Welcome to SPN

Register and Join the most happening forum of Sikh community & intellectuals from around the world.

Sign Up Now!

May Sikhs Eat Kosher Foods Other than Meat?

Discussion in 'Questions and Answers' started by GurjitJ, Jul 23, 2011.

  1. GurjitJ

    GurjitJ
    Expand Collapse
    SPNer

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2011
    Messages:
    11
    Likes Received:
    13
    I was just wondering if it was ok to eat kosher foods that arent meat. Like fruits, vegtables and juices and stuff.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. Loading...

    Similar Threads Forum Date
    India West Delhi's Sikhs may give cold shoulder to BJP Breaking News Mar 29, 2014
    1984 Sikhs for Justice v. Congress (I) – US Court order for pretrial hearing on May 29 History of Sikhism May 27, 2013
    USA FBI May Not Begin Tracking Hate Crimes Against Sikhs Until 2015 Breaking News Dec 14, 2012
    Legal Hindus, Sikhs May Face Worse Time in the Future Breaking News Apr 16, 2011
    Legal Larger bench may take up Punjab Sikhs' minority status case Breaking News Nov 19, 2010

  3. Randip Singh

    Randip Singh
    Expand Collapse
    SPN Sewadaar
    Historian SPNer Supporter

    Joined:
    May 25, 2005
    Messages:
    2,949
    Likes Received:
    2,952
    How can that be Kosher?
     
  4. GurjitJ

    GurjitJ
    Expand Collapse
    SPNer

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2011
    Messages:
    11
    Likes Received:
    13
    I think that they can. I saw on my orange juice bottle a while ago that it was kosher.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  5. Mai Harinder Kaur

    Mai Harinder Kaur
    Expand Collapse
    Mentor Writer SPNer

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2006
    Messages:
    1,760
    Likes Received:
    2,766
    I certainly hope - and believe - that it is OK to eat kosher food as long as it is not meat. It is halal and kosher meat that is forbidden to Amritdhari Sikhs. An interesting fact is that kosher foods are not generally blessed or prayed over.


    Yes, all processed foods Orthodox Jews - and most Conservative Jews - eat must be certified as kosher. This does not include fresh produce, but it does cover everything else.

    One Jewish dietary law not much known outside of Jewish circles is that it is not kosher to eat dairy and meat at the same meal. This is relevant to vegetarian Sikhs because most cheese is made with rennet, an enzyme harvested from the stomach of baby cows. Kosher cheese, however, uses vegetable enzymes to accomplish the same purpose. I use Tillamook cheese personally for the most part because it meets my requirements and also is of good quality and reasonable price.

    It is still necessary to be careful, though. Not all kosher dairy products are acceptable to vegetarian Sikhs. They might contain eggs or even something called "kosher gelatin." Gelatin is made from the hooves of animals. The rabbis have decided that the product has been processed to the point that it is no longer meat, but is now neutral (parva/pareve). Go figure. It is still made from a dead animal and is thus not vegetarian. This is especially a problem with most yogurt. Read the ingredients. Most of them - including Tillamook brand - contain gelatin. I buy Mountain High brand or make my own. (BTW, yogurt is called curd in India.)

    For a picture of marks indicating if a food is kosher, as well as some other interesting facts on kosher foods, I recommend Burton2: Study Breaks. At least I found it interesting.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  6. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
    Expand Collapse
    1947-2014 (Archived)
    SPNer Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2004
    Messages:
    14,551
    Likes Received:
    19,200
    Because Kosher does not refer to a method of killing. It is a broader term that refers to purity and can apply to food but other things as well. It includes cooking fats, vegetable and not, flours, cracker meal for dumplings, lotions and creams, candles, and more.

