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Goal of Human Life

Discussion in 'Gurmat Vichaar' started by Sikh80, Dec 9, 2007.

  1. Sikh80

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  3. Sinister

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    Re: Goal Of Human Life

    These are my personal Views … take what you wish from them

    Goal Of Human Life
    To contemplate such a question is beyond arrogance. Some riddles are best left unsolved. This is well beyond You and I.

    Man's creation could not have been meaningless.
    Explain? You seem sure of this. For me, Meaning is what you make of it.

    There are three parts to man - the body, the mind, and the soul.
    The former two entities may just be synonymous.

    Man regards himself as a separate entity because of egoism. When the wall of egoism is broken man realizes his identity with God.
    If god created everything then god created ego and then ego must also have a purpose or goal or value. Ego should be an entity equally respected, if it is truly god that created man.


    According to Sikhism, the individual soul has arrived to the human form after going through innumerable cycles of birth and death.
    According to Sikhism we are always required to wear a kachera.

    The goal of human life is, to try, to integrate the individual personality with God.
    A task complete with incomprehensibility.



    Im going to leave you with a quote:

    God created man, but man returned the favour

    cheers brethren.
     
  4. Sikh80

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    Re: Goal Of Human Life

    Hi Sinister ji,
    Ssa,

    Nice to see your post. I am reminded of a poem titled 'Man - a perfect Blunder of God'. I shall post it if I can lay my hands on. But the poem is written in a very sentimental and emotional manner. In normal course it is likely to make one sad. Likewise some posts that contain some element of dejection can always be detected and make other feel low.

    All the Best to All.
     
  5. S|kH

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    Re: Goal Of Human Life

    Meaning is what you make out of it. If your implying life has an objective meaning (such as God gave us all one unified meaning), except to reproduce, I fail to see it (as does the scientific community).


    Two of these parts have a thorough scientific understanding. The "Soul" can either be defined as the "mind" or "non-existant". My question to you is .. how do you know that following a strict moral discipline will result in a "happy / better" soul ? Maybe its the exact opposite, maybe the epiphany some elder person had on-top of a mountain about how to control societies was wrong. I have written and logical answers on how to keep your mind and body healthy and better, which generally increases your life (in terms of quantity -- quality is always subjective, we're referring to things that have objective control, god).

    Let's take for example the act of pre-marital sex, which is usually against any strict moral discipline. You claim this act effects the soul, and that God is watching over your every move, and you will face the consequences of it. What are the consequences of such an act (if you remove the variable of an "all-watcher" god)) ? Do people get lonely or sad when eventually the tie or relationship breaks, does that mean that your soul aches/hurts ? Yes, but isn't this more related to the mind's dependence for interaction with another human for happiness, and related to your body's normal functions?

    To sum it up, I fail to see how following a strict moral guideline enhances your soul. These aren't my personal views or what I hold important, I lead a "moral-ful" life due to other reasons, not to enhance my soul or because I'm scared of the all-watcher. Whereas, following a healthy diet, and education enhances your body and mind, respectively. One has proof, the other does not, and can never will (FAITH!).

    Seems strict moral discipline and hide it behind the cover of God was used by leaders to keep power.

    Human kind will always exponentially increase in population. Does this mean that God is allowing more "souls" attempts to break the cycle of life and death? Religious observers argue that our society today has less morals than previous ones, does that mean that these souls are failing, yet God continues to create more? Is ego not a byproduct of the image that God created us in ? Why is it the age of Kaljug, if God is creating more human souls than ever before, maybe God wants it to be this way, maybe we're on the right path and God is rewarding us with more souls and opportunities to break the vicious cycle?

    How does God have a "destiny" for man if we were not created, and we were a byproduct of evolution? Evolution will continue, and something will eventually replace the human species. IF you were to argue that "evolution is millions of years in our time but a blink for god" then why did he waste all the other souls of animals prior to creating the human? Better yet, if he has a destiny, and he created us, why will we eventually be replaced? Your argument against man being obsessed with materialistic things can be changed the other way, why are certain men totally obsessed with things they can't see or feel the need to have an all-watcher around them? What leads a better life ? Isn't that subjective, for you to answer, your assuming you have figured out the madness that is God, but yet you say he's incomprehensible...

