Welcome to SPN

Register and Join the most happening forum of Sikh community & intellectuals from around the world.

Sign Up Now!

Sikhi after life

Discussion in 'Sikh Sikhi Sikhism' started by harmanpreet singh, Jul 31, 2013.

Tags:
  1. harmanpreet singh

    harmanpreet singh India
    Expand Collapse
    SPNer

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2008
    Messages:
    266
    Likes Received:
    410
    Sat sri akaal

    lets discuss "Sikhi Afterlife " in light of Gurbani,what you think ,kindly gave your views :geeksingh:

    sri waheguru ji ki fateh
     
    • Like Like x 1
  2. Loading...

    Similar Threads Forum Date
    Sikhi Meditation As A Way Of Life In Sikhism Sikh Sikhi Sikhism Jun 11, 2016
    Life Before Sikhi? Questions and Answers Mar 27, 2016
    Bacis concept of life according to all four major religion(Hinduism,Islam Sikhism and Christain) Questions and Answers May 17, 2015
    Sikhi? Does it Bring Kindness into Your Life? Inspirational Stories Feb 2, 2013
    Exploring the need for a Step-by-Step Manual on following Sikhi Way of Life... Questions and Answers Nov 2, 2012

  3. Harry Haller

    Harry Haller United Kingdom
    Expand Collapse

    Moderator

    Writer SPNer Contributor

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2011
    Messages:
    5,122
    Likes Received:
    7,948
    how can we discuss it when none of us have experienced it, and some of us do not even believe in it!

    call it what it is, death, the end, finito, time for wormfood.

    somewhere here there is an excellent article by Baldev Singh on how it is clear in SGGS that there is no afterlife, I will find it for you and post a link, but the subject has been debated many many times.

    What are your thoughts on the matter Harmanpreetji?
     
    • Like Like x 3
  4. Abneet

    Abneet
    Expand Collapse
    SPNer

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2013
    Messages:
    281
    Likes Received:
    311
    Well I'm going to type what I think in a small summary.

    After a sikh dies, its depends on the sikhs actions in his/her life where that person will be heading afterlife.

    "Those whose final thoughts are of the divine, merge eternally with the Lord of the Universe to dwell forever in the abode of radiant light."

    And those who haven't become one with Waheguru will be continuously reincarnated until they have become One.

    Also I'm pretty sure reincarnation is included in Bhagat Trilochan's shabad in the GGS.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  5. harmanpreet singh

    harmanpreet singh India
    Expand Collapse
    SPNer

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2008
    Messages:
    266
    Likes Received:
    410
    Thanks Harry ji for your reply ...

    so overall we three main views

    1)Dharmic ( birth -death cylcle until Oneness, nirvaana(Nirbaan pad),satisfaction,perfection ) .
    2)Abrahmic ( Heaven for some -Hell for others).
    3)Athiestic ?(The END ).


    harry ji i have read Dr Baldev Singh ji bit , m not fully satisfied with it , its will be great to discuss it here .


    *i just want a healthy discussion on topic not debate .
    blessings
     
    • Like Like x 3
    #4 harmanpreet singh, Jul 31, 2013
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2013
  6. Harry Haller

    Harry Haller United Kingdom
    Expand Collapse

    Moderator

    Writer SPNer Contributor

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2011
    Messages:
    5,122
    Likes Received:
    7,948

    you seem to have missed out Sikhi..........
     
  7. harmanpreet singh

    harmanpreet singh India
    Expand Collapse
    SPNer

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2008
    Messages:
    266
    Likes Received:
    410
    m here to learn :grinningsingh:
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. Harry Haller

    Harry Haller United Kingdom
    Expand Collapse

    Moderator

    Writer SPNer Contributor

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2011
    Messages:
    5,122
    Likes Received:
    7,948
    "Those whose final thoughts are of the divine, merge eternally with the Lord of the Universe to dwell forever in the abode of radiant light."

    so what happens to all those warrior Sikhs who died on the battlefield?hose whose final thoughts were 'must go for the crown jewels' before being hit by an arrow?

    Dig deeper, past lives is simply your past, future lives, your future and the 8.4 million births are the number of potential personalities at your disposal.

