Who is a True Muslim ??

Neutral Singh · #1 (**permalink**) 14-Aug-2004, 23:22 PM

Shalok, First Mehl:
Let mercy be your mosque, faith your prayer-mat, and honest living your Koran.
Make modesty your circumcision, and good conduct your fast. In this way, you shall be a true Muslim.
Let good conduct be your Kaabaa, Truth your spiritual guide, and the karma of good deeds your prayer and chant.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/islam/542-who-is-a-true-muslim.html
Let your rosary be that which is pleasing to His Will. O Nanak, God shall preserve your honor. ||1||

First Mehl:
There are five prayers and five times of day for prayer; the five have five names.
Let the first be truthfulness, the second honest living, and the third charity in the Name of God.
Let the fourth be good will to all, and the fifth the praise of the Lord.
Repeat the prayer of good deeds, and then, you may call yourself a Muslim.
O Nanak, the false obtain falsehood, and only falsehood. ||3||

Shalok, First Mehl:
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=542
It is difficult to be called a Muslim; if one is truly a Muslim, then he may be called one.
First, let him savor the religion of the Prophet as sweet; then, let his pride of his possessions be scraped away.
Becoming a true Muslim, a disciple of the faith of Mohammed, let him put aside the delusion of death and life.
As he submits to God's Will, and surrenders to the Creator, he is rid of selfishness and conceit.
And when, O Nanak, he is merciful to all beings, only then shall he be called a Muslim. ||1||

Maize · #2 (**permalink**) 08-Jan-2005, 23:09 PM

Publically state the Shahadah, "There is no God but God and Muhammad is His prophet," follow the Five Pillars, and you are a Muslim.

muslim · #3 (**permalink**) 09-Jan-2005, 02:18 AM

Ok let me begin by saying who is guru nanak to say how to be a true muslim was he a muslim prophet or any way linked to islam? no and so as guru nanak has done i will also do. i have compiled together my own quotes establishing a true sikh.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=542

ADMIN CUT : Avoid manipulating the holy scriptures. Such an act does not make you a true muslim, or does it ?

Dear muslim, kindly be aware that this is your first official warning for ridiculing the holy scriptures... please avoid such an occurance in future.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=542

Singhstah · #4 (**permalink**) 09-Jan-2005, 04:26 AM

You Are Nowhere Near Guroo Nank Dev Jis Spiritual State, He Wasnt A Muslim Prophet He Was The Teacher Of Mankind.

CaramelChocolate · #5 (**permalink**) 09-Jan-2005, 07:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Singhstah

You Are Nowhere Near Guroo Nank Dev Jis Spiritual State, He Wasnt A Muslim Prophet He Was The Teacher Of Mankind.

Singhstah, I don't think he was claiming to be, he simply gave some valid and interesting points about what makes a Sikh a good Sikh...
Although I understand where he is coming from as a Muslim, I think your is a very good point also - he was a teacher for mankind and he had the knowledge of Islam to be able to say what made a Muslim a good Muslim in his view.

From my knowledge of Islam I would say that tawheed is a fundamental part of the religion and that if you do not believe in tawheed as a Muslim [a partnerless formless undivided God] then you are not a true Muslim, that is the first principle and then comes the other stuff.

Neutral Singh · #6 (**permalink**) 09-Jan-2005, 10:32 AM

ADMIN CUT : Avoid manipulating the holy scriptures. Such an act does not make you a true muslim, or does it ?

Dear muslim, kindly be aware that this is your first official warning for ridiculing the holy scriptures... please avoid such an occurance in future.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=542

Gyani Jarnail Singh · #7 (**permalink**) 09-Jan-2005, 14:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aman Singh

Shalok, First Mehl:
Let mercy be your mosque, faith your prayer-mat, and honest living your Koran.
Make modesty your circumcision, and good conduct your fast. In this way, you shall be a true Muslim.
Let good conduct be your Kaabaa, Truth your spiritual guide, and the karma of good deeds your prayer and chant.
Let your rosary be that which is pleasing to His Will. O Nanak, God shall preserve your honor. ||1||

First Mehl:
There are five prayers and five times of day for prayer; the five have five names.
Let the first be truthfulness, the second honest living, and the third charity in the Name of God.
Let the fourth be good will to all, and the fifth the praise of the Lord.
Repeat the prayer of good deeds, and then, you may call yourself a Muslim.
O Nanak, the false obtain falsehood, and only falsehood. ||3||

Shalok, First Mehl:
It is difficult to be called a Muslim; if one is truly a Muslim, then he may be called one.
First, let him savor the religion of the Prophet as sweet; then, let his pride of his possessions be scraped away.
Becoming a true Muslim, a disciple of the faith of Mohammed, let him put aside the delusion of death and life.
As he submits to God's Will, and surrenders to the Creator, he is rid of selfishness and conceit.
And when, O Nanak, he is merciful to all beings, only then shall he be called a Muslim. ||1||

Guru nanak ji is the First Truly Universal Prophet of the Universal GOD we know as Allah/Raam/Haree/Waheguru..and of course GOD.

