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Absolute Nothingness ???

Discussion in 'Interfaith Dialogues' started by Neutral Singh, Oct 16, 2004.

  1. Neutral Singh

    Neutral Singh
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    Have you ever stopped to think that almost every question is superceded by a more important question? Not to say a more critical question, or a question worth finding the answer to more. But a question that must be asked, and answered, before you’ll ever find a meaningful answer to the question at hand.

    Science is probably the best example of this. I can’t think of a great example off the top of my head, but just think about the way scientists have gotten off onto so many tangents throughout the centuries. How many alchemists spent an entire lifetime trying to make gold in a lab? True, they weren’t all obsessed with making gold, but they were obsessed with the thoughts of making things by mixing things. If only they would have known something about protons and electrons. If only they would have asked the proper question, and attempted to answer it.

    Who’s to say that modern scientists aren’t the equivalent of the alchemists of old? It’s true that we’re light years ahead of scientists from even a few centuries ago. But we’re no more confident in our abilities, or proud of our achievements than the old alchemists were. So who’s to say that we’re not on a wild goose chase now? Isn’t it possible that we’re not seeing the forest for the trees? I'll just point out that it's happened before.

    I think there are more important questions out there. And I believe with a doubt that the ultimate question has never been asked. The ‘ultimate question’ being the question to end all questions—the question that will provide the means to answer all other questions.

    So what is the ultimate question? What question is the mother of all questions? I don’t know any more than anyone else, but there’s a question at the very core of my curiosity, and if I had to venture a guess I’d say the ultimate question is:
    Why is there not nothing?
    Please excuse the double negative, because it’s the only way to properly ask the question… the question being when it came down to there being something or nothing, why was it decided there would be something, and not nothing?

    In referring to ‘something’ I’m not referring to matter, or time, or energy. I’m not talking about the blob of whatever you want to call it, which supposedly fueled the Big Bang. I’m talking about ‘something’… something in its simplest form—the opposite of nothing.

    It’s interesting to think about ‘nothing’. ‘Nothing’ is a relative term to us. We look inside of a box and say that nothing is inside of it, when there are nearly countless air molecules—all worthy of being called something. We look out at the stars and talk about the countless miles of nothingness between ourselves and them, when there is a measurable distance of space between the stars and us. Space is something, isn't it?

    Everywhere you look there’s something. And every thought you have is about something. You can’t have a thought about nothing, because what would you think about? You must think about something in order to think—there’s no way around that.

    Just try to imagine true ‘nothingness’ for a second (I call it ‘absolute nothingness’). Think of an existence where there is absolutely nothing to give a name to—wait, there’s no such thing. You can’t imagine absolute nothingness—it’s impossible.

    My point is that ‘something’ defines us, and everything we know. But you know, there didn’t have to be something. I’m guessing there just as easily could have been nothing.

    Anyways, that’s what I think the ultimate question is: why was there not nothing? I’m curious to hear what you think the ultimate question is.
     
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  3. etinder

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    wow amazing.......u sure made me think aman

    since when u have become a disciple of Nietzsche...i smell nihilism here:)
     
  4. thecoopes

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    Dear Aman that question has troubled me for years but I have never been able to convey it in such a logical way. 10/10 for a wonderful piece of philosophy.



    Here’s one I think I can explain but not as clearly as you, perhaps you can help me with it?



    Where do we exist?



    Given that the past no longer exists and the future does not exist, but only the present exists then what is this present and how big is it?

    For an example when we see a second hand moving around the face of a clock we would say everything behind the hand is the past and has ceased to exist while everything in front of the hand is the future and therefore has not come into existence.



    So is the present one second? No it can’t be because we can divide time into smaller sections so that if time were measured in nanoseconds (0.000 000 001 seconds) the principle would still be the same, everything behind is the past while everything in front is the future, so the actual piece that is the present is finite or as near to nothing as is possible so then do we really exist?



    Perhaps there are others out there that feel there is an explanation?



    Best wishes



    John C
     
  5. saint

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    Absolute Nothingness....hmmmm. This is a topic in which i have exercised thought upon thought.
    Interesting....
    In order to understand the beauty of something...it is important to understand the concept of absolute nothingness. Absolute Nothingness to me is the non-being of being, the non-existence of exisitence, but also to freak out the idea and show just how impossible absolute nothingness is, i would have to say that absolute nothingness is also the non-being of non-being, the non-existence of non-existence. Absolute Nothingness = Not Even Nothing Itself. We can visualize it to a point where it just becomes incomprehendable.

    Absolute Nothingness is impossible.
    It cannot be. It cannot happen. It never was nor will be. and we definetly know it IS NOT.
    If before the beginning or everything ,there was absolute nothingness where then did the power and energy for things to be come from? NO WHERE? that would be a very silly answer. if absolute nothingness WAS there then it ceases to be absolute nothingness cos absolute nothingness cannot BE and therefore cannot even contain no power to bring things into being.

    IF THERE IS 0 HOW CAN 1 BE GOTTEN FROM IT? OR 0.000000000001 ETC ETC FOR THAT MATTER. if we can get any infitisimal thing from it then it ceases to be 0.

    The importance in understanding what absolute nothingness is gives one realization into the supernatural.

    since absolute nothingness is impossible then
    THERE MUST BE SOMETHING THAT ALWAYS WAS, ALWAYS IS, AND ALWAYS WILL BE. FOREVER EVERLASTING. THE SOURCE.
    this something must also have in it all the power of existence. thus making it ALL POWERFUL.
    and since it has ALL OF EXISTENCE within itself....and that some of these existences have within theirselves SELF AWARNESS AND CONCIOUSNESS...then it would really be silly to think that this infinite everlasting all powerful being does not know it is being. To deny it to be ALL KNOWING would simply be an act of ignorance.

