Hinduism Kinds Of Raam?

[kds1980]

from my view point and limited understanding,

Raam as used in SGGS is representation of Almighty

How can we read Hindu scriptures differently?

how can we have different glasses

anyways...

i am not defending caste system or anything, they have no relevance. However every religion has different concept to approach the pursuit of becoming one with almighty.

so be it.

what ticks me off is show off of half baked understanding and eagerness to show "my way is best"

ofcourse i am human too

With my little knowledge of hinduism i just want to say that raam was already a sacred naame before the birth of ramchandra.

 

[Archived_member2]

Pray Truth for all and say Satsriakaal!
Dear all and Jatinder Jee!

Quote "would it be possible for you elaborate more on the Shabad / guide you mentioned in the response?"
Thanks for your invitation to extend the Satsang. Perhaps we may go through line by line later.

This is my understanding for the wonderful Sabad from Kabeer Jee.


ਕਬੀਰ ਰਾਮ ਕਹਨ ਮਹਿ ਭੇਦੁ ਹੈ ਤਾ ਮਹਿ ਏਕੁ ਬਿਚਾਰੁ ॥
कबीर राम कहन महि भेदु है ता महि एकु बिचारु ॥
Kabīr rām kahan meh bẖėḏ hai ṯā meh ėk bicẖār.
Kabeer, the difference is in saying Raam. In that is one contemplation.

ਸੋਈ ਰਾਮੁ ਸਭੈ ਕਹਹਿ ਸੋਈ ਕਉਤਕਹਾਰ ॥੧੯੦॥
सोई रामु सभै कहहि सोई कउतकहार ॥१९०॥
So*ī rām sabẖai kaheh so*ī ka*uṯakhār. ||190||
The same Raam all speaks. The same is Astonish Creator.

ਕਬੀਰ ਰਾਮੈ ਰਾਮ ਕਹੁ ਕਹਿਬੇ ਮਾਹਿ ਬਿਬੇਕ ॥
कबीर रामै राम कहु कहिबे माहि बिबेक ॥
Kabīr rāmai rām kaho kahibė māhi bibėk.
Kabeer say Raamay Raam. In saying is conscience.

ਏਕੁ ਅਨੇਕਹਿ ਮਿਲਿ ਗਇਆ ਏਕ ਸਮਾਨਾ ਏਕ ॥੧੯੧॥
एकु अनेकहि मिलि गइआ एक समाना एक ॥१९१॥
Ėk anėkeh mil ga*i*ā ėk samānā ėk. ||191||
ONE is united in numerous. One is merging in one.


Balbir Singh

 

[Archived_member2]

Pray Truth for all and say Satsriakaal!
Dear all!

I find the Gurus singing Raam and HIS Attributes through Gurbaanee.
Raamu, Raamaeeaa, Raamahi, Raamkalee, Raamchand, Raamchandi, Raamchandu, Raamdaas, Raamdaasi, Raamdaasu, Raamdaasaa and Raamdasay are Raam's Attributes.
Also, the perl in the Maalaa of Gurus is well known name Guru Raamdaas Jee.


Balbir Singh

 

[drkhalsa]

Dear Balbir Singh Ji

I think I didint asked the question in right manner or may be you missed it
So I ask Again

here is qoute from your response

The real Guide is the true Sabad. This Sajjan becomes the beloved brotherly companion all the way.

I want you elaborate more on the True Shabad you mentioned here


Thanks

Jatinder Singh

 

[Archived_member2]

Pray Truth for all and say Satsriakaal!
Dear all and Jatinder Jee!

Experiencing true Naam is the exclusive way to realize the truth of Gurbaanee. Otherwise, it is something like the enlightened person singing about light and the blinds discussing His words.

Gurdev is singing His experience.
ਮੰਨੈ ਸੁਰਤਿ ਹੋਵੈ ਮਨਿ ਬੁਧਿ ॥
मंनै सुरति होवै मनि बुधि ॥
Mannai suraṯ hovai man buḏẖ.
Experiencing it, Surati befalls through mind, buddhi.

