| Tags | bodies, body, cut, cuttting hair, girls, hair, head, new modern world, remove, sikh, sikhi and hair  | 
27-Mar-2009, 17:17 PM
|  | | | | Enrolled: Feb 20th, 2006 Location: nottingham england
Posts: 150
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Liked 82 Times in 54 Posts
| |  | | | Re: Sikh Girls Who Do Not Cut Their Head Hair, But Remove All Other Hair on Their Bod
Dear Tejwant ji
Firstly I apologise for putting your name to the post as the only part that was meant to apply to yourself was the icing on the cake bit, but as you have asked I will go through the points I made so as to clarify, Firstly I have been honest, as to hair on my body I have no need to shave, My legs are almost completly hair free only having a small patch on the sides of my knee and upper thigh and these are hardly noticable as I said to you privately most women would love them except for there muscular shape, as for my chest again hardly noticeable same on my arms they are very fine. Your second point is to read your other posts which is why I have apologised to you. the mentioning of the Dasam Granth again wasnt aimed at yourself, nor was any article on how some Sikh men treat their women and admire you for the work you have done in London, I am fully aware that it is a problem in every society, But as it is one of the basic to treat all equally then surely it is this that comes first not the growing of hair. I have no aim to condemn Sikh men only those who say hair is a must but cannot treat all equally. Again the mentioning of the Rehat maryada wasnt aimed at you and have read your post regarding it and fully agree with you. Please explain why you think I am playing God because I said that the hair on my head is rapidly fading and being replaced by the hairs up my nose, this a fact as in alot of men as they get older, the hairs up my nose when i was younger where tiny and as you stated there to help filter the air, It is only as i have got older that they have got thicker and more noticeable, A sign of ageing not arrogant at all. My reply to icing on the cake is to say that I agree with you but some use their hair as the be all and end all symbol of spirituality and dont bother to make the cake. please explain what is arrogant about the hair may make you manly, when read with the rest of the post it merely states that it is your actions that God will take into account not your hair, no arrogance there. I fail to see where I have made Guru jis out to be Elephant man in what way is saying that they where special saying or implying that, please explain where is there insecurity in not wanting to look like someone else when in reality it states that Im happy to be myself. If we all wanted to look like our dads then we'd still be wearing loinclothes and animal skins. I also dont see why opposing others will is bordering on hooliganism, If Guru jis hadnt opposed then where would Sikhism be, Muslim man said shave heads, Gurus jis said it wouldnt improve their spirituality so refused. I dont shave my head to be a muslim nor to improve my spirituality, and before you get the wrong Idea no I dont think Im as good as Guru jis nowhere near nor will I ever be. I have said that I will not follow blindly any man if there is nothing to prove what they say, what is wrong in requireing prove what is anti Sikhi about that. Please tell where is my distain for Sikhs, When all I have said is that it is no good justing having hair and following this hukam if the basics arent followed ie equality for all, No Caste, No Creede, No Colour, No Sex, what is anti Sikhi about that. My only distaste is for those who carry five Ks and practise culturalism nothing anti Sikhi there as far as Im aware it is more pro Sikhi to try to make a stance for equality than to sit back and ignore it. I have no problem with hair it is personal choice my only problem is when Im told that to be a Sikh I must have it. I have read your posts on hair and agree with you, The mistake was mine when I addressed this post to you and accept that the contents where not aimed at yourself, but some of your replies I found distasteful as I am not a liar nor am I arrogant, I may be stubborn and require prove, but there is nothing wrong in that, to act without prove would be to follow blindly and wheres the Sikhi in that. I apologise to you again Tejwant ji for putting your name on the post but as I have never insulted you or any others intentionally please do not insult me. Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/sikh-youth/14899-sikh-girls-who-do-not-cut.htmlReference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=14899
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27-Mar-2009, 20:57 PM
| | | | | Enrolled: Feb 20th, 2006 Location: nottingham england
Posts: 150
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Liked 82 Times in 54 Posts
| | | | | Re: Sikh Girls Who Do Not Cut Their Head Hair, But Remove All Other Hair on Their Bod
Dear Singh ji