    There are many many quotes from the SGGS that confirm this, that confirm that we have only one life to find the connection, realise the connection and live through the connection. There is no second chance
     
    • Like Like x 2
  9. Harry Haller

    Harry Haller United Kingdom
    Expand Collapse

    Moderator

    Writer SPNer Contributor

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2011
    Messages:
    5,122
    Likes Received:
    7,948
    well, we are all here to learn, why do you not kick off with your current understanding? we can learn from each other
     
    • Like Like x 4
  10. harmanpreet singh

    harmanpreet singh India
    Expand Collapse
    SPNer

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2008
    Messages:
    266
    Likes Received:
    410
    thanks Abneet ji ,

    so "final thought " means , our thought at that moment will decide ? its like we get what we wish ?

    sat nam
     
  11. harmanpreet singh

    harmanpreet singh India
    Expand Collapse
    SPNer

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2008
    Messages:
    266
    Likes Received:
    410
    Hi harry ji ,

    my current understanding "Sikhi is Dharmic" .

    Un-satisfaction leads to Birth death cycle .
     
    #10 harmanpreet singh, Jul 31, 2013
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2013
  12. Harry Haller

    Harry Haller United Kingdom
    Expand Collapse

    Moderator

    Writer SPNer Contributor

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2011
    Messages:
    5,122
    Likes Received:
    7,948
    some questions.

    Is Dharmic even a Sikh word?

    why would the Gurus reject practically every aspect of Vedicism, but embrace reincarnation?

    How can life be so precious if you get to have 8.4 million?

    Even if what you are saying is correct, you, your being, the thing you call you, with your appetities and habits and way of doing things, your entire thinking and being will still be dead. You will still be dead as you know yourself, so reincarnation is just semantics, (not that..), in effect your death is your death, and even if after say 40 lives you get lucky, which if those 40 people gets to go to the lap of God? the first one? the one that liked fried chicken in life 4?

    Marvin Gaye wrote ' you are everything and everything is you', how do these 8.4 million different personalities represent you? are you now an 8.4 millionth of a person? is it like a lottery? can you get lucky? and if you have no recollection of your previous lives, what is the point anyway?
     
    • Like Like x 5
  13. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
    Expand Collapse
    1947-2014 (Archived)
    SPNer Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2004
    Messages:
    14,551
    Likes Received:
    19,200
    Sikhism is among the dharmic paths. Having said that dharma has a meaning all of its own. Its connection with re-incarnation depends on where one stands on re-incarnation, not on where one stands with respect to the meaning of dharma.

    We really do need an in-house expert on the philosophies of the subcontinent for the hundreds of years preceding Guru Nanak who knows what he/she is talking about. Someone who does not have an axe to grind. Someone who is not going to tell us Sikhi is an offshoot or a sect of Hinduism. Otherwise, we are getting ourselves twisted in our metaphysical knickers.

    harry ji - The idea of dharma is part of Guru Nanak's philosophy. The 84 lakh joon? I agree with you. You like the word "consonance." Dharma is another way of describing "consonance." Good topic for another thread.
     
    • Like Like x 7
  14. harmanpreet singh

    harmanpreet singh India
    Expand Collapse
    SPNer

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2008
    Messages:
    266
    Likes Received:
    410
    to me Dharma sounds very cool,sweet and it appeared numerous times in Gurbani .
    i know Guru Sahib Rejected All Vedic Karam- Kand and brahmanised Rituals ,Calculations .

    Guru Sahib refined impurities ,Gave us Pure /Truth in the form of Guru Granth Sahib ji . it no way means Guru Sahib rejected everything that appeared in Vedas .



    Only in human life one can attain Understanding and end duality .
     
    • Like Like x 1
    #13 harmanpreet singh, Jul 31, 2013
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2013
  15. harmanpreet singh

    harmanpreet singh India
    Expand Collapse
    SPNer

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2008
    Messages:
    266
    Likes Received:
    410
    it says all, perfectly expressed Admin ji .
     
