Dukh Bhanjani Sahib

harbansj24 · #10 (**permalink**) 09-Sep-2009, 13:24 PM

Well said Gyaniji.
But I am also sure that you must be familiar with the realities of India. There are millions of families with very limited means stretching themselves to the limit for survival. With that they provide for daily needs, for illness, for education and more often than not have hopelessness staring them in the face. Most of the children are likely to grow up and be doing nothing.
I am sure that you do empathise with them.
So is there anything seriously wrong if such persons use crutches or supports to try to climb on to the pedestal of chardi kalan? Is not the journey in Sikhism a step by step experience as very eloquently put by Narayanjot ji in another thread?
Not all Sants or Babas are frauds. I know a few of them. Some were very close and trusted associates of Bhai Vir Singh ji and who have contributed enormously by pulling up such hopelessly placed families step by step. Yes, they did advise them to recite Japji sahib, Chaupayi Sahib, Dukhbanjani Sahib etc as per the situation of the particular person.
Just yesterday in another thread, on the effect of placebos, we had discussed that Naam Simran has an equal if not greater effect. Tejwant ji also the related the beneficial effect some inspirational shabads have on him.
So Naam Simran and Gurus Shabads do create positive psychic effects which in turn triggers beneficial neurological biochemical reactions which induces positive vibrations in the person.
Therefore lets not frighten and drive away persons who have faith in Gurbani into the laps of charlatans who hand out charms and practice magic, by unrealistically expecting them to reach the highest level of Sikhism ideals in one go.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/sikh-sikhi-sikhism/26528-dukh-bhanjani-sahib.html
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=26528
We must understand that reality of life is much more complex, more so in India

Gyani Jarnail Singh · #11 (**permalink**) 09-Sep-2009, 19:21 PM

HarbansJ24 Ji,

I personally met a amrtidharee woman at Takhat damdama sahib in 2005. She was at the side of the Sarovar...and looked very very sad. I talked to her briefly and it turned out that she had been having a tough life with a drug addict abusive husband...unrelenting abusive mother in law who never blamed her son for anything, her daughter had passed away due to a fever and no money to buy medicine. She approached the Pujarees at the Takhat..they advised..so many Japji Sahibs will do the trick...after having done that and no results..they advised perhaps so many sukhmani shaibs will help...so many Chaupaii Sahibs..and so many..so many.... in another sarovar at a different Gurdwara where the sevadaar told her she must do so many Japji shaibs standing in the cold water at midnight..last i heard a woman was found floating in a sarovar...she could be the one...BECAUSE Japji Sahibs NEVER cured any drug addict husband, alcoholic husband, out of kehai children, out of control daughters etc. Telling such people to "recite" so many Japjis..is like the Doctor telling his emergency patient to..go for a few rounds around the city park...and return later...and then be told to go to have a holiday in Sri nagar Kashmir..and come back if still suffering from heart attack !!

In my personal capacity I do get so many such requests. The PARENTS obviously NEGLECTED their responsibilities...and when their chidlren begin skipping school, find dubious boyfriends/girlfriends...begin drinking womansiisng etc..they come running to me..Gyani Ji ARDASS KARO...parshaad karo..Paath karo..or TELL US..How many Japjis to do ?? oh ik veran baba ji ne falaneee bibi nu keha see 101 japjis kar..usdee kurree theek ho gayee..aaj viaheeyee hoee hai..baal bacha hai..sadee kurre nu wee theek kardo.....
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=26528

IS GURBANI a PLACEBO ?? Placebos cure PHYSICAL DISEASES that are the result of MENTAL STRESS. a Placebo can NEVER bring back a Diabetic's cut foot..or a lost eye ???

Chardee Kalla comes FROM JEEWAN !! APPLICATION of GURBANI !!

A mail making the rounds of the Internet decribes how the son of a Catholic PRIEST..was so IMPRESSED by the REAL LIFE of a SIKH GRANTHI...that he Became a SIKH..a Model SIKH !! THAT is spreading CHARDEE KALLA BY EXAMPLE..as the Gurus did..the singhs of old did...they LIVED GURBANI. Period.
Life is hectic, complex..everywhere..not just in India...its a myth that Dollars /Pounds hang on trees in UK or Canada..or they Grow like Grass just waiting to be picked up..in Fact LIVING in a Challenged position is more likely to produce a good man...the BEST STEEL is not made in a lukewarm bhatthhee...its made in the HOTTEST FIRE- thats why INDIA has produced the largest number of Spiritually Great Men - Punjab had 10 Guru Nanak Jyot...which other country had such a big number in a continous stream in short time period ??
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=26528

I have personally contributed towards the rehabilitation (pulling back out of clutches of fraud baabas) of seven families in Punjab since 2005. ALL were ardent RECITERS of Japji sahib/chaupaii/sukhmani etc BUT Firmly entrenched in their own Pet BABA JI as the GREATEST as well. One family was willing to die for Sant Isher singh rarewallah..another staunch nanaksariahs...another was dead set for dhadrianwallah. The Common thing was..GURU GRANTH is SECOND..Baba JI is FIRST !!..HE TALKS..he gives advise on crops, children education..husband addiction problems etc etc..while the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji is FOR READING ONLY. THESE were SINGHS of the BABAS and NOT Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji./GURU GOBIND SINGH Ji...on the surface they wore banna kirpans, recited nitnem etc..BUT FAITH in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji..came far second to baba JI !!! NOW they are rehabilitated..and since 2007 none of them ever mentioned their Baba ji again except for Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji ONLY. (and they stopped reading the other Punjabi papers Ajit and Jagbani and began to subscribe to Rozana Spokesman). Another family that i failed to convince has given their FOUR SONS..all grown UP...to a MUSLIM PIR baba, Baba at Beas, another in malwa somewhere..and one to a smadh in sultanpur lodhi dist. WHILE many in Punajb would give anything for a SON..this man donated hisi FOUR SONS..to the RUBBISH HEAP !! On his death he will donate his 8 acres land to Beas. He is an "amrtidaree" wears kirpan etc and recites the Nitnem banis daily and sukhmani shaib at least ten times...He took me on a special tour of the places (deras) where he donated his sons...to convince ME that he is right..these Babas are all powerful..while the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji is silent book.
So YES JI..I do have some finger on the pulse of Punjab..and its REALITY...the 99% of Amrtidharees..are actually HOLLOW INSIDE...they are sikhs of their own Babas...very very few are really sikhs of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 100%.

