Eternity of The Soul

abba · #1 (**permalink**) 08-Sep-2010, 01:57 AM

Question about the ultimate goal of man:

Does the soul "become God" and cease to be other than God OR does the soul become "one" with God while at the same time remaining other than God (a paradox to our human minds, being one and other at the same time)?
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/sikh-sikhi-sikhism/32154-eternity-of-the-soul.html

If we "become God" this would seem to mean that our souls disappear into God, like the flame of a candle would disappear in the sun. Also, to say that "we become God" is idolatrous if you take it literally.

If we become "one with God" and remain "other than God" at the same time, then this would seem to mean that we live forever, that our distinct personalities live forever and we can enjoy and bask in the radiance of God's light forever.

abba · #2 (**permalink**) 15-Sep-2010, 02:25 AM

I'd like to put my question another way:
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=32154

My name is Abba. According to Sikh beliefs, when I eventually reach the highest level and merge with God, will Abba still exist forever or will there eventually be no more Abba?

Bahadar S · #3 (**permalink**) 15-Sep-2010, 07:24 AM

Now I am installed on the throne of God,
Merging into him, as the wave merges into the sea,
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=32154
Ram and Kabir are now one,
They cannot be distinguished.

abba · #4 (**permalink**) 15-Sep-2010, 21:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bahadar S

Now I am installed on the throne of God,

You wrote "I am installed". Does this I - the You - Bahadar - exist forever?

Quote:

Merging into him, as the wave merges into the sea,
Ram and Kabir are now one,
They cannot be distinguished.

What are Ram and Kabir?

Astroboy · #5 (**permalink**) 16-Sep-2010, 00:09 AM

Abba Ji,

I kind of understand where you are coming from. I, myself, have asked these questions to appease my mind. What I was actually doing was trying to satisfy my mind, eventually realized that the mind never stops asking questions. A time came when I evolved to understand, nothing changes whether the mind finally gets satisfied with very many answers because since we have a physical body we still have the "I-ness" to deal with.

There are many gurbani quotes which attempt to give a close answer to how our illusion-filled mind would understand what we think is reality.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=32154

E.g.
ਕਬੀਰ ਤੂੰ ਤੂੰ ਕਰਤਾ ਤੂ ਹੂਆ ਮੁਝ ਮਹਿ ਰਹਾ ਨ ਹੂੰ ॥
Kabīr ṯūŉ ṯūŉ karṯā ṯū hū▫ā mujẖ mėh rahā na hūŉ.
Kabeer, repeating, "You, You", I have become like You. Nothing of me remains in myself.

ਜਬ ਆਪਾ ਪਰ ਕਾ ਮਿਟਿ ਗਇਆ ਜਤ ਦੇਖਉ ਤਤ ਤੂ ॥੨੦੪॥
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=32154
Jab āpā par kā mit ga▫i▫ā jaṯ ḏekẖ▫a▫u ṯaṯ ṯū. ||204||
When the difference between myself and others is removed, then wherever I look, I see only You. ||204||

abba · #6 (**permalink**) 16-Sep-2010, 01:19 AM

Namjap Ji (means Dear?),

Thank you. Let me please ask futher:

Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=32154
Do Nanak and the other Gurus know what is happening on Earth right now? Do they know what is happening in the higher worlds? Do they know what is happening to themselves? Are they aware of G-d and of other souls? Can they communicate with God and with other souls?

findingmyway · #7 (**permalink**) 16-Sep-2010, 04:43 AM

First define 'I'. Is soul part of this or all of this?

Seeker9 · #8 (**permalink**) 16-Sep-2010, 05:43 AM

Excellent questions Abba Ji

Let's look at this form the point of view of transmigration, reincarnation and the cycle of births and deaths as determined by Karmic progress

There are rare instances where some people may remember a previous life but most of the time, those memories are wiped

I would therefore suggest that any earthly memories of earthly lifes are wiped once the Soul merges with the Source

And to be honest, who would care for such banal memories having made such an achievement in the first place! So, basically, the identity of Abba would be irrelevant and erased
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=32154
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=32154

That's what I think.....

abba · #9 (**permalink**) 16-Sep-2010, 19:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by findingmyway

First define 'I'. Is soul part of this or all of this?

The good, holy, Godly, part of your soul, in other words, the essence of your soul, in other words, You without all of the negative aspects (ego, anger, lust, etc.), just the good part of you. This is what I mean by "I".

abba · #10 (**permalink**) 16-Sep-2010, 20:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seeker9

Excellent questions Abba Ji

Let's look at this form the point of view of transmigration, reincarnation and the cycle of births and deaths as determined by Karmic progress

There are rare instances where some people may remember a previous life but most of the time, those memories are wiped

I would therefore suggest that any earthly memories of earthly lifes are wiped once the Soul merges with the Source

And to be honest, who would care for such banal memories having made such an achievement in the first place! So, basically, the identity of Abba would be irrelevant and erased

That's what I think.....

Seeker9 Ji,

I'm not referring to the soul having memories of everything that happened to it during it's lifetime on earth.

Right now, at this very moment, is Guru Nanak aware of God and of himself as being God's child?