    That has been a problem all along our discussions of halal and kosher meat. These terms should not be used interchangeably because kosher meat is not killed according to ritual. There are no exclamations similar to Alah Akbar. Only a finely sharpened knife, an abatoire that meets with rabbinical standards of cleanliness, and a trained wielder of the knife. I checked this out at a local rabbinical college in my area.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  7. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
    Expand Collapse
    1947-2014 (Archived)
    SPNer Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2004
    Messages:
    14,551
    Likes Received:
    19,200
    Here is an interesting note (at least i think it is interesting). When meat is slaughtered for Jews in the slaughter houses of a given area, this happens in the morning. The abatoires are cleaned meticulously. After the slaughter for Jewish butchers and meat packers is complete, the halal for Muslim butchers and packers then takes place in the same abatoires. Muslims considering the hosing down after Jewish slaughter good enough.
     
  8. Ambarsaria

    Ambarsaria Canada
    Expand Collapse
    ੴ / Ik▫oaʼnkār
    Writer SPNer Contributor Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2010
    Messages:
    3,366
    Likes Received:
    5,657
    Mai Harinder Kaur ji an spnadmin ji, if you have not seen the movie "Earthlings (2003)" you may try (WARNING: Some scenes you will remember for the rest of your lives so be careful, I know I will). It has PETA oriented approach to show worst of the worst that animals suffer through in food chain and clothing/fur production. There was a scene also of a "Kosher" slaughter of a Buffalo, pretty disgusting. A Chinese guy skinning a live Wolf/Fox hung upside down while the animal keeps looking at the camera helplessly.

    What ends up in the grocery stores or clothing stores of course has no such Imagery or it won't sell. It is likely also that worst of the worse practices hopefully are not as prevalent. Jhatka or one blow by far appears comparatively civilized.

    The rest of the stuff about gummy bears (gelatin), cheese, eggs and other is rather civilized by being tail end of bye-products, etc. We do make our own yogurt and it is much tastier with no additives other than the culture.

    I have kind of given up in being too picky on this stuff as it is a losing battle with food processing and packaging.

    Sat Sri Akal.
     
  9. Mai Harinder Kaur

    Mai Harinder Kaur
    Expand Collapse
    Mentor Writer SPNer

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2006
    Messages:
    1,760
    Likes Received:
    2,766
    I thought of that kosher scene as I wrote and decided not to bring it up. I'm glad someone else did.
     
  10. Ishna

    Ishna
    Expand Collapse
    On hiatus
    Writer SPNer Contributor

    Joined:
    May 9, 2006
    Messages:
    2,942
    Likes Received:
    5,002
    Sorry for this basic question, but why is kosher meat forbidden to an Amritdhari if it's not slaughtered ritually? I thought that was the problem with the halal meat - it is slaughtered ritually and with Allah Akbar said over it.

    Is it that Amritdhari's can only eat jhatka meat?

    I don't want to talk about Sikhs eating meat or not. I'm just curious about the opinions regarding Sikhs eating these kinds of meats.

    Thanks
     
    • Like Like x 1
  11. Gyani Jarnail Singh

    Gyani Jarnail Singh Malaysia
    Expand Collapse
    Sawa lakh se EK larraoan
    Mentor Writer SPNer Contributor

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2004
    Messages:
    7,623
    Likes Received:
    14,188
    ISNT IT AMAZING that SIKHS seem to be getting pulled into this QUICKSAND so fast and furious..day by day....
    1. The SGGS avoided this entire diet thingy as fit for MOORAKHS to discuss and fight over.
    2. The Sikhs who formulated the SRM...got influenced by OUTSIDE FORCES (Hindu/Muslim religious environment)..and formulated the Jhatka/hallal restriction.
    3. Now Sikhs are asking..is it ok to eat "kosher"...?? Kosher diednt even feature as aword even in SGGS !! or in the SRM....
    4. Tomorrow Sikhs may be asking..about Chinese food..Buddhist food..Foods that a re OK for Neplai Hindus ?? for Kazhakstaani Mongols ?? for Americna Indian tribes living in Nicaragua ??..Can SIKHS eat this and That....????

