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Controversial Significance of Kesh (Kaes)

Discussion in 'Hard Talk' started by eropa234, May 8, 2010.

  1. eropa234

    eropa234
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    Many times I get into discussions regarding Kayse and Turban. So far I have not received any convincing argument. Gurbani States: Preet ik siun kiya aan duvidah Jaye, Bhanven Laambe Kayse kar Bhaven Dharar Munday. Keeping this statement in mind what is your opinion.

    Mind you there is no other source of true knowledge than that of Sri Guru Granth Sahib. At lest this is my opinion.

    Its a couplet by Kabir I have to look up Ang.
     
    #1 eropa234, May 8, 2010
    Last edited: May 8, 2010
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  3. spnadmin

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    eropa ji

    Would you please give us the Ang for this tuk, and the full shabad.

    I do not find any tuk in SGGS that begins with preet ik siun kiya. However your transliteration may be leading me off track. We need the Gurmukhi.

    Once we have that we can better discuss the meaning as per Gurmat. Thank you.
     
  4. eropa234

    eropa234
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    ਕਬੀਰ ਪ੍ਰੀਤਿ ਇਕ ਸਿਉ ਕੀਏ ਆਨ ਦੁਬਿਧਾ ਜਾਇ ॥
    ਭਾਵੈ ਲਾਂਬੇ ਕੇਸ ਕਰੁ ਭਾਵੈ ਘਰਰਿ ਮੁਡਾਇ ॥੨੫॥
    Page 1365 line 15 16
     
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    #3 eropa234, May 8, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 5, 2016
  5. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
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    Thank you eropa ji

    Here is Ang 1365

    <table align="center" border="0" cellpadding="5" cellspacing="0" width="98%"><tbody><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="ggs">ਲੈ ਫਾਹੇ ਉਠਿ ਧਾਵਤੇ ਸਿ ਜਾਨਿ ਮਾਰੇ ਭਗਵੰਤ ॥੧੦॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="subhead">lai faahae outh dhhaavathae s jaan maarae bhagavanth ||10||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="shlok">They take the noose and run around; but rest assured that God shall destroy them. ||10||
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">


    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="ggs">ਕਬੀਰ ਚੰਦਨ ਕਾ ਬਿਰਵਾ ਭਲਾ ਬੇੜ੍ਹ੍ਹਿਓ ਢਾਕ ਪਲਾਸ ॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="subhead">kabeer chandhan kaa biravaa bhalaa baerrihou dtaak palaas ||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="shlok">Kabeer, the sandalwood tree is good, even though it is surrounded by weeds.
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">

    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="ggs">ਓਇ ਭੀ ਚੰਦਨੁ ਹੋਇ ਰਹੇ ਬਸੇ ਜੁ ਚੰਦਨ ਪਾਸਿ ॥੧੧॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="subhead">oue bhee chandhan hoe rehae basae j chandhan paas ||11||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="shlok">Those who dwell near the sandalwood tree, become just like the sandalwood tree. ||11||
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">

    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="ggs">ਕਬੀਰ ਬਾਂਸੁ ਬਡਾਈ ਬੂਡਿਆ ਇਉ ਮਤ ਡੂਬਹੁ ਕੋਇ ॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="subhead">kabeer baans baddaaee booddiaa eio math ddoobahu koe ||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="shlok">Kabeer, the bamboo is drowned in its egotistical pride. No one should drown like this.
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">


    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="ggs">ਚੰਦਨ ਕੈ ਨਿਕਟੇ ਬਸੈ ਬਾਂਸੁ ਸੁਗੰਧੁ ਨ ਹੋਇ ॥੧੨॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="subhead">chandhan kai nikattae basai baans sugandhh n hoe ||12||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="shlok">Bamboo also dwells near the sandalwood tree, but it does not take up its fragrance. ||12||
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">

    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="ggs">ਕਬੀਰ ਦੀਨੁ ਗਵਾਇਆ ਦੁਨੀ ਸਿਉ ਦੁਨੀ ਨ ਚਾਲੀ ਸਾਥਿ ॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="subhead">kabeer dheen gavaaeiaa dhunee sio dhunee n chaalee saathh ||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="shlok">Kabeer, the mortal loses his faith, for the sake of the world, but the world shall not go along with him in the end.
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">

