Is Islam Incompatible with Western Liberalism?

kds1980 · #10 (**permalink**) 23-Feb-2009, 12:20 PM

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The dominat religion of India too divide people based on caste. The previlages are graded according to the caste; the lowest one are relegated almost to animal kingdom. The other religions are also treated similarly. In many of their temples I cannot enter as Sikh. President of India. a Sikh could not visit a temple in Kerala due to this reason. Shrimati Indira Gandhi, then prime minister of India was refused entry into temple at Puri, she went to court and won the right to enter the same. Ancient religions are like that only.

Its true that Hindu's divided people on the basis of caste but they have accepted this fault
Though it will take time to eradicate caste mentality of Indians.Also hindu's are not implementing Laws of manu smriti or demanding That laws of manu smriti should be imposed.It is muslims that always demand that sharia laws should be imposed

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This is the case with the ancient religion of India. Even Indian constitution also supports it. Women, as per 'Laws of Manu' based on which the sociology of the said religion works, has no right. They are treated as the lowest of the lowly class. Some time back court in India ordered a woman, who was living with another man, to go back to her husband, not because her womanhood was getting violated but because the rights of her husband were getting infringed. Woman as per Indian legal enactments i.e. the marriage code of the said religion does not consider woman as independent entity; she is some male's, wife, daughter,or sister. Ancient religions are like that only.

Again I am saying reforms took place and are still taking place.Hindu women now don't sati themselve though there are 1-2 cases that could be heard.On the other hand In saudi Arabia Women still cannot drive cars.where are the reforms?

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In the original articale under reference, if you replace the word Islam by some other ancient religion, mostly, it will apply. What i donot feel very happy with is that the west is Targetting Islam. It will do lot better if they look into their own religion and bring it to conform to the western liberal values. They say that their Prophet was to only son of God. They say that woman was made from the rid of the man, while the science just proves the opposite i.e. the male is modification of fem

Many of the feminists movement started in west.How many women liberation movement started in islamic countries?

Gyani Jarnail Singh · #11 (**permalink**) 23-Feb-2009, 13:44 PM

Guru Teg bahadur Ji said all these things and many more to Aurengzeb.... There was a long long discourse in which Aurengzeb tried to convince Guru Ji to convert to Islam..accept the superiority of Islam...etc etc..Guru Ji told him..Far from there being ONLY ONE "true" religion..there will soon be One more...The Khalsa...in addition to Islam and Hinduism
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/islam/24090-is-islam-incompatible-with-western-liberalism.html
Guru Ji still lost his head...because Aurengzeb had the power to remove it...and he miused it to the hilt....
Yes we can say all these nice things.....brotherly things..peace and respect...love..etc etc...BUT it takes the other side to accept/appreciate...otherwise....we too lose our heads..IF we make the mistake of taking it at face value when the other side has no such equally noble intention....Bhai Khaniya...showed one side...anyone knows of a representative from the other side that can compare with Bhai Khaniya Ji....i will appreciate the name...

2. The Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji openly DECLARES brotherhood of Man..equality of sexes.. caste less society....etc etc..even though SIKHS may not be following the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji to the Letter. In this case the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji CANNOT be faulted on even a single account...no hatred..no oppression..no discrimination... etc is encouraged via Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji...ALL there is is LOVE LOVE LOVE ..and MORE LOVE....there is no need to "change" or alter any tuk of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji.....that may be found incompatible with modern world society standards SIMPLY BECAUSE THERE IS NO SUCH INCOMPATIBILITY...BUT can the same be said of the other holy books ??

Amarpal · #12 (**permalink**) 23-Feb-2009, 20:13 PM

Dear kds1980 Ji,

When Indian constitution and earlier the ligel enactments were frame by British, Laws of Manu were the main laws that influenced their formulation. It is because of this that women do not have an identity of their own. You may refer the book 'The :aws of Manu' a penguin classic publication

When already what they wanted is largely provided, why will they ask for it.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=24090
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=24090

With love and respect for all.

Amarpal Singh

Questioner · #13 (**permalink**) 15-May-2009, 22:08 PM

kds1980 WERE U DROPPED ON UR HEAD AS A CHILD? IF NOT THEN BACK UP UR CLAIMS WITH SOMETHING IMPORTANT... EVIDENCE!!! I FEEL NOTHING BUT HATE AND RESENTMENT COMING FORTH FROM UR HIGHLY UNINTELLECTUAL EXPRESSION ON ISLAM. I'D DEBATE U BUT JUDGING FROM UR LEVEL OF EXPERTISE IN THE FIELD, I DECLINE. FOR THE SAKE OF PEACE, PLEASE, GIVE IT A REST.

Questioner ji

You have some very intuitive contributions and SPN hopes that you will continue to contribute in this way. But please observe forum rules at the same time. The use of capital letters makes it look like you are shouting at us. And it is not acceptable to speak to kds ji as you have. Please consider my remarks a friendly but firm warning. Thank you, aad0002

kds1980 · #14 (**permalink**) 15-May-2009, 23:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Questioner

kds1980 WERE U DROPPED ON UR HEAD AS A CHILD? IF NOT THEN BACK UP UR CLAIMS WITH SOMETHING IMPORTANT... EVIDENCE!!! I FEEL NOTHING BUT HATE AND RESENTMENT COMING FORTH FROM UR HIGHLY UNINTELLECTUAL EXPRESSION ON ISLAM. I'D DEBATE U BUT JUDGING FROM UR LEVEL OF EXPERTISE IN THE FIELD, I DECLINE. FOR THE SAKE OF PEACE, PLEASE, GIVE IT A REST.

Questioner ji

You have some very intuitive contributions and SPN hopes that you will continue to contribute in this way. But please observe forum rules at the same time. The use of capital letters makes it look like you are shouting at us. And it is not acceptable to speak to kds ji as you have. Please consider my remarks a friendly but firm warning. Thank you, aad0002

Point out what is hate in my posts and then I will reply to you

Questioner · #15 (**permalink**) 16-May-2009, 01:02 AM

there is so much rubbish being posted by ignorant individuals. if u like what they say then keep believing the hype, but if u want truth then delve a little deeper. lets focus on the definition of what western liberalism actually is??? anyone know?

Narayanjot Kaur · #16 (**permalink**) 16-May-2009, 02:55 AM

Questioner ji

Without specific examples of statements you object to nothing can be discussed. Without those examples all a forum member can do is make a guess as to what it is that he/she said that is bothersome to you. If someone asks for specifics and then your response is another accusation without those specific points, then the conversation can't go forward. Please make an attempt to be responsive. Then the discussion will be a true exchange of opinions and points of view. Thanks