JI. AVOID such Nonsense.

    jarnail Singh
     
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  6. gagan

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    Re: Black magic

    Yes i do agree, there is nothing greater than waheguru, and i have full faith in this however, saying that, people who are non-sikh and sikh believers ..why do they fall into this? Why do they believe in such mantra, tantra...surely their must be some form of this shakti??? thats why they turn to this to harm people?

    in general not even this, but majority are very superstitious...why the hypocrisy??
     
  7. Gyani Jarnail Singh

    Gyani Jarnail Singh Malaysia
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    Re: Black magic

    Dear Gagan Ji,


    In Punjabi there is a saying..Jehrre pind jaanna nahin..usda raah kahton puchhnna ?? Why ask for durections to a village you dont intend to visit ??

    Thoise who "beleive" in Black Magic/White magic/and whatever are free to do so and they may get affected by them....whay we worry ??

    Sikhse and Gurmatt says IGNORE such things..thya are of no cencern to us and rather HINDER our Progress towards waheguru. Time is too short..the Journey is long and tedious...if you stop to dilly dally by the wayside..you waste precious time...

    Thats all i can say for now. If you still want to do so..there are thousands of books available on magic..black and white.

    jarnail singh
     
  8. gagan

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    Re: Black magic

    Thats fine, i just wanted to know views on this matter....whether it does exist or not.. Not that im onto all this rubbish, and yes i do agree with what you mentioned..if people carry on with this then yes they could be affected by it.

    Thanks for your time

    Sat sri akal ji
     
  9. sukhpaal

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    Re: Black magic

    The Devil and the
    Way of the Guru

    By Dr. Kanwar Ranvir Singh
    The focus of the Guru is on purifying the heart and becoming more Life-centred/Naam-centred and realising that the self is part of Life and supported by it, so there is no gain by being self-centred, to the exclusion of others. By drawing Life into one’s life, we become lamps for the Light that is God. Then, we can spread that Light to others. The whole technology of gurmat (Way of the Guru) is for this purpose.

    Since gurmat is about how we live Life, most people tend to regard discussion of spirits as superstition, or at best irrelevant. This is unfortunate since there is nothing in Guru Granth Sahib Ji/Gurbani or the daily prayers which is not for our benefit. That various spirits exist is mentioned many times in Gurbani. In common with many indigenous traditions, there is mention of the elemental spirits of water and fire, and mother earth (“mata dharat mahat”), various Hindu gods and goddesses, the prophets mentioned in the Semitic religions (Judaism, Christianity, Islam), many Buddhas and others. Free from the confusion that this world is all there is, the spirits cannot be sincere atheists. Whether they serve or rebel against God, they remember the Name.

    “Demons, angels, snake kings of hell, and sprites utter the Name all the time.” (Tav Prasad Swayyas, verse 7, third of morning prayers)

    However, in this material world, people often go on to worship these other spirits rather than God. Gurbani tells us that,

    “Some fools go to worship idols, while others, behaving unenlightened as animals go to worship the dead.” (Tav Prasad Swayyas, verse 9)

    This does not include only black magic and voodoo but also lighting candles at the tombs of dead saints and praying to them, often accompanied by music, which was a common practice of Sufi Muslims. It is different from remembering dead beloved ones. What happens to those we loved after death? The angel of death is sometimes called Yama, by which name he is also known to the Jains, Buddhists and Hindus, and Azrael, which is what the Muslims call him. The soul is taken from the body and then taken to the Divine Court for Divine Justice. According to our good and evil deeds, people are placed in heavens (rewards) and hells (punishment). Thereafter they may be given another chance at serving God through being reincarnated.

    “Those who obey God do not go with the angels of punishment.” (Jap Ji Sahib, verse 13, first of morning prayers).

    “Those who have not recited the Naam – the gurmantra (Wahe-Guru), the praises of God, and sincerely sought through prayer the Presence of God, are unfortunate and will go with the angels of punishment.” (Raag Gujri, Fourth Guru, verse 3 in evening prayers).

