What is Jhatka? Tricky Reality...

Dear All,

A dear friend in a recent mail mused about "academics and scholars and vidwaans..etc " arguing endlessly about this "meat-jhatka-hallal" subject when Guru Nanak ji Sahib only mentioned "moorakhs". as in "Maas maas kar moorakh jhaggrrey..." Are we i ndeed beating about the bush on a NON-ISSUE ? I beleive so. Diet in Gurmatt is a non-issue. All those rules and regulations ( and there are indeed many many detailed rules about Kosher/Hallal - Both derived from the same source). The Hows the Whys the Whens are all side forays into the bushes. Nearly ALL who kill/slaughter - inlcuding the Chinese, Christians, and other communities even as diverse as the aborginals of Australia, tribes of the Sub-Sahara who are not muslims or christians etc etc cut the throat and drain off all the blood. The head is left intact joined to the dead animal.

The ONLY way one can see an animal indeed being killed by breaking its spinal chord/neck etc is by the hunting animals like lions, cheetahs etc.Those wild hunters in nature do not just take a bite to the throat and walk away in order for the victim to bleed to death before they eat it. Otherwise in 100% of cases of slaughter in abattoirs the blood is indeed drained off completely and the head is intact on the carcass.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/hard-talk/34375-what-is-jhatka-tricky-reality.html

Our Gurus hunted and the preferred methods were either a rifle shot or an arrow. In that case the animal bleeds to death as the head is not severed..or until such a time when the hunter arrives on the spot and completes the job with his sword...or not as ? This is also the same method applied by modern hunters.

Only certain times in India at Kali Mata mandirs and Nihung ceremonies is the Goat slaughtered by a single stroke to the neck severing it at once. A TINY minority of slaughtered animals die this way. This is supposed to be JHATKA - the "permitted" method of slaughter to a Sikh.In numerous Punjab villages and roadside dhabbas the preferred method is a TWIST to the neck. That would also qualify as Jhatka as the neck is broken - but this is applied only to birds/chickens and not to larger animals such as goats.

Numerous u-tube videos on the internet and Animal Rights Activist Groups propoganda materials show the undescribable horrors that take place on supposedly modern farms and animal breeding stations and the undescribable horrors that take place in abbatoirs- a testimony to Man's immense cruelty and GREED. Indeed Man is the only "animal" on Earth that actively practises and enjoys giving pain knowingly and for fun. Watch the Documentary Earthlings. Documnentaries on widespread cases of fur collectors,, whale hunters, seal hunters etc will make you throw up on seeing what man does to his fellow creatures, his pets, his "food", Indeed GOD is missing IF we fail to see HIM in all His Creatures. A "Stone hearted" man is all that is left. THAT is the stark reality of the modern cultivated FOOD CHAIN connected tot he nicely packaged meat products we see in store shelves. Gurmatt/Sikhism cannot have anything to do with THAT. A "lazy" Sikh is not a Sikh....just cannot be. Uddam, Dya Dharam are all hallmarks of a Good practsing Sikh. ALL these three are MISSING from the modern meat products. THere is instead a whole lot of religious dishonesty - exactly what Guru nanak ji Sahib saw almost 540 years ago in the society around Him and why He tackled this tricky reality via the Maas maas kar moorakh jhaggrrey shabad to guide us. Gurbani is timeless and Universal - applicable at all times regions and in all situations. Deep down we all know or we dont want to know. Beyond that it becomes individual choice and no amount of Gurbani quoting/hand wringing/ etc will chnage the reality of the situation. Each of us must settle this dilemma with himself.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=34375

Regards to all

Jarnail Singh Malaysia.

 
Do share your immediate thoughts or reactions on this issue? We value your views! Login Now! or Sign Up Today! to share your views with us.. Gurfateh!

__________________
We hear with our ears but we listen with our minds.
Hearing the sound of a mantra is one thing - listening to it is another !

I think Gyani ji,
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=34375

The rational for Jatkha comes from a Martial heritage, and one blow could be with a gun too.

