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Pauri 16 Paudi-16-Jap Ji Sahib Interpretation

Discussion in 'Jap Ji Sahib' started by Sikh80, Mar 17, 2008.

  1. Sikh80

    Sikh80
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    jdhu Awpy Qwtu kIAw bih krqY qdhu puiC n syvku bIAw ] (551-6, ibhwgVw, mÚ 4)

    When the Creator, sitting all by Himself, created the Universe, he did not consult with any of His servants;

    qdhu ikAw ko lyvY ikAw ko dyvY jW Avru n dUjw kIAw ] (551-7, ibhwgVw, mÚ 4)
    so what can anyone take, and what can anyone give, when He did not create any other like Himself?

    iPir Awpy jgqu aupwieAw krqY dwnu sBnw kau dIAw ]
    (551-8, ibhwgVw, mÚ 4)
    Then, after fashioning the world, the Creator blessed all with His blessings.

    Awpy syv bxweIAnu gurmuiK Awpy AMimRqu pIAw ]
    (551-8, ibhwgVw, mÚ 4)

    He Himself instructs us in His service, and as Gurmukh, we drink in His Ambrosial Nectar.

    Awip inrMkwr Awkwru hY Awpy Awpy krY su QIAw ]7]
    (551-9, ibhwgVw, mÚ 4)
    He Himself is formless, and He Himself is formed; whatever He Himself does, comes to pass. ||7||


    The above is quoted for the purpose of further exploring nature of God and HIS attributes. I could not place this text in the main post as above as I could not edit it, May be due to slow speed of the internet etc.
     
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  3. Sikh80

    Sikh80
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    I have taken the first line of the above that states that God created the world without the assistance of the Servant. The translation appears to be correct in the literal sense. However, it has a serious flaw as the Creator did not have any Sewaks to help HIM out. From the wording of the lines it appears that HE had some sewaks but HE preferred to create the creration HIMSELF.

    In essence it should have meant that HE had no one to assist HIM as no one would be in a position to be Of HIS stature and no one is capable of being so. HE has no limitless and how could anyone become so high as to be of any assistance to HIM. It is just not feasible.

    The following summarize some of the Attributes of the Lord.

    jw krqw isrTI kau swjy Awpy jwxY soeI ] (4-19, jpu, mÚ 1)

    The Creator who created this creation-only He Himself knows.

    ikv kir AwKw ikv swlwhI ikau vrnI ikv jwxw ] (4-19, jpu, mÚ 1)
    How can we speak of Him? How can we praise Him? How can we describe Him? How can we know Him?



    AMqu n jwpY kIqw Awkwru ] (5-8, jpu, mÚ 1)
    The limits of the created universe cannot be perceived.

    AMqu n jwpY pwrwvwru ] (5-8, jpu, mÚ 1)
    Its limits here and beyond cannot be perceived.



    [Bani is God; One who partakes of it becomes immortal]

    Bhul Chuk Mauf
     
  4. Sikh80

    Sikh80
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    Paudi-16- As per Maskeen Ji Commentary