Thank you for agreeing that caste system is wrong, it is on this basis that I say how can a member of the Khalsa be pure if he continues to follow the caste system, the carrying of the five Ks is then merely reduced to a symbol. The cutting of my hair may be considered an insult to one Guru Ji but the caste system is an insult to all Guru jis. You have however twisted alot of what I wrote and ask that you reread what i wrote and if the term Hairies offended you I apologise it was meant light heartedly. it is I who was insulted in a previous post of yours when you said that or implied that the bullying of my children wasnt likely at panjabi school. It was only this morning that I could get them to agree to go back and then only if I would stay at the school with them. this was Ok'd at the Gudwara last night. the subject of hair was also discussed with cutters and growers, all agreed that hair wasn't a necessity to being a Sikh but was if I wished to Join the Khalsa panth, This I accept and would like to do in the future, but only when I think that I my actions and thinking's where pure enough not to disgrace the most honourable part of Sikhism, I have no wish to continue arguing with you over this matter, I believe I have made my point and will now withdraw from this debate unless I am asked to comment on my posts Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=14899Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=14899
Tony
ps have you ever tried that wash and gone shampoo its a hair today gone tomorrow type of product and is supposed to leave your hair in IMMAC-ulate condition, once tried you'll never use any thing else, highly recommended for those who dont want to cut their hair |
28-Mar-2009, 00:13 AM
| | | | | Enrolled: Jun 30th, 2004 Location: Henderson, NV. Age: 59
Posts: 3,194
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Liked 4,671 Times in 1,930 Posts
| |  | | | Re: Sikh Girls Who Do Not Cut Their Head Hair, But Remove All Other Hair on Their Bod
Quote:
Originally Posted by tony  Dear Tejwant ji
Firstly I apologise for putting your name to the post as the only part that was meant to apply to yourself was the icing on the cake bit, but as you have asked I will go through the points I made so as to clarify, Firstly I have been honest, as to hair on my body I have no need to shave, My legs are almost completly hair free only having a small patch on the sides of my knee and upper thigh and these are hardly noticable as I said to you privately most women would love them except for there muscular shape, as for my chest again hardly noticeable same on my arms they are very fine. Your second point is to read your other posts which is why I have apologised to you. the mentioning of the Dasam Granth again wasnt aimed at yourself, nor was any article on how some Sikh men treat their women and admire you for the work you have done in London, I am fully aware that it is a problem in every society, But as it is one of the basic to treat all equally then surely it is this that comes first not the growing of hair. I have no aim to condemn Sikh men only those who say hair is a must but cannot treat all equally. Again the mentioning of the Rehat maryada wasnt aimed at you and have read your post regarding it and fully agree with you. Please explain why you think I am playing God because I said that the hair on my head is rapidly fading and being replaced by the hairs up my nose, this a fact as in alot of men as they get older, the hairs up my nose when i was younger where tiny and as you stated there to help filter the air, It is only as i have got older that they have got thicker and more noticeable, A sign of ageing not arrogant at all. My reply to icing on the cake is to say that I agree with you but some use their hair as the be all and end all symbol of spirituality and dont bother to make the cake. please explain what is arrogant about the hair may make you manly, when read with the rest of the post it merely states that it is your actions that God will take into account not your hair, no arrogance there. I fail to see where I have made Guru jis out to be Elephant man in what way is saying that they where special saying or implying that, please explain where is there insecurity in not wanting to look like someone else when in reality it states that Im happy to be myself. If we all wanted to look like our dads then we'd still be wearing loinclothes and animal skins. I also dont see why opposing others will is bordering on hooliganism, If Guru jis hadnt opposed then where would Sikhism be, Muslim man said shave heads, Gurus jis said it wouldnt improve their spirituality so refused. I dont shave my head to be a muslim nor to improve my spirituality, and before you get the wrong Idea no I dont think Im as good as Guru jis nowhere near nor will I ever be. I have said that I will not follow blindly any man if there is nothing to prove what they say, what is wrong in requireing prove what is anti Sikhi about that. Please tell where is my distain for Sikhs, When all I have said is that it is no good justing having hair and following this hukam if the basics arent followed ie equality for all, No Caste, No Creede, No Colour, No Sex, what is anti Sikhi about that. My only distaste is for those who carry five Ks and practise culturalism nothing anti Sikhi there as far as Im aware it is more pro Sikhi to try to make a stance for equality than to sit back and ignore it. I have no problem with hair it is personal choice my only problem is when Im told that to be a Sikh I must have it. I have read your posts on hair and agree with you, The mistake was mine when I addressed this post to you and accept that the contents where not aimed at yourself, but some of your replies I found distasteful as I am not a liar nor am I arrogant, I may be stubborn and require prove, but there is nothing wrong in that, to act without prove would be to follow blindly and wheres the Sikhi in that. I apologise to you again Tejwant ji for putting your name on the post but as I have never insulted you or any others intentionally please do not insult me.