    #14 harmanpreet singh, Jul 31, 2013
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2013
  16. harmanpreet singh

    harmanpreet singh India
    Expand Collapse
    SPNer

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2008
    Messages:
    266
    Likes Received:
    410
    harryji , just found a related Shabad from Guru Granth Sahib ji

    <table cellspacing="5"><tbody><tr></tr><tr><td> ਪਉੜੀ
    Pauri.
    </td></tr> <tr><td> ਫਫਾ ਫਿਰਤ ਫਿਰਤ ਤੂ ਆਇਆ
    Ph: Thou hast come after long wanderings.
    </td></tr> <tr><td> ਦ੍ਰੁਲਭ ਦੇਹ ਕਲਿਜੁਗ ਮਹਿ ਪਾਇਆ
    In this Dark age thou hast obtained the scarcely procurable human body.
    </td></tr> <tr><td> ਫਿਰਿ ਇਆ ਅਉਸਰੁ ਚਰੈ ਹਾਥਾ
    This opportunity shall not again come to thy hand.
    </td></tr> <tr><td> ਨਾਮੁ ਜਪਹੁ ਤਉ ਕਟੀਅਹਿ ਫਾਸਾ
    Repeat Lord's Name then shall the death's noose be cut away.
    </td></tr> <tr><td> ਫਿਰਿ ਫਿਰਿ ਆਵਨ ਜਾਨੁ ਹੋਈ
    Thou shalt not come and go again and again,
    </td></tr> <tr><td> ਏਕਹਿ ਏਕ ਜਪਹੁ ਜਪੁ ਸੋਈ
    by meditating on that One and One alone.
    </td></tr> <tr><td> ਕਰਹੁ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾ ਪ੍ਰਭ ਕਰਨੈਹਾਰੇ
    Have mercy, O Lord the Creator,
    </td></tr> <tr><td> ਮੇਲਿ ਲੇਹੁ ਨਾਨਕ ਬੇਚਾਰੇ ॥੩੮॥
    and blend poor Nanak with Thee.
    </td></tr> <tr></tr></tbody></table>
     
    • Like Like x 3
    #15 harmanpreet singh, Jul 31, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 5, 2016
  17. Ishna

    Ishna
    Expand Collapse
    On hiatus
    Writer SPNer Contributor

    Joined:
    May 9, 2006
    Messages:
    2,942
    Likes Received:
    5,002
    Which ang is that paurhi from, bhaji? We need to include the ang number when we post Gurbani here. :)

    I read the paurhi before reading the quote of Harry ji at the beginning of your post. When I read the paurhi, i read it as reaffirming this one precious life, and I didn't read it at all with reference to any other lives.
     
    • Like Like x 5
  18. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
    Expand Collapse
    1947-2014 (Archived)
    SPNer Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2004
    Messages:
    14,551
    Likes Received:
    19,200
    I am not sure why this thread is here separate from other threads related to re-incarnation.

    Yes it is a stupid way to have a debate. Very similar to throwing up a passage from the Bible to prove a point coming from Christianity. And I think insulting in its own way to Shabad Guru. The shabad requires a personal and serious attempt at vichaar/explanation so we know how it represents the posters point of view.

    I am actually going to go back and delete, now that I can see what is happening here.

    Thanks for your flagging this issue harry ji.

    harmanpreet singh ji Please give your aarth of the shabad so we can have a discussion about it.

    The one who posts the shabad gives the explanation, does not ask someone else to explain it for him/her as part of a debate, does not post smileys of tea-drinking mundas and nishan-waving kudis in that regard.
     
    • Like Like x 4
    #17 spnadmin, Jul 31, 2013
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2013
  19. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
    Expand Collapse
    1947-2014 (Archived)
    SPNer Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2004
    Messages:
    14,551
    Likes Received:
    19,200
    Back again to harry ji

    Yes this subject has been discussed on many other threads. If we do not get something that is new and contribute to our learning beyond that of other threads I will need to take this one down. Let's make an effort. Thanks.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  20. harmanpreet singh

    harmanpreet singh India
    Expand Collapse
    SPNer

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2008
    Messages:
    266
    Likes Received:
    410
    Shabad clearly says ,
    ie after wandering through so many lower lifeforms one obtained this precious human body .

    without naam one will follow same path of coming and going ie ( birth and death ) again .



    so how is this shabad anti reincar ?
     
    • Like Like x 2
  21. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
    Expand Collapse
    1947-2014 (Archived)
    SPNer Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2004
    Messages:
    14,551
    Likes Received:
    19,200
    harmanpreet singh ji

    You get one more chance and then the thread will be deleted. Repeating a translation is not an vichaar of the shabad. So nothing is clearly stated. If anything I am seeing contradictions.
     
    • Like Like x 2
    #20 spnadmin, Jul 31, 2013
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2013

Share This Page