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09-Aug-2012, 00:14 AM
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| |  | | | Re: Claims in the Sri Guru Granth Sahib are false
Quote: |
“From this primal void, came the moon, the sun and the earth.”
| If on reads the whole shabad you will come across many such verses. It is simply stating that God created the universe and stars and moons planets were formed in what use to be primal void. Even if taken literally it is not wrong. Quote:
“The limits of the created universe cannot be perceived. Its limits here and beyond cannot be perceived. Many struggle to know His limits, but His limits cannot be found. No one can know these limits.”
This is wrong.
We CAN perceive these expanding limits, in fact we have, and we know that The Universe is 13.7 billion years old with an increasing rate of accuracy.
| Seriously? Because you know the universe is 13.7 billion years old you know the limit of universe?
What is the area of universe please? How many planets, suns, moons, comets, asteroids are there? Please tell me the limits of the universe? Quote: |
“Creating the sun and the moon, He infused His Light into them. He created the night and the day; Wondrous are His miraculous plays.”
| This is the tricky one. Well Sikhs believe that every thing in the universe has one light or God's light in it. It is the source of everything that there is. So this quote can be taken in that sense that sun and moon have that light in them.
You see how one can use his imagination to approve or disprove various verses from Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji.
As mentioned before in this thread you should have read the whole shabad and the verses in context, it would have more sense. Got anything to share on This Topic? Why not share your immediate thoughts/reaction with us! Login Now! or Sign Up Today! to share your views... Gurfateh! |
09-Aug-2012, 00:49 AM
| | | | | Enrolled: Aug 29th, 2010 Age: 61
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| | | | | Re: Claims in the Sri Guru Granth Sahib are false
If one can grasp the WAVE CONCEPT OF DIVINE WORDS in Gurbanee then I think one can have ,better,and different understanding about the CREATOR and CTREATIONS
of the universe.
From Gurbanee one can learn that ultimately The Universe and its creations are
some INVISIBLE, SUPER ACTIVE WAVES only. Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/sikh-sikhi-sikhism/37125-claims-sri-guru-granth-sahib-false.html
Thus every thing of the Univese is nothing but A WAVE Only. Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=37125
Gurbanee messages are ETERNAL and CENT PERSCENT TRUE but every one may not be able to understand this without the grace of SATiGuRu.
Prakash.S.Bagga |
09-Aug-2012, 03:48 AM
|  | ਨਾਮ ਤੇਰੇ ਕੀ ਜੋਤਿ ਲਗਾਈ (Previously namjap) | | | Enrolled: Jul 14th, 2007
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| |  | | | Re: Claims in the Sri Guru Granth Sahib are false
The Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji written in poetry form
has used expressions in various ways
starting with the phrase: FROM THIS PRIMAL VOID....
For example, Page 1037, Line 11
ਪਉਣੁ ਪਾਣੀ ਸੁੰਨੈ ਤੇ ਸਾਜੇ ॥
पउणु पाणी सुंनै ते साजे ॥
Pa▫uṇ pāṇī sunnai ṯe sāje.
From this Primal Void, He fashioned air and water.
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok | Page 1037, Line 12
ਸੁੰਨਹੁ ਬ੍ਰਹਮਾ ਬਿਸਨੁ ਮਹੇਸੁ ਉਪਾਏ ॥
सुंनहु ब्रहमा बिसनु महेसु उपाए ॥
Sunnahu barahmā bisan mahes upā▫e.
From this Primal Void, Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva issued forth.
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok | Page 1037, Line 14
ਸੁੰਨਹੁ ਸਪਤ ਸਰੋਵਰ ਥਾਪੇ ॥
सुंनहु सपत सरोवर थापे ॥
Sunnahu sapaṯ sarovar thāpe.
From this Primal Void, the seven seas were established.
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok | Page 1037, Line 15
ਸੁੰਨਹੁ ਚੰਦੁ ਸੂਰਜੁ ਗੈਣਾਰੇ ॥
सुंनहु चंदु सूरजु गैणारे ॥
Sunnahu cẖanḏ sūraj gaiṇāre.
From this Primal Void, came the moon, the sun and the earth.