    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="ggs">ਪਾਇ ਕੁਹਾੜਾ ਮਾਰਿਆ ਗਾਫਲਿ ਅਪੁਨੈ ਹਾਥਿ ॥੧੩॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="subhead">paae kuhaarraa maariaa gaafal apunai haathh ||13||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="shlok">The idiot strikes his own foot with the axe by his own hand. ||13||
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">

    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="ggs">ਕਬੀਰ ਜਹ ਜਹ ਹਉ ਫਿਰਿਓ ਕਉਤਕ ਠਾਓ ਠਾਇ ॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="subhead">kabeer jeh jeh ho firiou kouthak thaaou thaae ||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="shlok">Kabeer, wherever I go, I see wonders everywhere.
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">


    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="ggs">ਇਕ ਰਾਮ ਸਨੇਹੀ ਬਾਹਰਾ ਊਜਰੁ ਮੇਰੈ ਭਾਂਇ ॥੧੪॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="subhead">eik raam sanaehee baaharaa oojar maerai bhaane ||14||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="shlok">But without the devotees of the One Lord, it is all wilderness to me. ||14||
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">

    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="ggs">ਕਬੀਰ ਸੰਤਨ ਕੀ ਝੁੰਗੀਆ ਭਲੀ ਭਠਿ ਕੁਸਤੀ ਗਾਉ ॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="subhead">kabeer santhan kee jhungeeaa bhalee bhath kusathee gaao ||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="shlok">Kabeer, the dwelling of the Saints is good; the dwelling of the unrighteous burns like an oven.
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">

    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="ggs">ਆਗਿ ਲਗਉ ਤਿਹ ਧਉਲਹਰ ਜਿਹ ਨਾਹੀ ਹਰਿ ਕੋ ਨਾਉ ॥੧੫॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="subhead">aag lago thih dhhoulehar jih naahee har ko naao ||15||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="shlok">Those mansions in which the Lord's Name is not chanted might just as well burn down. ||15||
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">

    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="ggs">ਕਬੀਰ ਸੰਤ ਮੂਏ ਕਿਆ ਰੋਈਐ ਜੋ ਅਪੁਨੇ ਗ੍ਰਿਹਿ ਜਾਇ ॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="subhead">kabeer santh mooeae kiaa roeeai jo apunae grihi jaae ||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="shlok">Kabeer, why cry at the death of a Saint? He is just going back to his home.
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">

    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="ggs">ਰੋਵਹੁ ਸਾਕਤ ਬਾਪੁਰੇ ਜੁ ਹਾਟੈ ਹਾਟ ਬਿਕਾਇ ॥੧੬॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="subhead">rovahu saakath baapurae j haattai haatt bikaae ||16||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="shlok">Cry for the wretched, faithless cynic, who is sold from store to store. ||16||
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">

    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="ggs">ਕਬੀਰ ਸਾਕਤੁ ਐਸਾ ਹੈ ਜੈਸੀ ਲਸਨ ਕੀ ਖਾਨਿ ॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="subhead">kabeer saakath aisaa hai jaisee lasan kee khaan ||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="shlok">Kabeer, the faithless cynic is like a piece of garlic.
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">

    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="ggs">ਕੋਨੇ ਬੈਠੇ ਖਾਈਐ ਪਰਗਟ ਹੋਇ ਨਿਦਾਨਿ ॥੧੭॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="subhead">konae baithae khaaeeai paragatt hoe nidhaan ||17||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="shlok">Even if you eat it sitting in a corner, it becomes obvious to everyone. ||17||
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">

    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="ggs">ਕਬੀਰ ਮਾਇਆ ਡੋਲਨੀ ਪਵਨੁ ਝਕੋਲਨਹਾਰੁ ॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="subhead">kabeer maaeiaa ddolanee pavan jhakolanehaar ||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="shlok">Kabeer, Maya is the butter-churn, and the breath is the churning-stick.
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">