This is the result of true Sabad. The true Sabad becomes the true Guru within and starts leading. The Surati follows.
Mind is normally running around. Buddhi is normally differentiating prejudicing. Those are not friendly causing troubles and more.

After receiving true Naam it changes. ONE begins to sing. Jeev's Surati expands through mind, buddhi and his existence becoming friendly and Sajjan. The true Naam Sabad also establishes Jeev's communication with this friend.
Please sing with Him. Gurdev is singing.

ਸੁਣਿ ਸਜਣ ਮੇਰੇ ਪ੍ਰੀਤਮ ਭਾਈ ਮੈ ਮੇਲਿਹੁ ਮਿਤ੍ਰੁ ਸੁਖਦਾਤਾ ॥
सुणि सजण मेरे प्रीतम भाई मै मेलिहु मित्रु सुखदाता ॥
Suṇ sajaṇ mėrė parīṯam bẖā*ī mai mėlihu miṯar sukẖ*ḏāṯa.
Listen, Sajjan my beloved brother. The friend the giver of Sukh has met me.

ਓਹੁ ਜੀਅ ਕੀ ਮੇਰੀ ਸਭ ਬੇਦਨ ਜਾਣੈ ਨਿਤ ਸੁਣਾਵੈ ਹਰਿ ਕੀਆ ਬਾਤਾ ॥
ओहु जीअ की मेरी सभ बेदन जाणै नित सुणावै हरि कीआ बाता ॥
Oh jī*a kī mėrī sabẖ bėḏan jāṇai niṯ suṇāvai har kī*ā bāṯā. SGGS Ang 564-7
He of the JeeA knows my all torments every day reciting talks of Hari.


Balbir Singh

 

[TGill]

Thanks Balbir ji
Satsriakal !!

 

[drkhalsa]

Thanks! Balbir Singh JI

for your Post!

Gurdev is singing His experience.
ਮੰਨੈ ਸੁਰਤਿ ਹੋਵੈ ਮਨਿ ਬੁਧਿ ॥
मंनै सुरति होवै मनि बुधि ॥
Mannai suraṯ hovai man buḏẖ.
Experiencing it, Surati befalls through mind, buddhi.

Mannai word used in this tuk denotes the experience of True Naam/True Shabad/Flash of light to a blind as I understood from your post

does this this word Mannai is used in same context rest of the Tuks along with this in Japuji Sahib as here below


ਮੰਨੈ ਸੁਰਤਿ ਹੋਵੈ ਮਨਿ ਬੁਧਿ ॥
मंनै सुरति होवै मनि बुधि ॥
Mannai suraṯ hovai man buḏẖ.
The faithful have intuitive awareness and intelligence.

ਮੰਨੈ ਸਗਲ ਭਵਣ ਕੀ ਸੁਧਿ ॥
मंनै सगल भवण की सुधि ॥
Mannai sagal bẖavaṇ kī suḏẖ.
The faithful know about all worlds and realms.

ਮੰਨੈ ਮੁਹਿ ਚੋਟਾ ਨਾ ਖਾਇ ॥
मंनै मुहि चोटा ना खाइ ॥
Mannai muhi cẖotā nā kẖā­ė.
The faithful shall never be struck across the face.

ਮੰਨੈ ਜਮ ਕੈ ਸਾਥਿ ਨ ਜਾਇ ॥
मंनै जम कै साथि न जाइ ॥
Mannai jam kai sāth na jā­ė.
The faithful do not have to go with the Messenger of Death.

ਐਸਾ ਨਾਮੁ ਨਿਰੰਜਨੁ ਹੋਇ ॥
ऐसा नामु निरंजनु होइ ॥
Aisā nām niranjan ho­ė.
Such is the Name of the Immaculate Lord.

ਜੇ ਕੋ ਮੰਨਿ ਜਾਣੈ ਮਨਿ ਕੋਇ ॥੧੩॥
जे को मंनि जाणै मनि कोइ ॥१३॥
Jė ko man jāṇai man ko­ė. ||13||
Only one who has faith comes to know such a state of mind. ||13||

ਮੰਨੈ ਮਾਰਗਿ ਠਾਕ ਨ ਪਾਇ ॥
मंनै मारगि ठाक न पाइ ॥
Mannai mārag ṯẖāk na pā­ė.
The path of the faithful shall never be blocked.

