Cannibis and Sikhism

harry haller · #37 (**permalink**) 17-Jun-2012, 17:36 PM

Harvirji

As my mother used to be fond of saying, 'this hair did not get white on its own', although what little hair I have is quite grey as opposed to white, We have all lived, all my opinions, everything I am, including my respect for Bani, has been forged by how I have lived. I am not a great one for following or distributing the official line. Things have to be experienced, and for me, they have to be experienced right to the end.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/sikh-sikhi-sikhism/38191-cannibis-and-sikhism.html

Cannabis is mentally highly addictive, it starts as the odd yearning, but soon, you notice everything is so much better after a joint, a bath, sex, food, walking in the sun. It attaches itself to everything in your life that is fun, and obstinately demands to be taken to enhance the fun. But then, everything is ok while things are in order, because as soon as you get a tough time, a bad spell, then it becomes a crutch, and once it becomes a crutch, you could get stuck with it for quite a long time. I have met plenty of successful people who gave up cannabis, I have yet to meet one successful person who still takes cannabis. They just have lots of constantly good ideas that they do nothing about! There is also the problem of production, 20 years ago cannabis was nothing like the strength of today, these days they pump it full of chemicals to enhance the effect and the speed of growth, because its all about money, who knows what your funding when you buy it. 20 years ago, you could have a joint, or two, and be ok for work the next day, today, who knows what your smoking, or have long the effects will last for.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38191

Lastly, next year the police will have roadside drug testing kits, traces of cannabis in your blood is going to label you a drug user, and the charge of driving whilst under the influence of drugs, bearing in mind cannabis can stay in the blood stream for upto 60 days, you will be taking a huge risk if you drive and even smoke 1 joint every 2 months,

In moderation, cannabis can be a highly pleasurable experience, but I have yet to meet a person that does not end up 'chasing the dragon', and anyway, the pleasure and high dwarf into insignificance when compared with the state of Naam, the state of connection, of being in consonance,

Laud lots of things, don't laud drugs, its not glamorous, its not hip, it is the absolute opposite of connection and consonance, it follows its own path, rather than enhancing yours.

sid · #38 (**permalink**) 17-Jun-2012, 17:43 PM

it is not allowed anywhere but it is restricted somewhere.
The best thing is to avoid it and the second best is that addiction is bad but occasionally and limited use is only way,else every is aware about the results

Taranjeet singh · #39 (**permalink**) 17-Jun-2012, 17:54 PM

Harry ji,

Have gone through your post and have enjoyed it.

Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38191
Just wondering how addiction actually operates through our physiology. Can you throw some light on this aspect.? Some spinal cord connection or from where nerve center begin and may be neuron or neuro-transmitters..etc..etc. I have only vague idea. I do not know if it is the right thread to initiate discussion. You may kindly take your own time or send me a link for small write up except for US sites on Mental Health.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38191
You may kindly ignore this if it is redundant and out of context.

Moderators are free to delete the post if it is out of place.

harry haller · #40 (**permalink**) 17-Jun-2012, 21:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taranjeet singh

Harry ji,

Have gone through your post and have enjoyed it.

Just wondering how addiction actually operates through our physiology. Can you throw some light on this aspect.? Some spinal cord connection or from where nerve center begin and may be neuron or neuro-transmitters..etc..etc. I have only vague idea. I do not know if it is the right thread to initiate discussion. You may kindly take your own time or send me a link for small write up except for US sites on Mental Health.
ou may kindly ignore this if it is redundant and out of context.

Moderators are free to delete the post if it is out of place.

Taranjeetji

I do not think this is reduntant, I think the greatest danger of cannibis is the addictive nature of the drug.I do not think the health aspects or the damage to the brain rates as high as the addictive. Long term and short term memory are hugely affected, sometimes permanently, short term memory can also be affected as can short term memory. Another facet is the effect on short term memory as well.