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok | Page 1037, Line 16
ਸੁੰਨਹੁ ਧਰਤਿ ਅਕਾਸੁ ਉਪਾਏ ॥
सुंनहु धरति अकासु उपाए ॥
Sunnahu ḏẖaraṯ akās upā▫e.
From this Primal Void, the earth and the Akaashic Ethers were created.
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok | Page 1037, Line 17
ਸੁੰਨਹੁ ਖਾਣੀ ਸੁੰਨਹੁ ਬਾਣੀ ॥
सुंनहु खाणी सुंनहु बाणी ॥
Sunnahu kẖāṇī sunnahu baṇī.
From this Primal Void, came the four sources of creation, and the power of speech.
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok | Page 1037, Line 19
ਸੁੰਨਹੁ ਰਾਤਿ ਦਿਨਸੁ ਦੁਇ ਕੀਏ ॥
सुंनहु राति दिनसु दुइ कीए ॥
Sunnahu rāṯ ḏinas ḏu▫e kī▫e.
From this Primal Void, He made both night and day;
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok |
Further references about Primal Void are in the following shabads: Page 1023, Line 3
ਖੰਡੀ ਬ੍ਰਹਮੰਡੀ ਪਾਤਾਲੀ ਪੁਰੀਈ ਤ੍ਰਿਭਵਣ ਤਾੜੀ ਲਾਈ ਹੇ ॥੧੦॥
खंडी ब्रहमंडी पाताली पुरीई त्रिभवण ताड़ी लाई हे ॥१०॥
Kẖandī barahmandī pāṯālī purī▫ī ṯaribẖavaṇ ṯāṛī lā▫ī he. ||10||
In the galaxies and solar systems, nether regions, celestial realms and the three worlds, the Lord is in the primal void of deep absorption. ||10||
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok | Page 1023, Line 10
ਨਾਨਕ ਨਾਮਿ ਰਤੇ ਬੈਰਾਗੀ ਨਿਜ ਘਰਿ ਤਾੜੀ ਲਾਈ ਹੇ ॥੧੬॥੩॥
नानक नामि रते बैरागी निज घरि ताड़ी लाई हे ॥१६॥३॥
Nānak nām raṯe bairāgī nij gẖar ṯāṛī lā▫ī he. ||16||3||
O Nanak, imbued with the Naam, I am detached; in the home of my own self deep within, I am absorbed in the primal void of deep meditation. ||16||3||
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok | Page 1023, Line 12
ਸਾਚੇ ਜੋਗ ਜੁਗਤਿ ਵੀਚਾਰੀ ਸਾਚੇ ਤਾੜੀ ਲਾਈ ਹੇ ॥੧॥
साचे जोग जुगति वीचारी साचे ताड़ी लाई हे ॥१॥
Sācẖe jog jugaṯ vīcẖārī sācẖe ṯāṛī lā▫ī he. ||1||
I contemplate the Way of Yoga, the Way of Union with the True Lord. I am truly absorbed in the primal void of deep meditation. ||1||
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok | Page 1023, Line 13
ਤਾੜੀ ਲਾਈ ਸਿਰਜਣਹਾਰੈ ॥
ताड़ी लाई सिरजणहारै ॥
Ŧāṛī lā▫ī sirjaṇhārai.
the Creator Lord was absorbed in the primal void.
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok | Page 1026, Line 14
ਤਾੜੀ ਲਾਈ ਅਪਰ ਅਪਾਰੈ ॥
ताड़ी लाई अपर अपारै ॥
Ŧāṛī lā▫ī apar apārai.
the infinite, endless Lord was absorbed in the primal void.
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok | Page 1037, Line 10
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=37125
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=37125
ਸੁੰਨ ਕਲਾ ਅਪਰੰਪਰਿ ਧਾਰੀ ॥
सुंन कला अपर्मपरि धारी ॥
Sunn kalā aprampar ḏẖārī.
In the Primal Void, the Infinite Lord assumed His Power.