ਮੰਨੈ ਪਤਿ ਸਿਉ ਪਰਗਟੁ ਜਾਇ ॥
मंनै पति सिउ परगटु जाइ ॥
Mannai paṯ si­o pargat jā­ė.
The faithful shall depart with honor and fame.

ਮੰਨੈ ਮਗੁ ਨ ਚਲੈ ਪੰਥੁ ॥
मंनै मगु न चलै पंथु ॥
Mannai mag na cẖalai panth.
The faithful do not follow empty religious rituals.

ਮੰਨੈ ਧਰਮ ਸੇਤੀ ਸਨਬੰਧੁ ॥
मंनै धरम सेती सनबंधु ॥
Mannai ḏẖaram sėṯī san­banḏẖ.
The faithful are firmly bound to the Dharma.

ਐਸਾ ਨਾਮੁ ਨਿਰੰਜਨੁ ਹੋਇ ॥
ऐसा नामु निरंजनु होइ ॥
Aisā nām niranjan ho­ė.
Such is the Name of the Immaculate Lord.

ਜੇ ਕੋ ਮੰਨਿ ਜਾਣੈ ਮਨਿ ਕੋਇ ॥੧੪॥
जे को मंनि जाणै मनि कोइ ॥१४॥
Jė ko man jāṇai man ko­ė. ||14||
Only one who has faith comes to know such a state of mind. ||14||

ਮੰਨੈ ਪਾਵਹਿ ਮੋਖੁ ਦੁਆਰੁ ॥
मंनै पावहि मोखु दुआरु ॥
Mannai pāvahi mokẖ ḏu­ār.
The faithful find the Door of Liberation.

ਮੰਨੈ ਪਰਵਾਰੈ ਸਾਧਾਰੁ ॥
मंनै परवारै साधारु ॥
Mannai parvārai sāḏẖār.
The faithful uplift and redeem their family and relations.

ਮੰਨੈ ਤਰੈ ਤਾਰੇ ਗੁਰੁ ਸਿਖ ॥
मंनै तरै तारे गुरु सिख ॥
Mannai ṯarai ṯārė gur sikẖ.
The faithful are saved, and carried across with the Sikhs of the Guru.

ਮੰਨੈ ਨਾਨਕ ਭਵਹਿ ਨ ਭਿਖ ॥
मंनै नानक भवहि न भिख ॥
Mannai Nānak bẖavahi na bẖikẖ.
The faithful, O Nanak, do not wander around begging.

ਐਸਾ ਨਾਮੁ ਨਿਰੰਜਨੁ ਹੋਇ ॥
ऐसा नामु निरंजनु होइ ॥
Aisā nām niranjan ho­ė.
Such is the Name of the Immaculate Lord.

ਜੇ ਕੋ ਮੰਨਿ ਜਾਣੈ ਮਨਿ ਕੋਇ ॥੧੫॥
जे को मंनि जाणै मनि कोइ ॥१५॥
Jė ko man jāṇai man ko­ė. ||15||
Only one who has faith comes to know such a state of mind. ||15||





also one more question what does word

"Suṇi­ai " means in your understanding in the preceding tuks in Japuji as given below




ਸੁਣਿਐ ਸਿਧ ਪੀਰ ਸੁਰਿ ਨਾਥ ॥
सुणिऐ सिध पीर सुरि नाथ ॥
Suṇi­ai siḏẖ pīr sur nāth.
Listening-the Siddhas, the spiritual teachers, the heroic warriors, the yogic masters.

ਸੁਣਿਐ ਧਰਤਿ ਧਵਲ ਆਕਾਸ ॥
सुणिऐ धरति धवल आकास ॥
Suṇi­ai ḏẖaraṯ ḏẖaval ākās.
Listening-the earth, its support and the Akaashic ethers.