I have no explanation of what causes addiction, I can only state my own experiences, I always thought everyone was like me, but I know I have an extremely addictive nature. So for me to embrace Sikhism, I have had to conquer several addictions, they whet my appetite for the state of Naam.

It is my desire to be completely addicted and a slave to Creator, to follow Hukam is the sweetest path there is, and taking the paths I have, the beauty of this one is without equal.

Now I am curious, I have no desire to do many things that were for a long time a way of life for me, to those reading that had the disciplne to stay on the good path, is it a battle? have you only put yourself in a state of aversion rather than understanding? I sense this a lot in Islam, I still cannot understand why heaven is described in terms that reflect earthly pleasures, almost as if aversion is rewarded by the very action one is averse to on earth. Why is the concept of addiction not present in heaven? In Sikhism should one be averse to actions that cause addictions, absolutely, how can one do that through understanding alone if the action is never experienced, and all you have to guide you is propoganda and the memories of old hippies.

I am not advocating trying everything, I genuinely wish someone wiser than myself, which puts most in that catagory, can describe the ease of the path that I did not take, so that others find it helpful, one at least being our thread starter

Luckysingh · #41 (**permalink**) 18-Jun-2012, 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taranjeet singh

Harry ji,

Have gone through your post and have enjoyed it.

Just wondering how addiction actually operates through our physiology. Can you throw some light on this aspect.? Some spinal cord connection or from where nerve center begin and may be neuron or neuro-transmitters..etc..etc. I have only vague idea. I do not know if it is the right thread to initiate discussion. You may kindly take your own time or send me a link for small write up except for US sites on Mental Health.
You may kindly ignore this if it is redundant and out of context.

Moderators are free to delete the post if it is out of place.

I can explain the physiology that you have requested but most of it is quite complex to mention here as it involves the different chemicals released at the junctions or synapses of neurons.
This is what results in the different effects of drugs that mess with our body chemistry.

To keep it simple and brief for all to understand, we can firstly assume it is these neurons and nerve endings that all lead to the brain that gives us our sense of perception such as touch, sight, sound, taste, smell...etc..
Now all recreational drugs become recreational because of this very stimulation of senses as well as the euphoria and good feeling.
NOTE- It is not just stimulation but also the opposite dampening effects that occur elsewhere.
This is what I find interesting and fascinating, since the WHOLE UNIVERSE works in a kind of duality such as day-night, light-dark,positve-negative, up-down, cold-hot,good-bad....etc..etc... So for every positive effect there is also a corresponding negative action be it around us or inside our bodies.
In this case of mood enhancing drugs we also get the dampening numbness and loss of perception to physical pain or stimulation, while enjoying other 'upper' effects/

A well known fact that certain musicians and artists can only work under the influence. This is because cannabis, acid and mdma..etc.. all cause the user to experience enhanced perception in music.
They can hear instruments and sounds that they would not normally hear or distinguish in normal conditions.
Many musicians can't compose unless they haven't had drugs for this very reason. BUT- this also gives the negative effects that affect physical feelings of thirst, hunger, numbness over body, vision and 'downers'(when affect wears off).

So basically for all the positive effects that are normally short term there are also many negative effects with some being short and some long term.
The body does contain many many neurons that are not normally active.
These unactive neurons can be awakened with many recreational drugs. But there are always the drawbacks and negatives that come along.

Nearly all abused drugs of today have been created by researchers looking for benefits of awakening these very dormant neurons and cells. But to this day an ideal wihtout any drawbacks has not been found.

Most of the research is done for armed forces with soldiers being used as tests for these developments. The aim is usually to increase their abilities in combat, alertness, machine control..etc...etc.

The main thing to understand is Yes, the person consuming is and will be experiencing some good chemical actions and feelings, BUT these sensations and benefits can NEVER outweigh the risks and negative drawbacks that the user will encounter in the long term no matter if it is cannabis, heroin, MDMA, ketamines, acid, LSD....etc..etc..

