Master Tara Singh (1885 - 1967)

dilgeer · #10 (**permalink**) 28-Oct-2011, 18:08 PM

Gyani Ji,

Malhotra is his surname. Do you think, as the Jatt population is orthodox in Punjab, they would have supported a so-called 'BHAPPA', as it is said, which I dont subscribe to absolutely. This ploy MIGHT have been cause, to counter the effect. If I was there in his time, I would have supported him, since he being the General of the Sikhs, but after his failure, No one could have convinced me to believe otherwise.
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dilgeer · #11 (**permalink**) 28-Oct-2011, 18:11 PM

Sardar Mann is also given undue glorification for giving up his job. Bhagat Puran singh returned his PadamShree. I heard that one of the sikh ambassadors also resigned from his post to register protest. They have never been glorified and even talked about. Sardar Mann has failingly lead the Kaum, for which he was given unconditional support by the Whole Kaum.

Tejwant Singh · #12 (**permalink**) 29-Oct-2011, 00:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gyani Jarnail Singh

Malhotra was NEVER used by the Master ....he was always just Plain Master Tara singh. PERIOD.

Bhai Ranjit Singh never uses this....BUT..those who dont like him will always add GHATAURA to his name !! Ranjit Singh Ghataura !! This is common way to deride someone among sikhs..lets not do this anymore.

Gyani ji,

Guru Fateh.

You are right. No one addressed Mastar Tara Singh with his surname. No one cared about that because despite any shortcomings, that all of us have, he was the first and great Sikh leader during that time, despite the fact he was born in a Hindu family.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dilgeeer;

Gyani Ji,Malhotra is his surname. Do you think, as the Jatt population is orthodox in Punjab, they would have supported a so-called 'BHAPPA', as it is said, which I dont subscribe to absolutely. This ploy MIGHT have been cause, to counter the effect. If I was there in his time, I would have supported him, since he being the General of the Sikhs, but after his failure, No one could have convinced me to believe otherwise.

Dilgeer ji,

Guru Fateh.

I beg to disagree with you about Bhappas and Jatts. The fact is that majority of the Jatts at that time stayed in Pakistan and became Muslims. That is why you will see Muslim, Cheema, Gills etc etc in Pakistan. At that time this was not the case. FYI, Maliks are Bhappas and they were in forefront to solve this issue and fought for their country. In fact Pita ji, Dr. Balwant Singh Malik who was a doctor and a lawyer by profession left his practice and entered the fight to get the Gurdwaras back from the Masands and spent sometime behind bars.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gyani Jarnail Singh;

In a recent case..Sardar Mann was offered DPM of INDIA...but he pulled out his 3 ft kirpan...which led to the Kirpan being banned from parliament....later as Sangroor MP he quietly entered Parliament WITHOUT his Kirpan !! Its a FACT that SIKHS always WIN the battles BUT LOSE the WARS due to LEADERS who are really DEALERS.

Talking about Simranjit Singh Mann, here is an older thread about him.

http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/sikh-n...fer-state.html

Simranjit Singh Mann was a good person and a great Sikh. Once upon a time, he was stationed as DIG of police in Ferozepore and befriended my family and became very close. I have never met him in person. Only heard of him through my older brother Harsimran who was a buddy of his.I was living in the UK then. He was a devout Sikh and had a mirror in his office. The reason for the mirror was that any Sipahi who was a Sikh but had a trimmed beard was encouraged in a coercive way to change his style and he was quite successful in that. He helped a lot of people during his tenure there.

His downfall started when he was the only Sikh elected as the MP and he refused to enter the Parliament without his 3 ft kirpan which I thought was more an arrogant part of Me-ism on his part rather than taking the best of his opportunity to become the spokesperson of the Sikhs. As he refused to leave his 3 ft Kirpan, he also lost the opportunity to travel in the capacity of MP abroad and tell the world the atrocities committed on the minority Sikhs and on Punjab by the Central Govt. From there on it was all downhill for him from all aspects.

For me buffer zone is like building your own cocoon and we all know that we can only hear our own voices of " freedom" echoing in our own ears when we confine ourselves in our self made prisons. Freedom is not attained by any kind of walls, how imaginary they may be, and without freedom there can never be progress.

The only long term solution for Punjab is when ALL the corrupt members of the Govt are put behind bars and some kind of bill should be passed where there can not be any political interference with the SGPC and SGPC should be managed by the educated managers, not by those whose only qualifications are the lengths of their beards and pugs.

Once we step into the sarover of Gurmat pragmatism rather than living in the muck of
manmat as we have for this long, hence falsely hoping to become lotus flowers one day, then only can we start having a Govt that can lead its people to the life of Miri- Piri, which will result in progress from all facets of life.

Then they say I am a dreamer........

Tejwant Singh

dilgeer · #13 (**permalink**) 29-Oct-2011, 00:45 AM

Tejwant Ji,

Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/history-of-sikhism/122-master-tara-singh-1885-1967-a.html
Thanks for correcting me. You indeed have more experience and understanding in the issue, as your age and access suggests.

Also, We have Maliks and Cheemas, may be bcoz some of the muslims converted to Sikhism. Anyhow, this is not important.

I want your thoughts on this:
What impact you think the literature pertaining to Our (Sikh's) history, earlier and recent, can have on the youth, which in India are more or less in oblivion about? I have read that after reading book about the atrocities by Poohla, Navtej singh Guggu decided to correct the Fake Nihang. My point here is that, that way youth shall contribute in their ways, and the hate that is propagating from the Sikhs side towards the Hindus could be clarified, as to what is the truth ?
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=122

Another query is that: Why youth abroad is more close to sikh religion and in India, they are going away from the faith ?