ਸੁਣਿਐ ਦੀਪ ਲੋਅ ਪਾਤਾਲ ॥
सुणिऐ दीप लोअ पाताल ॥
Suṇi­ai ḏīp lo­a pāṯāl.
Listening-the oceans, the lands of the world and the nether regions of the underworld.

ਸੁਣਿਐ ਪੋਹਿ ਨ ਸਕੈ ਕਾਲੁ ॥
सुणिऐ पोहि न सकै कालु ॥
Suṇi­ai pohi na sakai kāl.
Listening-Death cannot even touch you.

ਨਾਨਕ ਭਗਤਾ ਸਦਾ ਵਿਗਾਸੁ ॥
नानक भगता सदा विगासु ॥
Nānak bẖagṯā saḏā vigās.
O Nanak, the devotees are forever in bliss.

ਸੁਣਿਐ ਦੂਖ ਪਾਪ ਕਾ ਨਾਸੁ ॥੮॥
सुणिऐ दूख पाप का नासु ॥८॥
Suṇi­ai ḏūkẖ pāp kā nās. ||8||
Listening-pain and sin are erased. ||8||

ਸੁਣਿਐ ਈਸਰੁ ਬਰਮਾ ਇੰਦੁ ॥
सुणिऐ ईसरु बरमा इंदु ॥
Suṇi­ai īsar barmā inḏ.
Listening-Shiva, Brahma and Indra.

ਸੁਣਿਐ ਮੁਖਿ ਸਾਲਾਹਣ ਮੰਦੁ ॥
सुणिऐ मुखि सालाहण मंदु ॥
Suṇi­ai mukẖ sālāhaṇ manḏ.
Listening-even foul-mouthed people praise Him.

ਸੁਣਿਐ ਜੋਗ ਜੁਗਤਿ ਤਨਿ ਭੇਦ ॥
सुणिऐ जोग जुगति तनि भेद ॥
Suṇi­ai jog jugaṯ ṯan bẖėḏ.
Listening-the technology of Yoga and the secrets of the body.

ਸੁਣਿਐ ਸਾਸਤ ਸਿਮ੍ਰਿਤਿ ਵੇਦ ॥
सुणिऐ सासत सिम्रिति वेद ॥
Suṇi­ai sāsaṯ simriṯ vėḏ.
Listening-the Shaastras, the Simritees and the Vedas.

ਨਾਨਕ ਭਗਤਾ ਸਦਾ ਵਿਗਾਸੁ ॥
नानक भगता सदा विगासु ॥
Nānak bẖagṯā saḏā vigās.
O Nanak, the devotees are forever in bliss.


Thanks again for your Help!


Jatinder Singh

 

[Archived_member2]

Pray Truth for all and say Satsriakaal!
Dear all and Jatinder Jee!

Quote "Mannai word used in this tuk denotes the experience of True Naam/True Shabad/Flash of light to a blind as I understood from your post

does this this word Mannai is used in same context rest of the Tuks along with this in Japuji Sahib as here below"

I feel asking a basic question. Why should one agree till it has become his experience? 'Mannay' is the experience that belongs to one for always.
The preachers and translators are trying to convince all with just the opposite. They plead to believe in true experience they are searching since many lives.

**************

Quote " also one more question what does word "Suṇi­ai " means in your understanding in the preceding tuks in Japuji as given below"

Dear Jatinder Jee, The experience of the true Sabad belongs to one when he receives it through the mouth of the Sat Guroo. The seeker listens, before it becomes his experience. The Sat Guroo sings it before one listens.

All the rituals that the bhaykh-dhaaree Baabaas are doing in Gurudwaras have nothing to do with the true Guru's Wisdom.

**************

I thank all for their love and the corner they have given me in their heart. It is a true palace for me. I hope I can maintain it.

The true wisdom of Naam is open for everybody. True seekers always receive it with God's Grace.
It never falls in the hands of wrong minded people.


Balbir Singh

 

[drkhalsa]

Balbir Singh JI Satsriakal!

Yes you answered all my curosities that to say till now !
Will be back with more questions soon

Thanks again everybody for there presence

Jatinder Singh