Just as every benefical synthesised medicine has it's side effects and adverse reactions so do all recreational substances.

The 'nasha' from gurbani is the ultimate high without ever any long term negatives. From what I have encountered and experienced in my lifetime, I can in all honesty guarantee this!!!!

KaranveerSinghSahota · #42 (**permalink**) 05-Nov-2012, 08:27 AM

VJKKVJKF, Hate to interupt but I would like to share with you something our beloved veer Ji's were sharing at a Gurdwara once, they both simply explained to us what all this Marijuanna and Nihang drama was all about, Nihangs had to live in the jungle when in battle, even worse the Punjabi Jungle, loads of predators walking about, ready to attack etc, The Nihangs/Guru Gobind Singh Ji could not risk going hunting for food, so they had to feed on what they could find in their surroundings, like tree barks, nuts, they needed something to aid them with this food, and that was Marijuanna, guru Gobind Singh Ji told us that a certain thing was ok if it aided/increased your healh, even things that were shunned upon like Alcohol, drugs. Haha imagine getting kicked out of a Gurudwara for taking aspirin or paracetamol, anyway back to the point, using bad things that don't help progress you/recreationally was against Sikhism, today's so called "Nihangs" use the excuse "Guru Ji gave this as prasad/blessing" to do these things, some of them don't even realise that it's bad and actually believe guru Ji would of wanted them to do it, these are perfectly healthy Nihangs taking Weed to enjoy, by making some Juice or lassi when they are not even in war and have normal food around them, that is wrong, if it's does good and doesn't harm anyone else around you, then go ahead and increase your life, which will be used to praise Waheguru Ji, VJKKVJKF icecreammunda

prakash.s.bagga · #43 (**permalink**) 05-Nov-2012, 15:37 PM

I am surprised to see here as to why one should be so interested in the past activities
I think it would be much better to know what our present GuROO Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji is telling us to do.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38191

Prakash.S.Bagga

prakash.s.bagga · #44 (**permalink**) 06-Nov-2012, 12:56 PM

One should spread the following message from Gurbanee as

ਪੂਰਾ ਗੁਰੁ ਪੂਰੀ ਬਣਤ ਬਣਾਈ ॥

पूरा गुरु पूरी बणत बणाई ॥

Pūrā gur pūrī baṇaṯ baṇā▫ī.

The Perfect Guru has fashioned His perfect fashion.

ਨਾਨਕ ਭਗਤ ਮਿਲੀ ਵਡਿਆਈ ॥੪॥੨੪॥

नानक भगत मिली वडिआई ॥४॥२४॥

Nānak bẖagaṯ milī vadi▫ā▫ī. ||4||24||

O Nanak, the Lord's devotees are blessed with glorious greatness. ||4||24||

ਆਸਾ ਮਹਲਾ ੫ ॥

आसा महला ५ ॥

Āsā mėhlā 5.

Aasaa, Fifth Mehl:

ਗੁਰ ਕੈ ਸਬਦਿ ਬਨਾਵਹੁ ਇਹੁ ਮਨੁ ॥

गुर कै सबदि बनावहु इहु मनु ॥

Gur kai sabaḏ banāvahu ih man.

I have shaped this mind in the mold of the Guru's Word.

ਗੁਰ ਕਾ ਦਰਸਨੁ ਸੰਚਹੁ ਹਰਿ ਧਨੁ ॥੧॥

गुर का दरसनु संचहु हरि धनु ॥१॥

Gur kā ḏarsan sancẖahu har ḏẖan. ||1||

Beholding the Blessed Vision of the Guru's Darshan, I have gathered the wealth of the Lord. ||1||

ਊਤਮ ਮਤਿ ਮੇਰੈ ਰਿਦੈ ਤੂੰ ਆਉ ॥

ऊतम मति मेरै रिदै तूं आउ ॥

Ūṯam maṯ merai riḏai ṯūŉ ā▫o.

