24-Mar-2008, 20:43 PM
|  | | | | Enrolled: Jan 7th, 2007 Location: UK
Posts: 290
| | Adherent: Sikhism of Gurus - Not that dictated by Panth Khalsa
Liked 10 Times in 8 Posts
| |  | | | re: Can Sikhs Eat Beef?
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24-Mar-2008, 20:45 PM
| | | | | Enrolled: Jan 7th, 2007 Location: UK
Posts: 290
| | Adherent: Sikhism of Gurus - Not that dictated by Panth Khalsa
Liked 10 Times in 8 Posts
| | | | | re: Can Sikhs Eat Beef?
Quote:
Originally Posted by aad0002  The Shabad can be found on Ang 920, and the English is in the Dr. Sant Singh Khalsa translation.  | The translation was acceptable hence It was posted. What is your point here? |
24-Mar-2008, 23:40 PM
| | | | | Enrolled: Jan 7th, 2007 Location: UK
Posts: 290
| | Adherent: Sikhism of Gurus - Not that dictated by Panth Khalsa
Liked 10 Times in 8 Posts
| | | | | re: Can Sikhs Eat Beef?
Quote:
Originally Posted by kds1980
I am really sorry to say but you have not authority to judge who is propagating falsehood
and who is bemukh.
| You can now wait for the Gurus to personally come and advise you who is propagating falsehood and who is bemukh if history and a personal account is insufficient evidence for you.
Good Luck. |
25-Mar-2008, 00:00 AM
|  | .jpg) ਨਾਮ ਤੇਰੇ ਕੀ ਜੋਤਿ ਲਗਾਈ (Previously namjap) | | | Enrolled: Jul 14th, 2007
Posts: 4,455
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Liked 1,363 Times in 810 Posts
| |  | | | re: Can Sikhs Eat Beef?
ਜੇ ਕੋ ਗੁਰ ਤੇ ਵੇਮੁਖੁ ਹੋਵੈ ਬਿਨੁ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਮੁਕਤਿ ਨ ਪਾਵੈ ॥ਪਾਵੈ ਮੁਕਤਿ ਨ ਹੋਰ ਥੈ ਕੋਈ ਪੁਛਹੁ ਬਿਬੇਕੀਆ ਜਾਏ ॥ਅਨੇਕ ਜੂਨੀ ਭਰਮਿ ਆਵੈ ਵਿਣੁ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਮੁਕਤਿ ਨ ਪਾਏ ॥ਫਿਰਿ ਮੁਕਤਿ ਪਾਏ ਲਾਗਿ ਚਰਣੀ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੂ ਸਬਦੁ ਸੁਣਾਏ ॥ਕਹੈ ਨਾਨਕੁ ਵੀਚਾਰਿ ਦੇਖਹੁ ਵਿਣੁ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਮੁਕਤਿ ਨ ਪਾਏ ॥੨੨॥