    The only criteria will be worship of God and good deeds towards the Light of God in every heart, including your own. Either there is rejoicing or sadness, but the choice is ours, here, now.

    “They shall not get back lost time – the fruit of their actions shall they receive. With face blackened, into deep hell shall they be hailed, as a thief by the neck bound.” (Guru Granth Sahib Ji, p.303).

    According to the Guru the real devil is the devil inside, our hau-mai or ego-centredness which is born of and leads to ignorance. The opposite, of course, is the Sikh or student of Life. If our choices were meaningless, we would not be alive, but mere puppets. God’s gift of life, God’s love for us, implies that our choices matter. Therein, is the risk of evil and disaster. We have five energies which are supposed to serve us, to be under our control – pride, anger, lust, greed, and attachment. When these control us, we behave like devils.

    “Those devoid of love for God are ego-centred goblins – how long can they find consolation?” (Guru Granth Sahib Ji, p.305).

    Those seeking God outside the self are “misguided goblins” (Guru Granth Sahib Ji, p.309). Why? Because it denies that God is with us and in us. We are part of Life/God as well as a gift from Life. The dancer is in the dance yet the dance cannot be compared to the dancer. Similarly, God’s Light is in all things, even as God stands outside creation. WaheGuru dwells with us as reflection in a mirror, fragrance in a flower, fire within wood. If one dissects and analyses a mirror, a flower, or a piece of wood, one will not find these things “in” there, yet our own experience tells us that they are “in” there somewhere. Similarly, the law of karma, of right and wrong, is universally written on every heart as common sense, and the law of wird, of God’s Grace and love for us, reaching out to us, and guiding us to deeper and deeper love for all good and holy things is an unplayed symphony resounding in every fiber of the universe. Through choosing life over death, trusting in God’s help which is always available, we also can say,

    “You have subdued the five evils (five inner energies gone out of direction) and destroyed the torments of death.” (Anand Sahib, verse 5 in evening prayer).



    Satan

    Whatever inner demons, external enemies of Life, or angels of punishment nothing can harm one who seeks comfort and shelter with God, the Lord of the Worlds.

    Satan is mentioned six times in the Guru Granth Sahib Ji. His aim is to cause evil and lead people from God’s worship to evil. One of his works is to destroy spiritual discipline. Presented below are multiple translations giving the interpretations of different people on this topic.

    SIREE RAAG, FIRST MEHL, THIRD HOUSE: Make good deeds the soil, and let the Word of the Shabad be the seed; irrigate it continually with the water of Truth. Become such a farmer, and faith will sprout. This brings knowledge of heaven and hell, you fool! || 1 || Do not think that your Husband Lord can be obtained by mere words. You are wasting this life in the pride of wealth and the splendor of beauty. || 1 || Pause || The defect of the body which leads to sin is the mud puddle, and this mind is the frog, which does not appreciate the lotus flower at all. The bumble bee is the teacher who continually teaches the lesson. But how can one understand, unless one is made to understand? || 2 || This speaking and listening is like the song of the wind, for those whose minds are colored by the love of Maya. The Grace of the Master is bestowed upon those who meditate on Him alone. They are pleasing to His Heart. || 3 || You may observe the thirty fasts, and say the five prayers each day, but ‘Satan’ can undo them. Says Nanak, you will have to walk on the Path of Death, so why do you bother to collect wealth and property? || 4 || 27 || (Guru Granth Sahib Ji p.24)

    You observe the thirty Ramadan fasts and make five daily prayers your companions. Keep these in a way that Satan violates not their merit.

    The implication is not just that Satan attacks Muslims trying to observe their fasts! But rather that Satan will try and undo anyone trying to follow guidance of religious practices. One who lives in an evil way is described as behaving like Satan.