    ਪੰਚ ਪਰਵਾਣ ਪੰਚ ਪਰਧਾਨੁ
    ਪੰਚੇ ਪਾਵਹਿ ਦਰਗਹਿ ਮਾਨੁ
    ਪੰਚੇ ਸੋਹਹਿ ਦਰਿ ਰਾਜਾਨੁ
    ਪੰਚਾ ਕਾ ਗੁਰੁ ਏਕੁ ਧਿਆਨੁ
    ਜੇ ਕੋ ਕਹੈ ਕਰੈ ਵੀਚਾਰੁ
    ਕਰਤੇ ਕੈ ਕਰਣੈ ਨਾਹੀ ਸੁਮਾਰੁ
    ਧੌਲੁ ਧਰਮੁ ਦਇਆ ਕਾ ਪੂਤੁ
    ਸੰਤੋਖੁ ਥਾਪਿ ਰਖਿਆ ਜਿਨਿ ਸੂਤਿ
    ਜੇ ਕੋ ਬੁਝੈ ਹੋਵੈ ਸਚਿਆਰੁ
    ਧਵਲੈ ਉਪਰਿ ਕੇਤਾ ਭਾਰੁ
    ਧਰਤੀ ਹੋਰੁ ਪਰੈ ਹੋਰੁ ਹੋਰੁ
    ਤਿਸ ਤੇ ਭਾਰੁ ਤਲੈ ਕਵਣੁ ਜੋਰੁ
    ਜੀਅ ਜਾਤਿ ਰੰਗਾ ਕੇ ਨਾਵ
    ਸਭਨਾ ਲਿਖਿਆ ਵੁੜੀ ਕਲਾਮ
    ਏਹੁ ਲੇਖਾ ਲਿਖਿ ਜਾਣੈ ਕੋਇ
    ਲੇਖਾ ਲਿਖਿਆ ਕੇਤਾ ਹੋਇ
    ਕੇਤਾ ਤਾਣੁ ਸੁਆਲਿਹੁ ਰੂਪੁ
    ਕੇਤੀ ਦਾਤਿ ਜਾਣੈ ਕੌਣੁ ਕੂਤੁ
    ਕੀਤਾ ਪਸਾਉ ਏਕੋ ਕਵਾਉ
    ਤਿਸ ਤੇ ਹੋਏ ਲਖ ਦਰੀਆਉ
    ਕੁਦਰਤਿ ਕਵਣ ਕਹਾ ਵੀਚਾਰੁ
    ਵਾਰਿਆ ਜਾਵਾ ਏਕ ਵਾਰ
    ਜੋ ਤੁਧੁ ਭਾਵੈ ਸਾਈ ਭਲੀ ਕਾਰ
    ਤੂ ਸਦਾ ਸਲਾਮਤਿ ਨਿਰੰਕਾਰ ॥੧੬॥


    I have listened to the explanation of Paudi-16 as given by Maskeen ji as given at the following site.

    Kuwait Recordings 2001 - Maskeen Sahib

    [File 1999-1A-1999-1B of Maskeen ji –Two files.


    The discussions/explanations are very lengthy and very useful. One may kindly listen to the entire ‘Katha’. I could listen two the above 2 files and could make notes of those that were very relevant. One may kindly visit the site and listen to the explanation of Maskeen ji. I am giving below the extracts of the following six lines only. I have added a few lines so that it can become a good reference material.



    Besides, I have also added Headings and the Sub-heads.Interpreters usually endeavor to hit upon something novel. But truth is, of course, truth. It is neither ever new, nor does it ever grow old. The following is, however, not verbatim or literal transcription. It is a condensed version only i.e.about 90 minutes of commentary.]


    ਪੰਚ ਪਰਵਾਣ ਪੰਚ ਪਰਧਾਨੁ
    ਪੰਚੇ ਪਾਵਹਿ ਦਰਗਹਿ ਮਾਨੁ
    ਪੰਚੇ ਸੋਹਹਿ ਦਰਿ ਰਾਜਾਨੁ
    ਪੰਚਾ ਕਾ ਗੁਰੁ ਏਕੁ ਧਿਆਨੁ
    ਜੇ ਕੋ ਕਹੈ ਕਰੈ ਵੀਚਾਰੁ
    ਕਰਤੇ ਕੈ ਕਰਣੈ ਨਾਹੀ ਸੁਮਾਰੁ

    Introduction



    Need Of spiritual knowledge


    It is through knowledge of the ‘end[1]’ that we remember the endless. It is for the knowledge of the ‘Kaal’ that we get an urge to understand the ‘Akaal[2]’. It is through the knowledge of our ignorance that we proceed ahead to get the knowledge that is the fountain source of all the knowledge; the ultimately reality, the truth.

