Hinduism Avatars Of Vishnu And The Satguru

[Astroboy]

Re: Q&A with Sant Jagjit Singh ji Harkhowal

The Upanishads: Meditate to Find Gnosis of the One
All is change [samsara] in the world of the senses,
But changeless is the supreme Lord of Love.
Meditate on him, be absorbed in him.
Wake up from this dream of separateness.
Know God and all fetters will fall away.
No longer identifying yourself
With the body, go beyond birth and death.
All your desires will be fulfilled in him
Who is One without a second.
Know him to be enshrined in your heart
always.
Truly there is nothing more in Life to know.
Meditate and realise this world
Is filled with the presence of God.
--- The Shvetashvatara Upanishad, Hindu Scripture
"The Upanishads", Eknath Easwaran translation

Rig Veda Samhita​

[Translated into English by Pravesh K. Singh]

​

"Indrasya sakhyamribhavah samaanashurmanornapaato apaso dadhanvire.
Saudhanvanaaso amritatvamerire vishtvee shameebhih sukritah sukrityayaa."
TRANSLATION:
May the learned persons, illuminated and rendered more capable owing to acquiring the true knowledge and true justice, attain to the company of the Majestic Supreme Lord or the Most Prosperous Emperor (i.e. God). May the reflective men take on the highest or supreme actions which do not allow their mind to decline or fall down into abominable/despicable/avoidable acts, or, may the reflective and thoughtful people be conscientious, righteous in their actions! May those persons of the highest wisdom attain to the ultimate immortality (freedom from rebirth) reaching into the highest realm of the Supreme Lord by being the best sons or disciples and displaying righteous peace-yielding conduct! Further, may the adept and learned people perform wise actions and being equipped with the best of means perform the highest actions in the most artistic or sublime way! May with their (rightful worldly) actions they make a name for themselves in their country and earn their livelihood!
COMMENTARY (by Maharshi Mehi Paramhans):
This sacred verse counsels one to accept the disciple-hood of a Guru possessing the highest knowledge, and to be righteous in one's conduct so as to attain to immortality by ascending oneself into the loftiest of realms, the realm of God, and also to make worldly progress by being learned, conscientious and adept-at-work thus getting proximity and attracting the attention of the King, the rulers, or the higher authorities. Vedas do not command to devote all the time and resources at one's disposal only to efforts for attaining Moksha (liberation) forsaking the duties towards the nation (and other worldly & household assignments). It instructs to make a balanced progress on both the fronts. That who performs actions as ordained by true knowledge is a Karmayogi; he, having attained the state of equipoise and equanimity, also keeps discharging his worldly duties. But the learning and initiation into the right methodology or way for attaining such a sublime state cannot be possible without humbly seeking the noble company of, and reverence for a Sadguru. Verse 34 of chapter 4, verse 6 of chapter 13 and verse 14 of chapter 16 of the sacred book "Shrimad Bhagvad Geeta" underline the necessity of serving the Guru. Sants have very firmly stressed this need (of serving a Guru). When Vedas, as is obvious from this Veda-mantra, have so clearly laid out the necessity (of serving a Guru), how can any other Holy Scripture speak to the contrary? This mantra orders to progress by harmoniously balancing the two paths - those of this world and the Supreme Cause. Therefore, this hymn can be said to be the primary formula or mantra of Karmayoga (Yoga of action). Shrimad Bhagvad Geeta is mainly a scripture primarily devoted to the Karmayoga.
Karmayoga consists of progressing or marching ahead on the aforementioned courses. Karmayoga can not be accomplished by sacrificing any one of these two. It is absolutely essential that the seeker of Moksha lives and acts in this world adopting the real way of Karmayoga in order to attain his Ultimate goal. That is why, very frequent allusions can be found in Sant Vaani (sayings of Sants) to this golden principle.
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[Astroboy]

Re: Q&A with Sant Jagjit Singh ji Harkhowal

Compare these two - do you find a link ? Sons of Light and Sons of God is quite similar - meaning disciple(s) of God.

The "mysteries of the Kingdom" (i.e., the names of the heavenly powers, etc.) are revealed, according to the Gnostics, by the Son, who has descended the inner realms and taken human form to explain these divine secrets. The adherents or initiates are named Sons of Light and alone are taught the path of light and sound and the "imperishable names." As one Gnostic puts it:
The Son who is perfect in every respect--that is, the Word who originated through that Voice...who was within him the Name; who is Light--he [the Son] revealed the everlasting things and all the unknowns were known. And those things difficult to interpret and secret, he revealed, and as for those who dwell in Silence...he preached to them. And he revealed himself to those who dwell in darkness, and he showed himself to those who dwell in the abyss, and to those who dwell in the hidden treasuries he told ineffable mysteries, and he taught unrepeatable doctrines to all those who became Sons of the Light.