    I am AMAZED at how far sikhs can DEVIATE away from SGGS and the SERIOUS STUFF in the 1429 pages....to simply FRIVILOUS STUFF....meant only for MOORAKHS. I wonder if all of us have already EXHAUSTED all the HEAVY STUFF in SGGS..which 10 Guru sahibs spent over 250 YEARS to bring to us....that we must waste time on this utterly frivilous subject...???
     
    • Like Like x 4
  12. Mai Harinder Kaur

    Mai Harinder Kaur
    Expand Collapse
    Mentor Writer SPNer

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2006
    Messages:
    1,760
    Likes Received:
    2,766
    I agree the subject itself is silly, but it might not be to someone who really doesn't know.

    I have used it as an opportunity to teach a bit about another religion that might be of interest to some people.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  13. BhagatSingh

    BhagatSingh Canada
    Expand Collapse
    SPNer sikhiart.com

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2006
    Messages:
    2,912
    Likes Received:
    1,640
    I think the distinction of healthy vs unhealthy is quite enough, and fulfills the basic Sikh dietary requirements. We need not create more distinctions. Sikh dietary requirements are based on the idea of being tyar bar tyar, fully conscious/fully aware.

    What follows from this?
    No alcohol and avoid other intoxicants, as they reduce conscious awareness. Practice naam simran instead.

    Eat lows carbs combined with healthy fats and proteins, so one is less drowsy after a meal.
     
  14. Ambarsaria

    Ambarsaria Canada
    Expand Collapse
    ੴ / Ik▫oaʼnkār
    Writer SPNer Contributor Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2010
    Messages:
    3,366
    Likes Received:
    5,657
    Bhagat Singh ji I agree with your thinking in general.

    Are the Cholay Bhathureh allowed per your thoughts?

    By the way why you want to be less drowsy after a meal? I thought that is what body naturally wants to do. Siesta time all the time!

    I thought the healthy body is the one that talks back.

    Sat Sri Akal.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  15. Ishna

    Ishna
    Expand Collapse
    On hiatus
    Writer SPNer Contributor

    Joined:
    May 9, 2006
    Messages:
    2,942
    Likes Received:
    5,002
    Sometimes Sikhi can be so confusing, it is difficult to know what to believe.

    Is Sikhi supposed to be this complicated?

    If Sikhs just did what SGGS told us to do it would be a lot easier, but there would be no SRM, and no Khalsa. There would be no uncut hair, no turban, people would eat what they like, and simply be honest, hard working, good natured citizens absorbed in the rememberence of God.

    Everything else is too bloomin' complicated.

    yellingsardarni
     
    • Like Like x 1
  16. Gyani Jarnail Singh

    Gyani Jarnail Singh Malaysia
    Expand Collapse
    Sawa lakh se EK larraoan
    Mentor Writer SPNer Contributor

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2004
    Messages:
    7,623
    Likes Received:
    14,188
    <<<<<<<<<<If Sikhs just did what Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji told us to do it would be a lot easier>>>>>>>>

    Ishna Ji..
    This is where you are sadly very mistaken.......its not as "easy" as you think to be a SIKH according to the SGGS....in Fact as I have already pointed out in an earlier posting..even GURU ARJUN JI the compiler of SGGS considers HIMSELF..barely "Half a sikh"...and the ONE and ONLY Complete SIKH in front of Him was GURU RAMDASS JI.

    If one can be 0.01 % a SIKH according to SGGS..the REST of your post...about SRM Khalsa hair etc becomes totally irrelevant....because when heat is put to water it will BOIL naturally...so when the SGGS is applied to a Human Being..SIKHI/KHALSA/SRM etc all follow Naturally...The trouble with Modern Sikhs is they want to ..."see the water boiling" before they light the fire !!! they want to be Khalsa etc BEFORE they even understand the SGGS 0.01%.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  17. Gyani Jarnail Singh

    Gyani Jarnail Singh Malaysia
    Expand Collapse
    Sawa lakh se EK larraoan
    Mentor Writer SPNer Contributor

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2004
    Messages:
    7,623
    Likes Received:
    14,188
    SGGS declares..Thorra khayah..thorra soaa..eat in MODERATION..sleep in MODERATION...the Key word is MODERATION...
    Din gavaiah khayeh ke..rein gavaee soi ke..
    Day is LOST in eating...NIGHT lost in SLEPING !!