Presenting them the literature could provoke in them the seed of curiosity to know more about our history. Clearly speaking, Babas, and maximum prachariks have lost the credibility among the youth, after suspicious leaks about their behavior. No Pracharik ever ask feedback or has a Question/Answer round to know, what doubts or questions are in the mind of the youth ? Probably, they speak on the subjects they are comfortable about. They dont dare to ask people to put their queries forward.

Tejwant Singh · #14 (**permalink**) 29-Oct-2011, 03:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dilgeer

Tejwant Ji,

Thanks for correcting me. You indeed have more experience and understanding in the issue, as your age and access suggests.

Also, We have Maliks and Cheemas, may be bcoz some of the muslims converted to Sikhism. Anyhow, this is not important.

I want your thoughts on this:
What impact you think the literature pertaining to Our (Sikh's) history, earlier and recent, can have on the youth, which in India are more or less in oblivion about? I have read that after reading book about the atrocities by Poohla, Navtej singh Guggu decided to correct the Fake Nihang. My point here is that, that way youth shall contribute in their ways, and the hate that is propagating from the Sikhs side towards the Hindus could be clarified, as to what is the truth ?

Another query is that: Why youth abroad is more close to sikh religion and in India, they are going away from the faith ?

Presenting them the literature could provoke in them the seed of curiosity to know more about our history. Clearly speaking, Babas, and maximum prachariks have lost the credibility among the youth, after suspicious leaks about their behavior. No Pracharik ever ask feedback or has a Question/Answer round to know, what doubts or questions are in the mind of the youth ? Probably, they speak on the subjects they are comfortable about. They dont dare to ask people to put their queries forward.

Dilgeer ji,

Guru Fateh.

I have no idea about the other Maliks, but this is supposed to be some sort of title given to my ancestors. Our actual surname is Ahulwalia and we have Jassa Singh Ahulwalia Family Trust which has helped lots of widows and orphans of 1984 and has been helping many other families since after the partition.

The problem in India about lack of Sikhi spirit among the youth is multifold. The main burden and responsibility lies in the hands of the parents.

1.How many parents buy Sikh history books to bring home and encourage their children to read Sikh history?

2.How many parents take their kids to the Gurdwaras once or twice a week to listen and understand the Keertan? I know they go and matha tek during Gurpurab times.

3.How many parents have Shabad Vichaar at home with their kids and how often?

4.How many parents send their kids to the Gurmat camps?

If the above is done often in India as it is done outside, then the kids themselves will become interested in Sikhi and use their best tool- the computer in learning more about Sikhi. Hence, they will become what India is in dire need of.

Regards

Tejwant Singh

kds1980 · #15 (**permalink**) 29-Oct-2011, 07:41 AM

Quote:

The problem in India about lack of Sikhi spirit among the youth is multifold. The main burden and responsibility lies in the hands of the parents.

Tejwant Singh ji

I agree with it that main responsibility is on parents but there are not one but many cases where children turned their back on sikhism despite best effort by parents

Quote:

1.How many parents buy Sikh history books to bring home and encourage their children to read Sikh history?

There were parents relative who use to give books to children of Sikh history.Apart from it
there were many sikh schools where Sikh history is compulsory subject.In 80s When tension was high Sikh schools use to of almost 100% sikh yet that same generation did not give importance to sikhism

Quote:

.How many parents take their kids to the Gurdwaras once or twice a week to listen and understand the Keertan? I know they go and matha tek during Gurpurab times.

Understanding keertan is beyond the reach of most of adults what can they teach kids from it.

Quote:

.How many parents send their kids to the Gurmat camps?

I don't think in India there was a concept of such type of camps.

dilgeer · #16 (**permalink**) 29-Oct-2011, 11:21 AM

Tejwant Ji and kds1980 Ji,

You thoughts on this:
I usually search for literature pertaining to Computer, Science, Music or Videos, everything is readily available. Every Latest movie or ebook is to there to be read. You have million of porn sites which are at your disposal. But I have tried to search for popular titles related to Sikhism, but surprisingly no results. I searched for Hindu Literature, Islamic literature, I could find their popular titles. Everybody could post DVD of Harry Potter on the torrent but no one thought of converting Sikh literature and putting in ebook format so that It has global reach, and it could reach multitude of people. I have tried and but due to lack resources and companion, could not move further. Your kind thoughts on this ? My apologies to the admin if this is deemed to be off-topic.

kds1980 · #17 (**permalink**) 29-Oct-2011, 18:05 PM

It will be interesting if some mods will create New thread from Dilbeer singh's post that why Indian sikhs are not interested in Sikhi compared to western counterparts

Gyani Jarnail Singh · #18 (**permalink**) 27-Feb-2013, 10:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kds1980

It will be interesting if some mods will create New thread from Dilbeer singh's post that why Indian sikhs are not interested in Sikhi compared to western counterparts

I think Sikhs in India are a small island in the middle of the vast OCEAN of HINDUISM..Hindu Hindi Hindostan... Daily the Ocean rises in high tide and washes over the tiny ISLAND of SIKHISM..daily eroding its base...daily the Island peak arises out of the ocean as its high tide recedes..BUT by nightfall the High tide is back to wash over it...SIKHISM is just managing to keep its HEAD above water....and many drown at high tide daily...as one can see form the media reports of sikhs cutting hair in the Barber shops and drinking at THEKAS..or having havans in mandirs etc etc...

But in the DIASPORA..there is no such "Ocean"..there are small "lakes"..or seas..and Sikhs float in ships...and here and there land ashore like Robinson Crusoes...BUT there is no overwhelming ocean daily eroding the base...no media reports of "sikhs" at Church or in the mosques..or sikhs having circumcisions or communions ...there may be a few..but NOT as widespread as in India...