    Life is like a game of cards, but no one is peering over your shoulder. Cards has no destiny or faith. A game of cards relies on strict probability. The cards are given to the player; it is up to the player to play well, badly, wisely or foolishly. The rest is random probability. Human life is just that, human life.

    To claim the goal of human life is spiritual attainment is a pretty bold statement. One that is beyond our realm of intelligence, and is one that we will always have to accept as such -- there is no answer to it.
     
  6. Sikh80

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    Re: Goal Of Human Life

    Dear friend ,

    I think that one can analyse the goal of life from two angles :


    1.within the periphery of Sikhism and sprituality.

    and

    2. The second being as a Human being who knows nothing about what was there before the Birth and what it would be after the death.

    If one makes an assumption to follow the second route ,it is felt that one will feel lost and shall not be able to rationally think as to who we are and why we are here and where will we be going after death. In the second stage there is no answer. One will be driven insane if one accepts the second proposition. It would be toatlly illogical. I am not saying as a protagonist of sikhi but as a ordinary human being. In this state one will be required to take the bearings. One will have to establish the value system for one self and one may go weird in this procees. Having no faith to recourse to it is difficult to have an objective view point of anything. It is only when we identify with something that is established and fairly stable that one gets some comfort.

    The point of view as per the sl.1 is fairly well known. i.e.
    GOBIND MILAN KEY EH TERI BARIA......................

    The Gurus believed that this life has a purpose and a goal. It offers an opportunity for self and God realization. Moreover man is responsible for his own actions. He cannot claim immunity from the results of his actions. He must therefore be very vigilant in what he does. Finally, the Sikh Scripture (Sri Guru Granth Sahib) is the perpetual Guru. This is the only religion that has given the Holy Book the status of a religious preceptor. There is no place for a living human Guru (Dehdhari) in Sikh religion.

    Sikhism emphasizes Bhakti Marg or the path of devotion. It does, however, recognizes the limited value of Gyan Marg(Path of Knowledge) and Karam Marg(Path of Action) [2]. It also lays stress on the need for earning God's Grace in order to reach the spiritual goal. Sikh has the right to action but not to its results as the latter is dependent upon HIS grace. One should persuade himself that fruits of action i.e achieving salvation as per the teachings of SGGS ji and assume that the result simply does not exist. Sikh should not desire any fruits and neither should he grow disillusioned with action. In any case one would get the results of Karmas in the next births/Incarnations as per the edict contained in the SGGS ji. On a macro level a seeker has a right to action as per the teachings, but not to its fruits. At the same time seeker/aspirant/sikh ought not to lose faith that results in doubts and duality in the performance of the duties. In other words, he should be constantly and devotedly engaged in its performance of praise of lord and devotion durimg the service of the Almighty. It has been stated that worship of the lord /worship of the one God is the only worthwhile action. The human body is meant for worship of God is pointed at more than one places in the SGGS ji.


    1.siqguir syivAY nwmu min vsY ivchu BRmu Bau BwgY ] (590-10, vfhMsu, mÚ 3)
    [Serving the True Guru, the Naam comes to abide in the mind, and doubts and fears run away.]


    2.hir hir nwmu AvKdu muiK pwieAw jn nwnk suiK vsMqI ]4]12]62] (625-2, soriT, mÚ 5)

    [The Lord, Har, Har, has placed the medicine of the Naam into my mouth; servant Nanak abides in peace. ]


    E&OE.
     
  7. Sinister

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    Re: Goal Of Human Life

    Hello Sikh80

    I'd love to read it. I've always been a fan of poetic philosophy.
    maybe i could find it...but who's the author?


    cheers










    Hello SIKH
    nice discourse and analysis
    well I obviously agree with you.

    cheers
     
  8. Sikh80

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    Re: Goal Of Human Life

    My dear Siny.,

    I shall post it as and when I find it. But dear friend why do you feel so low. Life will always be like this whether U r 27 or 37.
    have faith in HIM.





    That is all. Leave everything to HIM. He has to take care Of us. If HE cannot, HE is not He but only a he.
     
  9. Randip Singh

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    Re: Goal Of Human Life

    If the there are three parts to man/woman - mind body and soul, how does Miri - Piri sit in this? or Shakti and Bhagti?
     