    Seers and the knowledge


    It is not the nature of the worldly affairs that one should get engrossed and get lost in it. It is the sheer carelessness that one has forgotten the righteous path that has been so felicitously paved and widened by the seers and sages.

    Seers: The interpreters of Experience of Realizing the God


    One cannot explain the creation the how can one express the creator. No one is capable of describing of the same. The seers and prophets have tried to explain the same in their own ways, be it Mohammed or Nanaks. However, our senses fall short of realizing the truth. People have explained their experiences either directly or indirectly through the medium of other human being as they could not describe the greatness of the lord on account of their limited vocabulary and the grammar of any particular language.
    • Those who have realized and have explained the truth. [Sages]
    • Those who know but could not describe in their words.[e.g. Swami Ram Krishna]
    • Those who not realized but have described through other beings.[e.g. Swami Vivekanand who put the experience of Swami Ram Kishan]
    • Those who have not realized but only explain.[ Almost all of us would be in this category.]
    The first category of the people would constitute the Prophets, Seers and sages and the true disciple try to follow them. Nanaks were in the first category. He has experienced and has explained or, at least, tried to explain in their own words. The same are contained in the Granth sahib and in other Elahi-bani[3]. Truth is immutable and permanent, it is always what it is. If one ventures forth to change or modify it, he has evidently not known truth, it is true for the last category as stated above.But it is the seers/prophets who are capable of representing truth in a definitive form and prompting other men to its pursuit.

    ‘Panch’ and Meaning


    The word ‘five’ has significance in Sikh philosophy. There are five elements and there are five senses. We get the knowledge through these five senses. Mind only gets the impressions through these five senses only.Empiricists, such as Locke, Berkeley, and Hume, also argued that human knowledge originates in our sensations. Man’s cravings are also expressed in five demonical quality and if the internal energy is converted in divine qualities and there are five types/levels of bodies. Ayurvedas[4] have deeply explained the five types of bodies.

    Thus five represents the significant association of persons[5] who are supposed to be God in so far as the resolving the issues of the particular villages.

    Panch : Brahmgyanis


    In other words those who have realized the God are also called as the “Panch’[five] i.e. the person who are acceptable to the Almighty / The Nirankaar. One who is acceptable to the Lord is also the leader[Pardhaan] and the person stated above are respected in His Court[dargah], ‘Panch’ would mean ‘Brahmgyani[6]’ and is to be used in a singular form. In earlier times Kings used to engage Raj-Gurus. He was involved in the important issues of the kingdom. This is not a current practice in current times. These kinds of persons are the real ornaments of the kingdoms. They [Panch] are respected on the earth ,in the courts of the kings here, and in the Court of Lord.

    Dharama [righteousness] is stated to be ‘Dhyan- Sadhna’ i.e Dharma is the practice of Dhyan / focused consciousness. Listening to the word of ‘waheguru’ is essential. One may recite ‘waheguru’ but if one does not listen the same it would amount to lack of being attentive devoid of single- minded consciousness.

    Panch- Always conscious Of the Truth


    The Panch are always conscious of the Lord, the one and the single. They may be engaged in any profession or worldly affairs but they have that ‘single’ focused in their mind. They are not lost in the worldly affairs even though they may be engrossed.
    They live in this world in a detached manner. God has not made this world for being getting lost but it is the person who himself gets drowned in this sea of worldly affairs.

    ‘Panch’ are above the sea of this world and creations. They are like God but even then
    ‘Panch’ cannot describe the creation and how can they explain the Lord, the creator.

    ਕਰਤੇ ਕੈ ਕਰਣੈ ਨਾਹੀ ਸੁਮਾਰੁ
    [1] Death

    [2] Kindly refer Mool -Mantra

    [3] Dhur- Ki- Bani

    [4] Indian system of Medicinal Sciences

    [5] Indirect reference to The ‘Panch Parmeshwar’ in the village Panchayat.

    [6] Kindly note that it is the interpretation of Gyaani ji.



    E & E O



    Bhul Chuk .Mauf...
     

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