What is Prayer? Should Sikhs Pray?

Archived_member15 · #46 (**permalink**) 27-Apr-2012, 05:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gyani Jarnail Singh

Hum AADMI haan EK Dammi......we are of ONE BREATH.........says GURU NANAK....
Quote: Prayer is nothing but the inhaling and exhaling of the one breath of the universe......

Wow!

I never knew Guru Nanak said that! We are ONE breath!

I just googled it and found:

There is only one breath; all are made of the same clay; the light within all is the same.
The One Light pervades all the many and various beings. This Light intermingles with them, but it is not diluted or obscured.
By Guru’s Grace, I have come to see the One. I am a sacrifice to the True Guru. (3)

What a stunning message of the Unity of Humanity and of all creatures!

I think I remember reading that passage already - it is stunning! I am reminded of the Quaker teaching of the "Inner Light", as its founder George Fox explained:

"...Every Man is enlightened by the Divine Light of Christ, and I saw it shine through all..."

- George Fox (1624 – 1691), Founder of Quakerism

I just adore Nanak's teachings. I could read the Granth all day without tiring or feeling wearied. Its just so full of the Holy Spirit and of wisdom

I'm with His Holiness the Dalai Lama when he said:

"...We bow to this great Granth, which was compiled 400 years ago. Since then it had been spreading the message of peace and love all over the world. The 21st century is witnessing a revolution in technology and man is improving his skills, but in matters of living and relationships between nations there is a marked degradation. The aim of all religions is to create a good man..."

- His Holiness the Dalai Lama, spiritua leader of Tibetan Buddhism

Taranjeet singh · #47 (**permalink**) 27-Apr-2012, 13:30 PM

Harry ji,
I am posting a sabad from ang 149 that speaks of Pain and pleasure in context of prayer. Guru Sahibaan have clearly stated in this regard that :
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/sikh-sikhi-sikhism/38357-what-is-prayer-should-sikhs-pray.html

ਮਃ ੧ ॥
मः १ ॥
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38357
First Mehl:

ਨਾਨਕ ਬੋਲਣੁ ਝਖਣਾ ਦੁਖ ਛਡਿ ਮੰਗੀਅਹਿ ਸੁਖ ॥]
O Nanak, it is absurd to ask to be spared from pain by begging for comfort.

ਸੁਖੁ ਦੁਖੁ ਦੁਇ ਦਰਿ ਕਪੜੇ ਪਹਿਰਹਿ ਜਾਇ ਮਨੁਖ ॥
Pleasure and pain are the two garments given, to be worn in the Court of the Lord.

ਜਿਥੈ ਬੋਲਣਿ ਹਾਰੀਐ ਤਿਥੈ ਚੰਗੀ ਚੁਪ ॥੨॥
Where you are bound to lose by speaking, there, you ought to remain silent. ||2||

And Jap ji Sahib also states:

ਹੁਕਮੀ ਉਤਮੁ ਨੀਚੁ ਹੁਕਮਿ ਲਿਖਿ ਦੁਖ ਸੁਖ ਪਾਈਅਹਿ ॥

By His Command, some are high and some are low; by His Written Command, pain and pleasure are obtained.

There would be other lines as well besides these. Your thinking is in line with that Guru Sahib has stated.!

harry haller · #48 (**permalink**) 27-Apr-2012, 15:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taranjeet singh

Harry ji,
I am posting a sabad from ang 149 that speaks of Pain and pleasure in context of prayer. Guru Sahibaan have clearly stated in this regard that :

ਮਃ ੧ ॥
मः १ ॥
First Mehl:

ਨਾਨਕ ਬੋਲਣੁ ਝਖਣਾ ਦੁਖ ਛਡਿ ਮੰਗੀਅਹਿ ਸੁਖ ॥]
O Nanak, it is absurd to ask to be spared from pain by begging for comfort.

ਸੁਖੁ ਦੁਖੁ ਦੁਇ ਦਰਿ ਕਪੜੇ ਪਹਿਰਹਿ ਜਾਇ ਮਨੁਖ ॥
Pleasure and pain are the two garments given, to be worn in the Court of the Lord.

ਜਿਥੈ ਬੋਲਣਿ ਹਾਰੀਐ ਤਿਥੈ ਚੰਗੀ ਚੁਪ ॥੨॥
Where you are bound to lose by speaking, there, you ought to remain silent. ||2||

And Jap ji Sahib also states:

ਹੁਕਮੀ ਉਤਮੁ ਨੀਚੁ ਹੁਕਮਿ ਲਿਖਿ ਦੁਖ ਸੁਖ ਪਾਈਅਹਿ ॥

By His Command, some are high and some are low; by His Written Command, pain and pleasure are obtained.