    PAUREE: He sees the terrible, awful wilderness as a city. Gazing upon the false objects, he believes them to be real. Engrossed in sexual desire, anger and egotism, he wanders around insane. When the Messenger of Death hits him on the head with his club, then he regrets and repents. Without the Perfect, Divine Guru, he roams around like Satan. || 9 || (Guru Granth Sahib Ji p.707-8)

    A terrible forest has man thought of as a city; viewing unreal objects has he taken them to be real. Involved in lust, wrath and pride man in madness wanders along. As falls on his head Yama’s baton, has he regrets. Without guidance of the Holy Master, perfectly endowed, in diabolical thoughts he wanders along.

    Satan is shown to be an active force for evil in the world, for instance, in the rape and murder of women by the soldiers during the invasion of India by the Moghuls.

    TILANG, FIRST MEHL: As the Word of the Forgiving Lord comes to me, so do I express it, O Lalo. Bringing the marriage party of sin, Babar has invaded from Kaabul, demanding our land as his wedding gift, O Lalo. Modesty and righteousness both have vanished, and falsehood struts around like a leader, O Lalo. The Qazis and the Brahmins have lost their roles, and Satan now conducts the marriage rites, O Lalo. The Muslim women read the Koran, and in their misery, they call upon God, O Lalo. The Hindu women of high social status, and others of lowly status as well, are put into the same category, O Lalo. The wedding songs of murder are sung, O Nanak, and blood is sprinkled instead of saffron, O Lalo. || 1 || (Guru Granth Sahib Ji p. 722-3)

    Friend Lalo, as descends to me the Lord’s word, I express it. Babar with the wedding party of sin from Kabul rushed down and forcibly demanded surrender of Indian womanhood. Then went modesty and righteousness into hiding and falsehood was strutting about in glory. Set aside were Kazis and Brahmins, and Satan went around solemnising marriages. Muslim women, reciting the Koran in their affliction called on Khuda. Other women of lower castes and of the Hindus in this suffering too include in your account. Says Nanak, Divine Beloved! Sung are paens of blood and sprinkled is blood for saffron.

    His evil is not simply seen in such dramatic instances, but also in the day-to-day evil which we encounter:

    SHALOK, FIRST MEHL: Thieves, adulterers, prostitutes and pimps, make friendships with the unrighteous, and eat with the unrighteous. They do not know the value of the Lord’s Praises, and Satan is always with them. If a donkey is anointed with sandalwood paste, he still loves to roll in the dirt. O Nanak, by spinning falsehood, a fabric of falsehood is woven. False is the cloth and its measurement, and false is pride in such a garment. || 1 || (Guru Granth Sahib Ji p. 790)

    Thieves, fornicators, harlots and procuresses, all in mutual friendship are bound. The wicked associate with each other, and together eat and drink. They know not the essence of devotion (attributes of God), ever in Satan’s company living. A donkey rubbed over with sandal-paint, will still roll about in dust. Evil the measure and in wearing evil take pride. Says Nanak, those that spin evil (falsehood), evil is their wearing.

    One should never approach the black arts, nor play with it, but rather call on God for safety and protection. This is the answer if we ever have the misfortune to encounter evil spirits. Only fear God – do not fear evil, but the consequences of evil, and be truthful with people about the situation. One should become God’s own. In old times, land owned directly by the Ruler was called the Khalsa. Thus, the Khalsa means one who belongs to God. When one receives Khande-de-Pahul (amrit ceremony) one becomes part of this Khalsa. “WaheGuru Ji Ka Khalsa” means ‘the Khalsa belongs to God’, “WaheGuru Ji Ki Fateh!!” affirms that no-thing can stand against the Power and Victory of God. By entering the Khalsa you affirm that you will strive to be part of the victory, rather than the loss.