ALL others came as Prophets of their own religions.... the religions they established only deal with their own who are placed on ahigher status than the rest of the mankind...apparently disregarding the fact that the UNIVERSAL GOD must be for ALL.

When Guru nanak ji came on the World Scene in 1469, he was born into a HINDU WORLD ruled over by the MUSLIM Rulers. The Hindus had been colonised for a thousand years..and were total slaves in their own land..paying taxes even for practising their own religion. The Foreign invaders destroyed hindu mandirs by the thousands, looting and burning - humans and buildings..converting others who lived. Furthermore the Muslims themsleves were not united but fighting fiercely....read baabvani about Guru nanak Ji's Eyewittness account of the RAPE and wanton destruction of MUSLIM INDIA by MUSLIM Babbar..Muslim VS Muslim....NO MERCY for anyone. In Baabr's savagery Muslims as well as Hindus died horribly..GURU NANAK was taken PRISONER by bababr's troops...Guru nanak was brave enough to CHALLENGE Bababr's cruelty to his face...Babbr let Guru Ji go in Peace. Guru Ji calls the Rulers of the day as: Rajeh SHEENH mukadam KUTTEH.. the KINGS are LIONS who tear and devour their own peoples instead if ruling them justly..and the JUSTICE OFFICIALS are DOGS...who tear apart justice seekers seeking bribes and dont dispence justice at all..KAZIS who were supposed to be impartial judges took bribes to kill justice Guru Ji saw that the Brahmins and religious leaders of the Hindus had taken the easy way out of siding with the ruling classes to rob their own people of their dignity.

Instead of taking pot shots at guru Nanak ji ( calling him not muslim etc) I would prefer that Muslims REFUTE HIS ARGUMENTS...

1. Make MERCY your Mosque....means mosque going peoples should be MERCIFUL...does nay Muslim contend that Guru Ji is WRONG and that a muslim should NOT be MERCIFUL.....in fact "merciful" is the MOST used word in the Muslim vocabulary...
2.Faith your Prayer Mat.... Prayer Mat is COMPULSORY in Islam....and Guru Ji is saying make FAITH in ALLAH as compulsory as your Prayer Mat..that is BASE your Prayers on FAITH just as you base your body on a PMat..can anyone argue this is wrong
3.The KORAN is the Most Important Thing to a Muslim...and Guru Ji links this to HONEST LIVING. How good a muslim can be if he is DISHONEST but carries a KORAN everywhere he goes ( for swearing purposes as well tio show his honesty) Can anybody find fault with this observation by Guru Ji.
4 Good Conduct, Modesty, moderation, etc etc are all good HUMAN traits for any human being and especially so for a MUSLIM. Show me why a Muslim shouldnt be of good conduct or modest ?? that Guru Ji has said a wrong thing ?

So on and On..I could go on to the end and still no Muslim would dare to contradict what GURU JI has said. The wonderful thing is that although the MUSLIM is being used as an example, these VALUES are UNIVERSAL.. applicable to all SIKHS included.

There is no need to get too emotional. Even today we normally use words in many ways...to make acronyms and make words out of acronyms...examples

As Soon As Possible is ASAP.... In My Humble Opinion is IMHO
In the other way around we often see:
SIKH...S- seeker of knowledge
I- Independent thinker
K- Knowledgeable
H- Humble...humorous..etc

in the same way GURU JI has used obviously MUSLIM VOCABULARY to Bring home His Value system

Mosque - - Mercy ( kindness to all and animals environment etc )
Kaaba - Good Conduct ( Morality etc )
Koran - Honest Living
Prayer mat - Faith etc etc

And given his "name" to the Five Prayers in Islam -
1st Prayer: TRUTHFULLNESS
2nd Prayer: Honest Living
3rd Prayer: Charity
4th Prayer: Good will
5th Prayer: PRAISE of ALLAH..

Which just means remember these values and virtues when you go to pray at the respective times....whats so bad or evil in this advise ??

IT can only be called ANTI if anything is advised that is AGAINST what the Prophet (PBUH) said or ordained...or it ridicules the religion or its values or practises.

A MUSLIM can tell a Third neutral person what his religion says..and this third person can then hear what guru ji just said above....and I can bet my last dollar the neutral person will say exactly what i have said above....Guru Ji is FOR MUSLIMS rather than AGAINST MUSLIMS ..or ridiculing muslims in any way.

Jarnail Singh

lion · #8 (**permalink**) 09-Jan-2005, 16:26 PM

muslim,

Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=542
be carefull man.............

CaramelChocolate · #9 (**permalink**) 10-Jan-2005, 01:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aman Singh

ADMIN CUT : Avoid manipulating the holy scriptures. Such an act does not make you a true muslim, or does it ?

Dear muslim, kindly be aware that this is your first official warning for ridiculing the holy scriptures... please avoid such an occurance in future.

I really do not think he ridiculed the scriptures. He simply took a verse of the Guru Granth Sahib and retaining it's form, made up his own verse on what makes a Sikh a good Sikh.
He got his inspiration from Guruji, manipulation? I do not think so, I think we should praise the fact he got inspiration from Guruji on how to be a true follower of a religion and applied it to the Sikh context.
So come on guys, lets not get all insecure.