    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="ggs">ਸੰਤਹੁ ਮਾਖਨੁ ਖਾਇਆ ਛਾਛਿ ਪੀਐ ਸੰਸਾਰੁ ॥੧੮॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="subhead">santhahu maakhan khaaeiaa shhaashh peeai sansaar ||18||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="shlok">The Saints eat the butter, while the world drinks the whey. ||18||
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">

    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="ggs">ਕਬੀਰ ਮਾਇਆ ਡੋਲਨੀ ਪਵਨੁ ਵਹੈ ਹਿਵ ਧਾਰ ॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="subhead">kabeer maaeiaa ddolanee pavan vehai hiv dhhaar ||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="shlok">Kabeer, Maya is the butter-churn; the breath flows like ice water.
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">

    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="ggs">ਜਿਨਿ ਬਿਲੋਇਆ ਤਿਨਿ ਖਾਇਆ ਅਵਰ ਬਿਲੋਵਨਹਾਰ ॥੧੯॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="subhead">jin biloeiaa thin khaaeiaa avar bilovanehaar ||19||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="shlok">Whoever does the churning eats the butter; the others are just churning-sticks. ||19||
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">


    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="ggs">ਕਬੀਰ ਮਾਇਆ ਚੋਰਟੀ ਮੁਸਿ ਮੁਸਿ ਲਾਵੈ ਹਾਟਿ ॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="subhead">kabeer maaeiaa chorattee mus mus laavai haatt ||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="shlok">Kabeer, Maya is the thief, which breaks in and plunders the store.
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">


    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="ggs">ਏਕੁ ਕਬੀਰਾ ਨਾ ਮੁਸੈ ਜਿਨਿ ਕੀਨੀ ਬਾਰਹ ਬਾਟ ॥੨੦॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="subhead">eaek kabeeraa naa musai jin keenee baareh baatt ||20||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="shlok">Only Kabeer is not plundered; he has cut her into twelve pieces. ||20||
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">


    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="ggs">ਕਬੀਰ ਸੂਖੁ ਨ ਏਂਹ ਜੁਗਿ ਕਰਹਿ ਜੁ ਬਹੁਤੈ ਮੀਤ ॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="subhead">kabeer sookh n eaeneh jug karehi j bahuthai meeth ||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="shlok">Kabeer, peace does not come in this world by making lots of friends.
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">


    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="ggs">ਜੋ ਚਿਤੁ ਰਾਖਹਿ ਏਕ ਸਿਉ ਤੇ ਸੁਖੁ ਪਾਵਹਿ ਨੀਤ ॥੨੧॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="subhead">jo chith raakhehi eaek sio thae sukh paavehi neeth ||21||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="shlok">Those who keep their consciousness focused on the One Lord shall find eternal peace. ||21||
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">


    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="ggs">ਕਬੀਰ ਜਿਸੁ ਮਰਨੇ ਤੇ ਜਗੁ ਡਰੈ ਮੇਰੇ ਮਨਿ ਆਨੰਦੁ ॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="subhead">kabeer jis maranae thae jag ddarai maerae man aanandh ||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="shlok">Kabeer, the world is afraid of death - that death fills my mind with bliss.
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">


    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="ggs">ਮਰਨੇ ਹੀ ਤੇ ਪਾਈਐ ਪੂਰਨੁ ਪਰਮਾਨੰਦੁ ॥੨੨॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="subhead">maranae hee thae paaeeai pooran paramaanandh ||22||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="shlok">It is only by death that perfect, supreme bliss is obtained. ||22||
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">


    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="ggs">ਰਾਮ ਪਦਾਰਥੁ ਪਾਇ ਕੈ ਕਬੀਰਾ ਗਾਂਠਿ ਨ ਖੋਲ੍ਹ੍ਹ ॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="subhead">raam padhaarathh paae kai kabeeraa gaanth n kholh ||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="shlok">The Treasure of the Lord is obtained, O Kabeer, but do not undo its knot.
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">


    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="ggs">ਨਹੀ ਪਟਣੁ ਨਹੀ ਪਾਰਖੂ ਨਹੀ ਗਾਹਕੁ ਨਹੀ ਮੋਲੁ ॥੨੩॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="subhead">nehee pattan nehee paarakhoo nehee gaahak nehee mol ||23||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="shlok">There is no market to sell it, no appraiser, no customer, and no price. ||23||
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">