    He has 7,000 commanders, and hundreds of thousands of prophets; He is said to have 88,000,000 shaykhs, and 56,000,000 attendants. || 1 || I am meek and poor — what chance do I have of being heard there? His Court is so far away; only a rare few attain the Mansion of His Presence. || 1 || Pause || He has 33,000,000 play-houses. His beings wander insanely through 8.4 million incarnations. He bestowed His Grace on Adam, the father of mankind, who then lived in paradise for a long time. || 2 || Pale are the faces of those whose hearts are disturbed. They have forsaken their Bible, and practice Satanic evil. One who blames the world, and is angry with people, shall receive the fruits of his own actions. || 3 || You are the Great Giver, O Lord; I am forever a beggar at Your Door. If I were to deny You, then I would be a wretched sinner. Slave Kabeer has entered Your Shelter. Keep me near You, O Merciful Lord God — that is heaven for me. (Guru Granth Sahib Ji p.1161)

    He who has seven thousand chiefs of his hosts and has a lakh-and-a-quarter prophets under Him, whose devotees are eighty-eight crore in number, whose special attendants number fifty-six crores. Who to him shall present my petition, a humble man’s? Far is His court, a rare one to His mansion attains. Thirty-three crores are His domestics: in eighty-four lakh species whirl creatures crazed. To Adam, ancestor of mankind the Lord showed grace, whereby he attained fullness of paradise. Whoever has perturbation in heart, turns yellow-faced, and leaving scriptures (Kateb, implying the Koran), follows Satan. Such a one blames the world and carries a grievance against mankind: each receives his desserts according to his deeds. You the Provider, we perpetually beggars. Should we answer You back, we turn sinners. Kabir, Thy servant Thy shelter seeks. Merciful Lord, pray keep me close to paradise.

    Whether someone has played with these satanic arts or not, the answer is the same. Keep on devotion to God. Fear of God will eat up all other fears, and Love for God will become Love and Compassion for all, including yourself. Love by its Nature is offered; it may be rejected and then there is nothing but regret, tragedy and loss. The Nature of Life is growth and the Sikh is always a ‘learner’, learning by doing Life, always growing. But Life by its Nature cannot be imposed. It is the gift of the Generous, Compassionate and Forgiving God who wishes us to live and be victorious. Disobeying God one can choose to self-destruct in which case there is only bitterness, anger and regret.

    SHALOK, FIRST MEHL: Cursed are the lives of those who read and write the Lord’s Name to sell it. Their crop is devastated — what harvest will they have? Lacking truth and humility, they shall not be appreciated in the world hereafter. Wisdom which leads to arguments is not called wisdom. Wisdom leads us to serve our Lord and Master; through wisdom, honor is obtained. Wisdom does not come by reading textbooks; wisdom inspires us to give in charity. Says Nanak, this is the Path; other things lead to Satan. (Guru Granth Sahib Ji p.1245)

    Cursed is the life of such as write out God’s Name and sell it as incantations. Those whose crop (devotion) is ruined, what harvest shall they have. Those without truth and modesty in the hereafter honoured shall not be. To indulge in disputation is to lose sense – such is not the way of wisdom. By wisdom is the Lord served, by wisdom is attained honour. By wisdom are books interpreted, by wisdom is dispensed charity. Says Nanak, there is one sole path to God (devotion) – all else is Satan’s prompting.

    No one will ever regret loving too much, and God is Love. “Jin Prem Kio Tin He Prabh Payo.” – ‘only those who love, know and live God-Life.’ God’s love for you is greater than powers of hate, but will you choose Love or hate? The purpose of Satan is to take you from God. Therefore, to focus on the negative qualities in yourself or in others is Satan’s work and not God’s. God is Wahe-Guru, ‘Wah’ meaning WOW or amazing, ‘Guru’ meaning Grace. [The ‘heh’ is the pause in breathing, it is not part of the spelling, but an aspirant/sound in the reciting. It recalls God putting Her Spirit, Her ‘Ruh’, Her Breath into the world giving it Life. By reciting the Guru-mantra, one moves towards and joins the streams of praise joining the Ocean of Happiness. There are specific verses of Gurbani which may assist someone who feels touched by evil. Traditionally, people some have advised hymns like “Tatti vah na lagaye” – ‘even the hot wind does not touch…those who turn to God whatever evil they may have done.’ This is part of Dukh Bhanjani Sahib, a collection of hymns to counter-attack negative feelings and forces. Send me an e-mail if you need further information regarding anything. There is only One Law which applies however damned you may be feeling. The verses above may be repeated as a kind of mantra (simply keep repeating them) in order to invoke the Power of the Name of God. Misery in this life and exile from God are always self-imposed and go against the Will of the Most Holy. God has made us to flourish in Happiness, not to fail. God reaches out to us in love. This is what we mean by God’s grace and what we mean by Gurmat – the Way of the Guru.

