Who calls Charitropakiyan Gurbani? Jathedar Tarlochan Singh

Sir i have not said i have more or less knowledge than you or called you agyani. But have you read Sri Dasam Granth and analyzed all of it? If so, then you are obviously more knowledgeable and I apologize. But it is a style of writing. Even in Adi Granth, there are different style of writing. Let me ask you something, is Sant Kabeer your guru? Or Sheikh Farid? His writing is in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Is he your guru? Your point is completely invalid and your question is baseless. There are many types of writings, many styles.

 
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Trivial? vikram 9724 ji I am astounded.

Any debate with International Akaali ji will be far more interesting than any conversation with me. So I for now I will be concise.

This debate is so trivial that the political arm of the SGPC/Badal conglomerate has told Professor Darshan Singh ji not to come to India on December 5. And the religious arm of the conglomerate, the jathedar of Akaal Takht, in alignment with his advocate, Mr. Lamba, and jathedars friendly to him, have not withdrawn the "edict" and continue with charges of heretical teaching. That looks like some fairly wicked gamesmanship to me.

Vikram 9274 ji
Waheguru ji ka khalsa
Waheguru ji ki fateh
I do not think your advocacy of doing the parkaash of anoother granth and phillipingly naive comment about Quran would sit well with most sikhs. Nanak's Panth is a nirmal Panth. His God
loves all and is not vengeful.Nanak exhorts us to shape ourselves in the image of our loving lord-be caring and compassionate. He exhorts us to be ever awake of the poisonous and destructive nature or the five thieves. Guru Nanak does not make tall claims about his being the son of god or a special messenger. He associates with the poor and the downtrodden. He calls himself a neech, a jan. Remember we must;HOUMAIN NAAVAIN NAAL VIRODH HAI , DOVAIN NA VASSAY IK THAIN. The gurus gave us A Gaadi Rah,pulled us away from Bipran Ki Reet. Now what you are suggesting is to open the portals of every other philosophy to inundate the sikhs . As if we need more dilution!
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/hard-talk/28123-who-calls-charitropakiyan-gurbani-jathedar-tarlochan.html
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=28123
Respectfully,

Satnam Singh Randhawa

Well that is just it isn't it, I don't care what other Sikhs think, for I only try to apply the Guru's lessons to my life and views. Guru has told me to respect others and their religions, so i would only be overjoyed if a muslim set his quran next to the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji and prayed with me. In my heart I will pray only to Akal Purakh, I will only have Guru in my mind and Heart. So why would I care if there is a Quran next to Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji? Like I said, Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji is the next in line of ten gurus, if they would not care if someone sat next to them, or even above them, then either would Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. This is my view on that matter.



Yes I do believe that the matter of prakash is trivial. My interpretation of the lessons in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji lead me to believe that these are materialistic and trivial matters. And once again, the Jathedars and their political motivations go against trying to resolve this issue and only cause more controversy. They are doing the exact opposite and only adding to the fire. All of them are incompetent.

Satnam ji

Thanks for your beautiful words! But is that not part of the very foundation of this debate? To open the portals of every other philosophy in order to dilute the significance of Guru Granth Sahib? Has that not been the basis of the controversy over Bachitar Natak since 1902? Now we get into the historical aspect of this "strange drama."

Vikram 9274 ji
Waheguru ji ka khalssa
Waheguru ji ke fateh
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=28123
you can draw whatever conclusions you want.I only bow to Sri Guru Granth SAhib Ji . And i do not stop you from worshipping whatever you want . However I do not subscribe to turning a gurdwara into a Gobind Sadan .Guru Granth Sahib Is my GUR POORAA.It gets me away from karam kaands,superstitions.It makes my life simple and enjoyable.Kirat karo ,naam jappo and wand chhako.it tells me : hasandiaan, khedandiaan, painandiaan, khaavandiaan ,whichay hovai mukat. The Guru ,my only support gives me a Juggat. Thanks.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=28123
Respectfully
Satnam Singh Randhawa

Sir i have said repeatedly that Guru Granth Sahib is my guru. A gurdwara is the house of guru (Guru da Dawar). Guru Gabind Singh was the tenth Guru. Do not forget that. Waheguru is everywhere sir. The main point is to worship Waheguru, the Akal Purakh. For me, Waheguru is above even the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. I find just as much peace in my car when I am reciting the name of Waheguru as I do in any gurdwara. To be honest, I find more peace in my car or at my house because in today's day and age, most gurdwaras have become places of chugli nindya and are surrounded by controversy and political talk.

Vikram Ji
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=28123
Waheguru ji ka khalsa
Waheguru ji ki fateh
I am indeed very happy that you feel the presence of the lord and could not agree with you more that our gudwaras have oftentimes been the centres of squabbles and monstrous Manmat.AS sikhs we are required to remember God oothat,baidhat,sovat jaagat,but also to fight oppression both within and without.All the Gurus did . They did not shy away from stating the Truth and propagating it ,even at the cost of their lives. No compromises.Says Gurbani; It marg per dhireejai,Sir deejay kaan(h) na keejay. While we have a duty to further our moral growth, we also are expected to fight Manmatt.Fighting this Manmatt is what prof. Darshan Singh is doing. It is not going to be easy. His very life is on the line.I compliment him for keeing his cool under these circumstances . I believe his strength comes from Gubaani which his very being is suffused with . May the Guru give him strength to keep his faith.Lovingly,
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=28123
Satnam Singh Randhawa

vkiram9274 ji

In a way you are making a quick retreat without making any retreat whatsoever.

Your focus on Waheguru, your need to find peace, and your experience that gurdwaras have become placs of controversy and political talk are a very different kind of reply. Contrast that to some of your earlier statements. They were more confrontational.

Good that we can agree that Sri Guru Granth Sahib is our guru. Sri Guru Gobind Singh may have believed he ended all controversy in 1699. That seems more logical reason why he would not be interested in discussing the matter any further. I refer to your comments about our gurus being unlikely to find the discussion of Dasam Granth to have any merit. ("Like i said, I do not think that the same Guru's who went through so many hardships, would have minded if someone sat next to them, or even if they sat on the floor while everyone else sat on a higher platform.")

And yes -- in the scheme of eternity - parkash of Sri Guru Granth Sahib cannot be fathomed by the human mind because the human mind cannot fathom eternity. Not that I agree that makes this controversy trivial. The operative words are aad sach, jugaad sach, hosi bi sach. So I believe that Guru Nanak has resolved that part of your dilemma, and cleared any doubts.


We should keep in mind that December 5 is not too far off. It makes sense that this is a time to throw some hard punches. For example, some have stated i.e., Professor Darshan Singh made his money from Dasam Granth, and now is a preaching hypocrite, nothing more than a materialistic money grubber. Why did he suddenly change his mind, and so forth?

There are many people who are sitting on the fence, have doubts about their understanding of Dasam Granth, don't know what to think, have not made up their minds, wish the discussion would just go away, hate it when their inner peace is disturbed, etc. etc. -- they are the very people who are supposed to be persuaded by watching these punches thrown, outside of the rules of debate. Not that I am suggesting that you are doing that.