    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="ggs">ਕਬੀਰ ਤਾ ਸਿਉ ਪ੍ਰੀਤਿ ਕਰਿ ਜਾ ਕੋ ਠਾਕੁਰੁ ਰਾਮੁ ॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="subhead">kabeer thaa sio preeth kar jaa ko thaakur raam ||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="shlok">Kabeer, be in love with only that one, whose Master is the Lord.
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">


    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="ggs">ਪੰਡਿਤ ਰਾਜੇ ਭੂਪਤੀ ਆਵਹਿ ਕਉਨੇ ਕਾਮ ॥੨੪॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="subhead">panddith raajae bhoopathee aavehi kounae kaam ||24||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="shlok">The Pandits, the religious scholars, kings and landlords - what good is love for them? ||24||
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">


    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="ggs">ਕਬੀਰ ਪ੍ਰੀਤਿ ਇਕ ਸਿਉ ਕੀਏ ਆਨ ਦੁਬਿਧਾ ਜਾਇ ॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="subhead">kabeer preeth eik sio keeeae aan dhubidhhaa jaae ||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="shlok">Kabeer, when you are in love with the One Lord, duality and alienation depart.
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">


    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="ggs">ਭਾਵੈ ਲਾਂਬੇ ਕੇਸ ਕਰੁ ਭਾਵੈ ਘਰਰਿ ਮੁਡਾਇ ॥੨੫॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="subhead">bhaavai laanbae kaes kar bhaavai gharar muddaae ||25||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="shlok">You may have long hair, or you may shave your head bald. ||25||
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">


    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="ggs">ਕਬੀਰ ਜਗੁ ਕਾਜਲ ਕੀ ਕੋਠਰੀ ਅੰਧ ਪਰੇ ਤਿਸ ਮਾਹਿ ॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="subhead">kabeer jag kaajal kee kotharee andhh parae this maahi ||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="shlok">Kabeer, the world is a room filled with black soot; the blind fall into its trap.
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">


    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="ggs">ਹਉ ਬਲਿਹਾਰੀ ਤਿਨ ਕਉ ਪੈਸਿ ਜੁ ਨੀਕਸਿ ਜਾਹਿ ॥੨੬॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="subhead">ho balihaaree thin ko pais j neekas jaahi ||26||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="shlok">I am a sacrifice to those who are thrown in, and still escape. ||26||
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">


    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="ggs">ਕਬੀਰ ਇਹੁ ਤਨੁ ਜਾਇਗਾ ਸਕਹੁ ਤ ਲੇਹੁ ਬਹੋਰਿ ॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="subhead">kabeer eihu than jaaeigaa sakahu th laehu behor ||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="shlok">Kabeer, this body shall perish; save it, if you can.
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">

    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="ggs">ਨਾਂਗੇ ਪਾਵਹੁ ਤੇ ਗਏ ਜਿਨ ਕੇ ਲਾਖ ਕਰੋਰਿ ॥੨੭॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="subhead">naangae paavahu thae geae jin kae laakh karor ||27||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="shlok">Even those who have tens of thousands and millions, must depart bare-footed in the end. ||27||
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">


    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="ggs">ਕਬੀਰ ਇਹੁ ਤਨੁ ਜਾਇਗਾ ਕਵਨੈ ਮਾਰਗਿ ਲਾਇ ॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="subhead">kabeer eihu than jaaeigaa kavanai maarag laae ||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="shlok">Kabeer, this body shall perish; place it on the path.
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">

    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="ggs">ਕੈ ਸੰਗਤਿ ਕਰਿ ਸਾਧ ਕੀ ਕੈ ਹਰਿ ਕੇ ਗੁਨ ਗਾਇ ॥੨੮॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="subhead">kai sangath kar saadhh kee kai har kae gun gaae ||28||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffecec"><td class="shlok">Either join the Saadh Sangat, the Company of the Holy, or sing the Glorious Praises of the Lord. ||28||
    </td></tr><tr><td class="rmenuheader">

    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="ggs">ਕਬੀਰ ਮਰਤਾ ਮਰਤਾ ਜਗੁ ਮੂਆ ਮਰਿ ਭੀ ਨ ਜਾਨਿਆ ਕੋਇ ॥
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="subhead">kabeer marathaa marathaa jag mooaa mar bhee n jaaniaa koe ||
    </td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffec"><td class="shlok">Kabeer, dying, dying, the whole world has to die, and yet, none know how to die.