May the learned persons, illuminated and rendered more capable owing to acquiring the true knowledge and true justice, attain to the company of the Majestic Supreme Lord or the Most Prosperous Emperor (i.e. God). May the reflective men take on the highest or supreme actions which do not allow their mind to decline or fall down into abominable/despicable/avoidable acts, or, may the reflective and thoughtful people be conscientious, righteous in their actions! May those persons of the highest wisdom attain to the ultimate immortality (freedom from rebirth) reaching into the highest realm of the Supreme Lord by being the best sons or disciples and displaying righteous peace-yielding conduct! Further, may the adept and learned people perform wise actions and being equipped with the best of means perform the highest actions in the most artistic or sublime way! May with their (rightful worldly) actions they make a name for themselves in their country and earn their livelihood!

 

[pk70]

Re: Q&A with Sant Jagjit Singh ji Harkhowal

ਗੁਰ ਸੇਵਾ ਆਪਿ ਹਰਿ ਭਾਵੈ ॥
gur saevaa aap har bhaavai ||
Service to the Guru is pleasing to the Lord Himself.

ਕ੍ਰਿਸਨੁ ਬਲਭਦ੍ਰੁ ਗੁਰ ਪਗ ਲਗਿ ਧਿਆਵੈ ॥
kirasan balabhadhra gur pag lag dhhiaavai ||
Even Krishna and Balbhadar meditated on the Lord, falling at the Guru's Feet.

ਨਾਨਕ ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਹਰਿ ਆਪਿ ਤਰਾਵੈ ॥੪॥੫॥੪੩॥
naanak guramukh har aap tharaavai ||4||5||43||
O Nanak, the Lord Himself saves the Gurmukhs. ||4||5||43||
~SGGS Ji p. 165
Clearly Gurbani is calling Krishna a Gurmukh who is surrendered to Guruji's feet. If Krishna is described as a Gurumukh in Gurbani, why do Sikhs say He is NOT merged with nirguna, but only egotistically boasting in a false way?(quote Harjas Kaur Khalsa Ji)

Dear Sangat ji, now first try to understand the above Gurbani quote, and then we shall see if Harjas kaur Khalsa ji’s is correct.
Very clearly it is said in the first Vaak of above Gurbani quote that it is the real Guru seva( obeying the Guru) which pleases Almighty, next Vaak says clearly that Krishna also meditated on HIM by taking refuge in Guru, next following Vaak says, it is HIM who saves those who follow Guru. Where is [/FONT]Krishna[/FONT] called Guru or Gurmukh? Isn’t a lie to prove him a Gurmukh, Krishna in Bhagwat Geeta boasts to be HIM( Creator ), Guru bachan says he mediated on Him by taking refuge in Guru. See the difference. It has nothing to do what Bhain ji is trying to say, obviously her second hand understanding of Gurbani and her desparate determination to convert Sikhism into Hinduism are playing this role of distorting of Gurbani , forgive me, I have to say that because this is what it has been going on. You say a word against Veda, [/FONT]Krishna[/FONT], Hindu, she will jump upon you, all the same, you are free to say any thing against Gurbani, she won’t care. Now lets see the next one:[/FONT]
[/FONT]ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਮਧੁਸੂਦਨੁ ਨਿਸਤਾਰੇ ॥
guramukh madhhusoodhan nisathaarae ||
The Gurmukhs are emancipated by the Lord.

[/FONT]ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਸੰਗੀ ਕ੍ਰਿਸਨ ਮੁਰਾਰੇ ॥
guramukh sangee kirasan muraarae ||
The Lord becomes the Gurmukh's Companion.

[/FONT]ਦਇਆਲ ਦਮੋਦਰੁ ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਪਾਈਐ ਹੋਰਤੁ ਕਿਤੈ ਨ ਭਾਤੀ ਜੀਉ ॥੨॥
dhaeiaal dhamodhar guramukh paaeeai horath kithai n bhaathee jeeo ||2||
The Gurmukh finds the Merciful Lord. He is not found any other way. ||2||
[/FONT] ਨਿਰਹਾਰੀ ਕੇਸਵ ਨਿਰਵੈਰਾ ॥
nirehaaree kaesav niravairaa ||
He does not need to eat; His Hair is Wondrous and Beautiful; He is free of hate.

ਕੋਟਿ ਜਨਾ ਜਾ ਕੇ ਪੂਜਹਿ ਪੈਰਾ ॥
kott janaa jaa kae poojehi pairaa ||
Millions of people worship His Feet.( Lord's)

ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਹਿਰਦੈ ਜਾ ਕੈ ਹਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਸੋਈ ਭਗਤੁ ਇਕਾਤੀ ਜੀਉ ॥੩॥
guramukh hiradhai jaa kai har har soee bhagath eikaathee jeeo ||3||
He alone is a devotee, who becomes Gurmukh, whose heart is filled with the Lord, Har, Har. ||3|
~SGGS Ji p. 98
One of the traditional titles of Krishna is "the Lord of beautiful hair," Keshava. So Gurbani equates Krishna as a disciple, as a Guru, as merged with the Divine and as the Transcendant Lord Himself.
Again, in the above Gurbani quote, it doesnt talk about Krishna but about the Lord, if we believe for a second that Bhain ji is right, then why in the previous above quote, Guru ji says Krishna also meditated on HIM by taking refuge in Guru; suddenly now Gurbani has turned towards Krishna as a GOD? No, reality is simple, in Gurbani, Lord is addressed with many names, one of them is Krishan Muraar( eko Krishanan. Also Allah etc.) Never forget that Gurbani also considers Krishan as one of the millions HE created. It just doesn’t add up, distortion is going on, take one Vaak from here and one from there and keep beating the drums which is getting very annoying ( due ti their being lies).

