Literal Meaning of Gurbani

Randip Singh · #37 (**permalink**) 14-Mar-2008, 21:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sardara123

Point 1-

Those are provided for non punjabi readers. To me as much justice one can do while doing a translation- Translator has done it.

I have provided the Punjabi exact version. So you can get it translated from others as well. I am not concerned, I am talking after understanding it in from my MENTAL LANGUAGE.

Point 2- IN SIKHI THERE IS NO PHYSICAL GURU- PHYSICAL IS TRIGUN- MAYA. MAYA DA PYAAR- DUJA BHAO.

Thankyou for making it clear that Guru is some Physical entity for you. Thankyou Thankyou Thankyou

Thanks.

I think we are talking at cross puposes.

On Point 1

I cannot see or view your Punjabi translation and there is no link. Infact the translation is from Sikh to the Max from contributors. Before posting here I suggest you verifiy your sorces.

Pont 2

Do not try to insinuate what I have said or not said without reading the entire debate.

Guru is not a physical entity for me . Guru can mean God. Guru can mean physical person. In Bani Guru is described as aboat, a shrine etc etc.

Example page 17 Sri Guru Granth Sahib Jiji

Sri Granth: Sri Guru Granth Sahib

Siree Raag, First Mehl:

.
The virtuous wife exudes virtue; the unvirtuous suffer in misery.

If you long for your Husband Lord, O soul-bride, you must know that He is not met by falsehood.

No boat or raft can take you to Him. Your Husband Lord is far away. ||1||

My Lord and Master is Perfect; His Throne is Eternal and Immovable.

One who attains perfection as Gurmukh, obtains the Immeasurable True Lord. ||1||Pause||

The Palace of the Lord God is beautiful. Within it are flawless diamonds,

gems, rubies and pearls. A fortress of gold surrounds this Source of Nectar.

How can I climb up to the Fortress without a ladder? By meditating on the Lord, through the Guru, I am blessed and exalted. ||2||

The Guru is the Ladder, the Guru is the Boat, and the Guru is the Raft to take me to the Lord's Name.

The Guru is the Boat to carry me across the world-ocean; the Guru is the Sacred Shrine of Pilgrimage, the Guru is the Holy River.

If it pleases Him, I bathe in the Pool of Truth, and become radiant and pure. ||3||

He looks so Beautiful in His Perfect Place. He fulfills the hopes of the hopeless.

O Nanak, if one obtains the Perfect Lord, how can his virtues decrease? ||4||9||

As I have stated time and time again, a point that seems to have eluded you, the word Guru must be read in context.

Sardara123 · #38 (**permalink**) 14-Mar-2008, 21:28 PM

Guru is All - for this moorakh, Randip Ji.
All is God.

Guru has told me that and I believe it.
I am sorry that I said any thing to you. You can disscuss it with yourself and others about it as long as you want.

No body can match GURU WORD. Bhai Gurdas is just an interpretation of Guru Word, same as SikhiToTheMax is.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/gurmat-vichaar/20491-literal-meaning-of-gurbani.html

GURU WORD IS WRITTEN IN HEART, LOVE IS THE LANGUAGE- ONE LOVE.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=20491

GOOD LUCK.

Randip Singh · #39 (**permalink**) 14-Mar-2008, 21:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sardara123

Guru is All - for this moorakh, Randip Ji.
All is God.

Guru has told me that and I believe it.
I am sorry that I said any thing to you. You can disscuss it with yourself and others about it as long as you want.

No body can match GURU WORD. Bhai Gurdas is just an interpretation of Guru Word, same as SikhiToTheMax is.

GURU WORD IS WRITTEN IN HEART, LOVE IS THE LANGUAGE- ONE LOVE.

GOOD LUCK.

So somebody like Guru Nanak is God for you? Is that what you are saying?

PS some pointers for you in order to avoid a confused debate:

1) Stick to posting on one thread.

2) Get verifiable translations.

3) Post linkts to the translations so we can verify.

4) Don't make perosonal remarks on insinuations.

5) Try and write precisely and concisely in English your points.

Thanks

Sardara123 · #40 (**permalink**) 14-Mar-2008, 21:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by randip singh

So somebody like Guru Nanak is God for you? Is that what you are saying?

PS some pointers for you in order to avoid a confused debate:

1) Stick to posting on one thread.

2) Get verifiable translations.

3) Post linkts to the translations so we can verify.