O sublime understanding, come, enter into my mind,

ਧਿਆਵਉ ਗਾਵਉ ਗੁਣ ਗੋਵਿੰਦਾ ਅਤਿ ਪ੍ਰੀਤਮ ਮੋਹਿ ਲਾਗੈ ਨਾਉ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥

धिआवउ गावउ गुण गोविंदा अति प्रीतम मोहि लागै नाउ ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥

Ḏẖi▫āva▫o gāva▫o guṇ govinḏā aṯ parīṯam mohi lāgai nā▫o. ||1|| rahā▫o.

that I may meditate and sing the Glorious Praises of the Lord of the Universe, and love so dearly the Lord's Name. ||1||Pause||

ਤ੍ਰਿਪਤਿ ਅਘਾਵਨੁ ਸਾਚੈ ਨਾਇ ॥

त्रिपति अघावनु साचै नाइ ॥

Ŧaripaṯ agẖāvan sācẖai nā▫e.

I am satisfied and satiated by the True Name.

ਅਠਸਠਿ ਮਜਨੁ ਸੰਤ ਧੂਰਾਇ ॥੨॥

अठसठि मजनु संत धूराइ ॥२॥

Aṯẖsaṯẖ majan sanṯ ḏẖūrā▫e. ||2||

My cleansing bath at the sixty-eight sacred shrines of pilgrimage is the dust of the Saints. ||2||

ਸਭ ਮਹਿ ਜਾਨਉ ਕਰਤਾ ਏਕ ॥

सभ महि जानउ करता एक ॥

Sabẖ mėh jān▫o karṯā ek.

I recognize that the One Creator is contained in all.

ਸਾਧਸੰਗਤਿ ਮਿਲਿ ਬੁਧਿ ਬਿਬੇਕ ॥੩॥

साधसंगति मिलि बुधि बिबेक ॥३॥

Sāḏẖsangaṯ mil buḏẖ bibek. ||3||

Joining the Saadh Sangat, the Company of the Holy, my understanding is refined. ||3||

ਦਾਸੁ ਸਗਲ ਕਾ ਛੋਡਿ ਅਭਿਮਾਨੁ ॥

दासु सगल का छोडि अभिमानु ॥

Ḏās sagal kā cẖẖod abẖimān.

I have become the servant of all; I have renounced my ego and pride.

ਨਾਨਕ ਕਉ ਗੁਰਿ ਦੀਨੋ ਦਾਨੁ ॥੪॥੨੫॥
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38191

नानक कउ गुरि दीनो दानु ॥४॥२५॥

Nānak ka▫o gur ḏīno ḏān. ||4||25||

The Guru has given this gift to Nanak. ||4||25||

ਆਸਾ ਮਹਲਾ ੫ ॥

आसा महला ५ ॥

Āsā mėhlā 5.

Aasaa, Fifth Mehl:

ਬੁਧਿ ਪ੍ਰਗਾਸ ਭਈ ਮਤਿ ਪੂਰੀ ॥

बुधि प्रगास भई मति पूरी ॥

Buḏẖ pargās bẖa▫ī maṯ pūrī.

My intellect has been enlightened, and my understanding is perfect.

ਤਾ ਤੇ ਬਿਨਸੀ ਦੁਰਮਤਿ ਦੂਰੀ ॥੧॥

ता ते बिनसी दुरमति दूरी ॥१॥

Ŧā ṯe binsī ḏurmaṯ ḏūrī. ||1||

Thus my evil-mindedness, which kept me far from Him, has been removed. ||1||

ਐਸੀ ਗੁਰਮਤਿ ਪਾਈਅਲੇ ॥

ऐसी गुरमति पाईअले ॥

Aisī gurmaṯ pā▫ī▫ale.