    </td></tr></tbody></table>
    ----------------

    Now we have it, but the line starts a different way, and the transliteration is quite different throughout.

    ਕਬੀਰ ਪ੍ਰੀਤਿ ਇਕ ਸਿਉ ਕੀਏ ਆਨ ਦੁਬਿਧਾ ਜਾਇ ॥
    kabeer preeth eik sio keeeae aan dhubidhhaa jaae ||
    Kabeer, when you are in love with the One Lord, duality and alienation depart.


    ਭਾਵੈ ਲਾਂਬੇ ਕੇਸ ਕਰੁ ਭਾਵੈ ਘਰਰਿ ਮੁਡਾਇ ॥੨੫॥
    bhaavai laanbae kaes kar bhaavai gharar muddaae ||25||
    You may have long hair, or you may shave your head bald.


    in the future please post the shabad as it is your responsibility under TOS. Not to leave it to forum admins to do this for you.
     
  6. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
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    I have also changed the thread title from Significance of Kaysse to Significance of Kesh (Kaesh). Thankx. :happykaur:
     
  7. Hardip Singh

    Hardip Singh India
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    But the question raised remains unanswered. If we go thro the meaning given than Keasas are not important in the way to meet the Almighty. Someone pl elbrote this for us .
    :confusedkudi:Thanks.
     
  8. japjisahib04

    japjisahib04 Kuwait
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    Kabeer through these line is ridiculing the prevalent practice of matted (unhygeinic hair) and complete rodo modo a means followed during his period by Jattadhari yogies, Jains for assimilating with God. It is not related with natural growth of beard and hair on head but converting them into filthy state. We will not find a single bhagat or devote (like bhats) who were either rodo modo or jattadhari yogi whose baani is incorporated in SGGS.Those who argue that 5K is a means of assimalting with God, this pankti can apply to them. Five K is the identification code allocated by Guru Gobind Singh Ji for protector of truth. It is not a passport for merger. Yes 5K give us boost and or energy to live in honor and protect ourselves ready made in case we are trapped in a situation like 1984 and many other situation where I have witneess innocent were lynched.
    Best regards
     
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    #7 japjisahib04, May 8, 2010
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  9. eropa234

    eropa234
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    I take this shabad as its the word of SGGS which does not ridicule anyone rather compels me to question false practices that may be part my beliefs that does not stand up to any rationale with reasons. If SGGS is ridiculing "unhygienic" hair than its also ridiculing "non hygienic "completely shaved hair as well in the same shabad.

    Does "truth" requires any protection? Do the five Ks represent those who comprehend and submit to truth and practice it in their daily lives without any regard for profit or loss, pleasure or pain, praise or insult, or merely protect the truth without knowing and understanding it?

    Yes 5K give us boost and or energy to protect ourselves ready made in case we are trapped in a situation like 1984 and many other situation where I have witneess innocent were lynched.
    Best regards[/quote]

    Is it the power of "Gyan" that guides us through turbulence, just like a "Kamal" which remains above water weather the water is clear or murky, or the 5ks? Could "Gyan" be achieved without 5ks or a person can be a Gyani without 5ks? Does 5ks require any pursuit like "Gyan" does?
     
