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Legal Living together a part of right to life, not an offence: SC

Discussion in 'Breaking News' started by rajneesh madhok, Mar 26, 2010.

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Should government regulate the cohabitation of unmarried couples? Check all that describe your view.

  1. In a constitutional democracy this question should be decided by the electorate.

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  2. In a secular democracy the government should play no role. Cohabitation is a private matter.

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  3. Any regulation of cohabitation by government should be guided by majority religious sentiments.

    1 vote(s)
    20.0%
  4. Cohabition should be protected by laws that uphold the fundamental right to privacy.

    4 vote(s)
    80.0%
  5. Cohabitation should be banned. It undermines core social values, including loyalty to family.

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  6. Cohabition should be banned. It undermines core religious values found in nearly every society.

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  7. No opinion

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  8. Other - Please share your views in the thread.

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  1. rajneesh madhok

    rajneesh madhok India
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    Living together a part of right to life, not an offence: SC

    Living together a part of right to life, not an offence: SC

    The Supreme Court threw its weight behind live-in relationships on Tuesday, observing that for a man and a woman in love, to live together is part of the right to life, and not a “criminal offence”.“If two people, man and woman, want to live together, who can oppose them? What is the offence they commit here? This happens because of the cultural exchange between people,” a special three-judge bench of Chief Justice of India (CJI) K G Balakrishnan and Justices Deepak Verma and B S Chauhan observed.

    The court was hearing a batch of petitions filed by actress Khusboo to quash 22 FIRs filed against her by Tamil activist groups and forums for her alleged comments on pre-marital sex in interviews five years ago.“If living together is an offence, then the first complaint should be filed against the Supreme Court, because we have permitted living together,” the court said. It was referring to a 2006 judgment in which the Supreme Court directed the administration and police across the country to protect runaway couples from harassment, and to initiate action against those resorting to violence.

    “It is part of right to life to go away with someone you love,” the bench said. The Supreme Court had earlier stayed a Madras High Court order of April 2008, which allowed criminal proceedings against the actress.Khusboo was alleged to have said there was nothing wrong in “sex before marriage”, provided girls were careful about pregnancy and sexually-transmitted diseases. Her detractors argued that the implied advice to the educated male to not expect virginity from modern girls was “offensive” and a source of “public nuisance”.

    To an argument that Khusboo’s comments on pre-marital sex would mislead gullible youths and minors, the court said: “The scenario is highly unlikely in this age of the Internet where we do not know what our children are doing or where they are going or what pornography site they are watching.”To this, the lawyer appearing for one of the complainants, Miniammal, a lawyer in Tamil Nadu, responded that “there should be some morality in the comments made by people of prominence like Khusboo, who has a temple in Tamil Nadu where she is worshipped as a goddess”.

    “And this is how you revere your goddess, by dragging her to court?” retorted Justice Verma.The bench made it clear that Khusboo’s comments could at best be termed as “personal opinions”, and did not amount to a cognizable offence.But the lawyer persisted that Khusboo’s comments on pre-marital sex would lead to the “spoiling of the entire institution of marriage. Statements like this can result in chaos in the society.” Even as the CJI at this moment responded that people were better off listening to themselves than to others, Justice Verma asked the counsel to point out how many marriages were “spoilt” or how many instances of chaos happened in the past five years because of her comments on pre-marital sex. .

    The court said it cannot stop anyone from expressing their opinions before reserving the petitions for final verdict.Besides, the court said, Khusboo (who was present during the day-long hearing) had said “nothing new” about the concept of living together.Justice Chauhan pointed out that even the “ceiling limit” for the construction of temples for twin deities like Radha and Krishna or Ram and Sita were calculated under the consideration that they were “husband and wife”.

    Rajneesh Madhok
     
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  3. Randip Singh

    Randip Singh
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    Although its up to people what they do, lets not have a copy of damaging Celeb culture we have here in the West, where moral (Or lack of ) bench marks are set by celebrities.

    I really do despair.
     