ਵੇਮੁਖੁ = ਜਿਸ ਨੇ ਮੂੰਹ ਦੂਜੇ ਪਾਸੇ ਕੀਤਾ ਹੋਇਆ ਹੈ। ਮੁਕਤਿ = ਵਿਕਾਰਾਂ ਤੋਂ ਖ਼ਲਾਸੀ, ਮਾਇਆ ਦੇ ਪ੍ਰਭਾਵ ਤੋਂ ਖ਼ਲਾਸੀ। ਹੋਰਥੈ = ਕਿਸੇ ਹੋਰ ਥਾਂ ਤੋਂ। ਬਿਬੇਕੀ = ਪਰਖ ਵਾਲਾ ਬੰਦਾ, ਵਿਚਾਰਵਾਨ। ਜਾਏ = ਜਾਇ, ਜਾ ਕੇ। ਭਰਮਿ ਆਵੈ = ਭਟਕ ਕੇ ਆਉਂਦਾ ਹੈ।੨੨। (ਜਿਥੇ ਮਾਇਆ ਦੇ ਮੋਹ ਦੇ ਕਾਰਨ ਸਹਿਮ ਹੈ ਉਥੇ ਆਤਮਕ ਆਨੰਦ ਨਹੀਂ ਪਲ੍ਹਰ ਸਕਦਾ, ਪਰ) ਜੇ ਕੋਈ ਮਨੁੱਖ ਗੁਰੂ ਵਲੋਂ ਮੂੰਹ ਮੋੜ ਲਏ (ਉਸ ਨੂੰ ਆਤਮਕ ਆਨੰਦ ਨਸੀਬ ਨਹੀਂ ਹੋ ਸਕਦਾ ਕਿਉਂਕਿ) ਗੁਰੂ ਤੋਂ ਬਿਨਾ ਮਾਇਆ ਦੇ ਪ੍ਰਭਾਵ ਤੋਂ ਖ਼ਲਾਸੀ ਨਹੀਂ ਮਿਲਦੀ। ਬੇਸ਼ੱਕ ਕਿਸੇ ਵਿਚਾਰਵਾਨਾਂ ਤੋਂ ਜਾ ਕੇ ਪੁੱਛ ਲਵੋ (ਤੇ ਤਸੱਲੀ ਕਰ ਲਵੋ, ਇਹ ਪੱਕੀ ਗੱਲ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਗੁਰੂ ਤੋਂ ਬਿਨਾ) ਕਿਸੇ ਭੀ ਹੋਰ ਥਾਂ ਤੋਂ ਮਾਇਕ ਬੰਧਨਾਂ ਤੋਂ ਖ਼ਲਾਸੀ ਨਹੀਂ ਮਿਲਦੀ। (ਮਾਇਆ ਦੇ ਮੋਹ ਵਿਚ ਫਸਿਆ ਮਨੁੱਖ) ਅਨੇਕਾਂ ਜੂਨੀਆਂ ਵਿਚ ਭਟਕਦਾ ਆਉਂਦਾ ਹੈ, ਗੁਰੂ ਦੀ ਸਰਨ ਤੋਂ ਬਿਨਾ ਇਸ ਮੋਹ ਤੋਂ ਖ਼ਲਾਸੀ ਨਹੀਂ ਮਿਲਦੀ। ਆਖ਼ਰ ਗੁਰੂ ਦੀ ਚਰਨੀਂ ਲੱਗ ਕੇ ਹੀ ਮਾਇਆ ਦੇ ਮੋਹ ਤੋਂ ਛੁਟਕਾਰਾ ਮਿਲਦਾ ਹੈ ਕਿਉਂਕਿ ਗੁਰੂ (ਸਹੀ ਜੀਵਨ-ਮਾਰਗ ਦਾ) ਉਪਦੇਸ਼ ਸੁਣਾਂਦਾ ਹੈ। ਨਾਨਕ ਆਖਦਾ ਹੈ-ਵਿਚਾਰ ਕੇ ਵੇਖ ਲਵੋ, ਗੁਰੂ ਤੋਂ ਬਿਨਾ ਮਾਇਆ ਦੇ ਬੰਧਨ ਤੋਂ ਆਜ਼ਾਦੀ ਨਹੀਂ ਮਿਲਦੀ, (ਤੇ ਇਸ ਮੁਕਤੀ ਤੋਂ ਬਿਨਾ ਆਤਮਕ ਆਨੰਦ ਦੀ ਪ੍ਰਾਪਤੀ ਨਹੀਂ ਹੋ ਸਕਦੀ)।੨੨। ❁ ਭਾਵ: ਮਾਇਆ ਦਾ ਮੋਹ ਅਤੇ ਆਤਮਕ ਆਨੰਦ-ਇਹ ਦੋਵੇਂ ਇਕੋ ਹਿਰਦੇ ਵਿਚ ਇਕੱਠੇ ਨਹੀਂ ਟਿਕ ਸਕਦੇ। ਤੇ ਮਾਇਆ ਦੇ ਮੋਹ ਤੋਂ ਖ਼ਲਾਸੀ ਤਦੋਂ ਹੀ ਮਿਲਦੀ ਹੈ ਜਦੋਂ ਮਨੁੱਖ ਗੁਰੂ ਦੀ ਸਰਨ ਪੈਂਦਾ ਹੈ। ਗੁਰੂ ਮਨੁੱਖ ਨੂੰ ਜੀਵਨ ਦਾ ਸਹੀ ਰਸਤਾ ਦੱਸਦਾ ਹੈ।
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=19502
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=19502
 |
25-Mar-2008, 00:25 AM
| | gone to greener pastures | | | Enrolled: Apr 4th, 2007
Posts: 938
| |
Liked 24 Times in 21 Posts
| |  | | | re: Can Sikhs Eat Beef?
Quote:
Originally Posted by ekmusafir_ajnabi This was my conversation with Aman ji and was hoping for him to respond. I do not intend to respond to it.
I did ask you several questions in the previous posts in the hope you would take a more mature stance but I am yet again bitterly disappointed. Calling oneself a Historian and a Sikh does not make one.
