Our Last Guru, Religions, What does God want?

Prithipal Singh · #1 (**permalink**) 08-Nov-2005, 23:05 PM

WJKWJF,
I would like to discuss a few issues:
This is a very sensitive and a delicate topic. Please correct your younger brother for any mistakes I may make in expressing my view point, it is not intentional.

Our Last Guru & UNITY
We do believe that Guru Granth Sahib is our 11the Guru, our "Last" Guru, the reason being:
Guru Granth Sahib contains and teaches everything for a truthful seeker for Mukti, and physically impossible to pass the “Guru ship ” on to someone else.

All our previous Gurus, would give Hukam, instructions, decide, what was good for the panth and the Sikhs would follow. There was Unity as the decision could not be challenged..(Came from the GURU)
With time, from Guru Nanak Devji to Guru Gobind Singh Ji, , reforms were necessary, and the Gurus implemented and made the changes that were necessary to survive in this world.
Guru Gobind Singh Ji does state that we should change with time….

In the case of Guru Granth Sahib, Hukams and instructions are to be read from the Guru Granth Sahib,and correctly understood !!.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/sikh-sikhi-sikhism/6911-our-last-guru-religions-what-does.html
Today reforms to Sikhism, changes with society are necessary as well. Thet are difficult as they are decided by our sikh leaders, Granthis. There is a disagreement between the leaders and Sikhs do disagree at some reform points, ! When making decision for the Sikhs the leaders should have love of the Guru and people 1st, then they will always make the right decision. !
At times Sikhs do not believe the Hukams of the central Sikh body as the leaders at times have their personal gains in front of them. This is the main reason we do not have UNITY in Sikhism……..,

So a Sikh living today, has to be smarter to understand:
1) To interpret the Guru word correctly

2) To obey the Hukam of a unbiased central sikh body ! (?#@!)

Then only we can have unity, have changes and reforms to survive the ever changes of culture we face today. !!

Religions come and go and will keep coming !
Note, Guru Gobind Singh Ji , mentioned in the Bachiter Natak, That whenever there is a problem on the earth, God Sends enlightened person to help. He states this keeps on happening.
Jesus came, at its origination, when Jesus was there, path was okay. Mohammed was there, all was in control. After the spiritual leaders (God Sent Guru”s ) passed away, the teachings become “RELEGION” and the community leaders in order to keep ethical controls pass judgments what is right and what is wrong. They become rigid, and say they are the only true ones, and start fighting each other in the name of the same Father WaaheGuruu !! This has happened to Sikhism as well to an extent. We will be naïve to say Sikhism is the last religion and nothing will be after this ! For others, new religions will keep coming !
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=6911
Let us not be in the same boat as other religions, and be so RIGID (or we will break like a stick), objective is the same, paths are different!! We have a advantage as we have Our Guru Granth sahib.

Great saints will come and go away. They will be Gurus for others (“religions”), so we should not condemn other “saints” as we cannot judge who is wrong or correct. We should keep to our “GURU” and let others go there way. (Even a leaf does not move without hukam, so who are we to judge Gods decisions !!!!!) In Sukhmani sahib - Sant ki Nindya is condemned !

Guru Gobind Singh Ji in past life was in Hemkunt Sahib, and as ordered by God came to the earth to show the correct way in a “new “ physical body. The body is not important as it dies away. Guru Gobind Singh Ji is an enlightened Soul, which has emerged with GOD and if requested by GOD may come again to the earth, and but be in a different body !!!
The question is, Will we be able to recognize him ?,

Is it important to recognize him ?

(May be not ! )

Why do we pray, What does Waheeguru want ?
Many people have DIFERENT reasons to believe in Waheguru, some of these are:
Q) Is God a piece of commodity which can be bought ?
No , he can not be bought, bribed, or won.
Q)We pray so we dont want to go to hell ?
So you are praying in FEAR of not going to hell, instead of love to him !!!!. BIG PROBLEM, thats what Christians believe !!! If live is ethical, dont do harm to others, through Karma, deeds , next Janam will be better, but no Mukti..

Q)I remember him so I can, and is with me always, and I want to emerse my self with him !! (Ultimate Reason-mukti)
The best reason to remember Waaheguru, so we can merge with him, mukti !! Can be obtained with bakshis with Gurus GRACE. No amount of Path, Bhakti, can help to cross over, if Guru's Bakhshis is not there !!!!!!!

Q) Will be happy if we pray to him ? and not be happy with other not praying ?
No, Waaheguru is ever loving and forgiving, he cannot be unhappy with anyone.

Q) A person doing path, in reyat, but has not left the 5 vices ? What about a person not doing path but has left the 5 vices ?
Leaving the 5 vices are very very important, a person doing path my be full of ego, and this will not help him !!!! If he is full of anger

for others !!
Waaheguru is he a being who wants all to sing his praises and then only help them !!, Then he may have an ego problem!!! God wants all to be ethical, love all, and we do path to CLEAN ourselves, not to gain points in our score card kept with GOD !!!
Whatever path you do will all be in EGO, if the vices are not left, and according to me it can be more dangerous as the person thinks he is above all !!!!!.
God needs humility, innocence, love, control 5 vices, and your engine (body) is the perfectly tuned (like a 4 stroke car engine). All it needs is a spark plug, and correct fuel (Food and Naam) then can START the inward journey to Mukti.
If the engine (body) is not tuned, no amount of spark plugs, and fuel will START your engine.

WJKWJF

Occam's Razor · #2 (**permalink**) 10-Nov-2005, 06:21 AM

Quote:

Q)I remember him so I can, and is with me always, and I want to emerse my self with him !! (Ultimate Reason-mukti)
The best reason to remember Waaheguru, so we can merge with him, mukti !!

I'm just curious ... do you think that humans can be inherently good and moral with no selfish reason, such as fusing with the creator force after death?

Prithipal Singh · #3 (**permalink**) 10-Nov-2005, 21:19 PM

WJKK
WJKF

Your Question, "I'm just curious ... do you think that humans can be inherently good and moral with no selfish reason, such as fusing with the creator force after death?"
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=6911

I may not have understood your question correctly?

Humans generally are self centered, selfish, as they are short sited and think of their survival., They will not want to do anything without a reason, no wonder we have all these problems around the world. They always want more, more, ... They assume they are always right, and the other person is wrong , starting conflicts..No wonder we find so many wandering around, and never thinking what will happen after they die !
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=6911
From a thousand, may be a person who is unselfish, will live for others, his personal gain will not come first.
Total surrenderence, humility, love for all, are prerequisites in this difficult path, and are inherently OUR (Atma)qualities but the mind concludes otherwise !

"Mann Jetay Jagjeet"

WJKK
WJKF

bindi · #4 (**permalink**) 14-Nov-2005, 15:54 PM

Sat Sri Akal,

Wow! An indeed rare person you are! A thinking and practising Sikh. Hard to find people like that these days. May guru guide you always, dear seeker.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=6911

A mystic in the mist.