Is SGGS The Word Of God ?

Amardeep · #1 (**permalink**) 02-Mar-2006, 06:06 AM

sath shri akal jee.

i am a bit confused about this topic.
My muslim friends say that the Quran is from God, and in the verses of the Quran, God is talking about himself using words as "I" "We" etc.(We is because he is talking about himself in plurioal, to raise himself, the way queens etc does)
for instance:

011.025
YUSUFALI: We sent Noah to his people (with a mission): "I have come to you with a Clear Warning:

006.089
YUSUFALI: These were the men to whom We gave the Book, and authority, and prophethood: if these (their descendants) reject them, Behold! We shall entrust their charge to a new people who reject them not.

etc.. God speaks to Mankind..

but in Sri Guru Granth Sahab, God is being talked ABOUT

Page 2, Line 15
ਜੇ ਤਿਸੁ ਨਦਰਿ ਨ ਆਵਈ ਤ ਵਾਤ ਨ ਪੁਛੈ ਕੇ ॥
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/sikh-sikhi-sikhism/8335-is-sggs-the-word-of-god.html
जे तिसु नदरि न आवई त वात न पुछै के ॥
jay tis nadar na aavee ta vaat na puchhai kay.
still, if the Lord does not bless you with His Glance of Grace, then who cares? What is the use?
Guru Nanak Dev -

Page 7, Line 5
ਕਰਿ ਕਰਿ ਵੇਖੈ ਸਿਰਜਣਹਾਰੁ ॥
करि करि वेखै सिरजणहारु ॥
kar kar vaykhai sirjanhaar.
Having created the creation, the Creator Lord watches over it.
Guru Nanak Dev -

Page 7, Line 5
ਨਾਨਕ ਸਚੇ ਕੀ ਸਾਚੀ ਕਾਰ ॥
नानक सचे की साची कार ॥
naanak sachay kee saachee kaar.
O Nanak, True is the Creation of the True Lord.
Guru Nanak Dev -

etc..

so how can the holy Book be the Word of God, since it talks about God. is God Talkin about himself or is someone else?

does the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji even claim to be the word of God anywhere?

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

By The Way..the last verse says "O Nanak"..
what does this mean? is it Sri Guru Nanak that is being mentioned? i've read this "O Nanak" Several times before and got confused. i thought that none of the Guru's were names in the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=8335

Gyani Jarnail Singh · #2 (**permalink**) 02-Mar-2006, 06:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amardeep

sath shri akal jee.

i am a bit confused about this topic.
My muslim friends say that the Quran is from God, and in the verses of the Quran, God is talking about himself using words as "I" "We" etc.(We is because he is talking about himself in plurioal, to raise himself, the way queens etc does)
for instance:

011.025
YUSUFALI: We sent Noah to his people (with a mission): "I have come to you with a Clear Warning:

006.089
YUSUFALI: These were the men to whom We gave the Book, and authority, and prophethood: if these (their descendants) reject them, Behold! We shall entrust their charge to a new people who reject them not.

etc.. God speaks to Mankind..

but in Sri Guru Granth Sahab, God is being talked ABOUT

Page 2, Line 15
ਜੇ ਤਿਸੁ ਨਦਰਿ ਨ ਆਵਈ ਤ ਵਾਤ ਨ ਪੁਛੈ ਕੇ ॥
जे तिसु नदरि न आवई त वात न पुछै के ॥
jay tis nadar na aavee ta vaat na puchhai kay.
still, if the Lord does not bless you with His Glance of Grace, then who cares? What is the use?
Guru Nanak Dev -

Page 7, Line 5
ਕਰਿ ਕਰਿ ਵੇਖੈ ਸਿਰਜਣਹਾਰੁ ॥
करि करि वेखै सिरजणहारु ॥
kar kar vaykhai sirjanhaar.
Having created the creation, the Creator Lord watches over it.
Guru Nanak Dev -

Page 7, Line 5
ਨਾਨਕ ਸਚੇ ਕੀ ਸਾਚੀ ਕਾਰ ॥
नानक सचे की साची कार ॥
naanak sachay kee saachee kaar.
O Nanak, True is the Creation of the True Lord.
Guru Nanak Dev -

etc..

so how can the holy Book be the Word of God, since it talks about God. is God Talkin about himself or is someone else?

does the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji even claim to be the word of God anywhere?

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

By The Way..the last verse says "O Nanak"..
what does this mean? is it Sri Guru Nanak that is being mentioned? i've read this "O Nanak" Several times before and got confused. i thought that none of the Guru's were names in the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji

Nanak is the Name of the WRITER of Gurbani. ALL the Gurus used this single NAME to IDENTIFY the author of the Gurbani. This si because all the Gurus were ONE JYOT - NaanaK Jyot.

The Gurus ADDRESS "themsleves"..but the MESSAGE is for all of us...so wehn it say..O NANAK..it really means O MANKIND... It is Guru Jis humbleness that he addresses himself.

When the Gurban i is by Other than Gurus..Bhagat kabir Ji, Ravidass Ji or SHEIKH FARID JI... their NAMES are mentioned to IDENTIFY the author.

Guru nanak ji declares...These words that i write are NOT MINE..they are the words of MY KHASAM (HUSBAND..meaning GOD) Jaisee main aveh khasam ki banee tessra kari gyan ve lalo..

This means that the GURBANI is DHUR KI BANI..Straight form GOD and thus GOD's WORD..written Down IMMEDIATELY as it came ( not like others who wrote down "gods words" many CENTURIES after He spoke them...and by different authors)

The AIM of GURMATTT is to MEET and MERGE with GOD... so all the Gurbani by various authors talks ABOUT how beautiful and merciful GOD is...how we should aim to MEET HIM....and merge with HIM...and be ONE with HIM...