    [​IMG]
    only those who love, know God’















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    We sikhs have a bad habit of answering without investigating and adding personal opinions.
    PLEASE sangat ji, read - study - then reply.
    Clearly blackmagic exists as mentioned in sikhism. IT's use is clearly forbidden.
    Reply to proof above first.
    Then further proof will be provided.
     
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  10. Arvind

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    Re: Black magic

    Positive and Negative energies do exist within His creation. In this context, I may categorize Black Magic etc in negative one, if used for wrong purposes. Consider atomic power, if properly used, it is a boon... but if in wrong hands, then it is all about destruction. I have realized one thing by now, anyone with full faith in Guru is NOT affected by such energies around.
     
  11. Gyani Jarnail Singh

    Gyani Jarnail Singh Malaysia
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    Re: Black magic

    You write:
    <<
    We sikhs have a bad habit of answering without investigating and adding personal opinions.
    PLEASE sangat ji, read - study - then reply.
    Clearly blackmagic exists as mentioned in sikhism. IT's use is clearly forbidden.
    Reply to proof above first.
    Then further proof will be provided.<<<<




    Thus, the
    Khalsa means one who belongs to God. When one receives Khande-de-Pahul (amrit ceremony) one becomes part of this Khalsa. “WaheGuru Ji Ka Khalsa” means ‘the Khalsa belongs to God’, “WaheGuru Ji Ki Fateh!!” affirms that no-thing can stand against the Power and Victory of God. By entering the Khalsa you affirm that you will strive to be part of the victory, rather than the loss.
    Your post has the answer. What further "proof' is being requested ?? and then what furtehr "proofs" will be provided later??

    This Blackmagic/satan wagera wagera exists..BUT we KHALSA have NOTHING to do with those forces...SATAN is NOT as "BIG" in our life as He is in Christianity/Islam..WE DONT have a "ANTI-GURU" as they have an ANTI-CHRIST...Upside down crosses in churches, fertility rites, Satanic Worship, blood spattered altars, desecrated Churches, graveyards etc etc..and there are no "The Exorcist", Demon-Child, Son of SATAN..etc etc in our WORLD. All this is ALIEN.

    I am aware that Dr. Kanwar Ranvir Singh has been activley researching this topic and putting it up on his Gurmatt Learning Zone for quite some time now..but we can safely leave it aside.

    This is my humble opinion. We have such a short time to CONNECT with GURU-GURBANi, that wasting time on such matters is COUNTER PRODUCTIVE...isnt it rightly said that an IDLE MIND IS THE DEVIL'S WORKSHOP....Lets concentrate on GURU JI/NAAM JAAONA and not open our minds for the DEVIL to make it his Workshop. Jerreh PIND jannea hee nahin kion raah pucchheyaeh ??

    Jarnail Singh
     
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  12. sukhpaal

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    Re: Black magic

    Further proof of shabads to back up what i am saying.(existence of blackmagic)
    Yes i agree with above post!

    We should focus on waheguru - we respect and accept Gurbani ji.
    Thus we should accept all contents within.

    which is clearly posted ! Sangat asked about blackmagic- i answered!!!
     
  13. Kamal_Chauhan

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    Re: Black magic

    Yes Black Magic does exist but not many people can do it and many that claim they can do it are "Pakandis" (liars). I was watching a program (Sansani) on star new and they were uncovering these "Pakandis" (liars) and reveling their tricks and star news has claimed that they have uncovered 111 of these "Pakandis" (liars) till now. :advocate:

    But my advice is brother's stick with Guru ji and no one will be able to harm you because at the end of the day if you do "Jaddu Toona" and harm someone then you are commiting a big Sin and you will have to pay it back in some way or the another. :8-:)
    Now I know that Many sikhs go to these Baba's and Pandit's to solve their problems and they have no or very little trust in Guru Ji or God, they are merely sikh just because they are born in a sikh family and they knowledge and thinking wise they are not because Guru Ji has told us to stay away from these things.
     
