Discuss What is Detachment? Is it Misunderstood? within the Gurmat Vichaar forums, part of the The Sikh Scriptures category; Amazon.com Widgets
ਰਵਿਦਾਸ ਸਮ ਦਲ ਸਮਝਾਵੈ ਕੋਊ ॥੩॥
ravidhaas sam dhal samajhaavai kooo ||3||
O Ravi Daas, one who understands ...
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ਰਵਿਦਾਸ ਸਮ ਦਲ ਸਮਝਾਵੈ ਕੋਊ ॥੩॥ ravidhaas sam dhal samajhaavai kooo ||3|| O Ravi Daas, one who understands that the Lord is equally in all, is very rare. ||3||
__________________ ਮਨ ਕਰਹਲਾ ਗੁਰ ਗੋਵਿੰਦੁ ਸਮਾਲਿ ॥ man karehalaa gur govindh samaalO camel-like mind, dwell upon the Guru and the Lord of the Universe.
kwnVw AstpdIAw mhlw 4 Gru 1 <> siqgur pRswid ] jip mn rwm nwmu suKu pwvYgo ] ijau ijau jpY iqvY suKu pwvY siqguru syiv smwvYgo ]1] rhwau ] Bgq jnW kI iKnu iKnu locw nwmu jpq suKu pwvYgo ] An rs swd gey sB nIkir ibnu nwvY ikCu n suKwvYgo ]1] gurmiq hir hir mITw lwgw Guru mITy bcn kFwvYgo ] siqgur bwxI purKu purKoqm bwxI isau icqu lwvYgo ]2] gurbwxI sunq myrw mnu dRivAw mnu BInw inj Gir AwvYgo ] qh Anhq DunI bwjih inq bwjy nIJr Dwr cuAwvYgo ]3] rwm nwmu ieku iql iql gwvY mnu gurmiq nwim smwvYgo ] nwmu suxY nwmo min BwvY nwmy hI iqRpqwvYgo ]4] kink kink pihry bhu kMgnw kwpru BWiq bnwvYgo ] nwm ibnw siB PIk iPkwny jnim mrY iPir AwvYgo ]5] mwieAw ptl ptl hY BwrI Gru GUmin Gyir GulwvYgo ] pwp ibkwr mnUr siB Bwry ibKu duqru qirE n jwvYgo ]6] Bau bYrwgu BieAw hY boihQu Guru Kyvtu sbid qrwvYgo ] rwm nwmu hir BytIAY hir rwmY nwim smwvYgo ]7] AigAwin lwie svwilAw gur igAwnY lwie jgwvYgo ] nwnk BwxY AwpxY ijau BwvY iqvY clwvYgo ]8]1]
Kaanraa, Ashtapadees, Fourth Mehl, First House:
One Universal Creator God. By The Grace Of The True Guru:
Chant the Name of the Lord, O mind, and find peace.
The more you chant and meditate, the more you will be at peace; serve the True Guru, and merge in the Lord. ||1||Pause||
Each and every instant, the humble devotees long for Him; chanting the Naam, they find peace.
The taste of other pleasures is totally eradicated; nothing pleases them, except the Name. ||1||
Following the Guru's Teachings, the Lord seems sweet to them; the Guru inspires them to speak sweet words.
Through the Word of the True Guru's Bani, the Primal Lord God is revealed; so focus your consciousness on His Bani. ||2||
Hearing the Word of the Guru's Bani, my mind has been softened and saturated with it; my mind has returned to its own home deep within.
The Unstruck Melody resonates and resounds there continuously; the stream of nectar trickles down constantly. ||3||
Singing the Name of the One Lord each and every instant, and following the Guru's Teachings, the mind is absorbed in the Naam.
Listening to the Naam, the mind is pleased with the Naam, and satisfied with the Naam. ||4||
People wear lots of bracelets, glittering with gold; they wear all sorts of fine clothes.
But without the Naam, they are all bland and insipid. They are born, only to die again, in the cycle of reincarnation. ||5||
The veil of Maya is a thick and heavy veil, a whirlpool which destroys one's home.
Sins and corrupt vices are totally heavy, like rusted ****. They will not let you cross over the poisonous and treacherous world-ocean. ||6||
Let the Fear of God and neutral detachment be the boat; the Guru is the Boatman, who carries us across in the Word of the Shabad.
Meeting with the Lord, the Name of the Lord, merge in the Lord, the Name of the Lord. ||7||
Attached to ignorance, people are falling asleep; attached to the Guru's spiritual wisdom, they awaken.