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok | Page 1037, Line 12
ਅਗਨਿ ਪਾਣੀ ਜੀਉ ਜੋਤਿ ਤੁਮਾਰੀ ਸੁੰਨੇ ਕਲਾ ਰਹਾਇਦਾ ॥੨॥
अगनि पाणी जीउ जोति तुमारी सुंने कला रहाइदा ॥२॥
Agan pāṇī jī▫o joṯ ṯumārī sunne kalā rahā▫iḏā. ||2||
Your Light pervades fire, water and souls; Your Power rests in the Primal Void. ||2||
Guru Nanak Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok | Page 1141, Line 8
ਚੀਤਿ ਆਵੈ ਤਾਂ ਸੁੰਨਿ ਸਮਾਇਆ ॥
चीति आवै तां सुंनि समाइआ ॥
Cẖīṯ āvai ṯāʼn sunn samā▫i▫ā.
When He comes to mind, I am absorbed in the Primal Void of God.
Guru Arjan Dev - view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok |
Last edited by Astroboy; 09-Aug-2012 at 04:00 AM.
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09-Aug-2012, 09:17 AM
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| |  | | | Re: Claims in the Sri Guru Granth Sahib are False
The Primal Void is actually the space containing everything. Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=37125
Similar to how the ''nothingness' is in fact ''everything'' Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=37125
Only to us, can this be described as a void, because infact it is NOT an empty Void, this is what we see or don't see!!!
Wherever there is a void, it is indeed NOT that, that is just what we think we see or don't see !! | | The following members appreciate Luckysingh Ji for the above message. | |
11-Aug-2012, 04:38 AM
| | ਨਾਮ ਤੇਰੇ ਕੀ ਜੋਤਿ ਲਗਾਈ (Previously namjap) | | | Enrolled: Jul 14th, 2007
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| | | | | Re: Claims in the Sri Guru Granth Sahib are False
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luckysingh  The Primal Void is actually the space containing everything. | Here's a video I'd like to share that will explain further.
This simulations follows the formation of a galaxy like our own. It assumes a Cold Dark Matter Universe. The movie shows the distribution of gas ... |
11-Aug-2012, 10:47 AM
|  | Sawa lakh se EK larraoan | | | Enrolled: Jul 4th, 2004 Location: KUALA LUMPUR MALAYSIA Age: 64
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| | | | | Re: Claims in the Sri Guru Granth Sahib are False
Matter...anti-Matter..Void..?? imho there more "Void" than matter in the Universe..are those vast "empty" spaces between stars, galaxies really empty ?? in empty as we know empty ??
Is black hole Empty ?? Primal Void..is a English Word...translated word...Sunn is the Original...There was even a Black Hole of calcutta and it wasnt empty !! Lots of assumptions..and Lots of "primal Void" ADDED even wheres NONE mentioned in the Original. Guru nanak Ji didnt have the U-Tube and Modern Camera/photoshop/Nasa super computers to churn out VIDEOS like we can...Guru Ji only had WORDS.....to create the PICTURE in our MINDS that HE wanted us to SEE....and just as each person sees the Nasa Videos simulation videos on Utube differently...so does each reader of the words...there is NO UNIVERSAL EXACT SAME WORD PICTURE that everyone sees the same way...The One and ONLY BOTTOMLINE IS..as our Knowledge develops..grows..we UNDERSTAND GURBANI BETTER..we IMAGINE better..we "SEE" more and more what GURU NANAK ji saw and attempts to show us...a simple matter like explaining Quantum Physiscs to an aboriginal fresh out of the Amazon Jungle in sign language and gestures....is what GURU NANAK Ji faced...thats WHY Guru ji even DISCARDED all the known SCRIPTS,Vocabulary, language use, CONCEPTS etc ...simply because THOSE FAILED to address ADEQUATELY what He wanted to put across to US...but working BACKWARDS..with all the Computers and Nasa Pictures simulations etc we NOW have....we can RECONCILE the WORDS of Gurbani...and we see that they FIT PERFECTLY !!!...and we exclaim..HEY..what the computer simulations shows about Galaxies formations black holes is part of what Guru nanak ji was talking about 550 years ago....using ONLY WORDS and PAPER.  | | The following member appreciates Gyani Jarnail Singh Ji for the above message. | |
11-Aug-2012, 17:52 PM
|  | .jpg) everything's peachy | | | Enrolled: May 9th, 2006
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| | | | | Re: Claims in the Sri Guru Granth Sahib are False
Waheguru! | | The following member appreciates Ishna Ji for the above message. | | 
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