There would be other lines as well besides these. Your thinking is in line with that Guru Sahib has stated.!

mundahug

Archived_member15 · #49 (**permalink**) 27-Apr-2012, 18:06 PM

"...God is Breath, for the breath of the wind is shared by all, goes everywhere; nothing shuts it in, nothing holds it prisoner..."
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38357

- Saint Maximus The Confessor (c. 580 – 662), On Divine Names, I, 4, pg 4, 208, Catholic monk and mystic

"...Prayer is the oxygen of the soul. Prayer is the bread and life of the soul; it is the breath of the heart. I do not want to be anything more than this, a friar who loves...Pray, hope, and don’t worry. Worry is useless. God is merciful and will hear your prayer. Prayer is the best weapon we have; it is the key to God’s heart. You must speak to God not only with your lips, but with your heart. In fact on certain occasions you should only speak to Him with your heart..."
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38357

- Saint Padre Pio (1887 – 1968), Capuchin Catholic priest and mystic

Archived_member15 · #50 (**permalink**) 27-Apr-2012, 18:52 PM

"...God has given to the earth the breath which feeds it. It is his breath that gives life to all things. And if he were to withhold his breath, everything would be annihilated. It is the breath of God that you breathe - and you are unaware of it..."

- Saint Theophilus of Antioch ( c. 169 - 183), Catholic Bishop and mystic

"...This breathing of the air is a property of the Holy Spirit, for which the soul here prays so that she may love God perfectly...Breathing with that, His Divine Breath He raises the soul most sublimely and informs her, that she may breathe in the same breath of love...And this is for the soul so high a glory, and so profound and sublime a delight, that it cannot be described by mortal tongue, nor can human understanding, as such, attain to any conception of it; [because] the soul that is united with and transformed in God breathes God in God with the same divine breathing with which God, while in her, breathes her in himself...That which is born in the soul from that breathing of the air is the song of the sweet philomel; for even as the song of the philomel, which is the nightingale, is heard in spring, when the cold and the rains of the winter are all past, and makes melody to the ear and gives refreshment to the spirit, even so in this present communication and transformation of love the Bride is protected and freed from all temporal changes and disturbances, and detached and purged from all the imperfections of her nature, and feels the new spring in her spirit, wherein she hears the sweet voice of the Beloved, who is her sweet nightingale, in the inmost part of her soul..."
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38357

- Saint John of the Cross (1542 –1591), Catholic mystic and Doctor of the Church

The Gurus and the Catholic mystics metaphorically describe God as the "Beloved Spouse" of the Soul; and the human soul as the "Bride" yearning for the sweet embrace of her Divine Lover, his caresses, kisses and touch. This is a powerful way to envision prayer, as the loving interaction between lovers, who continually die to self and offer each other as a gift, one to the other, until they unite in the act of love itself - and become "One", in the Bridal Chamber of the soul. And then we hear the voice of the Beloved in our hearts. We Catholics call this "Bridal Mysticism" and I have found it throughout the Holy Granth. Its inspiration and foundation in Catholic Sacred Tradition is the biblical Song of Songs, an erotic and epic love poem I've quoted before on SPN. The longing for a Beloved is one of the most profound desires known to man. The Book of Proverbs in the Bible accounts, 'the Way of a man with a woman' as one of the four wonders of creation. Thus Saint Augustine tells:
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38357

"...To fall in love with God is the greatest of all romances;
To seek Him, the greatest adventure;
To find Him, the greatest human achievement..."

~Saint Augustine of Hippo (c. 354-430) Church Father and Catholic mystic

"...When he touches me I clutch the sky's sheets,
the way other lovers do
the earth's weave of clay.

Any real ectasy is a sign
you are moving in the right direction,
don't let any prude tell you otherwise.

They are like shy, young school kids -
time and space
before the woman and the man who are
intimate with God.
The realised soul can play with this universe
the way a child can a ball...

A chalice - the Grail - my body became, for it held the Christ
and he drank
from me.

Sanctified are our limbs,
for every heart has touched God,
though most with closed eyes.

A holy relic is each creature,
and beauty may worry
about its comeliness waning.

We fear dying 'til we know the truth of ourselves.

The seams on my body
are torn;

I have stepped from that region of me
that did not love
all the time.

There is a divine world of light
with many suns in the sky.

I slept with my Lord
one night,

now all that is luminous
I know we
conceived..."

- Saint Teresa of Avila (1515-1582), Catholic mystic and Doctor of the Church

"...I cannot dance, Lord, unless you lead me.
If you want me to leap with abandon,
You must intone the song.
Then I shall leap into love,
From love into knowledge,
From knowledge into enjoyment,
And from enjoyment beyond all human sensations.
There I want to remain, yet want also to circle higher still..."

Saint Mechthild of Magdeburg (c. 1207 – c.1294), Catholic mystic

As you can see, Teresa envisions herself and God as marital lovers. Their bedsheets are the sky, the earth is their bed and in between the two lovers consummate their love in the soul. Mechthild envisions God as her flirtatious young Spouse beckoning her to dance with Him. She exclaims that she cannot dance unless he grabs hold of her and leads her through the steps!