O Nanak, by His Will, He makes us walk as He pleases. ||8||1||
In the rehaao line of this shabad, Guruji says that we are asking to be blessed with his Name and understand that His Treasure in overflowing. This line is like a pivot, a turn in our vichaar. Before the rehaao, Guruji says that uncountable numbers of us are beggars, we beg of the Great Giver. We beg for Him to fulfill the desire within our hearts. Just before the rehaao, Guruji tells us about the the pre-requisites - we lay the foundation in chanting, meditation, self-discipline. We beg and we hope. Will we be blessed with His overflowing treasure? After the rehaao Guruji tells us what this blessing is like. The shabad explains what "equipoise" is like.
gUjrI mhlw 1 ]
goojree mehlaa 1. (503-14)
Goojaree, First Mehla:
kvn kvn jwcih pRB dwqy qw ky AMq n prih sumwr ]
kavan kavan jaacheh parabh daatay taa kay ant na pareh sumaar. Those who beg of God the Great Giver - their numbers cannot be counted.
jYsI BUK hoie AB AMqir qUM smrQu scu dyvxhwr ]1]
jaisee bhookh ho-ay abh antar tooN samrath sach dayvanhaar. ||1|| You, Almighty True Lord, fulfill the desires within their hearts. ||1||
AY jI jpu qpu sMjmu scu ADwr ]
ai jee jap tap sanjam sach aDhaar. O Dear Lord, chanting, deep meditation, self-discipline and truth are my foundations.
hir hir nwmu dyih suKu pweIAY qyrI Bgiq Bry BMfwr ]1] rhwau ]
har har naam deh sukh paa-ee-ai tayree bhagat bharay bhandaar. ||1||rahaa-o. Bless me with Your Name, Lord, that I may find peace. Your devotional worship is a treasure over-flowing. ||1||Pause||
suMn smwiD rhih ilv lwgy eykw eykI sbdu bIcwr ]
sunn samaaDh raheh liv laagay aykaa aykee sabad beechaar. Some remain absorbed in Samaadhi, their minds fixed lovingly on the One Lord; they reflect only on the Shabad, the Guru’s Word.
jlu Qlu Drix ggnu qh nwhI Awpy Awpu kIAw krqwr ]2] jal thal Dharan gagan tah naahee aapay aap kee-aa kartaar. ||2|| In that state, there is no water, land, earth or sky; only the Creator Lord Himself exists. ||2||
nw qid mwieAw mgnu n CwieAw nw sUrj cMd n joiq Apwr ] naa tad maa-i-aa magan na chhaa-i-aa naa sooraj chand na jot apaar. There is no intoxication of Maya there, and no shadow, nor the infinite light of the sun or the moon.
srb idRsit locn AB AMqir eykw ndir su iqRBvx swr ]3]
sarab darisat lochan abh antar aykaa nadar so taribhavan saar. ||3|| [i]The eyes within the mind which see everything - with one glance, they see the three worlds.
I read some vichaar on another web site a few days ago. The author explained how important it is to think about the rehaao line itself. The word rehaao means Pause and Think About This. Each side of the rehaao sets up two sides of the vichaar of the shabad. Our spiritual condition first, what we must think about(the rehaao), then the consequences, what will unfold.
__________________ ਮਨ ਕਰਹਲਾ ਗੁਰ ਗੋਵਿੰਦੁ ਸਮਾਲਿ ॥ man karehalaa gur govindh samaalO camel-like mind, dwell upon the Guru and the Lord of the Universe.
You have not answered my question aad0002. Detachment is an impervious immunity of worldly matters and temptations that distract us from the path of self realisation and frredom from the bonds and shackles of existence, fear, ignorance and dependancy upon others and earthliness that do not avail us in times of distress or need.
Kya Khayal Hai Aap Ka - means What's your opinion ?
__________________ Whether you are a small time entrepreneur, or the CEO of a large corporation, you cannot escape the daily challenges of business.
You may be equipped with adequate resources, but without determination and drive you will not be able to take on new challenges.
Na Koi Vairi, Na Koi Biganna, Nanak ki Pechan sub samje apna ...
I cannot meditate. Bhoot Sitar rahe hai..
Ilaaj kuch dussna ...
Nanak said the voices bark like maddened dogs, and when retaliating , I bark as loudly.. It is one verse that keeps me strong in times of darkness... John Nash, A beautiful mind - a truly intelligent person cannot be insane or incoherent or possesed because they are led by reason, and truth shall keep them upon the path of righteousness in times of torment and darkness ...
