Ardaas Changed

Either they believe that what our Gurus created was old and needs to be changed .. but if that that is the case then no big deal tommorow they will say that Guru Granth sahib is not appropriate we should review it. Let me give these stupids a call.
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1.Ardas is not Gurbani.
2.Ardas is not a Mantra if not said in a particular manner or with some additons or subtractions, it will result in catastrophe.
3. When any religion gets cramped by rituals then it seizes to be a liberating force that it is meant to be.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/sikh-sikhi-sikhism/25092-ardaas-changed.html
Anybody can argue for any number of hours on what is right or wrong. I Can argue endlessly on the importance of not changing the words of the ardas. But then I will be loosing on the essence of sikh religion. Remember Ardas is just a prayer. Say it in any manner and any language and anywhere. To whom it is addressed will understand and accept.

NOTHING can be changed from PRITHAM BHAUGAUTI SIMAR KE, UPTO, TEG BAHADUR SIMAR KE, GHAR NAUNITDH AAVEH THAE. These words of the Ardas ARE wtitten by Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji & ARE ecthed in stone. Beyond this, any changes are merely debateable.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=25092
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=25092

Bhaugauti means SHAKTI, it is the Akal Purakh !!!! So why change something that means the same thing. It makes NO sense. We should be dwelling on the shabad INSTEAD of trying to change it to our own benefits.
Ardass is an important part of Gurbani.
Guru Fateh.

sounds like the first change - from Bagauti to Akal Purkh - stems from a bit of hinduphobia... Guru Sahib wrote Bagauti, no need to change this part... all this hindu phobia is misplaced anyway as it all stems from Britain's and the BJP's divide and conquer attitude that has become so engrained in the culture now. there is no Hindu, there is no Musalman [there is no Sikh]. Aside from the first part, The rest of the ardas should not be and has never been standardized. The most important thing is that the Guru's Bani MUST NEVER BE CHANGED!!!! The mention of the Bhagats is a nice idea to keep their memory alive; after all we also bow to them.

They think themselves to be above Guru Ji??????????

Bhul chuk lai maafi ji

Dear All,

IMHO prayer and its words can be individualized but have a question from where did 35 Bhagats came; where as a breakdown of the 5,867 hymns found in the Guru Granth Sahib; include the writings of 6 Gurus, 15 Bhagats (of different faiths), 3 Sikh Bards, 8-17 Bhatts, and Raag Mala?
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=25092
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=25092

Cordially,

Virinder

Rajwinder ji

You are calling attention to the problem of where to draw the line. Once one change is justified, then another can be explained, and then another one, and another one....;until the Siri Guru Granth Sahib Maharaj itself become the target of modification and change -- and we know that there are political interests already to zoom in on that too. So thanks for making this point incisively.

But here is what my sneaking suspicion is about this situation. Finland is an isolated country in a lot of ways. The Internet and air travel connect us all that is true. But there is a kind of "insularity" in Finnish culture. To do it alone, to go it alone, to survive against odds, to be self-directed and like that. Changes to Ardaas are not unthinkable, but changes in any aspect of Sikh devotion have historically taken time and taken place through collective nternational discussion among sangats and scholars -- in order to insure that there is the benefit of collective wisdom.

So why did the Finns take off like this. My hypothesis is that some political interests crept into the sangat, that more traditional minds and voices were somehow silenced (I don't know how or why), and that the perplexed sangat did not know how to find or seek the help and advice of other sangats because of what I said above. Do it alone, go it alone, survive against odds, fix it -- and don't look outside for help.

Amazing and it will surely have a big ripple, no wave, perhaps tsunami effect in weeks to come.

Fo the record, people should also bear in mind that the contents of ardas has changed before, as recently as after partition.

I find it strange that bhagauti is removed though. I know people can use that term to refer to Chandhi but it can also mean sword.

The term Ardas stems from a Persian term which essentially means a petition before a sovereign.

It has always evolved over time. But it should be changed with a collective will, so it reflects the wishes of the sarbat panth, not in isolation.

Beginning of Ardas is from the time of Sri Gobind singh ji. This ardas was prevalent among sikhs much before initiation of khalsa. I have seen a tablet of ardas with a sikh professor dating back to 1690.

These gurnindaks have no knowledge of sikh traditions. Especially this Inder Ghagha who has been a communist in his life and was driver with Punja state electricity board is instigating ignorants to change sikh traditions.