Ardas: Can ardas be offered by one individual for another?

a.mother · #1 (**permalink**) 01-Sep-2011, 04:04 AM

Guru Piyare members jeos,
In normal life we Ardas for every body every time or when ever some-one need, but recently I have heard that any body in need have to Ardas for themself , (but if our loved one can't do or some other reason) can't we do? I could not get answer in SRM. Can some help me. ( If it is in punjabi I will appreciate other wise I 'll try to understand).
*

spnadmin · #2 (**permalink**) 01-Sep-2011, 04:31 AM

a.mother ji
Here is my intuitive response to your question. You won't find an authority to answer it. I do not know who it is who raised this issue, nor why. But o it is like so many other issues raised as pure technicalities, usually technical questions are raised by people who cannot be at peace without each and every detail nailed the table or life will fall apart. It is a kind of desperation that becomes an obsession and the obsession has to be shared.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/sikh-rehat-maryada/36824-ardas-can-ardas-offered-one-individual.html
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=36824

Ironically, SRM answered your question by not answering your question.

SRM never was a book of technical answers to technical questions. It outlines our covenant as a quom. Who are we? How do we act within the covenant with Akaaal, with one another.

We can and do pray/supplicate for others. Ardaas is a "congregational" prayer in which sangat dedicates itself to its "corporate life" as sangat. We pray together, we pray for the quom, and we even have a place were we can pray for individuals and for one another. Ardaas can be offered whenever and wherever Sikhs gather together.

Do we not cry out in Ardaas Jo Bole so Nihal !? We are praying for everyone, the entire world if need be.Why not for one individual? For someone else? Sat Sri Akaal! We place our trust that Akaal hears and we trust in divine wisdom. Akaal hears everything and decides or not.

More at the blog SaadSangat at this link

Ardaas in Depth http://sikhism.about.com/gi/o.htm?zi...ch%3Fq%3Dardas

spnadmin · #3 (**permalink**) 01-Sep-2011, 04:46 AM

This article is by Sukhmandir Kaur, a respected source.

Ardas is prayer of supplication performed by a Sikh. The word Ardas means to petition. Prayer may take the form of a request, an entreaty, or of an offering.

Too thakur tum peh ardaas||
"You are Lord Master; to You, I offer this prayer". (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji||268)

Ardas is offered

Before prakash, the ceremonial opening of the Sikh scripture Guru Granth.

During a worship service, or other Sikh ceremony such as a wedding or a funeral, prior to selecting a hukam, a random verse from the Guru Granth which is considered to be the Guru's order.

After sukhasan, the ceremonial closing of the Guru Granth.

Whenever a Sikh wishes to communicate with the divine.

Ardas is a structured petition which addresses:

Each of the ten gurus by name.
The Sikh scripture Guru Granth.
Waheguru, (the Sikh name for God).
The Panj pyara, administers of Sikh baptism.
Sikh martyrs and their sacrifices.
The Sikh places of worship.

Ardas asks for pardon of mistakes, fulfillment of objectives, company of like minded souls, and prosperity of all persons.

Ardas is concluded with a salutation by all present of, "Waheguru ji ka Khalsa Waheguru ji ki Fateh," which means the Khalsa, or initiated Sikhs, belong to God. Victory belongs to God.

This address is followed by who are all present calling out, "Sat Siri Akal," and is directed to the immortal enlightener, who is the destroyer of darkness.

...

Examples:
Ardas is performed while standing with hands pressed together.

The person offering ardas and all persons present stand with hands folded facing the Guru Granth.

The attendant of Guru Granth continues to hold and wave a fly whisk while standing.

When ardas is performed with out Guru Granth Sahib present, every one stands together and faces any direction.

When a specific ardas is performed for one or more persons, others are not required to stand.
"Du-e kar jor karao ardaas"||
"With my palms pressed together, I offer this prayer."(Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji||1152)
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=36824

http://sikhism.about.com/od/glossary/g/Ardaas.htm

Arvind · #4 (**permalink**) 02-Sep-2011, 02:02 AM

If a kid is hungry for food, but mother eats it for him.... will the hunger of kid go away? ... highly unlikely!