4) Don't make perosonal remarks on insinuations.

5) Try and write precisely and concisely in English your points.

Thanks

Guru Nanak is NOT SOMEBODY.

HE IS JOT.

Thanks for clarifying that Guru Nanak is- somebody for you.

I am not debating on translations, I am sharing. And I have mentioned the source as well, please check.

SIKHS dont debate GURU SHABAD. THEY SHARE

.

thanks and

GOOD LUCK FOR DEBATES

Randip Singh · #41 (**permalink**) 14-Mar-2008, 21:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sardara123

Guru Nanak is NOT SOMEBODY.

HE IS JOT.

Thanks for clarifying that Guru Nanak is- somebody for you.

I am not debating on translations, I am sharing. And I have mentioned the source as well, please check.

SIKHS dont debate GURU SHABAD. THEY SHARE

.

thanks

Guru Nanak was an actual physical person. He may have carried a Jyot, but he was a physical person, and yes he was somebody. Not some God, not somedemi-god, not someflame(Jyot), but a physical breathing, eating, reproducing , human body.

Actually one of the side issues of this thread is whether the English translation is accurate. If you do not wish to debate the translation I suggest you do not participate.

PS This is the final time I will say this. Keep personal remarks out of this. Debate the issue and not the person.

Sardara123 · #42 (**permalink**) 14-Mar-2008, 22:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daanveer

Literal Meaning of Gurbani

Gurbani is dear to many. Some read Gurbani every day, some as a rehat, some read it occassionaly.

I have noticed some people question the acceptance of the literal meaning of Gurbani. I am surprised to see that happening even under 'GURMAT VICHAAR' Section.

If we say that literal meaning is wrong: Isn't that imply that we are saying-GURU IS LYING.

CAN A TRUE GURU LIE TO HIS FOLLOWERS?

In my neechan neech budhi- GURU IS RIGHT IN LITERAL SENSE.

If anybody is telling me a meaning that does't go in line with the literal meaning of that Gurbani Line- CAN NOT BE REGARDED AS GURMAT.

For Example:

ਗੁਰੁ ਨਾਨਕੁ ਨਾਨਕੁ ਹਰਿ ਸੋਇ ॥੪॥੭॥੯॥
गुरु नानकु नानकु हरि सोइ ॥४॥७॥९॥
Gur Nānak Nānak har soė. ||4||7||9||
Nanak is the Guru; Nanak is the Lord Himself. ||4||7||9||

Any person who knows Hindi, Punjabi, Urdu, khari boli will tell you that it tells us- Guru Nanak is God Himself. So Guru is telling us- GURU NANAK IS LORD HIMSELF.

If somebody comes to us and tells us, No it is the literal meaning, He cant be God.

Should I listen to him/her or My Guru?

Obviously my Guru: GURU KNOWS BETTER THAN US AND HIM/HER.

LITERAL MEANING IS ALWAYS RIGHT- INTERPRETATION HAS TO GO IN LINE WITH THE LITERAL MEANING.

Daanveer Ji,

I listen to Guru, and it is PEACE in listening to Him. He tears away all the falsehood one after another. As we disscussed before, all these questions raised by different members, help learn everyday.

Guru answers

pk70 · #43 (**permalink**) 14-Mar-2008, 22:32 PM

Randip Singh ji

Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=20491
sardara 123 ji took one line out of the stanza ( in translation)he quoted which is very important. it says:
"lobali(WaHAGURU) dargeh vich maan nimana maan nimanai 11 There is no translation is given of that line.
In this war as per Guru Nanak panth, Gur parmeshar stands for The Almighty. Why because hint is towards duality,:dooja bhao". Guru ji always warns us not to have love for any one but Waheguru
Third line about tolerrance if some one does bad and the Sikh avoids revenge( in Gurbani its also known as ajarr jarna). The next line is about not to speak harshly or do slandering. then next one is about take a loss if it is good for humanity( aap gavai). Then it is about doing good for the humanity and enjoy it not try to boast about it.. Then comes line which is omitted in English translation, it says in God's court being humble getting honour by God because of good deeds done as stated above. The last. This is the right way to understand Guru teachings.
All above listed good deeds are praised because these are honoured by Waheguru and taught by Guru Ji.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=20491
I think, the transltor sardara 123 ji quoted just translated without giving a thought in what context Bhai Gurdaas ji is praising people.