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Yogism Nada Yoga & its influence on the Gurus

Discussion in 'Interfaith Dialogues' started by namjiwankaur, Sep 30, 2012.

  1. namjiwankaur

    namjiwankaur
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    Sat Nam _/|\_

    I learned of Nada Yoga today. I want to learn about it from two angles. One thing I want to know is how the idea of sound/vibration inspired the gurus. I found the word "naad" at Sikhi Wiki. It is described there as "the Immaculate Sound Current". What I'm finding in a Google search don't seem to tell me too much, at least from sources I might typically find as the most worthy resources.

    Seriously though I would like to learn more about how the gurus understood this concept. It seems like they stripped the yoga away from it and gave it a more subtle (yet profound) place in the Guru Granth Sahib.

    What is the understanding of others regarding this concept? I would like to keep this thread free of the current debating so we can really dive into the subject.

    When I was young, I would hum with the vacuum cleaner and feel my heart vibrate. Was this the naad?

    How can one align with it and become more deeply connected with it?

    :mundaviolin:japposatnamwaheguru:

    Nam Jiwan
     
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    #1 namjiwankaur, Sep 30, 2012
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2012
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  3. itsmaneet

    itsmaneet
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    'Yoga' was most preferred practice to unite with God but in Satyug & Duapar. In kalyug, all such activities are waste of time. The only way to unite with Waheguru is NAAM.
     
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  4. Luckysingh

    Luckysingh Canada
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    I don't think that I'm confined to the boundaries of any Yug.
    How do you attain the Naam in your opinion ?
     
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  5. Harry Haller

    Harry Haller United Kingdom
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    to really dive into any subject surely it is better to have various views in debate, rather than complete agreement and mutual backslapping...........
     
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  6. Harry Haller

    Harry Haller United Kingdom
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    From what I understand about the Sikh religion, an effort was made to understand and practice the word of God, as written in the SGGS. This was in comparison to other religions that favoured mantras or chants as a way of enlightenment. I think any Yoga is healthy for the mind, but I do not think it makes one a better Sikh. Although my father for one, has always said he finds the sounds of the words soothing and celestial, I personally think it is a lazy way of contemplation. However, this is my own opinion..
     
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  7. namjiwankaur

    namjiwankaur
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    Sat Nam

    Itsmaneet ji,

    How does one use Naam to unite with Waheguru? How is it different from Nada Yoga/Path? How do you define yoga?

    :mundabhangra:
     
  8. namjiwankaur

    namjiwankaur
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    Sat Nam _/|\_

    Harry ji

    I am not referring to diversity of opinion. I'm referring to lack of respect for those with other opinions and the conversation going astray with egoism. My request is for an objective discussion vs. subjective---though I'm aware that it is probably impossible to be completely objective as many of us are as unawakened beings who are still rejecting our drop of the Ocean is not the every drop of the Ocean.

    A lot of conversations here go astray. Rather than sharing a diversity of opinion, some start with digs and jabs & go completely off-topic so they can satisfy ego's need to prove itself the almighty. Its not about the topic; its about the ego.

    As you can see, you and I are already going off-topic. Its very important for me to discuss and learn about nada yoga & Naam. Please respect that, Harry ji. If it is not important for you to help me learn about it, then you don't have to participate in the discussion.

    You are already doing what you did in other discussions recently.

    How was guru inspired by the Science of Sound? That is the topic of the discussion. Not what is Harry ji's opinion about nada yoga and the science of sound. I refer to it as science, because physics is discovering what the sages and saints have known since ancient times.

    Hope you see what I meant now, brother.

    Nam Jiwan kaurhug
     
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    #7 namjiwankaur, Sep 30, 2012
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2012
  9. Astroboy

    Astroboy Malaysia
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    ਨਾਮ ਤੇਰੇ ਕੀ ਜੋਤਿ ਲਗਾਈ (Previously namjap)
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    Bhagat Ravdas's bani says,

    NAAM TERO AARTI MAJAN MURAREY
    HAR KE NAAM BIN JHUTE SAGAL PAASAREY
    Page 694 Line 13 of SGGS
     
  10. namjiwankaur

    namjiwankaur
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    Sat Nam _/|\_

    I looked this up so I could know it in English and it is soooo Beauty-full!