  10. Sinister

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    Re: Goal Of Human Life


    i dont feel low:}{}{}:, but im not against feeling low considering its one of those natural human emotions that enriches our life.

    could you imagine being happy all the time?t
     
  11. Sikh80

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    Re: Goal Of Human Life

    Yes, enrichment of soul is the only benefit that we have on this earth. If one does not feel low one should not feel the need of enrichment as one who is satisfied can never feel low,.
    Regads.
    [It is past 12.35 a.m here I shall take your leave unless you have something urgent for which I shall wait for 3/4 minutes .......love./regards'/.
     
  12. Sikh80

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    Re: Goal Of Human Life

    Dear Randip,
    ssa.
    Shakti and bhakti go on side by side. Physical power is immaterail and inconsequenial. A banyan tree lives for 5000 years . But what is the use of it. A man worth 42 year [guru gibind singh ji sahib was only 42 when he breathed his last] is ten times better than any one age wise.
    What do you think?
     
  13. Sikh80

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    Re: Goal Of Human Life

    Hi Siny.........

    I am posting the shabad that states 'the attitude' that may be helpful sometimes.

    gauVI pUrbI ]
    Gauree Poorbee:
    surg bwsu n bwCIAY frIAY n nrik invwsu ]
    Don't wish for a home in heaven, and don't be afraid to live in hell.
    honw hY so hoeI hY mnih n kIjY Aws ]1]
    Whatever will be will be, so don't get your hopes up in your mind. ||1||

    rmeIAw gun gweIAY ]
    Sing the Glorious Praises of the Lord,

    jw qy pweIAY prm inDwnu ]1] rhwau ]
    from whom the most excellent treasure is obtained. ||1||Pause||

    ikAw jpu ikAw qpu sMjmo ikAw brqu ikAw iesnwnu ]
    What good is chanting, penance or self-mortification? What good is fasting or cleansing baths,

    jb lgu jugiq n jwnIAY Bwau Bgiq Bgvwn ]2]
    unless you know the way to worship the Lord God with loving devotion? ||2||

    sMpY dyiK n hrKIAY ibpiq dyiK n roie ]
    Don't feel so delighted at the sight of wealth, and don't weep at the sight of suffering and adversity.

    ijau sMpY iqau ibpiq hY ibD ny ricAw so hoie ]3]
    As is wealth, so is adversity; whatever the Lord proposes, comes to pass. ||3||

    kih kbIr Ab jwinAw sMqn irdY mJwir ]
    Says Kabeer, now I know that the Lord dwells within the hearts of His Saints;

    syvk so syvw Bly ijh Gt bsY murwir ]4]1]12]63]
    that servant performs the best service, whose heart is filled with the Lord. ||4||1||12||63||


    This is Kabir Sahibs Bani. Sometimes., I wonder as to who translated the Bani of Kabeer ji in Gurmukhi. Anyways, It is nice sabad.
     