  14. Gyani Jarnail Singh

    Gyani Jarnail Singh Malaysia
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    Re: Black magic

    I came across this mail...Noteworthy point is that NONE of the SIKH GURUS SAHIBBAANS ever "cast" out any devils or "evil spirits" "unclean spirits" etc as is routine for Jesus and His Church even TODAY.

    Sikhism doesnt have any "exorcists" or "witch doctors" to cast out evil spirits black magic etc. Gurbani does state that..any place where the PRAISES of WAHEGURU are being SUNG..THATS the "ONE PLACE EVIL SHUN".... like the PLAGUE !!! SO anyone who beleives in Gurbani and does paath/Kirtan regularly need not fear any such. Bhai Sahib bahi randheer Singh ji in his books has stated many incidents of "houses" and dwellings that had "evil spirits" living there for generations....who were driven out with just one Akahnd paath and Kirtan smagam...one such evil spirit even attained muktee. SO even IF such things exist..we are not to be bothered too much as they have a different plane or world from ours and the two seldom cross.

    Absurdities in Mark
    1. "Unclean spirits" confess that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. If 1 Jn.4:2 is true, then these "unclean spirits" are of God. 1:23-24
    1. Jesus casts out more devils and tells them not to reveal who he is. 1:32-34
    1. More "unclean spirits" confess that Jesus is "the son of God." 1 Jn.4:2 says that all such spirits are of God. 3:11
    1. Although the disciples weren't sure about Jesus even after his alleged resurrection, the "unclean spirits" knew that he was "the son of God." But Jesus told them not to tell anyone. 3:11-12
    1. Jesus gives his apostles the power to heal sickness and "cast out devils." 3:15
    1. Jesus' friends think he is insane. 3:21
    1. The scribes think that Jesus casts out devils by the power of the prince of devils, Beelzebub. 3:22
    1. A man possessed with "an unclean spirit" recognizes Jesus as the son of God. According to 1 Jn.4:2, 15, this man must have been "of God." 5:7
    1. "Thy faith hath made thee whole." If you have enough faith, you will never get sick. (Illness is caused by sin and lack of faith. Medical science is unnecessary.) 5:34
    1. Jesus is rejected by those who knew him the best, the people from his home town of Nazareth. 6:3
    1. "And he could do there no mighty work." 6:5
    1. Jesus sends out his apostles, two by two, to cast out "unclean spirits." 6:7
    1. "An evil eye ... defile the man." 7:22-23
    1. Jesus puts his fingers in a deaf man's ears, then spits and touches the deaf man's tongue. 7:33
    1. The disciples ought to know by now where they can get enough food to feed a few thousand. After all, Jesus had just done it before (6:34-44). This "doublet" was probably the result of two oral traditions of the same event. 8:4
    1. Jesus spits on a blind man's eyes. 8:23
    1. Jesus' spit did not completely cure the blind. So Jesus tried again. He put his hands on the man's eyes and, this time, the blind man "saw every man clearly." 8:24-25
    1. There were various opinions about the identity of Jesus. Some thought he was Elijah or one of the prophets. And many thought he was a risen John the Baptist. With credulity like that just about anyone could later be passed off as the risen Christ. 8:27-28
    "Get thee behind me, Satan." When Peter expressed his dismay about Jesus' coming death, Jesus said to him "Get thee behind me, Satan" -- a fine way to address his holiness, the first pope! 8:33
    1. Jesus heals a boy with "a dumb spirit" by saying, "Thou dumb and deaf spirit, I charge thee, come out of him and enter no more into him." (Sounds like a script from Monty Python, doesn't it?) But how could a deaf spirit hear the words spoken to it? And how could a dumb spirit cry out? 9:17, 25-26
    1. The disciples saw some others that they didn't know "casting out devils" in Jesus' name. (It was a popular sport back in those days.) 9:38
    1. Jesus kills a fig tree for not bearing figs, even though it was out of season. He did this to show the world how much God hates figs. 11:13-14
    1. "In those days ... the moon shall not give her light, and the stars of heaven shall fall." Of course this is nonsense. The billions of stars will never fall to earth and the moon does not produce its own light. 13:24-25
    1. Jesus says that heaven won't last forever. 13:31
    1. There are some things that Jesus doesn't know -- like when the end of the world will come. 13:32
    1. Jesus tells his disciples to eat his body and drink his blood. 14:22-24
    1. One of the followers of Jesus was a young, nearly naked man who dropped his linen cloth and "fled from them naked" when the priests came to arrest Jesus. 14:51-52
    1. The true followers of Christ routinely perform the following tricks: 1) cast out devils, 2)speak in tongues, 3) take up serpents, 4) drink poisons without harm, and 5) cure the sick by touching them. 16:17-18

