Questions from Jasnoor

jasnoor · #1 (**permalink**) 18-Nov-2010, 01:34 AM

I have a few questions. It will probably be simplest to group them all in one email.

How is Jot (Divine Light) pronounced?

Do Sikhs use prayer beads?

What have the gurus said about worshiping God as Divine Mother? I heard one of the gurus worshiped the Feminine Divine.

Are there websites that are most popular amongst liberal Sikhs and others that are more popular amongst more conservative Sikhs?

Are there any Sikh websites that are geared at converts and/or Sikhs in the west?
I want to start wearing a turban, but I know I would never be able to manage the average amount of material. Are there easier ways to wear a turban?
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/new-to-sikhism/33259-questions-from-jasnoor.html
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=33259

Lastly, where do Sikhs in the west shop for their Sikh items. Especially items dealing with the 5k and books.

Jasnoor

spnadmin · #2 (**permalink**) 18-Nov-2010, 03:07 AM

Jasnoor ji

I will try to answer your questions to the best of my ability. See my replies to each question in red.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jasnoor

I have a few questions. It will probably be simplest to group them all in one email.

How is Jot (Divine Light) pronounced?

This is almost impossible to answer by writing it as you have to hear it. I suggest that you listen to a shabad containing the word being recited by a member of Damdami Taksal to get the right sound rather than try to recreate it this way. Some will try ...but on reflection how could that possibly work?

It may take some few hours, but I will post a video with the word jyot pronounced over and over again in sri Raag for you.

Do Sikhs use prayer beads?

Yes and No. the more influenced a Sikh is by the Hindu culture of India, the more likely you will see the use of prayer beads or a mala amongst ordinary people. Technically a mala should not be necessary. Indeed it is discouraged. That is actually a good discussion topic. There are exceptions to every rule. Among some traditions and sects of Sikhism a mala is used. For example some HO Sikhs, or Sikhs of Sikh Western Dharma, do use a mala by choice, not as an article of faith.

What have the gurus said about worshiping God as Divine Mother? I heard one of the gurus worshiped the Feminine Divine.

No expert, I would actually suggest there are two answers to this.

1. We are all "brides" of the eternal "bridegroom" who is Waheguru. So one could make a case that the only masculine element in creation is Waheguru.

2. The Creative, Nourishing, Supportive and Destructive power that we refer to as God, Satguruji, Waheguru, Akaal Purakh is neither male or female because Akaal is Nirgun without form. Akaal is also Sargun, taking from in every aspect of creation, making Akaal both male and female, and neither male nor female.

I thought you asked this before on a different thread and I answered this previously.

The Divine is nirgun and sargun, no thing and everything, male and female, neither male nor female.

Are there websites that are most popular amongst liberal Sikhs and others that are more popular amongst more conservative Sikhs?

Personally I find the question hard to answer. All depends on what you mean by liberal and conservative. However anyone of the leadership team here at SPN for obvious reasons would find it difficult to answer that question. So I leave it to other members to indulge. And I hope we start with a good definition of "liberal" versus "conservative" before they do.

Are there any Sikh websites that are geared at converts and/or Sikhs in the west?

Yes - Sikh Philosophy Network.

But in all seriousness I would not want to drive people away from SPN to other sites, but will give you the names of two interesting sites.

"New to Sikhi" and "gora sikh" Gora means a western Sikh.

I want to start wearing a turban, but I know I would never be able to manage the average amount of material. Are there easier ways to wear a turban?

Sorry cannot help you here. You could wear a patka or a small turban.

Lastly, where do Sikhs in the west shop for their Sikh items. Especially items dealing with the 5k and books.

This is what I do. I search on ebay and Amazon for Sikh items. There are also many sites on the net where purchases can be made. Rather than recommend any one let me suggest that you do this. Use the Google search engine. Type in the search engine window the words Buy Sikh.... and finsih up with the word that you are searching for

Buy Sikh kara
Buy Sikh kirpan
Buy Sikh gutka

And so forth and dozens of places will turn up.

Jasnoor

Welcome to SPN

spnadmin · #3 (**permalink**) 18-Nov-2010, 03:12 AM

Note for those of us who reply to this thread: If links to commercial sites are posted they will be deleted.

jasnoor · #4 (**permalink**) 18-Nov-2010, 05:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spnadmin

Note for those of us who reply to this thread: If links to commercial sites are posted they will be deleted.

I apologize for bringing up a question that would cause people to post things not allowed. And thank you for your help with how to go about finding people who sell Sikh items.

jasnoor · #5 (**permalink**) 18-Nov-2010, 06:00 AM

I'm not good at working with the "quote features" in forums. Can't figure out how to do it sometimes. So I'll reply by # to SPNAdmin.

I know what you mean about pronouncing words. Please don't put yourself through making a video for me, but how kind of you to offer.

I love prayer beads so I wonder why it is sometimes frowned upon. Why would it be discouraged? Just curious and, well, a little or maybe even a lot surprised.

Yes, I did ask a question about the Divine Mother from a slightly different angle the other day. Sometimes a subtle difference in a question can bring about a different answer. When it comes to monotheism, there is a tendency to subtly (and more often not so subtly) to worship the Divine only as Masculine.

I'll check out the websites you mention.

And again I'm sorry to ask a question about shopping.

Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=33259
I would really like to start wearing a turban, not that I've "converted" at this point, but I like the idea of a) having something that reminds me of to live devoted to God and remember God every time I look in the mirror or feel the cloth covering my head.

I have worn a scarf on and off and it does change everything. I also feel the chakra is protected by covering one's hair.

The reason I brought up easier ways to tie a turban is I have arthritis and carpal tunnel so working with that much material would be very hard for me.