  14. Sikh80

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    Re: Goal Of Human Life

    • Naam the Ultimate Liberator and the Goal of Life
    • Naam literally means, the Name(singular). A fuller definition of the word can only be found within the Guru Granth Sahib itself. Naam is God’s Word, or the Divine Essence. Etymologically, the word has a striking resemblance with the Greek neumena or the Bright Essence as opposed to phenomena. Naam is not merely the ‘Name of God’ as is commonly believed; it symbolizes the Being of God filling all Creation. Naam is also referred to as Shabad in the SGGS.
    • Where there was no creation, there was nothing in existence – no air, light, water, earth or space. God existed alone in deep meditation and self absorption. When God willed for the manifestations of his values, He created universes, worlds and all material and other living beings by uttering a single Word. His Word is all pervasive and the sole source of all Creation; the Word created the universes and supports and sustains all things within them. The Sri Guru Granth Sahib further enlightens us that God’s Word turned into waves of light, rays of which are present in all creatures and all other parts of His creation. This is consistent with a fundamental principle of physics that sound vibrations, when increased several fold, change into waves of light.
    • This Essence / Naam / Shabad / Logus is formless, colorless, and featureless but, as said, is present in all creation. There is no plant, no creature, in what it is not. The Earth and other heavenly bodies exist because there is Naam in this universe and when God withdraws this Naam from this Universe, there are natural calamities (Parloh / Mahaparloh) all over the universe and this is the time that the universe perishes and all the living creatures perish. Being so, the Essence can’t be seen or visualised by the mind. We can see only the physical dimension of Reality in God’s Creation – mountains, plants, trees, creatures etc. Thus the Outer Shell of Reality holds us (the appearances delude us) and we cannot penetrate deeper to experience the all pervading Reality. The physical dimensions of Reality (the outer shell) is always in flux; it keeps changing. While birth, death, creation, destruction etc. occur in the physical dimensions of creation, the Essence, being Sat (Sat-Naam) never changes, it transcends space and time.
    • We cannot focus our mind or attention on God, who is Absolute, the invisible Essence. The Naam (SHABD), the Name of God is the only medium available to us for approaching Him.
    • The term Naam refers to 5 realms / domains / functional groups / aspects / phases of GOD's CREATION. A human being has to pass through first four realms and finally be accountable to GOD in the realm of SachKhand (literally 'TRUE Phase').
    • SachKhand is perceived to be a realm where GOD seeks account of TRUTHs & Falsities earned by the soul during one's life. Based on this account, GOD rules out disposal of each individual soul for times to come. Truthful souls become part of GOD for ever & never ever get into the cycle of rebirth.
    • Others not having fared well & having lived life as per their own(& not as per GOD's prewritten commandments which accompanied the soul when it was born as a human being.) will are recycled back to be born again as a 'non human' being.
    • The soul thereafter stays in the cycle of death & rebirth as per GOD's Scheme of things. GOD willing, he gets born as human being again and the soul gets another chance to fare well this time by staying in harmony with GOD's commandments through the human life span & so on..
    • TRUE essence of the meaning of Naam can only be realized by believing in & understanding the teachings of SGGS. All who get Naam from the 'Shabad Guru' intuitively discard Falsehood & earn the wealth of Naam through one's life time. When we earn Naam, our soul starts responding to it. It is through Naam that we are able to think of Him, remember Him & live life as per His (& not our own )WILL (ie: Manmukh v Gurmukh).
    • In other words, the Naam is God Himself, subjected to our limited powers of perception and thought and to the capacities of our body and mind. Because we are endowed with the capacity to utter and attentively listen, the continuous recitation of and attentive listening to the Naam (Gurbani) focuses our mind on the object of invocation, resulting in a ceaseless remembrance of God (DHYAAN). This Dhyaan, in turn, results in complete absorption of our consciousness on the thought of God, who responds to our earnest invocation and He reveals Himself in our inner being.
    • The revelation of the Essence of Reality within us is the revelation of Naam. When the revelation of Naam occurs within, the devotee sees the Essence of God pervading throughout His Creation.
    • Gurus have taught that their teachings are for all the religion ( varnas )and all have the right to get the teachings of the Gurus.
    To Initiate our soul so that it starts towards the ultimate goal (SACHKHAND) a person has to repeatedly and continuously earn the wealth of Naam, and to cherish it in the heart all the time – this is the essence of prayer and devotion to God.
    • In Gurbani, the word Gurshabad or [[Shabad] is synonymous with Naam. Without ceaselessly earning the wealth of Naam, God cannot be realised.






    Source:
    Satnam - SikhiWiki, free Sikh encyclopedia.
     
  15. Randip Singh

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    Re: Goal Of Human Life

    For me as a Sikh the Guru's message is simple in terms of my goal.

    1) Be a Gurmukh.

    2) Achieve one by controlling 5 thieves, Kaam , Krodh, mOh ,Lobh and Hankaar.

    3) Control 2) by using Santokh, Sabr etc.
     
  16. Sikh80

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    Re: Goal Of Human Life

    Yes, Sir,
    As usual you should be right. One should get over ego that is stated to be the biggest hurdle in the process of 'yog'.One should have some other virtues besides contentment. This is as per standard text books.e.g.

    Contentment, Compassion,Humility and Love.

    Sikhs do have them in plenty.
    Regards ,Sir
     
  17. Sikh80

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    Re: Goal Of Human Life

    I am enlisting below some of the 'tuks' about gurmukhs for ready reference as well.