    Jarnail Singh
     
  15. sukhpaal

    sukhpaal
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    We sikhs do not emphasise exorcism.......as much as Christians!
    We do have accounts of exorcism done by late sant isher singh ji Rarewale.

    We have different methods. Look at baba bhadhwag place where people go through water and get healed. Now to know wether someone is really possessed is tough.

    Accounts of many getting healed or 'fake' is hard to prove.
    So in essence exorcism does exist in different manner.
     
  16. drkhalsa

    drkhalsa
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    Dear Singh ji

    Actually what gyani ji want to say is that there is no place of such things in Gurbani and should not ideally effect any sikh following his rehat but still such things exist like in hindu religion and as wellas pionted by gyani ji in Gyani Ji ( with references from bible)
    so if in any case somebody effected by it will come to some Gurmukh Singh like Baba Isher Singh ji offcourse they are going to help him but still it does means sikhism support such thing but offcourse sikhism has answer for evil things

    Jatinder Singh
     
  17. kds1980

    kds1980 India
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    waheguru ji ka khalsa
    waheguru ji ki fateh

    my question is if black magic is done on a manmukh gursikh
    and he is unable to do paath then what should his relatives do because
    99% of sikhs today are manmukhs.
    bhul chuk maaf
     
  18. Gyani Jarnail Singh

    Gyani Jarnail Singh Malaysia
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    Veer Ji,

    The TWO...MANMUKH-GURSIKH are like BLACK_WHITE....One is either Black or white..one cannot be BOTH.

    A GURSIKH wouldnt be affected as his Rehit/gurbani/GURU would be there to protect him.

    A MANMUKH on the other hand has DESERTED his GURU....and he can be affected by anything out there...as he is out of the Protective Walls of the Keshgharr Fort of Guru Ji. All he got to do is BHUL BAKSHAH..come back to GURU JI DEE SHARAN immediately...begin to keep the REHIT, chhak Amrit..and he will be left by the black magic ehatever that is affecting him.

    To get "cured" one must not only go to a doctor..but follow his instructions and take the medicines prescribed. SO Go to the Panj Piyars, take Amrit and start GURBANI and REHIT.

    But if your answer is..NO i wont go to the doctor because I am afraid of Needles or bitter medicines....and I cant swallow pills..then SORRY as NO doctor can cure you.

    I reiterate forcefully...NO BLACK MAGIC TOONA JADOO can work on a REHITWAAN GURSIKH. Anybody out there is welcome to try on ME.