I will say this to clear your illusion that I do not post under any other names unlike yourself. "People who live in glass houses do not throw stones at others.
If is clearly beyond your capacity to respond sensibly, why not bring those who claim to be Sikhs and have written the essay. Why are they hiding? Let them defend themselves.
It is clearly not your or the forums intention to let the truth out.
Ekmusafir_ajnabi
|
yet another case of ekmusafir getting away with insulting people with no action from mods.
why is this person not subject to the same rules of the forum as the rest of us?  |
25-Mar-2008, 00:40 AM
|  | (previously Kanwardeep Singh) | | | Enrolled: Apr 4th, 2005 Location: INDIA Age: 31
Posts: 4,271
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Liked 2,401 Times in 1,244 Posts
| |  | | | re: Can Sikhs Eat Beef?
Quote:
Originally Posted by ekmusafir_ajnabi You can now wait for the Gurus to personally come and advise you who is propagating falsehood and who is bemukh if history and a personal account is insufficient evidence for you.
Good Luck. | From past 3 years I am reading everything that is available on this issue.could you please tell me what history and personal account I missed.As far as I know there is nothing in sikh history and personal account that prohibits meat eating. |
25-Mar-2008, 02:01 AM
|  | SPN Sewadaar | | | Enrolled: Feb 3rd, 2008
Posts: 51
| | | |  | | | re: Can Sikhs Eat Beef?
Quote:
Originally Posted by namjap | jay ko gur tay vaymukh hovai ban satgur mukat na paavai.
pavai mukat na hor thai ko-ee puchahu babiaykee-aa jaa-ay.
anayk joonee bharam aavai vi n satgur mukat na paa-ay. dar mukat paa-ay laag char nee satguru sabad su naa-ay.
kahai naanak veechar daykhahu va n satgur mukat na paa-ay. (22)
Can we please work together and get the English translation on this, so that everyone can profit from your post, namjap? |
25-Mar-2008, 02:09 AM
| | ਨਾਮ ਤੇਰੇ ਕੀ ਜੋਤਿ ਲਗਾਈ (Previously namjap) | | | Enrolled: Jul 14th, 2007
Posts: 4,455
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Liked 1,363 Times in 810 Posts
| | | | | re: Can Sikhs Eat Beef?
ਜੇ ਕੋ ਗੁਰ ਤੇ ਵੇਮੁਖੁ ਹੋਵੈ ਬਿਨੁ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਮੁਕਤਿ ਨ ਪਾਵੈ ॥ Jė ko gur ṯė vaimukẖ hovai bin saṯgur mukaṯ na pāvai. One who turns away from the Guru, and becomes baymukh - without the True Guru, he shall not find liberation. ਪਾਵੈ ਮੁਕਤਿ ਨ ਹੋਰ ਥੈ ਕੋਈ ਪੁਛਹੁ ਬਿਬੇਕੀਆ ਜਾਏ ॥ Pāvai mukaṯ na hor thai koī pucẖẖahu bibėkīā jāė. He shall not find liberation anywhere else either; go and ask the wise ones about this. ਅਨੇਕ ਜੂਨੀ ਭਰਮਿ ਆਵੈ ਵਿਣੁ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਮੁਕਤਿ ਨ ਪਾਏ ॥ Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=19502 Anėk jūnī bẖaram āvai viṇ saṯgur mukaṯ na pāė. He shall wander through countless incarnations; without the True Guru, he shall not find liberation. ਫਿਰਿ ਮੁਕਤਿ ਪਾਏ ਲਾਗਿ ਚਰਣੀ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੂ ਸਬਦੁ ਸੁਣਾਏ ॥ Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=19502 Fir mukaṯ pāė lāg cẖarṇī saṯgurū sabaḏ suṇāė. But liberation is attained, when one is attached to the feet of the True Guru, chanting the Word of the Shabad. ਕਹੈ ਨਾਨਕੁ ਵੀਚਾਰਿ ਦੇਖਹੁ ਵਿਣੁ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਮੁਕਤਿ ਨ ਪਾਏ ॥੨੨॥ Kahai Nānak vīcẖār ḏėkẖhu viṇ saṯgur mukaṯ na pāė. ||22|| Says Nanak, contemplate this and see, that without the True Guru, there is no liberation. ||22|| |
25-Mar-2008, 02:17 AM
| | SPN Sewadaar | | | Enrolled: Feb 3rd, 2008
Posts: 51
| | | | | | | re: Can Sikhs Eat Beef?
Thank you kindly, namjap!
I see I was wrong sometimes, but nevermind I´ll do my best to get better.  | 
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