  4. rajneesh madhok

    rajneesh madhok India
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    Dear Randip Singhji,
    Yeah you are absolutely right that the people should decide what is wrong or right. But it is a matter of great concern that India is the developing country and the people have rich values but alas! they are copying the celebrities culture. It is a matter of great concern that why the people are losing moral values day by day and copying the culture of western countries. I hope this is due to the Direct to Home (DTH) facility and the Cable connections provided in not only in cities but in towns and villages those provide soap opera and the people are imitating the culture provided in the telecasted programmes. This is a matter of great concern and the intellectual people should come forward to save our culture and guide the young generation not to copy the celebrities culture for the sake of their health and crime free society. As with the following of the celebrities culture the trend of drug addiction has also been taken the youth in its clutches.
    Rajneesh Madhok
     
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  5. kds1980

    kds1980 India
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    The problem of India is that in 1 India there many India's.On one hand you have extremly
    liberal people living westernised lifestyle in big cities caring about nothing on the another hand we have village's where panchayats issue Death penalties if someone break their caste laws like marrying within caste.
     
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  6. spnadmin

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    Here are my concerns.

    1. The discussion has migrated to discourse on Hindu theology and away from the topic.


    The thread has been split and the new thread Morality, Culture and Media in Traditional and Modern India. It can be found at this address http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/hinduism/29699-morality-culture-media-traditional-modern-india.html


    In my own experience there are many shades of practice of the various Hindu paths. These range from bathing an idol of Ganesh once a year and giving him a new set of clothes to rigorous practice of meditation on an abstract and indivisible creative and destructive force and all the possibilities between those two extremes. The stories of the Vedas can be taken as history or as philosophical meditations.

    This is not the place to discuss
    whether there is a more abstract meaning for Krishna or Tulsi, or whether the masses enjoy a literal meaning.
    The article that started this thread was about a legal matter that has ramifications for life and culture and so we want to stay focused on that. This is also a new forum created to discuss the law, abuses of the lase, legal questions and advocacy
     
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  7. JimRinX

    JimRinX
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    All jios
    I think that it is important for all people to find their soul mate; and, for modern people, who have birth control, etc., it is not at all wrong to share Love with more than one individual in the process of finding that one, special person.
    Anyone would be right to point out that, like in all things, people take this opinion of mine, and carry it too far; and that the 'Celeb Culture' that you deride, deserves your derision!
    There's a Happy Middle Ground, though; but then I've lived with five women who weren't my 'wife', and I learned a little more about what sort of person that I might want to marry from every one of them.
    All in all, they agreed with me that it was time to move on when we split up; for, in America, we like to say, "It's sad to belong to someone else, when the right one comes along."
     
  8. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
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    JimRinX ji

    I never heard that before now. Where did you hear it?
     
  9. JimRinX

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    Narayanjot ji
    It's a sad love song from the 1970's, by England Dan and John Ford Coley, see the latter perform it, here:
    YouTube- John Ford Coley ~ It's Sad To Belong
    Better than Paul Simons '50 Ways to leave your lover' - as it's little less HARSH.
    Us randy, over sexed, Maya dazed Americans - we just can't enough of it!:D
     
  10. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
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    LOL I am an American and I still can't remember it but will check the tube. The reason could be that I am not one of those randy, over-sexed Americans. Always standing I am on the outside looking in. :thinkingkudi:
     
  11. Tejwant Singh

    Tejwant Singh United States
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    Peeping Tomma??!!
     
  12. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
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    I was thinking marginalized. But maybe that is whining on my part. Back to topic!
     
  13. rajneesh madhok

    rajneesh madhok India
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    [LyricsMasti] Lyrics of Beete Hue Lamho Ki Kasak (Nikaah 1982)

    Dear JimRinX ji,

    Kindly go through the gravity of this song and then decide yourself whether the multiple relations leave impression on your mind or not. Whether you casually develop relations even then those memories will not fade away so easily and will certainly put the impression on your mind.