    Jarnail Singh
     
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  19. kds1980

    kds1980 India
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    waheguru ji ka khalsa
    waheguru ji ki fateh

    thanks for your reply gyani ji .but my question is sometimes the effect of the black magic is so high it is not possible for the person to do paath or keep rehat.i heard many ghost stories from my relatives.once i asked my bhua that why don't they take these people to gurudwara then she said it is not possible to take these people to gurudwara because the effect of evil spirit or black magic is so high on them.then what is the solution
    in such cases
    bhul chuk maaf
     
  20. Gyani Jarnail Singh

    Gyani Jarnail Singh Malaysia
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    For this type of afflictions contact the TARKSHEEL SOCIETY. They hold a record of curing each and every person who claims to have black magic toona and so far no one has collected their 2 LAKH rupee award for "not curable". They have branches in each town in Punjab. The Traksheels are ATHEISTS..that means they don't believe in any RELIGION..and Only in SCIENCE and FACTS. According to them there is NO SUCH THING as Ghosts,black magic toona jadoo etc...its all in the MIND....either MENTAL ILLNESS of the real kind...or "faked" kind of stress related illness bhoots etc.

    Their Website is : http://www.tarksheel.com and they have branches in Canada India etc. Just Google search for TARKSHEEL ( RATIONALIST)

    I am a Gyani and Gurbani teacher for the past 50 years, and GURBANI has been in my family for the past 8 generations..When the Patiala Maharajah Alla Singh became a Singh, my family also became Singhs..and I can Say with 100% Confidence that I CONCUR 100% with the TARKSHEELS..that This Black magic Satan stuff is for..those who believe and are conquered by it....This is called BHARRAM..Shaak. if anyone has Bharram that he "is sick", "sees ghosts" or "has cancer"... no body can cure him... these are called hypochondriacs by psychiatrists.

    Thats all... I can say for the moment.

    Jarnail Singh.
     
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  21. satnaam_waheguru

    satnaam_waheguru
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    Hello Friends my name is satnaam and am SIkhni. I am new here.
    Well you people are right somewhat like we should not believe in these things. As our Akaalpurakh save us from many such things daily. This hapened with me, i was in 5th or 6th when my cousin practiced Ouija board in other words its plan chette or in simpler words its a board we can contact with spirits. That was the worst night ever, i saw devilish lady and it is still in my mind. But to my luck she didnt possessed me although it was luking straight in my eyes tearing my spirit undefined experience! But it entered in my cousin's servant who came came in that room to tell us for dinner. Its gone now. in the Peepal tree where 2 pandit's were doing yagya. I am sikhni waheguru's daughter. Still i saw that. because i never believed in these things before and now am expert in theseicecreamkudi.
    An incident happened with sikh family only, they had only one child daughter who was 12 years old and had very long hair till thighs. One fine day she woke up and felt pain in her head. Told her mom to massage her head with oil. No relief. She saw a lady sitting at the edge of door she gave a brief look at her and asked her who are you she didnt replied just lokked that little girl. Her mom came and ask what happened she said this lady is sitting there. and POOF she disappeared. She didnt got it but ignored. Days passed and she experienced horrors of her life. She was not able to stand even from bed then one old lady told them to cut her hair from below by wetting the scissors with AMRIT. They did and hence she's cured. And guess what who did this black magic on her, her own BHua(aunty), and they were Sethi's.
    I know there is no place for such things in our religion but you know we have enemies who are not necessary to be sikhs they can be other people who do black magic. But we sikhs have best cure for this and its time to help others. My friend's sister is suffering from it. And i suggested my friend many things. But no relief. Its beacause some powers are beyond our imagination. I believe in every religion. Because waheguru said this. Our Guru nanak dev ji, when he retured after vanishing for 4 days and suddenly he appeared and his first words were "ALL MUSLIMS ARE MY BROTHERS ALL RELIGIONS ARE SAME". Am just following his words. Am not a good follower but i know whats right to know :happykudi:
    Guru Nanak Sah Fakir,
    Hindu Ka Guru,
    Musalman Ka Pir.


    What power has caste ?
    It is the righteousness that is tested.
    Whosoever tastes poison,
    Will die, no matter what his caste is.


    Neecha Andar Neech Jaat
    Neechi Hu At Neech
    Nanak Tin Kai Sang Saath
    Vadian Sio Kia Rees

    AM sorry if i said anything bad. Sorry if i wrote anything wrong.
    God bless you all;
    Waheguru ji da khalsa
    Waheguru ji di fateh.:khanda3:
     

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