Definitive Translation of Guru Granth Sahib ji, What Can We Learn From King James?

Siri Kamala · #10 (**permalink**) 20-Jan-2011, 02:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Narayanjot Kaur

Actually, I say this humbly and meekly. The King James version of the Bible has never been supplanted by any other for the beauty and sweep of its poetry. But it is acceptable only to Protestant denominations, and "forbidden" to Roman Catholics. There are major differences as to which scriptures are considered 'canonical' and therefore legitimate between these two branches of Christendom.

Thank you, Narayanjot Kaur Ji ~ I would like to suggest a small modification or correction to what you wrote there above about the KJV.

As someone who was once a politically and theologically liberal Christian, I have, at one point or another, attended churches of nearly every *mainstream* Protestant denomination out there -- Lutheran, Presbyterian, Methodist, Episcopal, and Congregationalist (aka: United Church of Christ).

NONE of these churches uses the King James Bible anymore, nor have they for probably the last 20 years. Most of them, based on my personal observation and experience, prefer either the New International Version (NIV) or the New Revised Standard Version (NRSV) of the Bible.

The King James Bible is the darling of fundamentalists, pentecostals, and some evangelicals.

It is also known to be RIDDLED with errors -- incorrect or inaccurate translations, modifications to scripture that were made exclusively for political purposes, etc.

Really, no one who has been educated as a clergyperson in a Protestant Christian Seminary that has *any* credibility in the mainstream Protestant community uses the KJV anymore, mostly because of the reasons cited there above.

The NIV and NRSV are both considered to be far more accurate.

There's a survey here that underscores how different denominations tend to prefer one or two over the other one or two.

It's arguable that the KJV "has never been supplanted by any other for the beauty and sweep of its poetry"... It's much less arguable, I think, that the NIV and NRSV make the *ideas* presented in the Bible MUCH more accessible to contemporary speakers of English.

Personally I've never cared for the thee-thy-thou goest-mayest-dost pomposity of the KJV -- and I say that as a former English teacher who adores Shakespeare.

spnadmin · #11 (**permalink**) 20-Jan-2011, 03:18 AM

Well Narayanjot Kaur did admit to making her statement "meekly and humbly."

Quote:

I know. You are quite correct. So this problem is so intransigent and convoluted that I did not even go there. Tried to limit my remarks to a narrower range of concerns - more specifically translations of the Bible to fit/suit a particular political and historical moment in time. I doubt it has ever been different if we turn the pages of history allllllllllllllllll the way back to the translation of the Bible in to Latin. It is a long story, isn't it. Thanks

Perhaps she is wrong about everything else.

Siri Kamala · #12 (**permalink**) 20-Jan-2011, 10:39 AM

En garde, spnadmin ji!

Or as we say Down South, "Them's fightin' words!"

Naraynjot Kaur is NEVER wrong! Highly abbreviated? Perhaps -- for brevity is the soul of wit, after all, but she is never wrong.

Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/sikh-sikhi-sikhism/29898-definitive-translation-guru-granth-sahib-ji.html

spnadmin · #13 (**permalink**) 20-Jan-2011, 10:55 AM

Siri Kamala ji
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=29898

Apparently she was wrong about the popularity of the King James Version of the bible. I think it could be that the number of modern Roman translations of the Bible that are available on the Internet stunned her, and she could not think clearly. Maybe that was it. Anyway politics seems to explain a lot.

Siri Kamala · #14 (**permalink**) 20-Jan-2011, 11:38 AM

Hey, btw -- spnadmin ji (or anyone else who can answer with authority) -- what of Max Arthur Macauliffe's exhaustively vetted and reviewed translation of the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji?

Does it exist anywhere, either online or in a library? Is it available for purchase that you know of? Has the SGPC ever considered reviewing it and adding that to the approved list of English translations?

The poor, dear man...

he devoted his life to this work, and was so deeply committed to getting it *exactly right*. It seems almost tragic that it's not on the approved list, especially when we consider how much closer he was to the time (and thus the language of the time) of the last *living* Guru, and thus how much more access he would have had to experts who could accurately translate whatever he could not grasp himself (due to a language/dialectical barrier)...

Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=29898
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=29898

I'd like to read his version just out of respect for Baba Max Arthur Macauliffe Singh Ji.

spnadmin · #15 (**permalink**) 20-Jan-2011, 11:44 AM

Siri Kamala ji

Actually I do not know if it is available on the Internet. It has to be available for purchase, and I think I have seen it. Will check for you. You might also consider looking for it in Google books. For purchase through Biblio.com and/or Amazon books. But I will check. His writing is historically important. I think he is often confused with a British theologian who translated Sri Guru Granth Sahib a bit earlier - i.e., Ernest Trump, who was a Christian minister and was quite open in his intentions and biases. I am not saying that Macauliffe was not unduly influenced by British interests and/or Brahmin perspectives on Sikhi. Only that some of the tar that lands on him may rightfully belong to Trump. And the man converted to Sikhism, and died reciting Japuji Sahib. But this is an area where I am not as versed as I should be. Nonetheless, will investigate.

Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=29898
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=29898

p/s The British historian Cunningham is generally considered trustworthy by most Sikhs.