Archived_member15 · #51 (**permalink**) 28-Apr-2012, 07:32 AM

"...It is possible to offer fervent prayer even while walking in public or strolling alone, or seated in your shop, . . . while buying or selling, . . . or even while cooking..."

- St. John Chrysostom (c. 347–407), Ecloga de oratione,
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38357
Church Father and Doctor of the Church

Scarlet Pimpernel · #52 (**permalink**) 28-Apr-2012, 14:10 PM

Quote:

"...It is possible to offer fervent prayer even while walking in public or strolling alone, or seated in your shop, . . . while buying or selling, . . . or even while cooking..."

Veera But is it possible to offer fervent prayer whilst debating in an internet forum?

Archived_member15 · #53 (**permalink**) 28-Apr-2012, 17:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scarlet Pimpernel

Veera But is it possible to offer fervent prayer whilst debating in an internet forum?

My dear sister Scarlet

An excllent thought! Actually I would say, why not?

Absolutely any activity can and should be sanctified as prayer because there is no separation between our spiritual life and our daily life - its just one life, as one Catholic saint said: "There is just one life, made of flesh and spirit. And it is this life which has to become, in both soul and body, holy and filled with God. [You cannot live] a kind of double life. On the one hand, an interior life, a life of union with God; and on the other, a separate and distinct professional, social and family life".

I suppose before going online we could say within our hearts, "I'm going to offer my time on this forum up to you my Creator, let your Will be done on SPN through me, and not mine." That's prayer.

And implore the Creator to work through you for the benefit and mutual building up of your fellow SPN'ers on this online community! That's prayer: Showing compassion to others, allowing God's Will to work through you for the benefit of the common good.

“...You don't know how to pray? Put yourself in the presence of God, and as soon as you have said, "Lord, I don't know how to pray!" you can be sure you've already begun...Prayer is not a question of what you say or feel, but of love. And you love when you try hard to say something to the Lord, even though you might not actually say anything... I have often meditated on this life of spiritual childhood, which is not incompatible with fortitude, because it demands a strong will, proven maturity, an open and firm character. To work in this way is to pray. To study thus is likewise prayer. Research done with this spirit is prayer too. We are always doing the same thing, for everything can be prayer, all activity can and should lead us to God, nourish our intimate dealings with him, from morning to night. Any honorable work can be prayer and all prayerful work is God's Work. In this way the soul develops a unity of life, which is both simple and strong..."

- Saint Josemaría Escrivá de Balaguer (1902 – 1975)

"...How few really understand this! If they hear about the interior life, they imagine some obscure temple. For more than a quarter of a century I have been saying that such isn't the case. I talk about the interior life of ordinary people who habitually find themselves in the hubbub of the city, in the light of day, in the street, at work, with their families or simply relaxing; they are centred on God all day long. And what is this except a life of continuous prayer? Isn't it true that you have seen the need to become a soul of prayer, to reach an intimacy with God that leads to divinization? Such is faith as always understood by souls of prayer — ‘A man becomes God,’ writes Clement of Alexandria, ‘because he loves whatever God loves.’ At first it will be more difficult. You must make an effort to seek out the Lord, to thank him for his fatherly and practical concern for us. Although it is not a question of sentiment, little by little the love of God makes itself felt like a rustle in the soul. It is God who pursues us lovingly: ‘Behold, I stand at the door and knock.’...Prayer then becomes continuous, like the beating of our heart, like our pulse..."

- Saint Josemaría Escrivá de Balaguer (1902 – 1975)

"...Great holiness lies in carrying out the little duties of each moment. Do everything for Love. Thus there will be no little things: everything will be big. Perseverance in little things for Love is heroism. A Christian should do all honest human work, be it intellectual or manual, with the greatest perfection possible: with human perfection (professional competence) and with Christian perfection (for love of God's Will and as a service to mankind). Human work done like that, no matter how humble or insignificant it may seem, helps to shape the world. The world's divine dimension is made more visible and our human labour is thus incorporated into the marvellous work of Creation. It is raised to the order of grace. It is sanctified and becomes God's work...Ordinary life can be holy and full of God...The supernatural value of our life does not depend on accomplishing the great undertakings sometimes suggested to us by our overactive imagination. Rather it is to be found in the faithful acceptance of God's will, in welcoming generously the opportunities for small, daily sacrifice..."

- Saint Josemaría Escrivá de Balaguer (1902 – 1975)

As God is everywhere and present in every moment of our lives, anywhere - yes, even an online forum like SPN - can become a meeting place with the Divine and a prayer.

Archived_member15 · #54 (**permalink**) 28-Apr-2012, 18:21 PM

BTW I JUST REALIZED I CALLED YOU SISTER

I KNOW YOUR A MAN AND YET WHENEVER I SEE SCARLET I THINK WOMAN

Somehow that name confuses me - I am very sorry my dear brother, I think I've called you sister before! Please accept my apology.