As for "liberal" and "conservative", there tend to be a liberal and conservative aspect in many religions. In Christianity, there are "progressive" and "evangelical" Christians. A progressive group would be totally different than Jehovah's Witnesses for example. In Judaism, there are liberal Reform Jews and very conservative sects. So I'm just wondering if the same thing exists in Sikhism. Do Sikhs feel the same across the board about things like homosexuality and gay marriage, for example? I don't mean it in a divisive way, just that any large religion will tend to have "sects" that end up being more liberal or more conservative than mainstream.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=33259

Hope I haven't offended. I'm very sorry if I have.

Jasnoor

spnadmin · #6 (**permalink**) 18-Nov-2010, 08:31 AM

Jasnoor ji

Please do not apologize. The note was for anyone, not for you. And I will work little by little to get additional resources moving in your direction.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=33259

Be back later.

spnadmin · #7 (**permalink**) 18-Nov-2010, 09:03 AM

Jasnoor ji
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=33259

Per your question on the correct pronunciaton of "jyote" - Here we go

Find this passage from the prayer Sukhmani Sahib on Ang 278. You will see it is part of a group marked as line "4" and is about half way down the page.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=33259

Jothee and Jhot are two grammatical form of the same word. (Keep in mind that jyote is a transliteration and is the same thing as jothee)

Link http://www.searchgurbani.com/guru_granth_sahib/ang/278

ਤਿਉ ਜੋਤੀ ਸੰਗਿ ਜੋਤਿ ਸਮਾਨਾ ॥

thio jothee sang joth samaanaa ||

तिउ जोती संगि जोति समाना ॥

his light blends into the Light.

Next find the little audio player at the top of the page. Click to start and listen along with reading the shabad, and at approximate 28 or 29 seconds you will hear how jothee and joth are pronounced.

spnadmin · #8 (**permalink**) 18-Nov-2010, 12:25 PM

me again

Now another question you asked in your first and then later post about finding a turban that would not be hard to wrap

Quote:

And again I'm sorry to ask a question about shopping.

I would really like to start wearing a turban, not that I've "converted" at this point, but I like the idea of a) having something that reminds me of to live devoted to God and remember God every time I look in the mirror or feel the cloth covering my head.

I have worn a scarf on and off and it does change everything. I also feel the chakra is protected by covering one's hair.

The reason I brought up easier ways to tie a turban is I have arthritis and carpal tunnel so working with that much material would be very hard for me.

All of what you say does make sense. There is a style of small turban, one type worn by men and another type worn by women. Neither takes up as much fabric as the more traditional styles.

To buy turban cloth, try my suggestion by typing in the Google search engine "Buy Sikh turban." Or if you live near an Indian neighborhood, look for a shopping area, and then find a clothing store. Most of them have a counter where turban cloth is sold.

The next thing you would need are some directions for how to tie it.

I do not know if you are a male or female. I am guessing you are a female. Forgive me if that is not correct. There are no requirements that a woman wear a turban in Sikhi. It is completely voluntary. And you have options. If you are a male, you still have options. Small turbans are acceptable. Let me know if this looks too complicated given your arthritis and carpel tunnel

YouTube - How to do an easy Turban Wrap - www.meditation-mantra.org/yoga

YouTube - Basic Turban Tying w/ Ram Rung Kaur

YouTube - Turban Tying Adding Color with Ram Rung Kaur

I have not been able to locate good video for a small male turban, but will keep searching.

Mai Harinder Kaur · #9 (**permalink**) 18-Nov-2010, 14:15 PM

Hi, Jasnoor ji! And welcome. I will volunteer to help you in any way I can. First:

Quote:

As for "liberal" and "conservative", there tend to be a liberal and conservative aspect in many religions. In Christianity, there are "progressive" and "evangelical" Christians. A progressive group would be totally different than Jehovah's Witnesses for example. In Judaism, there are liberal Reform Jews and very conservative sects. So I'm just wondering if the same thing exists in Sikhism. Do Sikhs feel the same across the board about things like homosexuality and gay marriage, for example? I don't mean it in a divisive way, just that any large religion will tend to have "sects" that end up being more liberal or more conservative than mainstream.

It is hard to find any two Sikhs that agree on everything Sikh; maybe it's impossible. The situation within the Sikh Panth right now is complicated and I would suggest you keep it simple as possible. There are not really different sects that are recognised as Sikh by mainstream Sikhs, although there are other groups that call themselves Sikh. By mainstream Sikh, I mean those who accept the Sikh Rehat Maryada (SRM - Sikh Code of Conduct) from Akal Takht. Some Sikhs follow it more strictly, others less. It is, however, the standard accepted by most Sikhs.

Individual Sikhs may be more conservative or more liberal. I suppose I would be considered rather conservative. I am Amritdhari and really think all Sikhs should either be Amritdhari or working toward it. (Many disagree with me on this.) I am vegetarian, but it isn't required by the SRM. (Others will argue vehemently about that.) I think everyone will agree that a stricter standard is required of Amritdhari than of those who are not.

As far the Divine Mother, the Sikh concept of the Eternal is neither male nor female. I did a three year experiment. First year, I called Akal Purakh by "he." Year two, I used "she." Year three, I used "it." This was quite an education for me. I have decided that "it" works best for me. Now I am experimenting with not using the word "God" for the Sikh concept of the Supreme Being.

I have been designated a mentor here at SPN, so I have made myself available if you'd like more individual help. I am no expert, but I love Sikhi and love to talk about it. Feel free to PM me, if that appeals to you.

So...again welcome. SPN is my online sangat. People here are very nice and have a wide variety of ideas and opinions. Relax, enjoy, learn, share.

And don't forget that ice cream and sweet ginger tea are often helpful.

Mai