Such are the Teachings which I have received from the Guru;

ਬੂਡਤ ਘੋਰ ਅੰਧ ਕੂਪ ਮਹਿ ਨਿਕਸਿਓ ਮੇਰੇ ਭਾਈ ਰੇ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥

बूडत घोर अंध कूप महि निकसिओ मेरे भाई रे ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥

Būdaṯ gẖor anḏẖ kūp mėh niksi▫o mere bẖā▫ī re. ||1|| rahā▫o.

while I was drowning in the pitch black well, I was saved, O my Siblings of Destiny. ||1||Pause||

ਮਹਾ ਅਗਾਹ ਅਗਨਿ ਕਾ ਸਾਗਰੁ ॥

महा अगाह अगनि का सागरु ॥

Mahā agāh agan kā sāgar.

To cross over the totally unfathomable ocean of fire;

ਗੁਰੁ ਬੋਹਿਥੁ ਤਾਰੇ ਰਤਨਾਗਰੁ ॥੨॥

गुरु बोहिथु तारे रतनागरु ॥२॥

Gur bohith ṯāre raṯnāgar. ||2||

The Guru is the boat; He is treasure of jewels. ||2||

ਦੁਤਰ ਅੰਧ ਬਿਖਮ ਇਹ ਮਾਇਆ ॥

दुतर अंध बिखम इह माइआ ॥

Ḏuṯar anḏẖ bikẖam ih mā▫i▫ā.

This ocean of Maya is dark and treacherous.

ਗੁਰਿ ਪੂਰੈ ਪਰਗਟੁ ਮਾਰਗੁ ਦਿਖਾਇਆ ॥੩॥

गुरि पूरै परगटु मारगु दिखाइआ ॥३॥

Gur pūrai pargat mārag ḏikẖā▫i▫ā. ||3||

The Perfect Guru has revealed the way to cross over it. ||3||

ਜਾਪ ਤਾਪ ਕਛੁ ਉਕਤਿ ਨ ਮੋਰੀ ॥

जाप ताप कछु उकति न मोरी ॥

Jāp ṯāp kacẖẖ ukaṯ na morī.

I do not have the ability to chant or practice intense meditation.

ਗੁਰ ਨਾਨਕ ਸਰਣਾਗਤਿ ਤੋਰੀ ॥੪॥੨੬॥

गुर नानक सरणागति तोरी ॥४॥२६॥

Gur Nānak sarṇāgaṯ ṯorī. ||4||26||

Guru Nanak seeks Your Sanctuary. ||4||26||

ਆਸਾ ਮਹਲਾ ੫ ਤਿਪਦੇ ੨ ॥

आसा महला ५ तिपदे २ ॥

Āsā mėhlā 5 ṯipḏe 2.

Aasaa, Fifth Mehl, Ti-Padas:

ਹਰਿ ਰਸੁ ਪੀਵਤ ਸਦ ਹੀ ਰਾਤਾ ॥

हरि रसु पीवत सद ही राता ॥

Har ras pīvaṯ saḏ hī rāṯā.

One who drinks in the Lord's sublime essence is forever imbued with it,

ਆਨ ਰਸਾ ਖਿਨ ਮਹਿ ਲਹਿ ਜਾਤਾ ॥

आन रसा खिन महि लहि जाता ॥

Ān rasā kẖin mėh lėh jāṯā.

while other essences wear off in an instant.

ਹਰਿ ਰਸ ਕੇ ਮਾਤੇ ਮਨਿ ਸਦਾ ਅਨੰਦ ॥

हरि रस के माते मनि सदा अनंद ॥

Har ras ke māṯe man saḏā anand.

Intoxicated with the Lord's sublime essence, the mind is forever in ecstasy.

ਆਨ ਰਸਾ ਮਹਿ ਵਿਆਪੈ ਚਿੰਦ ॥੧॥

आन रसा महि विआपै चिंद ॥१॥

Ān rasā mėh vi▫āpai cẖinḏ. ||1||

Other essences bring only anxiety. ||1||

ਹਰਿ ਰਸੁ ਪੀਵੈ ਅਲਮਸਤੁ ਮਤਵਾਰਾ ॥

हरि रसु पीवै अलमसतु मतवारा ॥

Har ras pīvai almasaṯ maṯvārā.