Infact, after Jhatka the blood is drained off. All methods of killing are cruel in some way or another, therefore humane killing is an oxymoron.

The point for Sikhs is when we do something we do it because we think it is Ok. We don't ask for a special purification from God or some form of guilt.

And randip ji..the most astonishing thing is that after going thru all that rigmarole of asking "permisiion" or on the orders from his god and tying up his son for the "sacrifice" the god changed his mind and decided to accept the SHEEP ( which had been brought along as insurance !! anyway ?? or it was all a charade ??) All laong this god wanted bloody sacriifce..that was the cause of the fight betwene the two brothers Cain and Abel leading to the jelaously and eventual MURDER of one of them by the hand of the other....what a bloody beginning to this tradition..

On the other hand look at Guru Gobind Singh ji sending forth his two eldest beloved sons Ajit and Jhujaar to certain death on the battlefield with no false hopes of any "god" changing his mind and sending them back alive or accepting a sheep in their place.

True sacrifice is ONES OWN and most precious..Ones LIFE !! not a lowly goat one can buy from the market...and killed without its permission and eaten by the killer himslef...Sikhism and Gurmatt cannot condone such a practice..Hundreds of thousands of sikhs offered their own lives readily and voluntarily and happily as true sacriifces. This is one reason why such sacrificial meat is anthema to gurmatt.

Gyani Jarnail SIngh ji thanks for starting this topic.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=34375

I was not aware that Sikhs eat so called sacrificial meet! When you go to buy meat in Punjab or elsewhere I don't think people have illusion that it is just meat and nothing sacred about it. Perhaps there are pockets of people who do some muslim like sacrificial thingy.

Halal meat is a fad in the West to appease the Muslims who are big meat eater constituency.

We heard around here of a meat processor that advertises Halal Chicken. Their method is the following to make it Halal,

They have a tape playing some muslim hymns/stanzas, etc., in the slaughter house where the chickens are slaughtered. Everything else is whatever Western meat slaughtering entails.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=34375

So I assume the Chickens get blessed listening to the music as I assume the chickens understand Arabic

Sat Sri Akal.

Indeed Gyani ji, and it is on this and other points our Sikhs get confused. They should not be arguing over whether it is Ok to eat meat or not,or argue about the merits of dispatching life.

This is why I find this whole thing about purity and purification odd. The Vaishnavs crow about purity through being vegetarian, the Muslims and Jews about purity through ritual sacrifice.......but what is pure and what is truly unpure?

Gyani Ji - do you eat meat ? just one word answer YES or NO.

Everybody else - if you eat meat is it HALAL or JHATKA ?

I can say for myself when i used to eat meat - i used to kill my own bird or atleast watch it being killed(chicken or hen). And i still remember when i was 16 or 17 and saw life going out just like that I stopped killing and eating meat.

Long long ago..in the 1980s when I was younger I used to rear chickens on the huge piece of land behind my house..and i used to slaughter my own. In those days even at akhand paaths held in the house some sikhs would slaughter a goat. I witnessed this myself as i used to accompany my dad on raols.
Not any more - with DAALS of every variety so readily available in the hyper markets clean and ready to cook, butter and desi ghee saag and various super fresh vegetables form all over the world...i dont have time for anything else as its my habit to enjoy just one or two dishes at the most and since daal and sabzee already complete the menu...meat is out.
Thats strictly personal.
On the Public Level I am a STAUNCH supporter of the SRM of Akal Takhat 1935...until and unless its changed I will continue to support it Hook line and sinker - meaning 100%. No Ifs and No Buts.

