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Is God a Conscious Entity from the Perspective of Sikhism?

Discussion in 'Sikh Sikhi Sikhism' started by Harman Singh, Mar 7, 2007.

  1. Harman Singh

    Harman Singh
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    Is god a conscious entity?

    Do we have free will or do we obey his will only and are nothing but mindless pawns acting out the inevitable?

    Why do we have to do anything other than simran, when simran is the way to open your mind and let the positive energy flow into you, I don't understand jap ji sahib and nor do I feel there is any added bonus in taking the time to recite it all everyday other than showing discipline and devotion, when that time can be used for much more important things? Also reading the english translation of japi sahib give me feelings of a calsh between the philosophy of sikhi i feel true and grew up learning with the actual preachings of the jap ji sahib


    How can a perfect god create something imperfect?

    When the gurus said they wrote the Bani as direct word of god, was waheguru, this higher state of "energy" that runs through all has life, actually speaking through them and the pen flowed and wrote the direct word of god, or was it, they meditated and wrote what they had discovered through their own enlightenment? Because, some sites I've read that guru Nanak was god himself reincarnate, others I've read he was a teacher, others that he was a 'prophet'. Am I supposed to believe he went into a river and came out three days later enlightened?


    Of all those questions, my main one is, how can god be conscious? why does he not answer prayers of true devotees (not myself specifically, but I have seen people of strong faith always be upset and dwell on why god hates them). I'm a man of science and logic, and I still believe in sikhi but I find some things very odd and it's really starting to bother me seeing people around me balme everything on gods will when they need to realise they control their lives and what's ahppening around them. I am just getting back into simran and I wish my faith could be stronger, but I refuse to believe there is a "god" who allows this suffering when he has control over it, I like to think of it more as the energy of life that links every living being, an unconscious creator that is in itself "supreme life". If something happens, it is not "gods will" rather a bunch of logical actions and reactions leading to that event, in which there is no super human intervention. I can believe stronger in most of what is preached, only if this is true, that there is no super human intervention in anything... sorry if I’m rambling but it's always on my mind and I’m at a very awkward stage in my life where I want to find myself again and remove myself from this cycle of wasting my precious time and my decisions are going to really effect the people I'm around. More specifically I have a friend who is contimplating suicide and is a very nice person but feels god continues to let her down time and time again, and her prayers are never answered, but I try to explain to her that she needs to take control and that there is no intervention and praying for htings to change won't make them change, she has to do ti herself and see that there is no super human intervention that is going to make her life better. She grew up in an all girls christian schol but her parents are backwards punjabi parents with stupid stubborn thinking.

    sorry again if I'm rambling but if someone can help me make sense of this I would really appreciate this. I know this isn't a support group site or anything, and it's selfish of me to come here and not contribute but take information, but if not here then where right?

    Thanks again,
    Harman Singh.






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  3. Ishminder

    Ishminder
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    Re: Some questions...

    WHen you meditate, you will see. It may seem weird, but do the mool mantar in japji sahib and it has your answer there about what is god. As for the rest of your questions, I highly recommend you read a book called "Gods Debris: A Thought Experiment" by Scott Adams. Private message me when you are done and we can talk more after. Good luck.
     
  4. Harman Singh

    Harman Singh
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    Re: Some questions...

    one of my favourite books, if not my favourite.

    Read it twice, last time about a year ago.
     
  5. vaapaaraa

    vaapaaraa
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    Re: Some questions...

    In the mool mantra, God is a purakh, a being, a person, who is the kartaa, doer of all that was, is, will be.

    who created all this expanse? Do you think; that one all encompassing being does not have the ability to be

    unseen and pervading all over. Purakh is a being, conscious of us, if was not, then Guru Nanak Sahib ji would

    not have written the line.

    "kar kar vaykhai nadar nihaal"

    Our creator is constantly watching us.

    logical actions and reactions? I totally agree, I believe this is known as the hukam.
    complex logic is beyond our ability to understand requiring powerful super computers

    we are constantly trying to improve our super computers to develop more advanced.

    We are not finding the ultimate supercomputer.
    This is because, We are confronted with infinity. We will always need "a better supercomputer".
    This infinity is the kartaa purakh

    Do you know the first cause in the logic action reaction?
    if you are going to say its the big bang. Then what is before the big bang?

    Kartaa purakh
    aad sach is the cause of causes.

    I went through suffering as well.... learned important thing, brought me closer to God. I couldnt change

    anything. Its hukam.

    we have to love God, and accept Hukam, knowing that our haumai has no power to do as it likes, hukam dictates

    all. Remember God at all times and be carefree abiding in hukam.
     
  6. Harman Singh

    Harman Singh
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    Re: Some questions...