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  10. japjisahib04

    japjisahib04 Kuwait
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    Sir, the SGGS is ridiculing the practice of converting God gifted beautiful hair into stink and also removing and throwing His Gift in the dust bin as a means of merger with Him. Jain way of removing hair by hand is also stink. Gurbani tells us ik jaini ujad paey dhuru khavaeya SGGS 1285.7

    Does "truth" requires any protection? Do the five Ks represent those who comprehend and submit to truth and practice it in their daily lives without any regard for profit or loss, pleasure or pain, praise or insult, or merely protect the truth without knowing and understanding it?
    [/quote] Yes treasure of baani requires protection. Flying of Nishan Sahib at a place signifies presence of Guru Granth Sahib. It stays up all the time as opposed to flag of a nation or state which comes down at the sunset. The Nishan Sahib is never flown at half mast either. The devotees or lover of truth make a parikarma of the Nishan Sahib alongwith the Guru Granth Sahib as a mark of reverence - a committment towards acceptance of TRUTH and protection of our 'peu dadeh da khaazana' treasure of baani. This further establishes in order to live with honor and protect treasure of baani where there is bhakti there must be shakti too. When Guru Arjan Dev was in captivity and under the cruelest torture, the only solution revealed to him was to metaphorephose the community into a determined and dedicated force. His last message to his son Hargobind was to 'sit fully armed on the throne and maintain an army to the best of his ability.' In the succesion ceremony, Guru Hargobind was adored with two swords. Then Guru declared that two swords signified Miri and Piri, Shakti and Bhakti, Teg and Deg. One symbolized temporal power, the other spiritual power, one to smite the oppressor, the other to protect the innocent. Thus in Guru Ghar the mundate and spiritual power stood mingled. Thus if you are not safe how could you maiantain your dignity and or achieve gian.

    Is it the power of "Gyan" that guides us through turbulence, just like a "Kamal" which remains above water weather the water is clear or murky, or the 5ks? Could "Gyan" be achieved without 5ks or a person can be a Gyani without 5ks? Does 5ks require any pursuit like "Gyan" does? [/QUOTE]
    answer issame as above.
     
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    #9 japjisahib04, May 8, 2010
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  11. Gyani Jarnail Singh

    Gyani Jarnail Singh Malaysia
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    Why did Guru Gobind Singh Ji name the Place where Vasakhi 1699 brought us the Gift of the 5 Kakaars..KESH-GARRH. Kesh is the Hair and GARRH means FORT.
    This FORT of the 5 kakaars is necessary to fight....a "Fort" also means that there is a disciplined (Rehitwaan) army of Saint Soldiers inside...SGGS teaches us how to FIGHT the Five that live and thrive inside us...kaam krodh lobh moh and hankaar. Gurbani declares that in order to store "water" its necessary to have a KUMBH..a vessel..without WATER..of what use is a KUMBH ?? Gurbani also states conditions necessary for receiving Amrit (Grace of Creator) and to do that we have to have a CLEAN VESSEL..

    2. Factual existence of the KeshGarh Takhat is testimony to the vital importance of hair as originally bestowed on us by the Creator...without HAIR..even the other FOUR Kakaars are absolutley USELESS. There is no Kirpan Garh, karra garh or kangha garh !! ONLY Kesh garrh.

    3. The 5 Kakars are a MEANS TO AN END...a rehit followed in order to ADVANCE along a certian path...The "rituals" that Kabir Ji and also GURU Nanak ji described in the SGGS were the "END"..the practiotioners asserted that Having Matted Hair is guarantee of whatever they wanted..others PULLED OUT ALL HAIR BY THE ROOTS and RUBBED ASHES...others walked NAKED all their life, rubbing ashes and not washing at all, others had the even more disgusting ritual of...passing motion and then covering it with a cloth that coverd their face over the WASTE MATTER, stirred with a stick and INHALING the ODOURS ( THAT was meant to reach the CREATOR !!) Yogis pierced their ears and left home...sidhs fasted and did penace in the himalyas and forests, ate roots to achieve this assimilation with the Creator...ALL THESE were preached as THE END...guarantee of meeting the creator...

    4. The 5 kakaars DONT GUARANTEE ANYTHING !! Juts having the 5 kaaars is no gaurantee of anything.....thats the difference. The kaars are a PATH...and in order to be on a JOURNEY...essential matter to have on hand...if a person doesnt want to WALK the Path but rely on the 5 kaakars to send him there..he/she is fooling only him/herself. Many do make this HUGE MISTAKE..and treat others as LESSER than them !! HOLIER than THOU attitude... another fools paradise...The 5 kakars are just the BEGINNING..a firts step..and the long Journey comes AFTER....
     
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