Guru Sahibaan have defined all these terms, if one just float on the words that doesn’t give license to one to force ones own views on Sikhs, it is unfortunate that without understanding the depth of Guru bachan, many would just remain away from Guru Message. Through all Sree Guru Granth Sahib ji, only one Lord and love and pining for Him are dominating factors, the rest are references to make people understand HIS sargun Sroop and Nirguna at the same time. As these guys get references, so do other creations because Guru ji also says in context of His sargun Sroop” O my Lord, you yourself are fish, you yourself is fisherman and the bait”( Mehl-1). Should the Sikhs then look for Fisherman, fish and bait to contemplate on them as special ones and start revering them? Point is simple, when one is defining all HIS creation, individuals talked about in the past, will be referred. For Sikhs, HIS Nirguna Sroop is to be contemplated, to please Guru ji, this is a written Hukam by Guru ji himself, all the rest should not detour your attention. Follow Guru and save yourself from misguiding illusions. Look at this snatana sect, it has degraded the society, exploited the society, now in today’s age, to look good, they talk about Sikhism or Budhism as their part and their Gurus as incarnation of Vishnu who himself couldn’t get MUKTI, poor conceptual thing still incarnates. It sounds so funny to my rationality that it makes me laugh when I see this false campaign against Sikhism or Buddhism. Grapes are sour as their own agenda along with religious belief, do not match even high standrads of humanity and human rights.

This is what I have to say today, I won’t be able to respond to abnormally long posts due to my limits to Internet till August 30th. Thanks.


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[Astroboy]

Re: Q&A with Sant Jagjit Singh ji Harkhowal

Through all Sree Guru Granth Sahib ji, only one Lord and love and pining for Him are dominating factors, the rest are references to make people understand HIS sargun Sroop and Nirguna at the same time. As these guys get references, so do other creations because Guru ji also says in context of His sargun Sroop” O my Lord, you yourself are fish, you yourself is fisherman and the bait”( Mehl-1). Should the Sikhs then look for Fisherman, fish and bait to contemplate on them as special ones and start revering them?

:star::star::star: to PK70 :happy:

 

[spnadmin]

This thread was started on August 21, 2008 -5 GMT to accommodate discussions of avatars of Vishnu and their role in sanatan philosophy. All comments posted prior to August 21 and were moved to this thread after August 21, 2008 are organized in chronological order, according to the date and time of their posting.

 

[Harjas Kaur Khalsa]

This thread was started on August 21, 2008 -5 GMT to accommodate discussions of avatars of Vishnu and their role in sanatan philosophy.

They were a legitimate response to topics brought up by the Gurbani vichaar of sant Jagjit Singh ji Harkhowal and not relegated to some far away corner as mere discussion of Vishnu avataars in sanatan philosophy, but a literal part of the Gurmat vichaar of Shri Guru Granth Sahib Ji regarding the nature of sarguna.

And once again thank you for the deletion of my response to pk70, and no mention whatsoever of his personal attacks directed against me.

 

[roopsidhu]

pk 70 quoted
I would like to hear from some one who can quote a single Vaak from Sree Guru Granth Sahib Ji that says that the people who have low intellect or consciousness, should start from Sargun Sroop and who have better should contemplate directly on The Infinite Lord. Here is a direct Hukam of our Satguru, should we ignore it or obey it. Let the world go what way it wants to go, I shall rather follow Guru
veer ji may be the following shabad may answer your question a bit
ibnu dyKy aupjY nhI Awsw ] jo dIsY so hoie ibnwsw ] brn sihq jo jwpY nwmu ] so jogI kyvl inhkwmu ]1] prcY, rwmu rvY jau koeI ] pwrsu prsY duibDw n hoeI ]1] rhwau ] so muin, mn kI duibDw Kwie ] ibnu duAwry qRY lok smwie ] mn kw suBwau sBu koeI krY ] krqw hoie su AnBY rhY ]2] Pl kwrn PUlI bnrwie ] Plu lwgw qb PUlu iblwie ] igAwnY kwrn krm AiBAwsu ] igAwnu BieAw qh krmh nwsu ]3] iGRq kwrn diD mQY sieAwn ] jIvq mukq sdw inrbwn ] kih rivdws prm bYrwg ] irdY rwmu kI n jpis ABwg ]

To achieve the giyan, the karams are performed but when the giyan is achieved the karams should vanish.

Bhul chuk maaf
Roopsidhu

 

[dalbirk]

Roop Sidhu Ji ,
Pk70 ji has left SPN , for any questions you can go to his blog
GURSOCH
Hope the moderators allow me this luxury of posting his link