Tony | Tony,
Guru fateh.
Thanks for the response. I do not want to get into a circular argument with you. I responded to your post point by point. Now if you do not agree with them, please respond in the same manner and give your reasons. What it seems from the above that you have not responded but justified again in what you said, hence the interaction turns into a circular argument with no end in sight and that is not my objective.
It seems that you are only apologising for the post because it was addressed to me but other points I have made you seemed to have overlooked.
In order for us to have a constructive interaction, I request you to put your intial point, then my response and then your objection or agreement to it.
No, I did not insult you. I was blunt to tell you what you wrote. Please give yourself a chance to read it with cool mind. Learning is not a tug of war. It requires openmindedness. If you have the right to accuse Sikhs or the Sikhi then I have the same right to dispute that.
So, let us learn from each other through our disagreement and it would not happen if you made the whole argument in one paragraph as you did.
Just for a starter, in order to show you how this can be managed in a fruitful manner, let us go to your first statement:
Your Quote: Dear Tejwant ji and all the other Hairies amongst us you are missing the point.
My response
"Your above quote is either a lie or you have not disclosed yourself truthfully to us. One can logically conclude from your above statement that you who admits of being a Sikh for 3 years shave your chest, legs and other body parts, if not then you are part of the " Hairies amongst us". Sikhi is about seeking truth not about hiding it. So is it Gillette or any other instrument?  And it is you who is missing the point and I will show you why from your own post."
Rather than admitting that you were wrong and arrogant and insulting because the discusssion is about hair, this is the way you justified in your response: Quote: Firstly I have been honest, as to hair on my body I have no need to shave, My legs are almost completly hair free only having a small patch on the sides of my knee and upper thigh and these are hardly noticable as I said to you privately most women would love them except for there muscular shape, as for my chest again hardly noticeable same on my arms they are very fine.
|
Tony, the above justification does not make you hairless and that is the fact hence you are one the " Hairies amongst us". Many Sikhs may have even less hair than you do but that is not the point. The point is your intention to insult the hair keeping Sikhs and that is uncalled for and if you respond to my post point by point then you will find no need to justify where it is not needed and accept where you are wrong.
Hope to hear from you with the open frame of mind.
Regards
Tejwant Singh |
28-Mar-2009, 01:00 AM
| | | | | Enrolled: Feb 20th, 2006 Location: nottingham england
Posts: 150
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Liked 82 Times in 54 Posts
| | | | | Re: Sikh Girls Who Do Not Cut Their Head Hair, But Remove All Other Hair on Their Bod
Dear Tejwant ji
My quote Dear tejwant ji and all the other hairies amonst us
where does this excluce myself the word us is used and where does it insinuate that i shave that is your conclusion and my justifcation was to tell you that I dont. in no way have i cliamed to be completly hair free only that I shave my head and chin for nonspiritual reasons. if you wish to continue this circular argument then please continue.btw the instrument I use for shaving is a Gillette mach 3 turbo Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=14899Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=14899
Tony |
28-Mar-2009, 01:16 AM
| | | | | Enrolled: Jun 30th, 2004 Location: Henderson, NV. Age: 59
Posts: 3,194
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Liked 4,671 Times in 1,930 Posts
| | | | | Re: Sikh Girls Who Do Not Cut Their Head Hair, But Remove All Other Hair on Their Bod
Quote:
Originally Posted by tony Dear Tejwant ji
My quote Dear tejwant ji and all the other hairies amonst us
where does this excluce myself the word us is used and where does it insinuate that i shave that is your conclusion and my justifcation was to tell you that I dont. in no way have i cliamed to be completly hair free only that I shave my head and chin for nonspiritual reasons. if you wish to continue this circular argument then please continue.btw the instrument I use for shaving is a Gillette mach 3 turbo
Tony | Tony,
Guru fateh.