faujasingh · #12 (**permalink**) 09-Sep-2009, 20:02 PM

Very well said Gyani ji and I personally thank you this great seva you have done. I know of a amritdhari collegue who's family got into the beas waale influence and he had then cut his kesh. This man even went to the level of discussing with another muslim collegue of ours, the 'bad effects' of keeping kesh and tying the pag !!!. 'Bas**rd* !
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=26528

The work you personally are doing is really good. The prob is with the mentality of such beings. I have met people of the white race belivers of Voodoo and Vicca ! This kind of thinking is growing everywhere.

Gyani ji what i think is as long as you follow the Bani without personal alterations from anyone it is fine. I have personally experienced the effects of doing the Paath of Sukhmani Sahib. Some people benifit others may have other things to say.

What I feel it is ok to have compiled Banis in a form like DukhBhanjani Sahib. As Long As This is revealed. This is not advertised in the name of the Gurus or any Bhagats.

Aman Singh · #13 (**permalink**) 09-Sep-2009, 20:16 PM

Quote:

What I feel it is ok to have compiled Banis in a form like DukhBhanjani Sahib.

And then when after the passage of another 100 years, we will have another Granth, on the lines of Dasam Granth, ready to replace of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, as only this collection of Gurbani is good for your personal benefit rest of the Gurbani does not have any benefit for you, so we can discard it...

Narayanjot Kaur · #14 (**permalink**) 09-Sep-2009, 20:22 PM

Aman ji

Thanks for pointing out a potential difficulty, which I missed completely. I have a concern. It is puzzling to me that the well known Gurbani site Rag Karega Khalsa includes Dukh Bhanjani Sahib in its collection of Gurbani/Sikh Prayers. After reading this thread from start to finish I am left wondering why they would do that. Another concern comes from the title -- "Sahib" is the last word. How is it that Dukh Bhanjani would end with Sahib when it is a compilation of raags that were assembled later in our history by individuals who were not either Gurus or members of the committee who wrote the Sikh Rehat Maryada. This situation has the look of a creeping vine that invades everywhere in garden and even the house. Left pondering and without answers.

faujasingh · #15 (**permalink**) 09-Sep-2009, 20:26 PM

Thats why I say " As long as this is revealed" . The compilation if revealed will not do any replacements however with correct references given will give rise to inquisitiveness in a person's mind. He might want to read the complete Bani rather than compilation.

There is this line in the Salok what is more of an inspiration for me and the urge to read more Bani grows in me:

"
a-ukhaDh mantar tant sabh chhaar.
All medicines and remedies, mantras and tantras are nothing more than ashes.
karnaihaar riday meh Dhaar. ||3||
Enshrine the Creator Lord within your heart. ||3||
taj sabh bharam bhaji-o paarbarahm.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=26528
Renounce all your doubts, and vibrate upon the Supreme Lord God
kaho naanak atal ih Dharam. ||4||80||149||
Says Nanak, this path of Dharma is eternal and unchanging.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=26528

harbansj24 · #16 (**permalink**) 09-Sep-2009, 22:13 PM

Gyaniji,

Agreed 99% of Sants are fake but still there are 1% who are genuine followers of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji and ask the Sangat to have faith only in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. They also ask the Sangat to do Nitnem and in addition recite Sukhmani sahib. Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji repeatedly says that doing Simran is one of the foremost tasks of this Janam. So if 1% of Sants (the genuine ones) prescribe recitation of some Shabads, what is wrong with that? They also give a rider "Aghe Jive Guru nu bhave" (Rest is upto the Guru)
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=26528
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=26528

Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji puts genuine Sants on a very high pedestal. The whole of Ashtpadi 13 of Sukhmani Sahib dissuades us from doing Ninda of Genuine Sants and tells about the beneficial effects of their company. Many other passages of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji say the same thing.

So lets not wholesale reject the role of genuine Sants in Sikhism. That itself will be going against Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji!

Tejwant Singh · #17 (**permalink**) 09-Sep-2009, 22:58 PM

Dukh Bhanjani Sahib "Gutka" is like making snake oil of this beautiful Gurbani and peddling to the individuals for their individual " needs". It is shame to notice that the care takers of Sikhi have made Gurbani into some illusionary black magic where all desires can be fulfilled by just parroting this beautiful poetry, rather than showing them the ways how to open this wonderful tool box and use the tools for the betterment of one's life.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=26528
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=26528

This is very insulting to our Gurus' vision and to their efforts.

Tejwant Singh

Narayanjot Kaur · #18 (**permalink**) 10-Sep-2009, 00:19 AM

Tejwant ji

Why do you think that a web site like www.ragkaregakhalsa.com has included Dukh Bhanjani Sahib among its gurbani files. After thinking through this conversation, it seems strange to me.