Ambarsariah Ji,
Its EXACTLY the way you described.
Anyway the BOTTOM LINE as I see it is..CONTROL.
The Halllal meat was used as a means of CONTROL in Guru Jis times - ONLY a Muslim Kazi etc could "hallal" meat..so non-muslims were forced to submit. During that time to make this control factor even stronger even keeping a KNIFE by the Non Muslim was Banned.
Imho Guru Ji had to break this stranglehold and Guru Ji did it via making it compulsory to Carry a WEAPON (kirpan) at all times and also to JHATKA ones meat. Kill two birds with one stone !! I understand this same "control" factor is behind this hallal meat pushing in the WEST - either way - Muslims want to stress and flex their muscles, and the western food corporations want to sell their meat....BOTH sides are exerting "control" of sorts.
The REAL "religious" part is LOST becasue its humanly impossible to do the real ritualised reading of kalmas on a speeding production line where live chickens and cows hanging from hooks swish past as if on a highway..its all a huge CHARADE and everyone knows about it..but how to bell the cat ?? In my country this hallal thingy creates "closed" occupation category for lots of bangladeshis who work in the wet markets slaughtering chickens as ONLY MUSLIMS are allowed to do that except in the PORK Abbatoirs.Its all in a days work as the workload is so heavy that the "bangla" has no time to even look at the bird as he slashes its throat with one quick slash and throws it into the revolving drum to remove the feathers etc....Maas Maas kar MOORAKH jhaggrrey ?? isnt Guru nanak ji absolutlely CORRECT ?? as ALWAYS.

Gyani Ji - I always look forward to your comments. Thanks for the reply. I myself just like you said - lived in a house with a poultry farm. I was barely 8 or 9 years old when i was trained how to kill and clean the chicken, fish and used to go to market to get Jhatka meat (goat). Like you said there are so many things to enjoy i stopped killing and eating meat around 1986 ਅਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਛਕਣ ਤੋਂ ਬਾਅਦ ।

One of the reason I asked these blunt questions was - In our town there is a Sikh owned business - ASIAN HALAL MEAT AND KABAB HOUSE. Now the family comes to our Gurduara Sahib and gives donation under the business name above. When i saw it i objected to this practise. But nothing changed. This family says to Sangat members - it's not HALAL it's regular meat, we just named it like that to attract HALAL eaters. Because of this there customers - both SIKHS and non SIKHS purchase and serve it without any guilt. It bothers me. First I stand by the SRM like you. SRM maryada says Kutha / HALAL is not acceptable.

Because i live in this society and has seen first hand persons who call themselves SIKHS but engage in anti SIKH practices(business owner is clean shaven - and we liberally call clean shaven as SIKHS too). I know this is a another topic and majority of us will agree and disagree on that label too. All of this bothers me - how far we will go ? our hunger for money is taking us to unchartered grounds- SIKH business owners are selling Cigarattes and other tobbacco products at their gas stations / stores. We convince ourselves that's the nature of business. We don't consume tobbacco products. I have seen the younger generation - smoke it.

Again i am a minority and most of us don't see wrong in above scenarios. Sometimes i question myself who is a SIKH ? just because we are born in Punjab or were born to SIKH family - does that make us a SIKH. Gurduara Sahib ਜਾ ਕੇ ਮੱਥਾ ਟੇਕਣ ਨਾਲ ਸਿੱਖ ਬਣ ਜਾਂਦਾ ਹੈ ?
One last thing to say before i stop beating the bush. I went to pick up a guest from Airport and was supposed to drop him at Gurduara Sahib for a bhog ceremony. I didn't know this person. I got a call from my Brother to pick him and drop him off. He mentioned something about my brother. This guest said - Dr. Sahib (my brother) says ਗੁਰਦੁਆਰਾ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਜਾਣ ਵਾਲੇ ਸਾਰੇ ਝੂਠ ਬੋਲਦੇ ਹਣ -ALL WHO LIE GO TO GURDUARA SAHIB and he laughed about this statement. Mind you at one time my brother was a Hard core SIKH. Anyways his thinking still is the same. This simple statement is extreme and i was hit with it. i was like not all of us but majority of us fall in that category.

After the above incident I was more blunt at Gurduara Sahib and now I am labelled - ਕੱਟੜ Hard Core.

When will we learn from our past ? When will we start practicing teachings of our GURUS ?

Gurduara Sahibs are not Social Clubs..............when will be realize this ?

ਸੰਗਤ ਤੋ ਦਾਸ ਭੁਲਾਂ ਦੀ ਮਾਫੀ ਮੰਗਦਾ ਹੈ ਜੀ ।