    Your Name, Lord, is my adoration and cleansing bath.
    Without the Name of the Lord, all ostentatious displays are useless. ||1||Pause||

    (Page 694: http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&g=1&h=1&r=1&t=1&p=0&k=0&fb=0&Param=694)

    Rahao/Pause! Let's reflect on that. What does it mean? Does this refer to the Sound? Have you ever heard a large group of people chant Om and felt the way it causes a vibrating in the chest. That is to touch Reality, imho. Is that Naam? Is that what Nada-Yoga/Union-with-Guru is about?

    I believe the more we are in union with the Sound and Light, the more compassion we feel toward all creation because it draws us toward the One as the ultimate Giver and Receiver of all our deeds, thoughts and words. Is that why Guru speaks of simran as the path of Union, recognizing all within the One?

    In Reality, are we all One Sound? And is that the way to finding the One in each other and even in ourselves?

    Nam Jiwan:sippingcoffeemunda:
     
  11. Astroboy

    Astroboy Malaysia
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    ਨਾਮ ਤੇਰੇ ਕੀ ਜੋਤਿ ਲਗਾਈ (Previously namjap)
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    Naam vibrates as the sound current within one's self.
    It may sound like drums referred on Page 663 Line 6
    Sound of the horn - page 360 Line 2
    Guitar, Tambourine and cymbals - page 381 Line 11
    Trumpets - Page 806 Line 12
    Celestial Bugles - Page 922 Line 19
    Bell - Page 393 Line 8
    Harp - Page 92 Line 15
     
  12. Kanwaljit Singh

    Kanwaljit Singh India
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    I would try to give the overview of Sikh philosophy as I can identify it till now:
    (Could be based on the 5 Khands in Japuji Sahib)

    First you are living in this world. Carefree enjoying college or hanging out with friends. Then some tragedy (I think mostly) befalls and you search for answers. You become aware that you are lacking something. You seek the Truth. You are shown the Path by Guru, how to live and how to understand life. You are given knowledge. Then you work on your life, try and shape it, guided by your knowledge. Thus you gain Wisdom. At one point, your wisdom is complete, unshakable, without holes and thus in a way permanently by your side. I think this is the Naad (when you have the under current buzz of Guru in your mind and surroundings). When you reach that stage, your actions change your equations with the world, breaking the chains. When all chains are broken, you are born free. Jiwan Mukat.
     
  13. Harry Haller

    Harry Haller United Kingdom
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    you are quite right, and frankly, well said!

    apologies for my bluntness of latemundahug
     
  14. Luckysingh

    Luckysingh Canada
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    Nam Jiwan ji, I will try to give you some help.
    Understanding what the sound or naad really is, is quite difficult to explain in one go.
    Unfortunately, I don't think there is any good resource that can answer all your questions. Most of us understand by getting bits from different resources and putting them together along with your own experience and hence coming up with a personal conclusion.


    Firstly, you have to understand that everything is vibrations in terms of science.
    Then you have to understand that these same vibrations must come from somwhere, I mean what initiates them or what's the origin ?
    -This is when you realise what ''Naam'' actually is.

    Now, there has been some mention of naam on this thread already and in all honesty it is misguiding!!
    I'm not going to try and explain what Naam is as there are already a few posts that are active. I have given some input on these and you may check there.

    Once you begin to understand that every wave of vibration has the same origin throughout the universe, then you will understand that it takes effort to get back and vibrate at the origin wavelength and at the same frequency or in harmony.
    -This is where the 'sounds' come in.


    Now, your question of the Gurus realising this and using yoga tools by stripping away the more outward physical aspects is on the right track in a way.
    Here, you should first try and understand what ''Nirgun'' and ''Sargun'' are and how they apply to ALL of sikhi.

    Once, you get the hang of these, you will understand that the yoga practices and rituals the Gurus got away from where the ones that were more associated with 'sargun'. ie. the ones more outward and empty.