    SGGS only bars EXCESSIVE.........excessive wealth collecting..excessive woman collecting..excessive servant collecting..excessive food..excessive clothing...jewelery..cars..horse..cows..elephants..computers..and YES EXCESSIVE POSTINGS on SPN !! facebooks and Gmails etc etc Ha Ha Ha..

    and yes Chholay Bhatureh are my fav too..my sister makes them every fortnight...sundays....just had this heavenly dish twice in four hours..EXCESSIVE YES !! admitted and guilty as charged.:mundaviolin::mundaviolin::mundaviolin::mundaviolin::mundaviolin:
     
    • Like Like x 3
  18. BhagatSingh

    BhagatSingh Canada
    Expand Collapse
    SPNer sikhiart.com

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2006
    Messages:
    2,912
    Likes Received:
    1,640
    Who could not like Cholay Bhaturay?

    (... and then there will be those who say who could not like a glass of whiskey or two?)

    I am not saying either is good or bad. They both have their place and to each his own.

    Tyar bar tyar is a good summary of Sikh thought. Tyar bar tyar for anything, the unraveling of God's will. Tyar bar tyar to obtain any understanding that is available as it unravels. Tyar bar tyar to receive Guru's wisdom in that moment.

    That wisdom maybe "I could eat a few more puris" or it maybe "I should probably stop". A decision that comes from the understanding will be best for that time. What is "allowed" will be revealed by the Guru.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  19. Ambarsaria

    Ambarsaria Canada
    Expand Collapse
    ੴ / Ik▫oaʼnkār
    Writer SPNer Contributor Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2010
    Messages:
    3,366
    Likes Received:
    5,657
    Bhagat Singh ji, Gyani Jarnail Singh ji, Ishna ji wonderful posts.

    I agree with all of you and see it as enjoy, simplicity, moderation and listen to your body as it will tell you quickly or in time if you are eating something bad though tasty.

    Bhagat Singh ji as you said, Gyani Jarnail Singh ji has said many times as well, and I agree, to help people focus on bigger parts of Khalsa and Guru ji's message, this is also very important "to each his/her own". If this was practiced there will be no Derah in Beas lol, dishing out garbage about eggs and meat as though this is the issue of the future of the world.

    Sat Sri Akal.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  20. Harry Haller

    Harry Haller United Kingdom
    Expand Collapse

    Moderator

    Writer SPNer Contributor

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2011
    Messages:
    5,120
    Likes Received:
    7,947
    Ishnabhenji,

    what you are talking about is the state, I believe, every sikh should find before they move on to the SRM and the Khalsa.

    I think the complications set in possibly, when you are trying to fly a helicopter with a car licence. I don't know if you ever saw Indiana Jones and the last crusade, (one of my fav films) , but at the end, when Indiana has his hand on the Grail, his father tells him to let it go, grasping ever so tightly on ideals we do not understand does not get us anywhere, but letting go should not lower morale, it just isnt time yet, my own view? I think for me, just being honest, truthful, respectful of life, true to myself, not getting angry, not judging, and so forth, a plethora of tasks and jobs I have to master before the next level.

    The question of kosher or not kosher is a valid question, and Gyaniji is correct that it is a question for moorukhs, but then are we not all moorukhs? and what does that make those that do not even ask the question, but take a guess at the answer that is more than likely the wrong one
     
    • Like Like x 2
  21. Randip Singh

    Randip Singh
    Expand Collapse
    SPN Sewadaar
    Historian SPNer Supporter

    Joined:
    May 25, 2005
    Messages:
    2,949
    Likes Received:
    2,952
    I would say no.

    The reason ebing is that the Sikh view would be that t is needless purification. How can you purify that which has been created by God?
     

Share This Page