Jarnail Singh Gyani

Amardeep · #3 (**permalink**) 02-Mar-2006, 20:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gyani Jarnail Singh

Nanak is the Name of the WRITER of Gurbani. ALL the Gurus used this single NAME to IDENTIFY the author of the Gurbani. This si because all the Gurus were ONE JYOT - NaanaK Jyot.

The Gurus ADDRESS "themsleves"..but the MESSAGE is for all of us...so wehn it say..O NANAK..it really means O MANKIND... It is Guru Jis humbleness that he addresses himself.

When the Gurban i is by Other than Gurus..Bhagat kabir Ji, Ravidass Ji or SHEIKH FARID JI... their NAMES are mentioned to IDENTIFY the author.

Guru nanak ji declares...These words that i write are NOT MINE..they are the words of MY KHASAM (HUSBAND..meaning GOD) Jaisee main aveh khasam ki banee tessra kari gyan ve lalo..

This means that the GURBANI is DHUR KI BANI..Straight form GOD and thus GOD's WORD..written Down IMMEDIATELY as it came ( not like others who wrote down "gods words" many CENTURIES after He spoke them...and by different authors)

The AIM of GURMATTT is to MEET and MERGE with GOD... so all the Gurbani by various authors talks ABOUT how beautiful and merciful GOD is...how we should aim to MEET HIM....and merge with HIM...and be ONE with HIM...

Jarnail Singh Gyani

okay..so it means that God told the Guru's to write this about himself..i see..

but how about the verses written by the non-sikhs? were they also the word of God, given through Ravidass, Fareed, Kabeer etc.

kds1980 · #4 (**permalink**) 02-Mar-2006, 20:37 PM

http://www.sikhitothemax.com/results...27,24841,30938
S E A R C H R E S U L T S (Gurbani Direct Word)
Gurbani
Details
siqgur kI bwxI siq siq kir jwxhu gurisKhu hir krqw Awip muhhu kFwey ]
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=8335
sathigur kee baanee sath sath kar jaanahu gurasikhahu har karathaa aap muhahu kadtaaeae ||
O GurSikhs, know that the Bani, the Word of the True Guru, is true, absolutely true. The Creator Lord Himself causes the Guru to chant it.

Guru Raam Daas Ji
Raag Gauree
308

qw mY kihAw khxu jw quJY khwieAw ]
thaa mai kehiaa kehan jaa thujhai kehaaeiaa ||
When I have spoken, I spoke as You made me speak.

Guru Nanak Dev Ji
Raag Vadhans
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=8335
566

Dur kI bwxI AweI ]
dhhur kee baanee aaee ||
The Bani of His Word emanated from the Primal Lord.

Guru Arjan Dev Ji
Raag Sorath
628

jYsI mY AwvY Ksm kI bwxI qYsVw krI igAwnu vy lwlo ]
jaisee mai aavai khasam kee baanee thaisarraa karee giaan vae laalo ||
As the Word of the Forgiving Lord comes to me, so do I express it, O Lalo.

Guru Nanak Dev Ji
Raag Tilang
722

Awvin ATqrY jwin sqwnvY horu BI auTsI mrd kw cylw ]
aavan at(h)atharai jaan sathaanavai hor bhee out(h)asee maradh kaa chaelaa ||
Coming in seventy-eight (1521 A.D.), they will depart in ninety-seven (1540 A.D.), and then another disciple of man will rise up.

Guru Nanak Dev Ji
Raag Tilang
723

ijn@ kau Bey dieAwl iqn@ swDU sMgu BieAw ]
jinh ko bheae dhaeiaal thinh saadhhoo sa(n)g bhaeiaa ||
They alone join the Saadh Sangat, unto whom the Lord becomes Merciful.

Guru Arjan Dev Ji
Raag Soohee
762

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vijaydeep Singh · #5 (**permalink**) 04-Mar-2006, 16:21 PM

Gurfateh

Say verse Kahe Ravidas as lag Jivo

means God tells Ravidas to tell people to live till hope to see Lord.

Here in verse God address the writer.
say Nanak Hosi Bhi Sach means
God Said,"Oh Nanak,It will be truth".

Term Kabi Ram or Kabi Siam in Dasham Granth are also meaning that God is poet there also.Ram(absorbed) Siam(state where God starts expansion of universe or some what like black hole).

Gyani Jarnail Singh · #6 (**permalink**) 05-Mar-2006, 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amardeep

okay..so it means that God told the Guru's to write this about himself..i see..

but how about the verses written by the non-sikhs? were they also the word of God, given through Ravidass, Fareed, Kabeer etc.

YES... the GURBANI recorded in Guru Granth Ji sahib as penned by Bhagats like Kabir Ji, Ravidass ji, Sunder Ji, Sheikh Farid Ji...are ALL from GOD..Dhur ki Bani.

This is the UNIVERSALITY..the Utter BEAUTY of GURU GRANTH JI...Guru Ji NEVER said that "ONLY I am the WAY"..ONLY I know the Way..Only I am of GOD..Beleive ONLY in ME..."..

Guru Ji declared that Waheguru Has sent His Message Before..Yuj Yig Bhagat Upaiyah..He sent it NOW..and He will Send it AGAIN ( IF He senses the Need for it)....no such beleifs as THE LAST MESSAGE..etc.

The Bhagats and others like Sheikh Farid were also Men of GOD..who had reached the PINNACLE of GOD LOVE..Jin Prem Kiyo tin PRABH PAIYO..they had achieved this degree of LOVE

Jarnail singh gyani