    You wil also understand that the Gurus were NOT against ritual practice or gurmantar or chanting or anything, but they went for the option where both Nirgun and Sargun approaches were applied to ALL these practices.

    For eg. when chanting you should have an inward element more than the outward element..etc or both ''form'' and ''formless'' approach.
    I'm sure that some other members can explain this concept a little better.


    When you understand these vibrations and how doing simran can get you in harmony with every single cell in your body and little hair on your body into the same tune of ''waheguru', such that every microscopic part is vibrating with the ''waheguru'' - then this is called 'rom rom simran'.
    This itself is another advanced stage of simran coming after the celestial sounds.
    You could imagine it as, the celestial or anhad sounds as being in tune or harmony with the sound waves that are already produced and ''rom rom'' as if the sound is coming independently from the initial source for every minute cell in your body.

    (again, these are my personal explanations from what I understand and you will find differing definitons from other people)

    I hope that can help answer your questions a little.
    To become more aligned to it and to get deeper as you asked, takes a lot of practice. Practice, practice, practice.. and the grace of the Lord when the time is right.

    When people start with simple naam jap or simran, they just recite and recite. At first it seems difficult to go within and all seems like a physical practice- this is not the gurmat way, but you have to start somewhere!!
    Once you practice this, then you slowly start to get attuned and go inward in a more nirgun approach.
    This is what Gurmat is all about- believing both dualities !!

    It's just like any other practice such as 'matha tek' which is bowing to the Guru Granth Sahib when entering the Gurdwara darbar.
    As a kid, you don't understand what it all is and you take the sargun or outward approach. Then with time and repeated practice as you get older you learn to be inward and close to the lord. Thus you start taking a more nirgun approach.
    In a similar way this is how you start with chanting which leads to gurmat simran and then naam simran !!!
     
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  15. Astroboy

    Astroboy Malaysia
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    ਨਾਮ ਤੇਰੇ ਕੀ ਜੋਤਿ ਲਗਾਈ (Previously namjap)
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    One's consciousness changes and what doesn't change is the Laws of God - call them the Laws of Nature. By a shift of consciousness, everything changes.
    For e.g., if we are very critical by nature, then we are quick to point out the negative aspects of a person, situation or event. But a devotee is not affected by a negative world. He/she is protected and always sees the brighter and beneficial aspects of the same event.
     
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  16. namjiwankaur

    namjiwankaur
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    _/|\_ Sat Nam

    Thanks to all who have helped me begin to glimpse this and understand this. I'm finding in almost every religion, there is a mysterious, often subtle something referred to as Light & Sound and it Truly Exists. Its a way of going deeper into our Essence.

    When I do that, I stop seeing "your soul" and "my soul"...I start seeing this Breath of Life, this Essence that is Us!

    My relationship with music is starting to make much more sense. During a very difficult childhood, I used to "escape" into music, but I see I wasn't escaping. I was listening to the rhythm and pulsing and other parts of the songs until I was "high/blissed out". In other words, I was escaping anything. I was entering into a new realm.

    I was experiencing Naam! I need to keep re-reading these threads to organize my thoughts and get things organized.

    :grinningkaur:
    Nam Jiwan
     
  17. Astroboy

    Astroboy Malaysia
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    ਨਾਮ ਤੇਰੇ ਕੀ ਜੋਤਿ ਲਗਾਈ (Previously namjap)
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    In a satsang where only one aim is focused on, we can experience a ceiling/clustered clouds of light where we find this as a new connection with us. It is necessary to renew this experience many times over until we learn to be good swimmers in this subtle essence of bliss.
     
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  18. harcharanjitsinghdhillon

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    at the beginning when there was nothing, there was no vibration and sounds, no space and time, except god was there in unmanifested form, nirgun, and there was no sargun yet..when god manifested god created creation, and that part of god that is in creation is called sargun.. in sikhism we are taking god to be transendental and immanent, then only we can define god to be everywhere. sargun created maya and multiplicity..when we are trying to understand about sounds and vibration, we are trying to understand the immanent part of god. but when we go much higher to understand the void, transendental lord, here there is no vibration and sounds, then we know that god is ONE.. thanks
     
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