    (Translated at the end of this message)
    abhi alavida mat kaho doston
    na jaane phir kahaan mulaaqaat ho, kyon ki

    beete hue lamhon ki kasak saath to hogi
    khwaabon men hi ho, chaahe mulaaqaat to hogi

    ye pyaar, ye doobi hui rangeen fizaaen
    ye chahere, ye nazaare, ye javaan rrut, ye havaaen
    ham jaaen kahin, in ki mahak saath to hogi
    beete hue lamhon ki..................

    phoolon ki tarah dil men basaae hue rakhana
    yaadon ke chiraaghon ko jalaae hue rakhana
    lamba hai safar is men kahin raat to hogi
    beete hue lamhon ki...................

    ye saath guzaare hue lamhaat ki daulat
    jazbaat ki daulat, ye khyaalaat ki daulat
    kuchh paas na ho, paas ye saughaat to hogi
    beete hue lamhon ki.....................


    Translation:
    Guys just do not say goodbye,
    No body knows when & where again you meet,
    the memories of the past moments will certainly with you,
    your meetings will be certainly held though it may be in dreams,
    This love, this colourful atmosphere,
    This face, these views, this powerful winds, this weather,
    where ever you go the smell of these moments will go alongwith you,
    the moments of the past.............
    Preserve me in the heart like the flowers,
    Keep the memories burning like a lamp pot (diya)
    May be it is a long journey but certainly there will be a night,
    The feelings of the past moments will be certainly there.
    The wealth of moments that we spent together,
    The feelings of that wealth, the wealth of those thoughts,
    Though there is nothing at this moment, but the gifts of those past moments are there,
    The feelings of the past moments will be there.


    Conclusion:
    Don't take casual relations so lightly. Those relations certainly put immarkable impression on the mind of everybody.

    Rajneesh Madhok
     
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  14. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
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    rajneesh ji

    This is an important message because it speaks volumes about "constancy" instead of our tendency to "trash" one another. Stability is fast becoming something akin to a curse and this is a western problem that is creeping eastward. Stability, constancy of relationships takes hard work and humility and it takes a lot out of a person. But it pays dividends and releases one from paranoia-- something the west doesn't realize.
     
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  15. JimRinX

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    Narayanjot ji
    Yes, they can be a bit too much, can't they? I believe in Free Love, and see Sex as a way to experience the Higher Love of Waheguru - though not as intensely; and, just as long as you take into account the feelings of your partner - try not to cause pain, not being so selfish about 'getting some' that you break someones heart (I'm "Not a REAL MAN" some say; because I "Passed THAT up", etc.), etc., I know that one will not be judged poorly for it (I wasn't, and you know what I mean).
    Most Americans - and many other peoples of the World - have reduced Sex to a 'Hit'; like a Drug Addict takes a 'Hit'; and they seldom realize what it is that they've done to themselves; how, by exchanging Quantity for Quality, they've made the experience banal, and much, much 'less good', 'less wonderful' than it could, and should always be in the process.
    You know I've been being bedeviled by Christian puritens lately; and that, I feel, they done something to sex that is 'opposite' of these sex fiends - but no less BAD.
    They've turned a Wonderful Thing into a 'Sin', and thus, every time someone partakes of it, they fill the world with 'guilty vibes' - when it should be the other way around.
    And then there's the consequences of driving such things UNDERGROUND....UGH!
    $ 1.5 BILLION lawsuits come to mind? I was raised Catholic - and the Priest who 'confirmed me' was one of THOSE priests (he did 'feel up' a little girl - not a boy) who just 'disappeared' (with a different priest taking his place, all hush-hush like) one day.
    They've set out to 'punnish me' for talking about it, you know (I've - probably - been 'Jail Baited'; which stinks, 'cause I REALLY LOVED and Respected her); and, since then, half of my problems have been caused by them - and the rest by the Evil White Supremacist Neo-NAZIs; as they have much in common, when it comes to disrespecting other peoples Fundamental Freedoms and Basic Human Rights.:hopmad:
    Anyway, I digress; glad you liked my reference.
     