    Saint.



     
  6. saint

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    the present is the moment..but how long is a moment? it is infinitly tiny so tiny that time stops. how fast does time move? from one moment to another moment? if we use your concept of breaking down time to the tiniest most single moment then time would stand still. but it would still BE nevertheless. so when you ask do we really exist? my answer would be yes..of course we really exist. WE ARE.
    think about this...in the begining God created the heavens and the earth.
    in the beginning = Time ,the heavens = Space, and the earth = Matter.

    Saint
     
  7. Tejwant Singh

    Tejwant Singh United States
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    According to your idea which has been borrowed from the Semitic religions, The God of Abraham stopped creating heavens. but according to the Gurbani' Aad Aach, jugaad Sach, Habbie Sach, Nanak Hossi bee Sach', IK ONG KAAR is still creating 'heavens' and 'earths'. The SAT is constantly unfolding itself.



    Tejwant
     
  8. Tejwant Singh

    Tejwant Singh United States
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    How can someone experience nothingness while being something?

    Tejwant
     
  9. saint

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    i dont know if god has stopped creating the heavens...this universe is the only one i know..and i dont even really know it that well...i experience a part of it and i am a part of it....who can know what is beyond the infinity of this universe?
    but i would hope that IK ONG KAAR is still making the heavens and the earth.
    i shouldnt think that GOD would stop...I think it is ITS nature to continue creating and destroying. IT IS THE WAY IT BREATHS
     
  10. saint

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    nothingness cannot be experienced because it - nothingness - in my sense of the word is an impossibilty...for me it would mean the non-existence of god and that is an impossibility.
     
  11. chk1

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    For simply "nothing" to exist would meant that "god", does not exist. There is nothing that god is not. And because God is everywhere even the nothing is "something". The outerspace, the air, the wind anything you would count as nothing is something, as you mentioned.
    And the answer is simple!

    Even the nothing is something because that is God. He is everywhere.

    Hope that helps!
     
  12. CaliforniaSeeker

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    I don't think absolute nothingness is possible. Research has shown that even in deepest space, where astronomers and scientists used to think nothing exists, there is the background "hum" of energy left from the Big Bang.

    To me, this is an example of how Waheguru's Naam vibrates everywhere, without exception.
     
  13. H.t.

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    Why is there something instead of nothing?
    I believe that God, as an intelligent being, decided to create our universe. Personally, i believe that God in His/Her non-tepmporal Self-Existence, has created an infinite universes. I love to think of eternity, nothingness, the nature of God, all the things that my mind cannot comprehend; it makes me remember how great if the One who does know.
    Nothing is nowhere, just as something is somewhere, and everything is everywhere. We cannot sense nothing, because it has no way to influence our nerves. We cannot be in the midst of nothing, because it has no space. Nothing by nature has no nature and no place amidst all that is. Nothing as being non-existence excisting in that it is not. It's all a word game. Nothing is just that, nothing. It is not important, because it is nothing. Nothing has no worth just as it has nothing else. Nothing can be drawn from nothing, therefore what use is it. God did not creat nothing, because if He/She had it would be something (part of krit).
    Nothing is unimportant and worthless. I give it a passing glance to refresh my appriciation of that which is.
    Focus on God that decides something and nothing. Focus on the Creator not the creation or the lack of creation.
    [your right the double negatives do abound]
    seeking after God
    H.t.​

    "I have mastered nothing! I know nothing as no one else knows nothing!"
    --Garth Nix​
     
  14. sikh_scholar

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    Fateh, I was actually recently entertaining this thought. I was reading that the universe is just an emanation of God. Then I read about nirgun and sargun. God is both trancendent and immanent. He is immanent in the creation but above the creation as well. It also says in the SGGS that God is formless but has form. Then it also says that the creation is just an outline of God that we see. The creation is God itself but God is much more than the creation. God is infinite and thus our universe is as well. I got confused thinking of what the formless God is. Does this mean that space itself is the formless form of God? But if God is above the creation, then space belongs in the creation as well. This implies that God is more than the creation and space. Then it said that God destroys and rebuilds the universe at will. I was thinking that the formless version of God is just infinite nothingness. Our universe is the manifestation of infinity. Just as God is infinite, so is his creation. God even fills the void of absolute nothingness and we obviously can't see formless entities thus is formless God just infinite nothingness? Fateh
     
  15. sikh_scholar

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    I forgot to add. Our job is to realize God through ourself. Once we do this, I believe the formless God will then be seen throughout the creation. Thus Guru Ji says once we are enlightened we see God in everything. I believe we serve as a link from this universe to formless God. Always keep in mind thought that God is only ONE and we need to recognize that the creation is just God itself. Instead of living in the creation, once we are enlightened we live as the creation. If we live as the creation, all our actions are pure. Just as nature itself is pure because those actions done by nature aren't controlled by humans. Anything related to humans is unpure and we need to shed our ego to recognize "I" is the same as "you." Meaning I guess, we will realize that instead of having our own unique identities, we will live in harmony with the universe, causing us to see ourselves as the universe and not just a part of it. I think as humans we are the formless version of God manifested in a creation that is the emanation of God. So when we do reach salvation, we see God in people because he is inside everyone. But a problem I have is, why did God create people to just have them realize himself? Also, without the universe in existence, is that the formless God? These are only opinions and they are everchanging. Only God is the one truth. Fateh
     

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