Please forgive me if I did not answer your question earlier in the thread. Sometimes I get distracted. I started this thread because detachment is one issue where, at least in my opinion, there are not easy answers, no quick fixes. No silver bullet. Follow this sadhana and you will find detachment -- which is what we are told.
You quote, Hours of darkness when the mind barks like a dog and quote the verse that says, "I cannot meditate." When you repeat the metaphor, my mind barks like a dog, I know exactly what that is saying. That happens to me.
When NamJap says, As long as the mind is in a state of perpetual flux and unrest, and is filled with thoughts of I-am-ness, Shabd fails to impart its sweet fragrance and Naam fails to inspire love and attraction. (Guru Ram Das)
Yes, this is part of the problem. Here again is an insight into the mind that is snared by Maya. And we can see how this is not a pleasant thing. If there had never been our Gurus, even without this forum, even without all the study of religious scholars, we know that this is not good for us. And there are hosts of people for whom Maya, the web of illusion that snares us, is the only thing. So there is no use in discussing detachment in that corner. They believe that they have truth and reality all figured out.
Where does that leave us? We sift through the writings of people who have "wisdom" to share. We examine all of our high tides of relentless thought. We study all kinds of theories and approaches to spiritual practice. Much of it is so abstract that I don't know half the time what is being said in these articles. Some writing contradicts other writing. We observe some truly holy people who seem to have this inner calm. And we wonder, How to get from knowledge and theory to the actual, real experience of "detachment" ? Sikhism adds another challenge to this. Be a householder living in the world, having a full life -- and be detached.
What is my opinion? You said something that I suspect is on the right track, Detachment is an impervious immunity of worldly matters and temptations that distract us from the path of self realisation and frredom from the bonds and shackles of existence, fear, ignorance and dependancy upon others and earthliness that do not avail us in times of distress or need.
Now please forgive me again when I say that I agree with you, and also that this is not the whole story. There has to be 'I-ness" to get through the day if you are a Sikh. If you are living in a cave, that is a different story.
I am going to respond in a simple-minded way, because I can't find the shabad I am looking for that expresses something very important. Detachment is "equipoise. " I trust Guruji. There is one who is truly detached, always. That is Akaal, Prabhu, Hari, Waheguru. Always in equipoise. He shows the way.
Sorry, this is a lame answer. But the discussion is open. We should say what is on our minds. When I find that shabad, I will post it. Meanwhile think of the Ch'uan master who when asked what is the Truth said nothing and instead picked up one red rose and stared at it for a long time in silence.
__________________ ਮਨ ਕਰਹਲਾ ਗੁਰ ਗੋਵਿੰਦੁ ਸਮਾਲਿ ॥ man karehalaa gur govindh samaalO camel-like mind, dwell upon the Guru and the Lord of the Universe.
-------------------- hir jIau swcw swcI bwxI sbid imlwvw hoeI ]1] The Dear Lord is True, and True is the Word of His Bani. Through the Shabad, we merge with Him. ||1|| ਇਕਾ ਬਾਣੀ ਇਕੁ ਗੁਰੁ ਇਕੋ ਸਬਦੁ ਵੀਚਾਰਿ ॥
There is One Bani there is One Guru there is one Shabad to contemplate (ang 646)
You quote, Hours of darkness when the mind barks like a dog and quote the verse that says, "I cannot meditate." When you repeat the metaphor, my mind barks like a dog, I know exactly what that is saying. That happens to me.
it happens to everyone, i think. a trick i learned from some buddhist monks is to let the thoughts, the "barking dog" pass through you, without grabbing hold. if one holds onto those thoughts, on cannot meditate. but it's possible to be detached even when distractions fill your head... just don't attach yourself to the barking of the dogs.
It is a good metaphor isn't it? The advice that you pass should work. Now there are times when my mind does not bark like a dog, when it is very still and peaceful. Here comes my next question --
Assume we achieve inner peace during our meditation, that our sadhana has taken us to a sensation of inner balance. For 10 minutes, an hour or more our mind is still. What has really happened of value if one hour later we are shouting, losing our temper, criticizing other people, feeling sorry for ourselves, or whatever, complaining in reaction to things, people, situations that bother us in the world.
What is detachment? Doesn't a change in the fundamental core of our being have to also occur so that the barking inside and outside is stilled?
The article given us by kaur-1 is really interesting on this point. "countless talk of vairag", but vaimglis lie whom He wills so to be" (GG, 634).
__________________ ਮਨ ਕਰਹਲਾ ਗੁਰ ਗੋਵਿੰਦੁ ਸਮਾਲਿ ॥ man karehalaa gur govindh samaalO camel-like mind, dwell upon the Guru and the Lord of the Universe.
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