If both kid and mother are hungry for food, but mother offers her share too to the kid, will the hunger of mother go away? ... somewhat likely!

Coming to the point...Whoever does ardaas, the effect is proportional to the kamaayee of the ardasiya. IMO, this kamayee can not be bought with money. It is good, if sangat joins the ardaas, because a single penny aka kamayee from everyone could potentially make a pile worth hundreds of dollars.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=36824

Instead of getting into more technicalities of SRM, if I were in your position, I would certainly do ardaas, just like we would spend the last penny of own kamayee towards treatment of loved one. Overall, I totally agree that we should seek courage to accept His will, and should not interfere in it. Reader might get a confusing signal out of this reading, but just putting forward my views from different perspectives please.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=36824

With Regards.

a.mother · #5 (**permalink**) 02-Sep-2011, 04:29 AM

If a kid is hungry for food, but mother eats it for him.... will the hunger of kid go away? ... highly unlikely!
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=36824

If both kid and mother are hungry for food, but mother offers her share too to the kid, will the hunger of mother go away? ... somewhat likely!

@ Arvind ji,
Exactly, Thats why I have ask this question. Some one told me that, but I can't swallow it for a big reason. I am totally agree with for hunger and food in normal way we eat if we are hungry, but is there problem if we are still hungry and we share our food ( kamaaee) with needy. I think a Sikh should dare to do that with pure heart. I think a Sikh should not that selfish.( if there is reason)
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=36824

@spadmin ji,

I am grateful to you for links and for your post , still want to hear from Gyani ji.

spnadmin · #6 (**permalink**) 02-Sep-2011, 05:22 AM

Quote:

Instead of getting into more technicalities of SRM, if I were in your position, I would certainly do ardaas, just like we would spend the last penny of own kamayee towards treatment of loved one. Overall, I totally agree that we should seek courage to accept His will, and should not interfere in it. Reader might get a confusing signal out of this reading, but just putting forward my views from different perspectives please.

In a nut shell!

Ambarsaria · #7 (**permalink**) 02-Sep-2011, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by a.mother

If a kid is hungry for food, but mother eats it for him.... will the hunger of kid go away? ... highly unlikely!

If both kid and mother are hungry for food, but mother offers her share too to the kid, will the hunger of mother go away? ... somewhat likely!

@ Arvind ji,
Exactly, Thats why I have ask this question. Some one told me that, but I can't swallow it for a big reason. I am totally agree with for hunger and food in normal way we eat if we are hungry, but is there problem if we are still hungry and we share our food ( kamaaee) with needy. I think a Sikh should dare to do that with pure heart. I think a Sikh should not that selfish.( if there is reason)

@spadmin ji,

I am grateful to you for links and for your post , still want to hear from Gyani ji.

Let us not get carried away to much with analogies.

Ardas at a personal level is for self and anyone else,

A cry from the heart seeking solace and support
A shout from the heart with jubilation
A simple thank you

An ardas is not a letter to the creator or a telegram or a phone call. Creator is all around and needs none of that.

Ardas creates energies (area of unknown how bodies react to such) within the person doing it and the person(s) cognizant of such. The actual impact of such is also indeterminate. With so many mysteries enclosed in everyone's body, virtual miracles are not that uncommon or unexplained positive effects can happen. Creator does not judge the person doing ardas and there is no dilution of your "so called food" sharing example. Sincere ardas done by a beggar, a thief or a saint has same value and is only gated by the sincerity quotient. That is, how truthful, sincere and soulful is the ardasi and person(s) cognizant of the ardas.

Just like happiness, it only grows without limits in sharing. Just like sadness, it shrinks the sorrow through sharing.

Go ahead do as many sincere ardas as you wish for self or anyone else, you got nothing to lose. But don't try to horse trade with the creator or play games.

Example: Do a "penny" offering with a pocket full of change and ask to win a lottery. This is addressed to those who go to Gurdwara, claim they only offer a paisa/penny while "matha take" (bow and seek grace), go to the langar and have a restaurant style attitude and demand to be served properly and come out always complaining. An utter sense of ego and lack of touch how everything and institutions need resources to run.

Sat Sri Akal.