One who drinks in the Lord's sublime essence, is intoxicated and enraptured;

ਆਨ ਰਸਾ ਸਭਿ ਹੋਛੇ ਰੇ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥

आन रसा सभि होछे रे ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥

Ān rasā sabẖ hocẖẖe re. ||1|| rahā▫o.

all other essences have no effect. ||1||Pause||

ਹਰਿ ਰਸ ਕੀ ਕੀਮਤਿ ਕਹੀ ਨ ਜਾਇ ॥

हरि रस की कीमति कही न जाइ ॥

Har ras kī kīmaṯ kahī na jā▫e.

The value of the Lord's sublime essence cannot be described.

ਹਰਿ ਰਸੁ ਸਾਧੂ ਹਾਟਿ ਸਮਾਇ ॥

हरि रसु साधू हाटि समाइ ॥

Har ras sāḏẖū hāt samā▫e.

The Lord's sublime essence permeates the homes of the Holy.

ਲਾਖ ਕਰੋਰੀ ਮਿਲੈ ਨ ਕੇਹ ॥

लाख करोरी मिलै न केह ॥

Lākẖ karorī milai na keh.

One may spend thousands and millions, but it cannot be purchased.

ਜਿਸਹਿ ਪਰਾਪਤਿ ਤਿਸ ਹੀ ਦੇਹਿ ॥੨॥

जिसहि परापति तिस ही देहि ॥२॥

Jisahi parāpaṯ ṯis hī ḏėh. ||2||

He alone obtains it, who is so pre-ordained. ||2||

ਨਾਨਕ ਚਾਖਿ ਭਏ ਬਿਸਮਾਦੁ ॥

नानक चाखि भए बिसमादु ॥

Nānak cẖākẖ bẖa▫e bismāḏ.

Tasting it, Nanak is wonder-struck.

ਨਾਨਕ ਗੁਰ ਤੇ ਆਇਆ ਸਾਦੁ ॥

नानक गुर ते आइआ सादु ॥

Nānak gur ṯe ā▫i▫ā sāḏ.

Through the Guru, Nanak has obtained this taste.

ਈਤ ਊਤ ਕਤ ਛੋਡਿ ਨ ਜਾਇ ॥

ईत ऊत कत छोडि न जाइ ॥

Īṯ ūṯ kaṯ cẖẖod na jā▫e.

Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38191
Here and hereafter, it does not leave him.

ਨਾਨਕ ਗੀਧਾ ਹਰਿ ਰਸ ਮਾਹਿ ॥੩॥੨੭॥

नानक गीधा हरि रस माहि ॥३॥२७॥

Nānak gīḏẖā har ras māhi. ||3||27||

Nanak is imbued and enraptured with the Lord's subtle essence. ||3||27||

Brother Onam · #45 (**permalink**) 06-Nov-2012, 21:57 PM

Gur Fateh, young brother,
I appreciate your thirst for Truth. As to the bhang, my observation is that, while I, like you, do not partake at all, historically various cultures around the world have found a place for mind-altering herbs, these were used strictly in ceremonial settings. There is a vast difference between devout ceremonial use of such herbs and recreational use. In today's world, and especially in Sikhi, there is really no place for such use. It is a slippery slope too. American Indians held tobacco to be a sacred herb, so now, after the utter destruction of their world and way of life, many Indians smoke cigarettes in broken imitation of its once-sacred use. Cannabis too, was once used as a true sacrament, but I'll guess maybe 99% of its use today is recreational. So, rather than getting closer to God, people are getting stoned and confused; further away from Him.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38191
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=38191
Stay strong and rightly-guided, young brother. Waheguru bless you.