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  16. rajneesh madhok

    rajneesh madhok India
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    Honourable Narayanjot Kaurji,
    Regards,
    Really this message is a hard fact, this is applicable to every religion and it is concerned with every body Moreover as You said that it speaks about constancy, secondly with this message we can make anybody agreeable on the point without trashing to one another and about the religion. This is really a great issue now-a-days. The young generation is not stable in relations. Though everybody knows it is a curse but the people are keep on changing the affairs with one and other. Though previously it was linked with Western countries but this problem is creeping in Eastern countries and the people are following westeren culture without considering its ill-effects.
    In the nut-shell thanks for agreeing to my point that the Stability will always be regarded, now and for the coming centuries.
    Regards,
    Rajneesh Madhok
     
  17. JimRinX

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    Dear Rajneesh Madhok ji
    The lyrics you shared with me above, are a good example of the 'other' point of view, with which the one I expressed is in balance; like all things, the issue has both some ying and some yang to it.
    I point out that it's sad to make perminent a relationship with one who is NOT you 'Ideal' - or, if you would, your Soul Mate - and assert that it may be best to experiment a bit with Love, and even Sex (there's such a thing as being both psychologically and sexually compatable), before you chose the one who you want to 'seal the deal' with; you point out that Love is a many splendored thing that can leave you with an achy breaking heart every tome you, oh (in my case), smell a certain perfume, or (again, in my case) see a Gazebo.
    This is a pain quite similar to the one one feels when one is in the WRONG relationship, and the 'right one comes along'.
    Thus, I justify SOME experimentation, but, at the same time, say that I agree we Americans and Europeans have, in the case of the emotionally unsophisticated and highly oversexed ignorant masses, cheapened the whole affair.
    I think that I addressed that point in the above comment; as well as pointing out that I, in my actually proving that I agree with you, have been told that I'm, "NOT a REAL Man."
    I pity the fools who've turned Sex into a Crack Hit - phhht! And it's gone; no basking in the lingering aura, no nothing.
    As far as Westerners being responsiblem you're WRONG though. The 'Sexual Revolution', which led to this quasi-decadence, began when the Kama Sutra was published, in the late 1800's!
    Those Erotic TEMPLES - Oh MY!
    Ha, ha - GOT YA!:tongue:
     
  18. rajneesh madhok

    rajneesh madhok India
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    Dear JimRinXji,
    Thanks for accepting the other point of view. I am grateful to you that you accepted the other side of the coin and that opinion which make balance in the opinions. You may consider the aspect in ying or yang. If you like that we should do voting on the subject.
    So, I request Dr. Narayanjot Kaurji to kindly make voting on the subject and collect the opinions of the members. We should know which point is better.
    I again differ with your point that you highlighted that it is sad to make permanent relation with one who is NOT your IDEAL. JimRinXji, I am of this opinion that with whomsoever you will decide that HE/SHE is the best match for one as a life partner. That decision will prove to be wrong not in months, days but from the same moment when you decide to marry with that person.
    You know in India we are settled in arranged marriage. When the relation has not been finalized all the merits of the boy and all the merits of the girl are being considered. Now I am telling you the moment, the relation is finalized that this girl/boy will be married to this one. At the same moment the demerits we start to count and from that day the boy and the girl those become husband and wife keep on counting the demerits of each other whole of life even then the adjustments are being made by one and other.
    Now we come to your point. Suppose a boy and a girl indulge in making love and sex with hundred persons of opposite sex. Now tell me which one will be the ideal match. What experience do you like to highlight how can you judge that this boy or girl is psychologically and sexually compatible. Now come to the point. Do you like to go to the era of Viagra or to the meditation. The relations developed by both persons sexually will last long in first sexual intercourse. How this parameter of choosing the right relation will be successful.
    Now I come to your point. If you will smell a certain good quality perfume daily it will arouse your good feelings and if you keep on changing the perfume with sub-standard quality you will get head-ache. The wrong and right relations depend upon one’s thinking and decisions. But I am sure that before marriage and with the meetings before marriage one can’t decide the future prospects. It is like a lottery whether your decision is right or wrong. Your justification regarding Americans and Europeans, we don’t agree. You may be emotionally unsophisticated and highly oversexed but as I had already discussed that too long the journey may be but there will certainly be a night. This oversexed attitude will come to stop at one stage, it may be due to health compulsions, Sexually transmitted diseases or any other reason may be. If you will not agree to me that hardly matters but in Reality one day you will think over my point and will agree to my point. I am not here to prove anything.
    “Bhagwan ki lathi mein awaz nahin hoti”
    “God’s stick has no voice”
    Samay ki chakki chalti bahut dheere hai par peesati bahut bareek hai”
    “The Grinder of Time moves very slowly but grind its granules in powder shape”
    Don’t say that Americans and Europeans enjoy life by adopting multi-sexual relations is a right step. All mis-deeds of the human being are known to him/her. He/she knows what is right and what is wrong. Don’t say that if society permits then it is right. NO----Never----If it is wrong in the East then it will certainly be wrong in the west. The Newton’s gravitational theory can be proved in East and West alike. If you say there is nothing Good or bad deed in our sexual entertainment with multiple partners. Dear one day you will realize and will feel what I am saying today. You have turned Sexual relations as Entertainment. One day you will get the after-effects of all those relations that you are justifying today.
    You may say that the westerners are right and we people are wrong.
    Now I come to your last point of Sexual Revolution that you linked with Kama Sutra and the reasons for those Erotic scenes in temples:

    I am reproducing the teachings made by Acharya Rajneesh (OSHO) and he has provided the knowledge about Kahjuraho’s temples and the reasons behind it. Kindly go through it.
    Osho in his book Sambhog Se Samadhi Tak gives a very beautiful description of this. He says that a person is always engaged in pleasure but a time comes when he is tired of all these things going round and round as depicted around the temple of Khajuraho and then he enters the temple to see God.
    That is first you have to deal with very natural things like Kaam and only after crossing this, you can attain Gyan or knowledge of God. You cannot ignore it.
    There is a quote by Arnold Toynbee wherein he attributes the creative minority of a particular society reducing to merely a dominant minority. When this happens, the degradation of society starts. As long as the creative minority in the civilization is indeed creative and open to wider views, (Brahmins in India played this role for long time. There were revival movements at fixed intervals of time throughout Indian History), the civilization cannot stagnate.
    The freeness of the society towards discussing sex empirically and scientifically usually says about the overall openness of the culture. I am not propagating a hedonist world view. Only thing I mean to say is, if people in particular culture are free to discuss sex in an impartial way, it denotes the overall openness.
    History of Sex in India – Erotic Pics of Indian Khajuraho Temple

    Rajneesh Madhok
     
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  19. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
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    rajneesh ji

    I am not certain what the questions on a poll should be. Help me with an example. Then I can adapt it and write other questions to fit.

    Would one question be something like, Should government outlaw cohabitation among unmarried couples?

    I am not sure if that is what you are getting at.
     
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  20. rajneesh madhok

    rajneesh madhok India
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    Dear Narayanjot Kaurji,
    I request you to kindly Put Question before the members about the Mulit-Sexual relations? Now there are two different opinions and every body is justifying its point about multi-Sexual relations. When we are not getting the decisions on any point then the Author used to go for Poll on the point to seek opinions from the members. The question should be like that and the members should be provided the option to write on the subject and the space should be provided for them. Secondly there should be option to put mark on Yes or No. Because the members those don’t like to describe anything on the subject may be having the choice to participate in the Poll. We shall come to the conclusion after getting the opinions from the members and with Poll results we shall get the knowledge about the thinking of the society as a whole. The person who is taking part in poll should not get the knowledge prior to his/her polling what is the result of the votes made so far. After one poll in the right/ wrong/ Does not say anything then only he/ she should have the knowledge of the percentage of votes in favour and against.
    If any member want to provide detail then he/she should be asked prior to his/her post whether your opinion should be published or not? This is a sensitive matter and there may be some members those don’t like to disclose their identity.

    Your example is also appealing that Should Government outlaw cohabitation among unmarried couples?
    I hope that we shall be able to get the opinions of the members and after that the data can be compiled.



    Rajneesh Madhok
     
  21. spnadmin

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    I can create a poll at the top of the thread that would be completely anonymous. But maybe I need to put some questions together and have you take a look to see if they have covered your concerns.

    Another idea would be for members to post questions for the poll in this thread, and I would convert them at the end of the week to an interactive SPN poll.
     

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