    "Do you think; that one all encompassing being does not have the ability to be unseen and pervading all over. Purakh is a being, conscious of us, if was not, then Guru Nanak Sahib ji would not have written the line.
    "kar kar vaykhai nadar nihaal"
    Our creator is constantly watching us."

    Pervading? Yes.

    Dr. Santokh Singh says: God, the Supreme Being, Himself is the Creator (Kartaa), and being immanent in His Creation, is All Pervasive and fills all beings (Purakh). He is thus Omniscient, knowing each one's inner mind, and Omnipotent, doing everything everywhere - evoluting, sustaining, and involuting.

    When they say he is fills all beings and in each's inner mind, that can be our "id" and if this energy is within us and we are concious of ourselves then in essence waheguru too is conscious of us. However, my main point was that he may be "watching us" but does not intervene in our lives, something does not happen because god wanted it to happen or it is in his will, we have free will.
     
  7. kaur-1

    kaur-1
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  8. vaapaaraa

    vaapaaraa
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    Re: Some questions...


    Also, you can read this short story below, If we allow God to help us, to intervene in our lives, then we can be helped.

    phorum - message board
     
  9. Harman Singh

    Harman Singh
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    Re: Some questions...

    Alright, I'm sorry but I have to play devils advocate here. If I got my arm chopped off, why can't god, with all his power and will, grow it back? If he can get that man the job he so badly wanted, why can he not make my arm grow back?

    I heard stories like that growing up form my mother all the time but stories are just that.... Sorry but that wasn't a very convincing link vaapaaraa. And Kaur-1 I will read your article tomorrow I have to run right now.
     
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  10. vaapaaraa

    vaapaaraa
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    Re: Some questions...

    It's no use telling or listening stories that are rooted in faith, if one doesnt develop faith within.

    Seems you are lacking faith in the power of Vaahiguroo, thats what you need.
    pray to Vaahiguroo with faith. faith develops bit by bit at a time, in one day, you won't have the faith, that will move mountains, it comes from your own inner spiritual expereince. It strengthens it, and makes it stronger day by day.
     
  11. QUEST1984

    QUEST1984
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    Re: Some questions...

    One night a man had a dream. He dreamedhe was walking along the beach with the LORD.
    Across the sky flashed scenes from his life.
    For each scene he noticed two sets of
    footprints in the sand: one belonging
    to him, and the other to the LORD.
    When the last scene of his life flashed before him,
    he looked back at the footprints in the sand.
    He noticed that many times along the path of
    his life there was only one set of footprints.
    He also noticed that it happened at the very
    lowest and saddest times in his life.
    This really bothered him and he
    questioned the LORD about it:
    "LORD, you said that once I decided to follow
    you, you'd walk with me all the way.
    But I have noticed that during the most
    troublesome times in my life,
    there is only one set of footprints.
    I don't understand why when
    I needed you most you would leave me."
    The LORD replied:
    "My son, my precious child,
    I love you and I would never leave you.
    During your times of trial and suffering,
    when you see only one set of footprints,
    it was then that I carried you."



    Mary Stevenson 1936
     
  12. badmash

    badmash
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    Re: Some questions...

    Or are the atheists correct? Is all our piety, religousness and prayer a salve for our inability to really face the possibility there is no God at all?

    It always strikes me as odd that people often ignore all the horror in the world, as if somehow all this misery we see around us is sanctioned or beneath the radar of a supreme being.

    I do not know the answer. But more and more, I question blind faith itself, as it is
    many ways irrational in the absence of any tangible, concrete, "obvious" evidence of a God. And it is not merely sufficient to invoke the elusiveness of the supreme being as the mark of its existence, there should be more hard analysis of our human psyche and our meek acceptance of "it must be so".

    In the end, it is all subjective anyway, and what is right in one's skull is one's rightful outlook. But if faith helps to sustain a person, it is a good thing.

    Sincerely
     
  13. badmash

    badmash
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    Re: Some questions...

    Or are the atheists correct? Is all our piety, religousness and prayer a salve for our inability to really face the possibility there is no God at all?

    It always strikes me as odd that people often ignore all the horror in the world, as if somehow all this misery we see around us is sanctioned or beneath the radar of a supreme being.

    I do not know the answer. But more and more, I question blind faith itself, as it is
    many ways irrational in the absence of any tangible, concrete, "obvious" evidence of a God. And it is not merely sufficient to invoke the elusiveness of the supreme being as the mark of its existence, there should be more hard analysis of our human psyche and our meek acceptance of "it must be so".

    In the end, it is all subjective anyway, and what is right in one's skull is one's rightful outlook. But if faith helps to sustain a person, it is a good thing.

    Sincerely
     
  14. spnadmin

    spnadmin United States
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    Re: Some questions...

    Discussions in this thread should address Sikhism. Comparisons of Sikhism with other faiths should be posted in Interfaith Dialogs. Thank you.
     

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