Thanks for proving my point.
End of discussion.
Enjoy your journey.
Tejwant Singh |
28-Mar-2009, 01:49 AM
| | | | | Enrolled: Feb 20th, 2006 Location: nottingham england
Posts: 150
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Liked 82 Times in 54 Posts
| | | | | Re: Sikh Girls Who Do Not Cut Their Head Hair, But Remove All Other Hair on Their Bod
so why call me a liar and being arrogant from that statement |
28-Mar-2009, 02:38 AM
| | | | | Enrolled: Jun 30th, 2004 Location: Henderson, NV. Age: 59
Posts: 3,194
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Liked 4,671 Times in 1,930 Posts
| | | | | Re: Sikh Girls Who Do Not Cut Their Head Hair, But Remove All Other Hair on Their Bod
Quote:
Originally Posted by tony so why call me a liar and being arrogant from that statement | Tony,
Guru fateh.
I wanted to stop this mundane *** for tat on a peaceful note but it seems you still feel itchy about things. You can not let it go which shows arrogance and holier than thou attitude.
I am here to learn and asked you how you and I can have a fruitful discussion. Read my post again where I asked you how to approach the subject but you ignored for the reasons only known to you.
Let us go with it for once and all. I have no idea what your educational level is as far as english comprehension is concerned but your statement shows either you are distorting the facts, lying or you do not know what you are talking about.
In your last post you write: Quote: Dear Tejwant ji
My quote Dear tejwant ji and all the other hairies amonst us
where does this excluce myself the word us is used and where does it insinuate that i shave that is your conclusion and my justifcation was to tell you that I dont. in no way have i cliamed to be completly hair free only that I shave my head and chin for nonspiritual reasons. if you wish to continue this circular argument then please continue.btw the instrument I use for shaving is a Gillette mach 3 turbo
Tony | The word AMONGST used by you excludes you as a starter. It shows that not ALL of us are HAIRY. the word us does not INCLUDE YOU in the discussion.You have been talking about Sikhs keeping hair and you shaving your head and your beard. If you had said "ALL HAIRIES AMONGST US INCLUDING MYSELF", then you would have included yourself. So stop fooling others and start admitting what you say in your own words. Rest about other lies and being arrogant, read my previous post and if you follow the instructions I requested about your responding point by point from post,then we can discuss it further and I will show you where you were arrogant and where you lied. It seems your agenda here is that you just criticise Sikhs and want them to be perfect in your own eyes and find flaws in them. Sikhi is the journey of the individual, each of us carries our own spriritual torch. You carry yours and check that it does not burn out nor it is put out and let others carry theirs. Tejwant Singh. |
28-Mar-2009, 02:43 AM
|  | .jpg) | | | Enrolled: Jun 1st, 2004 Location: Sikh Philosophy Network Age: 37
Posts: 5,222
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Liked 4,119 Times in 1,914 Posts
| | | | | Re: Sikh Girls Who Do Not Cut Their Head Hair, But Remove All Other Hair on Their Bod
Admin Note: This thread has well out-lived its knowledge value, is now closed. If anybody wants to open this thread for discussions again then please contact the admin and explain why this thread should be opened again. Thank you.
Last edited by Aman Singh; 15-Sep-2010 at 11:07 AM.
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