    Since you are here only I am posting the followings from the 'sukhmani sahib ji'.It describes at one place the Gurmukh and some attributes and qualities .



    gauVI mhlw 1 ] (227-12)
    Gauree, First Mehl: Gurmukhs
    bolih swcu imiQAw nhI rweI ] (227-12, gauVI, mÚ 1)
    They speak the Truth - not an iota of falsehood.
    cwlih gurmuiK hukim rjweI ] (227-12, gauVI, mÚ 1)
    The Gurmukhs walk in the Way of the Lord's Command.
    rhih AqIq scy srxweI ]1] (227-12, gauVI, mÚ 1)
    They remain unattached, in the Sanctuary of the True Lord. ||1||
    sc Gir bYsY kwlu n johY ] (227-13, gauVI, mÚ 1)
    They dwell in their true home, and Death does not touch them.

    gurmuiK syvw pRwn ADwrw ] (229-18, gauVI, mÚ 3)
    Selfless service is the support of the breath of life of the Gurmukh.
    gurmuiK ivchu haumY jwie ] (230-1, gauVI, mÚ 3)
    The Gurmukh eradicates egotism from within.
    gurmuiK mYlu n lwgY Awie ] (230-1, gauVI, mÚ 3)
    No filth sticks to the Gurmukh.

    gurmuiK krm Drm sic hoeI ] (230-2, gauVI, mÚ 3)
    Through karma and Dharma, good actions and righteous faith, the Gurmukh becomes true.

    gurmuiK Ailpq rhy ilv lweI ]5] (230-13, gauVI, mÚ 3)
    The Gurmukhs remain detached, and lovingly attune themselves to the Lord. ||5||

    gurmuiK myly Awpu gvwey ] (232-18, gauVI, mÚ 3)
    The Gurmukhs shed their ego, and merge with the Lord.

    gurmuiK Bgiq Bwau Duin hoeI ] (415-17, Awsw, mÚ 1)
    The Gurmukh shows his love through loving devotional worship.
    squ sMqoKu sBu scu hY gurmuiK pivqw ] (512-2, gUjrI kI vwr, mÚ 3)
    The Gurmukh is totally truthful, content and pure.
    AMdrhu kptu ivkwru gieAw mnu shjy ijqw ] (512-2, gUjrI kI vwr, mÚ 3)
    Deception and wickedness have departed from within him, and he easily conquers his mind.

    gurmuiK ijs no Awip kry so hoie ] (560-2, vfhMsu, mÚ 3)
    He alone becomes Gurmukh, whom the Lord so blesses.
    gurmuiK sbdu scu krxI swru ] (560-3, vfhMsu, mÚ 3)
    The Gurmukh lives the True Word of the Shabad, and practices good deeds.


    BUT
    jn nwnk kotn mY iknhU gurmuiK hoie pCwnw ]2]2] (685-2, DnwsrI, mÚ 9)
    O servant Nanak, among millions, only a rare few, as Gurmukh, realize God.





    There should be some others that I have not included.
     
  18. Sikh80

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    Re: Goal Of Human Life

    In nutshell the goal of human life will be God realization and 'jog'.One should be a perfect human being and should be engaged in HIS devotional worship. This is the best job and highest Karma in this life.
     
  19. Sikh80

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  20. Sinister

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    Re: Goal Of Human Life


    i accept the second route and im not insane. How do you explain that?
    Not only I but A huge population accept the second route and they form some of the most culturally rich countries in the world.

    Your logic is misguided because you have internalized religious propaganda. Humanism for me has all the answers, just like sikhism has all the answers for you (a position that should be equally respected...rather than labelling someone else is beleifs as agents of insanity). In humanism the part where you cannot conjure answers you simply state; "i do not know" instead of manufacturing a god. Your development of morality is independant of your belief in God.

    Have you ever heard of altruism? If you study human social evolution you would know that doing "the right thing" is rational and is just one of many factors in human evolution.
    Altruism: The selfless concern for the welfare of others.

    let me show you a video
    YouTube - An Atheist's 10 Commandments

    and if your primary reason for turning to religion is for "comfort"...then that is well and good. I personally turn to my love for family and freinds and gardening for comfort, not religion. In fact whenever I examine religion I feel the least comfortable, all it can effectively achieve is to wind me up with more questions. especially when i start to read bani.

    cheers
     
  21. Sikh80

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    Re: Goal Of Human Life

    Yes, You are right.
    Everyone has one's choice in these matters.
    Regards
     

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